925 réponses à ce sujet

[Newnation]

Bobad wrote...

Change is good, it saves you having to break a note.

Most people are looking at the changes like this though.
www.youtube.com/watch

Modifié par Newnation, 01 septembre 2010 - 05:03 .

[addiction21]

MerinTB wrote...

Kiely wrote...

SirOccam wrote...
I'd really hate to see what a turn-based firefight looks like...it sounds incredibly clunky.

Play Fallout 2 then decide SirOccam.  

There's also the SIlent Storm series.  Laser Squad.

I actually find this far more fun than the most enjoyable experiences I've ever had with a FPS.

Left out X-Com and Jagged Alliance. JA2 is the one you want.

[MerinTB]

addiction21 wrote...

MerinTB wrote...

Kiely wrote...

SirOccam wrote...
I'd really hate to see what a turn-based firefight looks like...it sounds incredibly clunky.

Play Fallout 2 then decide SirOccam.  

There's also the SIlent Storm series.  Laser Squad.

I actually find this far more fun than the most enjoyable experiences I've ever had with a FPS.

Left out X-Com and Jagged Alliance. JA2 is the one you want.

I haven't played X-Com or Jagged Alliance yet.  JA is the Anne McCaffery stuff, right?  I'd always meant to try both series.

[PsyrenY]

Coyote Hunter wrote...

If you guys really don't like change, just sit down in front of the Lord of the Rings trilogy, and pause the film every eight seconds to do some long division problems.  You'll get all the same thrills as you did when you first played Baldur's Gate a million years ago.

Okay, I'm an RPG fan, but I lol'ed at this.

SirOccam wrote...

Why would it have plot holes? Or necessarily be cheesy?

Like looting your 89th darkspawn dagger and selling it for 2 silver really adds to the fun. Oh, wait, you packs are full! Woo, now the fun really starts! You get to go through your 8 backpacks you are somehow wearing and decide if something there is less valuable than a darkspawn dagger! And then--hold on to your hats, folks--you get to lug all your junk back to a merchant! Wowzers! Hey hey, with that extra 50 silver you just made, you can afford your Sword of Badguy Slaying, which has +2 to accuracy! That may or may not be better than your current sword which has +2 to damage! You know what that means...time to whip out the spreadsheet! OMFG I am having so much fun! Hey, look at that! You're only 37.2 experience points away from leveling up! Better start deciding now if you are going to go for a 42nd point of dexterity, or maybe walk on the wild side and throw them all into strength! Is it going to have a measurable effect no matter where you put it? Who knows?! But the excitement level is at an all-time high, that's for sure!

/applause for this too.

I don't think it should be streamlined as FAR as ME2 was, but some trimming is definitely needed.

Modifié par Optimystic_X, 01 septembre 2010 - 06:26 .

[SirOccam]

addiction21 wrote...

MerinTB wrote...

Kiely wrote...

SirOccam wrote...
I'd really hate to see what a turn-based firefight looks like...it sounds incredibly clunky.

Play Fallout 2 then decide SirOccam. 

There's also the SIlent Storm series.  Laser Squad.

I actually find this far more fun than the most enjoyable experiences I've ever had with a FPS.

Left out X-Com and Jagged Alliance. JA2 is the one you want.

I'll have to try some of those; I'm genuinely curious.

All that comes to mind when I try to imagine it is a game I used to play on my Apple IIc...



I can't find any images of a gun being fired, but you chose to shoot someone from a menu, then you watched as the little white dot went from you to the bad guy, and either hit or missed.

Modifié par SirOccam, 01 septembre 2010 - 08:22 .

[Mabjestic]

MerinTB wrote...
I haven't played X-Com or Jagged Alliance yet.  JA is the Anne McCaffery stuff, right?  I'd always meant to try both series.

I admit I've never read anything by Anne McCaffery, but I can't see much connection after a quick wiki. Both Jagged Alliance games are about leading a group of mercenaries in guerilla warfare against a stronger military force. You do tactial combat and and have a strategical element in defending and utilizing resources in captured areas.

Jagged Alliance 2 is in the 'best game ever' category for me and definately worth playing.

Optimystic_X wrote...
I don't think it should be streamlined as FAR as ME2 was, but some trimming is definitely needed.

Agreed. Going with the trimming metaphor, ME2 might have cut too much, we still want our dogs fluffy and soft after all, but no trimming at all and you end up with a ball of fur with two eyes and a tongue lolling out..

