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Male on Male Romance for Hawke (updated - S/S romances confirmed)


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#1326
Tranceptor

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Ryzaki wrote...

 

Saibh wrote...



There will be no qunari LIs--Mary Kirby said as much. And, yeah, I'm gunning for a human warrior Nathaniel-type.


Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo!

:crying:

Gah. Human warrior is my only hope!



No qunari for youImage IPB

Male quanri aren't really all that appealing to me though. A male warrior is more of like what I want to see for my male Hawke. But I feel your pain, cause a female qunari would have been awesome for me female Hawke, what with the horns, and the white hair, the solid well muscled physique, the fact that they can be so rough in the sack that it could be fatal. . . you'd have to use restraints of iron chains just to survive their powerful. . . . Image IPB

. . . um, I've suddenly gotta go take care of something.

Modifié par Tranceptor, 05 novembre 2010 - 02:58 .


#1327
Dhiro

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Good luck, my friend.

#1328
Tranceptor

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It's cool, I've had a lot of practice. Image IPB

#1329
Eveangaline

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No Qunari!?



T_______T noooooo, first no romanceable sten, now this! I am saddended

#1330
LoveAsThouWilt

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I kind of feel as if the Romances have died in Bioware after Mass Effect 1. I mean, in tasteful romanticness. I mean the scene in Mass Effect 1 was awesome. Beautiful. Yet in ME2 they stuck with the non-cutscene style clothed groping. It was just distasteful and felt nothing like a pivotal point in romance as they did back in Mass Effect1. And DAO is on the same bench, well a bit lesser, in terms of quality, but in terms of sense more. (DAO graphics worse, DAO sense making, kinda, clothes or lack there of. ME2 clothed groping...) only romance I enjoyed in ME2 was carrying through with Shadow Broker and romancing no one BUT Liara. I'm sticking with her through and through with that Shepard. I do plan to go back through ME1 then ME2 as a hermit with no romances so I can at least, IMAGINE that I choose Kaiden.... After all, when saving his life I DID have his legs over my shoulder. Poor taste? You decide! lol

#1331
ErichHartmann

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BioWare needs to dump clothes and underwear in romantic cut scenes. They can do nudity without going all the way. A bare back shot would be nice though. :D

#1332
upsettingshorts

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A Qunari romance - straight or gay - would be antithetical to the Qun, would it not? That rules out died-in-the-wool believer Sten, but not an ex-patriot Qunari. In the future, I mean, not DA:2.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 05 novembre 2010 - 03:40 .


#1333
Ryzaki

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Yeah it would've been awesome but alas. No man Qunari for dude Hawke.



D:



I just hope it's not another elf.

#1334
LoveAsThouWilt

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ErichHartmann wrote...

BioWare needs to dump clothes and underwear in romantic cut scenes. They can do nudity without going all the way. A bare back shot would be nice though. :D


Agreed, but I guess that could be a bit biased, because, well, I like male backs lol

Also Bioware, and EA too, need to realize that their games are rated M or whatever for a reason: most of their audience is getting older, are adults. So, show the nudity, like we're going to gripe. Its their creative licsence to do so! Its not like we're asking for a porn sim, that would be idiotic. We want a realistic subplot romance that really brings us into the game and really FEEL that the romance is real. Hell, if I were a more artistic person, or computer savvy, I probably would have aimed for the goal of working in the gaming industry to develop my dream game... Suffice to say I'll just have to keep it to myself then lol

#1335
Ryzaki

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Yes ME1 did it beautifully.

Alas they never did it again D:

Damn you Faux News! *shakes fist* 

Modifié par Ryzaki, 05 novembre 2010 - 03:41 .


#1336
Tree Huggerz

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LoveAsThouWilt wrote...

ErichHartmann wrote...

