175 réponses à ce sujet

[IndigoWolfe]

What does "demonized" really mean? In what context is it?

Demons seemed to come in all shapes and sizes, demons of desire being the only human-looking ones with prominant horns.

And as one so aptly put it, horns do not make you evil. Neither does having these weird braid things in your hair make you evil just because Loghain has them.

Perception and preconception are powerful things, but not things that are to be trusted readily.

If you were to view things from, let's say, a dwarf. To them, a human woman would look like a desire demon sans horns. To them we would appear "demonized".

And the extent of the qunari's horns seen in the trailer was something I doubt is very common in qun culture. I'll bet that most either simply do not have horns that grow to that extent, or they cut them down, like a man grooms his beard.

[Maconbar]

aries1001 wrote...

During Shale's personal quest, I met an Ogre Alpha. Very very difficult to beat, especially since he had --- wait for it - horns. And liked to do like a bull when attacking. If you've read the codex entry about this, you'd know that the Ogres have horns because they're corrupted Quanaris. Logically, it must therefore follow that Quanaris have horns.

Also, the trailer was made by BLUR; some of us still look at the Sacred Ashes trailer (from the first game)
and think: 'why don't they look like this - in the game?'

And cows and bulls aren't evil, just because they have horns...

But bulls are evil that's why men in sparkly outfits, aka matadors, have to kill them with swords.

[Blastback]

The thing with me is that the horns are a bit jarring. I have a genuinly hard time reconcyling them with the species that we were introduced to in Origins. Just a mental does not compute. Maybe it will get better over time, but it sorta hurts my ability to associate the two games as the same world. But that is just me.

[SoR82]

MortalEngines wrote...


It's not a re-design, it's was already stated that Qunari have horns, now we get to see it. I do want Bioware to explain more about the Qunari however as there is much to be explained.

Yes you see but people keep saying this and no one has been able to tell me where it says this seriously I jsut wanna know where it is. Everyone says they already stated but no one seems to be telling me where.

[Raxxman]

Because it's a classic internet argument that if you repeat something enough times it's true.

[RazorrX]

I always wondered why they did NOT have horns. Ogres come from Qunari, and they have horns. Makes sense that the Qunari would have horns. I do not remember any other darkspawn who gained a physical feature that was not in the base race.



Hurlocks do not have horns or tails, nor do genlocks, shrieks, etc. Now shrieks are pretty odd looking, but no new physical traits, just more corrupted looking.

[ErichHartmann]

David Gaider.....

It may be
genetic-- I'm hesitant to get into a discussion of genetics in fantasy
races, but certainly the Talmassrans selectively breed qunari and from
the nature of qunari society it might not be too far a stretch to
suppose that they breed them to suit their roles more closely.

Hornless
qunari are not rare freaks of nature-- simply uncommon. Most of the
Ben-Hassrath are hornless, for instance, and thus your average qunari
might be forgiven for thinking that a lack of horns is very
intimidating.

[Raxxman]

RazorrX wrote...

I always wondered why they did NOT have horns. Ogres come from Qunari, and they have horns. Makes sense that the Qunari would have horns. I do not remember any other darkspawn who gained a physical feature that was not in the base race.

Hurlocks do not have horns or tails, nor do genlocks, shrieks, etc. Now shrieks are pretty odd looking, but no new physical traits, just more corrupted looking.

I don't like that line of reasoning as it requires Ogres to be the Qunari norm, and ALL the Qunari you encounter in DA:O to be the exception.

I mean you can flip your statement around to say:

"I always wondered why Ogres have horns. Ogres come from Qunari, and they don't have horns (as far as DA:O goes). Makes sense that the Orges wouldn't have horns. I do not remember any other darkspawn who gained a physical feature that was not in the base race."

and it's just as logical as your previous statement *.

* I'm not saying your statement is wrong, mearly that it is derived from bad logic.

Modifié par Raxxman, 30 août 2010 - 05:57 .

[Reaverwind]

Blastback wrote...

The thing with me is that the horns are a bit jarring. I have a genuinly hard time reconcyling them with the species that we were introduced to in Origins. Just a mental does not compute. Maybe it will get better over time, but it sorta hurts my ability to associate the two games as the same world. But that is just me.

I know what you mean. Right now, I can't help but wonder if the new Qunari aren't displaced Draenei.

Modifié par Reaverwind, 30 août 2010 - 06:03 .

[NightmarezAbound]

I like the horns on thr Qunari.

Maybe there are different types of Qunari as well. The Sten being one of their basically scouts. You'd want them to look more like the other races, from a distance, you see a humanoid, not until they grow close do you maybe realize the size.

Maybe this is one of the ways the Qun decide who fits into what role in their society?



and there as at least basis as Ogre, who have horns, are the Darkspawn birthed of Qunari Broodmothers.