Modifié par Mabjestic, 01 septembre 2010 - 08:56 .

[Lusitanum]

Tirigon wrote...

And maybe once it doesn't such so bad that it kills the entire franchise  before it even starts too? I mean, I'm just saying, you might get frustrated at the game's shortcomings and at the fact that there will never be a continuation to its story...

What you mean? So far I´ve only ever heard how awesomely great Alpha Protocol is.

I'm sorry, I meant to insert this link on my quote but I completely forgot about it.

Bottom line... maybe you don't want to play the game that decided to rip-off everything from ME1, including the bad things like the extremely stat-based combat.

And to all those that say "if it's not stat-based, then it's not an RPG"... well, then maybe you're the kind of masochists who likes to feel as frustrated and bored like Angry Joe in the first minute (and 10 seconds) of this review. I'd recommend watching it to the end though, it's an example of what would have happened to ME2 if Bioware had listened to all the people who just can't stand things that improve a game just because it's not what they're used to. Because it doesn't matter how good your story is, or how compelling your (voiced) PC is if the gameplay is just a chore that you have to put up with just to get to the next cutscene.

Modifié par Lusitanum, 01 septembre 2010 - 11:31 .

[Morroian]

MerinTB wrote...

addiction21 wrote...
Left out X-Com and Jagged Alliance. JA2 is the one you want.

I haven't played X-Com or Jagged Alliance yet.  JA is the Anne McCaffery stuff, right?  I'd always meant to try both series.

The original X-Com is the greatest game of all time. I can still play it now unlike any other game from that era.

[HTTP 404]

Morroian wrote...

MerinTB wrote...

addiction21 wrote...
Left out X-Com and Jagged Alliance. JA2 is the one you want.

I haven't played X-Com or Jagged Alliance yet.  JA is the Anne McCaffery stuff, right?  I'd always meant to try both series.

The original X-Com is the greatest game of all time. I can still play it now unlike any other game from that era.

I love the original X-Com!  I played it when it came out in DOS in 94-95.  Granted I was only 10 when I played it, it was really good and well thought out and ahead of its time.  I also played Daggerfall in DOS when that came out as well.  I also played board D and D.

Guess what I kind of agree with the OP.    rpg "elements" are really subjective.  When I played pencil and paper RPG we didnt concern ourselves with items, loot, etc but created very good stories.

[MerinTB]

X-Com got translated into a Freedom Force mod, too.



I can't find any connection between Jagged Alliance and Anne McCaffrey either. Dunno why I thought that.

[addiction21]

MerinTB wrote...

X-Com got translated into a Freedom Force mod, too.

I have to look that up.

MerinTB wrote...


I can't find any connection between Jagged Alliance and Anne McCaffrey either. Dunno why I thought that.

Brain damage? Huck huck huck.

Occam's screenshots above are giving me flashebacks of the OLD battletech pc games.

I am also sleep deprived enough to ay those games are as much rpg games as many others I have played.

[Gatt9]

Guertyras wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

shootist70 wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

[I felt the need to link it because he's sort of what they are marketing for, he views Mass Effect 2 as the best thing since sliced bread (comparing it to Dragon Age) while he can't even be bothered to get past Ostagar before saying the game was a waste of money and such.

Bioware are marketing their games for morons? Not these generalisations again *sigh*

I didn't mean that, it's 5-am and I'm extremely confused. >.<

It's just that.. this guy here is what I hate. He happens to also be getting everything and more that he wants for DA2. I can't voice it correctly but.. yeah. I facepalmed at it.

 well it makes sense, that guy represent he majority, he want  quick responsive action, instant gratification,cinematic events, voice acting, he dont especially want a rpg. The new fans were attracted to dragon age with the gore trailers and mailyn Manson "this is the new **** " stuff ...Now logically bioware try to cater more to the new crowd they attracted, not  the guys who liked old games where "it took ages to go anywhere and had to eat food"(mass effect 2 in game quote).
   .What i am expecting next from bioware is a dragon age facebook game, one with microtransactions, those games requires a much lesser budget, cater to many  more people and pay much more than a 3D fully voiced "next gen" game, its all win for them. They jumped from  traditional pc rpg to console action/rpg to get even better sales then the next step are the social browser games.

Well spoken,  but this is actually a much deeper event,  bear with me,  it's a long'un.

The gaming industry is actually characterized by cycles.  Self imposed cycles actually.

20 years ago there was the NES/Sega Master System.  They got their major kick via Super Mario and Final Fantasy,  those two games sold ridiculous numbers of units.  In short order,  everyone was churning out some variation of those two games.  This continued onwards into...

The SNES/Genesis,  which boasted better graphics,  but essentially the same games.  Pretty much everything was a platformer,  or a JRPG.  All of them terribly similiar.  Now punduits will blame Nintendo's promises of the CD and Genesis fragmenting the market for their death,  but research actually shows that was not the case.  Peripherals don't define systems,  games do.  Impending console launches don't affect game purchasing leading up to the release.  These consoles died because they kept releasing the same couple games,  and people got tired of them.  Because othwerise we'd have simply seen steady sales on the old systems and none on the new ones,  like Jaguar,  3do,  CD-i failed to affect the market.

The PC rose to take it's place.  From the early 90's to the 00's it stood strong.  Except Warcraft 2/Starcraft/Doom was released.  Then everyone and their grandmother made every game an RTS/FPS.  Of course,  most weren't very good,  and PC Gaming started it's drop off,  after a number of companies had high-profile deaths.  There was the additonal factor of the profit margin from the 3d switch that accelerated things.

The PS2 took over.  Carried by Resident Evil,  Grand Theft Auto,  Final Fantasy 7,  Grand Turismo.  It lost it's uniqueness,  like Legacy of Kain,  following in the footsteps of the preceeding generations,  it started making everything similiar to a handfull of games.

Which is pretty much where we stand today.  PS3/360,  SNES/Genesis,  it's the same event,  and the same problem.  A couple of games sold really well,  so now every game is a couple of games.  It leads to the same result,  decreasing interest as people can only play the same game so many times.  Oblivion,  Fallout 3,  Red Dead Redemption,  Saint's Row,  they're all just GTA.  Mass Effect 2 is just Gears of War.  Halo is just Doom/Half-Life.  Etc.

It's *really* obvious what's happening,  Gaming is starting it's decline,  and it'll only accelerate.  Month after Month of decreasing revenue this year,  and if you remove the music games,  you'll find it's been ongoing.  Bethseda shipped 4.6 million units of Fallout 3,  but sold only a fraction of that before NPD stopped reporting their numbers.  People are *tired* of the same couple games.

Gaming is,  and has been,  a "Me too!" driven industry,  which is fine so long as gaming has variety.  When the market converges to a couple games,  the market tanks.  Almost all of the platforms ended their cycle on a convergence to a handfull of games with little variety.

This is no different,  Bioware's converging along with the rest of the industry.  Their right along with everyone else shouting from the rooftop "It's an RPG HYBRID!!!",  and delivering some FPS/TPS/Grand Theft Auto variant.

So we're going to crash,  in about 3 years.  But this'll be different,  this'll be Atari-style crash.  This'll be total market collapse.

You see,  today,  companies are bankrolling their futures on the next 1-2 games.  They're pretty much all over-extended.  Firingsquad did a nice piece on this a year back,  pointing out that pretty much everyone's one bad game away from bankruptcy,  and it's only gotten worse.  EA and Bethseda are prime canidates,  and EA might even be a driving force for the upcoming crash.

Let's consider EA.  Need for Speed,  NFL/NHL,  the Sims,  and Bioware.  But what happens to NFS when Grand Turismo comes out?  How many Sims are too many?  Bioware's banking everything on the TPS market now instead of delivering quality RPGs.  So what happens when NFS gets tanked by Grand Turismo?  What happens when Sims hits saturation like Rockstar did?  What happens when Bioware sells far fewer games than they thought they would by playing "Me too!"?

EA's going to fold,  it no longer has insurance.  It killed Origin,  Westwood,  Bullfrog.  NFL/NHL can't support a company of it's size.  So then the market loses the NFL/NHL revenues for 24 months,  and a bunch of casuals.  It'll be a massive drop,  and like Microsoft did to the Tech market,  it'll take alot of others with it.

Gaming's unhealthy,  has been for years.  History has shown us several times what happens when the market converges to "Me too!",  and like the ancient saying,  it's what's going to happen again.  Bioware can chase after this "Mass Market!" all it wants,  but it's still just riding the fad,  just like others have before it (Super Mario,  Final Fantasy,  Doom,  Myst,  Full Motion Video,  RTS,  and today GTA),  just like every other fad it'll end,  and just like every other time,  companies are going to die.