[HTTP 404]

Quanaris eat babies

[MortalEngines]

SoR82 wrote...

MortalEngines wrote...


It's not a re-design, it's was already stated that Qunari have horns, now we get to see it. I do want Bioware to explain more about the Qunari however as there is much to be explained.

Yes you see but people keep saying this and no one has been able to tell me where it says this seriously I jsut wanna know where it is. Everyone says they already stated but no one seems to be telling me where.

I remember being linked this in a thread a while back, something about it being in a Codex in Origins or something. I haven't confirmed it myself, I'm sure someone else could. I get what you getting at though and I don't blame your questions. 

[Wishpig]

You know what I thought when I saw Sten and first learned about Quanris.



Wow, their so cool sounding on paper... but christ they look so mah. Their just tall and buff humans. We have a race of short and skinny humans with pointy ears (aka elves), shorter and fat humans (aka dwarves), and now a race of tall and strong humans.



Making them look the way they do is simply a matter of making them more visually appealing and unique. If you ask me it's working.



I am not 100% behind the artistic redesign of the game, but I am 100% the quanari redesign.

[Rhayth]

I'm sorry i'm going to have to agree, maybe not the demon thingy, but it does seem like this was something just kind of thrown in there, and expecting everyone to just openly accept that all Qunari have no horns. How many bands do you fight in Origins, and how many do you cross in Awakening? And it just so happens that not one Qunari with horns is roaming around Ferelden? I'm not horribly taken back by this, but it was one of the first things that made me say WTF?! I never once saw mention of this in a codex or any info, but its being treated like its been common knowledge the whole time.



I don't see why it couldn't just be a different race from the Qunari they were already oh so unique did they really need horns to make them stand out more? I think making these "horned" Qunari was just a means of not having to come up with a name for another race, which I think would have been better to add more depth to a very rich world they've created.



Am I losing sleep over it? No! Did my first thoughts be one of confusion. Yes! I think making a whole new race would have been better, even if they shared the Qunari lands thats fine to might explain the Qunari culture some, but to just openly accept such a drastic change is just fanboy-ism at its finest

[Bryy_Miller]

nhsk wrote...
 Retcon.

That word. I do not think it means what you think it means.

[CptSkull]

SOLID_EVEREST wrote...

nhsk wrote...

"Not all qunari have horns"

No, but they also said that it is very rare for a qunari to not have horns and those born without it are seen as special, akin to be born for some greater purpose.

So 1 in a 1000 qunari does not have horns.

Then why the h*ll do every Quinari in Ferelden--at least from what we've seen--not have horns? They simply tacked this on, and I wish they at least admitted it instead of saying this and that to cover it up. If they could point to a single codex that mentions this, I would be more than pleased. I mean even Sten's fade Quinari didn't have horns, and neither did the Quinari mercenaries. Since so many have horns, why not the ones that are in Ferelden...

I think I read somewhere that some Quinari cut off their horns, to show that they are no longer part of the Quinari nation.
Example: Mercenaries

But those born without are meant for something great.
Example: Sten and his friends.

[HTTP 404]

CptSkull wrote...

SOLID_EVEREST wrote...

nhsk wrote...

"Not all qunari have horns"

No, but they also said that it is very rare for a qunari to not have horns and those born without it are seen as special, akin to be born for some greater purpose.

So 1 in a 1000 qunari does not have horns.

Then why the h*ll do every Quinari in Ferelden--at least from what we've seen--not have horns? They simply tacked this on, and I wish they at least admitted it instead of saying this and that to cover it up. If they could point to a single codex that mentions this, I would be more than pleased. I mean even Sten's fade Quinari didn't have horns, and neither did the Quinari mercenaries. Since so many have horns, why not the ones that are in Ferelden...

I think I read somewhere that some Quinari cut off their horns, to show that they are no longer part of the Quinari nation.
Example: Mercenaries

But those born without are meant for something great.
Example: Sten and his friends.

ah but could you tell the difference between the ones who cut their horns off and the ones not born with them?  I couldnt. 

It doesnt bother me that Qunari have horns, I think its pretty cool.  But you got to admit it was more of a DA2 decision to implement than it was originally in DAO.  In fact I dont think there was a codex in DAO about qunari having horns?

[Heavenblade]

We need a female Qunari LI to set us straight. She can show us the human (and sensual) side of her race...

[Mouse That Roared]

You're right, the codex doesn't mention horns but that's easily explained by Brother Genitivi being a lush who really pulled a Stephen Glass on the codex.

[Bryy_Miller]

Raxxman wrote...

Because it's a classic internet argument that if you repeat something enough times it's true.

Except when it is true.

Multiple people lying about something the devs already answered? But of course! 