Sadly,  because we're at an "All the eggs in one basket" case,  gaming as we know it is going down.

[Merced256]

Gatt9 wrote...

Guertyras wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

shootist70 wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

[I felt the need to link it because he's sort of what they are marketing for, he views Mass Effect 2 as the best thing since sliced bread (comparing it to Dragon Age) while he can't even be bothered to get past Ostagar before saying the game was a waste of money and such.

Bioware are marketing their games for morons? Not these generalisations again *sigh*

I didn't mean that, it's 5-am and I'm extremely confused. >.<

It's just that.. this guy here is what I hate. He happens to also be getting everything and more that he wants for DA2. I can't voice it correctly but.. yeah. I facepalmed at it.

 well it makes sense, that guy represent he majority, he want  quick responsive action, instant gratification,cinematic events, voice acting, he dont especially want a rpg. The new fans were attracted to dragon age with the gore trailers and mailyn Manson "this is the new **** " stuff ...Now logically bioware try to cater more to the new crowd they attracted, not  the guys who liked old games where "it took ages to go anywhere and had to eat food"(mass effect 2 in game quote).
   .What i am expecting next from bioware is a dragon age facebook game, one with microtransactions, those games requires a much lesser budget, cater to many  more people and pay much more than a 3D fully voiced "next gen" game, its all win for them. They jumped from  traditional pc rpg to console action/rpg to get even better sales then the next step are the social browser games.

Well spoken,  but this is actually a much deeper event,  bear with me,  it's a long'un.

The gaming industry is actually characterized by cycles.  Self imposed cycles actually.

20 years ago there was the NES/Sega Master System.  They got their major kick via Super Mario and Final Fantasy,  those two games sold ridiculous numbers of units.  In short order,  everyone was churning out some variation of those two games.  This continued onwards into...

The SNES/Genesis,  which boasted better graphics,  but essentially the same games.  Pretty much everything was a platformer,  or a JRPG.  All of them terribly similiar.  Now punduits will blame Nintendo's promises of the CD and Genesis fragmenting the market for their death,  but research actually shows that was not the case.  Peripherals don't define systems,  games do.  Impending console launches don't affect game purchasing leading up to the release.  These consoles died because they kept releasing the same couple games,  and people got tired of them.  Because othwerise we'd have simply seen steady sales on the old systems and none on the new ones,  like Jaguar,  3do,  CD-i failed to affect the market.

The PC rose to take it's place.  From the early 90's to the 00's it stood strong.  Except Warcraft 2/Starcraft/Doom was released.  Then everyone and their grandmother made every game an RTS/FPS.  Of course,  most weren't very good,  and PC Gaming started it's drop off,  after a number of companies had high-profile deaths.  There was the additonal factor of the profit margin from the 3d switch that accelerated things.

The PS2 took over.  Carried by Resident Evil,  Grand Theft Auto,  Final Fantasy 7,  Grand Turismo.  It lost it's uniqueness,  like Legacy of Kain,  following in the footsteps of the preceeding generations,  it started making everything similiar to a handfull of games.

Which is pretty much where we stand today.  PS3/360,  SNES/Genesis,  it's the same event,  and the same problem.  A couple of games sold really well,  so now every game is a couple of games.  It leads to the same result,  decreasing interest as people can only play the same game so many times.  Oblivion,  Fallout 3,  Red Dead Redemption,  Saint's Row,  they're all just GTA.  Mass Effect 2 is just Gears of War.  Halo is just Doom/Half-Life.  Etc.

It's *really* obvious what's happening,  Gaming is starting it's decline,  and it'll only accelerate.  Month after Month of decreasing revenue this year,  and if you remove the music games,  you'll find it's been ongoing.  Bethseda shipped 4.6 million units of Fallout 3,  but sold only a fraction of that before NPD stopped reporting their numbers.  People are *tired* of the same couple games.

Gaming is,  and has been,  a "Me too!" driven industry,  which is fine so long as gaming has variety.  When the market converges to a couple games,  the market tanks.  Almost all of the platforms ended their cycle on a convergence to a handfull of games with little variety.