SoR82 wrote...

MortalEngines wrote...


It's not a re-design, it's was already stated that Qunari have horns, now we get to see it. I do want Bioware to explain more about the Qunari however as there is much to be explained.

Yes you see but people keep saying this and no one has been able to tell me where it says this seriously I jsut wanna know where it is. Everyone says they already stated but no one seems to be telling me where.

In the Qunari thread. It's buried deep in the past pages. Try the search button.

Modifié par Bryy_Miller, 31 août 2010 - 04:41 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

I do share some of the OP's concern. While the Qunari's new look doesn't mean they are getting necessarily villanised, the fact that they seemingly will try to invade the Free Marches makes them a main if not the main antagonist of the game (I assume that's how Hawke becomes champion, by beating them).

I don't mind them being antagonists, in fact it was hinted at that they are going to invade soon. What I will mind however is if Bioware will try to villanise them, as in make them the darkspawn's replacement for mindless heartless souless villains to hack and slash.

Now I am not saying that the Qunari are beyond ruthlessness, I disagree with a lot of their philosophy. But they never came accross, to me at least, as a very cruel and barbaric race (if such a thing exists. And they don't sound any more cruel than the human kingdoms). So I hope they won't turn them into that. The Qunari are interesting and I am sure they have their faults and their bright spots. Try to show case both.

I guess what I am saying is that the horned look doesn't really bother me, but if it's used to say "hey look! We Qunari are evil!", then I am going to facepalm.

[CptSkull]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

I do share some of the OP's concern. While the Qunari's new look doesn't mean they are getting necessarily villanised, the fact that they seemingly will try to invade the Free Marches makes them a main if not the main antagonist of the game (I assume that's how Hawke becomes champion, by beating them).
I don't mind them being antagonists, in fact it was hinted at that they are going to invade soon. What I will mind however is if Bioware will try to villanise them, as in make them the darkspawn's replacement for mindless heartless souless villains to hack and slash.
Now I am not saying that the Qunari are beyond ruthlessness, I disagree with a lot of their philosophy. But they never came accross, to me at least, as a very cruel and barbaric race (if such a thing exists. And they don't sound any more cruel than the human kingdoms). So I hope they won't turn them into that. The Qunari are interesting and I am sure they have their faults and their bright spots. Try to show case both.
I guess what I am saying is that the horned look doesn't really bother me, but if it's used to say "hey look! We Qunari are evil!", then I am going to facepalm.

Sten was as, some would say, "a softie"......who killed an entire family with his bare hand, because he lost his sword. I think that most Qunari who follow The Qun are brainwash to a degree greater than what the Chantry does. 

Modifié par CptSkull, 31 août 2010 - 06:43 .

[AtreiyaN7]

CptSkull wrote...

Sten was as, some would say, "a softie"......who killed an entire family with his bare hand, because he lost his sword. I think that most Qunari who follow The Qun are brainwash to a degree greater than what the Chantry does. 

Wrong...so wrong. Sten panicked and basically says that he panicked when he found out that he had lost his sword, and losing his sword was like losing a piece of his soul (or his entire soul - whichever  ). It has nothing to do with brainwashing, and as you might also recall, Sten submitted peacefully to arrest because he felt badly about what he had done. 

Ultimately, he put himself in that cage in Lothering because he was trying to atone. Yeah, that's totally what a homicidal maniac/brainwashed fanatic with no conscience would do. Their philosophy is strict and their caste-based society is definitely rigid, but they also know right from wrong and have a sense of morality.

Modifié par AtreiyaN7, 31 août 2010 - 08:46 .

[Arttis]

They brain wash them to follow their code of conduct.

[TSamee]

True... but the brainwashing results in people with wills of steel. The impression I got from the Qunari was something like... imagine Buddhism, but with a martial element and an understanding of violence. Possibly with the same "gotta convert 'em all!" philosophy that's present in modern-day Islam (I'm not saying that's right; I'm learning traditional Arabic so I can interpret for myself). Or maybe it's less conversion, more imperialism, not so sure.

Still, they're certainly very interesting as a race, if they get turned into cardboard ogres I'm going to be annoyed. I think continuity will be quite easy to preserve in regards to Sten being, well... not a demon person. The Qunari have conquered buckets of races; Sten might not be "pure Qunari". Or perhaps being non-horned is just random, and hornless soldiers are selected for squads like Sten's. Must be easier to see a seven-foot man with bronze skin spying on you than it is to see a giant demon-person.

EDIT: I understand that sticking obstinately to a doctrine and having a strong will are two different things; Sten seems to do both. However, the only time when his actions aren't controlled by an iron will is when he kills the family upon losing his sword. That's his only moment of weakness during the entire game.

Modifié par TSamee, 31 août 2010 - 10:12 .