This is no different,  Bioware's converging along with the rest of the industry.  Their right along with everyone else shouting from the rooftop "It's an RPG HYBRID!!!",  and delivering some FPS/TPS/Grand Theft Auto variant.

So we're going to crash,  in about 3 years.  But this'll be different,  this'll be Atari-style crash.  This'll be total market collapse.

You see,  today,  companies are bankrolling their futures on the next 1-2 games.  They're pretty much all over-extended.  Firingsquad did a nice piece on this a year back,  pointing out that pretty much everyone's one bad game away from bankruptcy,  and it's only gotten worse.  EA and Bethseda are prime canidates,  and EA might even be a driving force for the upcoming crash.

Let's consider EA.  Need for Speed,  NFL/NHL,  the Sims,  and Bioware.  But what happens to NFS when Grand Turismo comes out?  How many Sims are too many?  Bioware's banking everything on the TPS market now instead of delivering quality RPGs.  So what happens when NFS gets tanked by Grand Turismo?  What happens when Sims hits saturation like Rockstar did?  What happens when Bioware sells far fewer games than they thought they would by playing "Me too!"?

EA's going to fold,  it no longer has insurance.  It killed Origin,  Westwood,  Bullfrog.  NFL/NHL can't support a company of it's size.  So then the market loses the NFL/NHL revenues for 24 months,  and a bunch of casuals.  It'll be a massive drop,  and like Microsoft did to the Tech market,  it'll take alot of others with it.

Gaming's unhealthy,  has been for years.  History has shown us several times what happens when the market converges to "Me too!",  and like the ancient saying,  it's what's going to happen again.  Bioware can chase after this "Mass Market!" all it wants,  but it's still just riding the fad,  just like others have before it (Super Mario,  Final Fantasy,  Doom,  Myst,  Full Motion Video,  RTS,  and today GTA),  just like every other fad it'll end,  and just like every other time,  companies are going to die.

Sadly,  because we're at an "All the eggs in one basket" case,  gaming as we know it is going down.

Good post.

[Tirigon]

Gatt9 wrote...

Gaming's unhealthy,  has been for years.  History has shown us several times what happens when the market converges to "Me too!",  and like the ancient saying,  it's what's going to happen again.  Bioware can chase after this "Mass Market!" all it wants,  but it's still just riding the fad,  just like others have before it (Super Mario,  Final Fantasy,  Doom,  Myst,  Full Motion Video,  RTS,  and today GTA),  just like every other fad it'll end,  and just like every other time,  companies are going to die.

Sadly,  because we're at an "All the eggs in one basket" case,  gaming as we know it is going down.

As long as Blizzard continues StarCraft gaming won´t die.
Because StarCraft2 Wings Of Liberty is the best game that has ever existed, and will probably only be topped by Heart of the Swarm and the Protoss part of the Campaign.

[Kilshrek]

Tirigon wrote...

As long as Blizzard continues StarCraft gaming won´t die.
Because StarCraft2 Wings Of Liberty is the best game that has ever existed, and will probably only be topped by Heart of the Swarm and the Protoss part of the Campaign.

It's sweeping statements like these that get my goat sometimes.

I have to disagree with you there, I wouldn't even consider SC anywhere near my greatest, probably on a top 20 list but not on my top 10 for sure.

Homeworld and Total Annihilation would be my top two, then Age of Empires, Total War games...  But that's just my opinion.

But this should be going back to DA 2..

Again I can agree with some that streamlining a la ME 2 would be a terrible idea, to me at least.. I liked the old-school-iness of DAO. Reducing the frequency and redundancy of loot might be a good thing, but I suppose care should be taken to balance it with the economy of the game as well. Being a poor 'champion' isn't quite my idea of good fun.

I honestly didn't see too much that should be changed in combat from DAO aside from the fact that tanks could rarely physically block choke points, instead relying on abilities that relied on stamina that ran out all too quickly in DAO. Awakenings addressed this with stamina pots, but I wouldn't like to see warriors being overly reliant on pots. My team should function like a well oiled machine, with the mage focusing on maximum damage so we can eliminate the threat quickly or maximum support so s/he can keep everyone alive and well (stamina buffs etc).

Spells needed no fixing at all, casting time for powerful spells was about right, lower level spells got cast instantly anyway.

Can't really think of much else that needed fixing, besides several aesthetic issues but they're nowhere near as important as any game play issues.

[Rubbish Hero]

Valve best, only good company market.
Bioware disappoint big day age, $1.99 shades ripoff super extravaganza little turd man sell quest in game content cutout if buy re-sale. Dragon Age 2 Mass Effect. Buy instead witching 2. CD Project passion no big wig fat cat profeeterer. Hipster young forin bunch think change world no tainted.

Modifié par Rubbish Hero, 02 septembre 2010 - 02:13 .

[wowpwnslol]

SirOccam wrote...

Why would it have plot holes? Or necessarily be cheesy?

Like looting your 89th darkspawn dagger and selling it for 2 silver really adds to the fun. Oh, wait, you packs are full! Woo, now the fun really starts! You get to go through your 8 backpacks you are somehow wearing and decide if something there is less valuable than a darkspawn dagger! And then--hold on to your hats, folks--you get to lug all your junk back to a merchant! Wowzers! Hey hey, with that extra 50 silver you just made, you can afford your Sword of Badguy Slaying, which has +2 to accuracy! That may or may not be better than your current sword which has +2 to damage! You know what that means...time to whip out the spreadsheet! OMFG I am having so much fun! Hey, look at that! You're only 37.2 experience points away from leveling up! Better start deciding now if you are going to go for a 42nd point of dexterity, or maybe walk on the wild side and throw them all into strength! Is it going to have a measurable effect no matter where you put it? Who knows?! But the excitement level is at an all-time high, that's for sure!

Time to go back to Halo and MW2. People like you ruined RPG gaming on PCs and turned it into dumbed down shooters like ME2. There's plenty of "point and shoot" games out there. Leave one decent RPG for people who enjoy things you find boring thanks to your limited attention span and lack of desire to think.

[FlintlockJazz]

I haven't bothered to read the whole thread, but from what I read from the OP it sounds like he wants all the games to be the same? I love ME2, and still consider it an RPG for reasons I won't get into here, but that does not mean that I want all games to be ME2. Enough genres and gametypes have been killed off or distilled down over the years, do we need Bioware to make the same game in different settings now?

[IckyLicks]

Bomberman65 wrote...

Taura-Tierno wrote...


Dragon Age, on the other hand, is a real RPG. I like smaller side quests and travelling between areas and exploring. That's a big part of what makes a game an RPG for me. Not just options in dialogues, but choices of where to go when. The more open the world, the more the RPG, basically. A "real" RPG needs all of those things.

.

Couldnt have put it better myself. Thats why I love DA more than ME.  I mean I loved rumaging through all my weapons and armor and biotics in ME1 and DA:O. Then figuring out what to sell at shops and what new/better gear was avaliable in shops.
And just exploring in both Origins and ME1.
Those things werent present in ME2 which I was disapointed with. I mean dont get me wrong ME2 is a great game but it just didnt have that RPG feel to me like the first did. Which is why I love Origins. I just want them to keep those thing in DA2. I dont want them to do what they did from ME1 to ME2. I would be throughly disapointed in them cause Origins harkens back to the days of old school RPGs which I loved back in the day.
Sorry rant over now just wanted to get that off my chest.

I sense a bias towards fantasy over sci-fi.  How is Origins more of an RPG than ME1 or more "real" than ME1?  ME1 has its flaws but it was still an RPG as much as origins.  From I remember you could:

1. pick type character
2. name the character
3.modify appearances
4. choose class
5. level up
6 find lots of loot
7. manage loot
8.buy items
9upgrade items
10. choose weapon types
11.Has a great story
12.etc

From reading, I sense people are either bias towards the sci-fi theme or hate "twitch" elements in the action.  I'm sorry to tell you folks but RPG has been effectively grown in so many directions that it is no longer the type of game that you remember.  I sort of miss "pure stat" based games but it doesn't mean that it's not an RPG if it uses twitch skills or if it uses guns, lol. 

I sort of agree with the OP because a lot of people want the old fashioned swords and sorcery style "stat based" gameplay and I'm sort of tired of it.  That's what I loved about ME1.  It took sci-fi and these cool abilities and turned it into an RPG.  And you know what....from what I heard about Deus Ex.....that sounds like an RPG too. 

I think Origins was an attempt by Bioware to rehash a system they're not into anymore.  What's interesting is they admitted this in Game Informer stating that type of gameplay is dying.  DA2 is what Bioware really wanted to do with the game.  You're either with it or not.  Me, I love how the Witcher is playing out because of it's unique system of gameplay so instead of getting DA2 I'm getting Witcher 2.

[Heimdall]

Brodyaha wrote...
Awsomeness

...I like you

Your opinions on DA:O and the ME games are exactly like mine!

[Lusitanum]

wowpwnslol wrote...

Time to go back to Halo and MW2. People like you ruined RPG gaming on PCs and turned it into dumbed down shooters like ME2. There's plenty of "point and shoot" games out there. Leave one decent RPG for people who enjoy things you find boring thanks to your limited attention span and lack of desire to think.

I'm sorry, you say that ME2 is a dumb-down and then mention Dragon Age as the decent game? The game with no tactical depth and which doesn't need the least bit of thought through the entire game? Are you serious.

It's our desire to actually think that makes us want DA2 to be more like the ME2. I mean, say what you want about shooters, at least in ME2 I wasn't bored to tears from having to do do the same thing over and over again everytime I fought any monster in the game. From deepstalkers to the bosses, EVERY - SINGLE - FIGHT in the whole damned game was solved in the exact same way: one tank, one DPS dealer, one support Rogue that is more useful to open locked crap than anything else, and my mage just bombarding the enemy with the same spells until everything is killed.

It's boring. It's shallow. My brain goes numb from never having to actually have to think on what I should do to adapat to new situations because I never need to adapt. I just need to use the most generic of MMORPG tactics and there you go, the game's already won for you right from the start. Oh, and every once in a while you have to go back and sell your crap. Because, you know, that's so mentally stimulating I can almost feel my brain cells shrivel and die due to the lack of interesst on doing what feels like a formality of clearing my inventory of crap that I don't need.

On the other hand, ME2 had different enemies, all with their strengths, weaknesses and approaches to combat which forced to adapt your equipment and party members according to the situation you had to face. Using the same squadmates through the whole game means that you'll end up facing situations that you won't be able to beat because they're just not cut up for the job. On the other hand, doing the same thing in DA1, means nothing, if you've beaten a Darkspawn with a given party, you can beat everything else.

But hey, ME is a shooter, so I guess it's alright to just lump it up with "the Hal0z" and Modern Warfare so you don't have to actually come up with an intelligent retort. Who's lacking the desire to think now?

Lord Aesir wrote...

Brodyaha wrote...
Awsomeness

...I like you [smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/grin.png[/smilie]

Your opinions on DA:O and the ME games are exactly like mine!

Seconded!

Modifié par Lusitanum, 02 septembre 2010 - 05:19 .

[Tirigon]

Rubbish Hero wrote...

Valve best, only good company market.
Bioware disappoint big day age, $1.99 shades ripoff super extravaganza little turd man sell quest in game content cutout if buy re-sale. Dragon Age 2 Mass Effect. Buy instead witching 2. CD Project passion no big wig fat cat profeeterer. Hipster young forin bunch think change world no tainted.

I don´t understand a single word of what you say.

[Tirigon]

Kilshrek wrote...

Tirigon wrote...

As long as Blizzard continues StarCraft gaming won´t die.
Because StarCraft2 Wings Of Liberty is the best game that has ever existed, and will probably only be topped by Heart of the Swarm and the Protoss part of the Campaign.

It's sweeping statements like these that get my goat sometimes.

I have to disagree with you there, I wouldn't even consider SC anywhere near my greatest, probably on a top 20 list but not on my top 10 for sure.

Homeworld and Total Annihilation would be my top two, then Age of Empires, Total War games...  But that's just my opinion.

It´s a matter of age, I think. When I started playing PC games more than once in a month Total Annihilation was already old-fashioned. In fact I only heard about it when Supreme Commander was praised as its unofficial sequel. Which was a good game, btw, but nowhere close to StarCraft.
Homeworld, now, hearing about it the first time. Total War is fine, Age of Empires was good when Win 95 was modern, but nowadays it´s just no longer relevant.

[shootist70]

HTTP 404 wrote...


Guess what I kind of agree with the OP.    rpg "elements" are really subjective.  When I played pencil and paper RPG we didnt concern ourselves with items, loot, etc but created very good stories.

This guy gets it.

Compelling plot, characters and story > intrinsic reward based, rat maze gameplay everytime.

Modifié par shootist70, 02 septembre 2010 - 06:29 .