BioWare needs to dump clothes and underwear in romantic cut scenes. They can do nudity without going all the way. A bare back shot would be nice though. :D


Agreed, but I guess that could be a bit biased, because, well, I like male backs lol

Also Bioware, and EA too, need to realize that their games are rated M or whatever for a reason: most of their audience is getting older, are adults. So, show the nudity, like we're going to gripe. Its their creative licsence to do so! Its not like we're asking for a porn sim, that would be idiotic. We want a realistic subplot romance that really brings us into the game and really FEEL that the romance is real. Hell, if I were a more artistic person, or computer savvy, I probably would have aimed for the goal of working in the gaming industry to develop my dream game... Suffice to say I'll just have to keep it to myself then lol


BW is smarter then you think they knew someone would make a nude mod so they wouldnt have to make the game rated Adults only.

#1337
LoveAsThouWilt

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Tree Huggerz wrote...

LoveAsThouWilt wrote...

ErichHartmann wrote...

BioWare needs to dump clothes and underwear in romantic cut scenes. They can do nudity without going all the way. A bare back shot would be nice though. :D


Agreed, but I guess that could be a bit biased, because, well, I like male backs lol

Also Bioware, and EA too, need to realize that their games are rated M or whatever for a reason: most of their audience is getting older, are adults. So, show the nudity, like we're going to gripe. Its their creative licsence to do so! Its not like we're asking for a porn sim, that would be idiotic. We want a realistic subplot romance that really brings us into the game and really FEEL that the romance is real. Hell, if I were a more artistic person, or computer savvy, I probably would have aimed for the goal of working in the gaming industry to develop my dream game... Suffice to say I'll just have to keep it to myself then lol


BW is smarter then you think they knew someone would make a nude mod so they wouldnt have to make the game rated Adults only.


Well some of us our console gamers and dont know anything about moding and, console wise, would not does such a thing (bad bad bad) and computer wise... too expensive to have a computer capable of playing such games and ACHIEVEMENTS. So there. I want my PURCHASE to be the best game that it can be. If I am going to buy it new, from them, it have better be the best and not downplayed just because "someone will make a mod". This is one of many reason I buy many games used. If companies would put more heart into their games to make them live up to their full potential, ie: not holding back because of the stupid press, then I would probably buy their games from them more often, you know, because they deserve it more.

#1338
Saibh

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Tree Huggerz wrote...

BW is smarter then you think they knew someone would make a nude mod so they wouldnt have to make the game rated Adults only.


Like ME1?

And people have made nude mods (several, actually) for DAO and there's no AO rating. Hell, people have made intricate graphic sex scenes for a ton of different characters and scenarios. It all depends on what the moral guardians get wind of.

Modifié par Saibh, 05 novembre 2010 - 03:53 .


#1339
TrackerTrem

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Omg...what if Zevran showed up, and you could romance him TWICE



DUN DUN DUNNNN

#1340
imyangxp

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I hope in DAO2 we can romance anyone we really love XD



but it seems impossible

#1341
Ziggeh

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This is probably a touch redundant, but I thought I'd comment on the one area of the discussion that I feel Mr. Gaider didn't cover comprehensively. I'm going to call it "Don't get any Gay on me" because it really is that ludicrous, despite being pretty common.

A lot of the discomfort with potentially gay relationships comes from the unwelcome flirting, which the Devs did cover deftly. It makes me rather uncomfortable personally, but I rather like the fact that that discomfort effects how I percieve the character involved, it adds depth to the experience. The moral choices in Origins made me uncomfortable too, and similarly this was part of it's emotional weight. If it makes you uncomfortable to the extent that you cannot bring yourself to play a game you might otherwise enjoy, then at risk of envoking a stereotype, you probably should have a good hard think about why it might effect you so deeply.

The point that I find harder to grasp however; there have been numerous posts in this and other threads that take the position that if a gay relationship is possible, that this possiblity becomes a part of the character they might be playing. That homosexuality will be thrust upon them, so to speak.

I've read it written that some people see the dialogue options provided as the main characters thought process, that all of them occur yet only one acted upon, and this makes sense until you think about what that actually means: that they suffer from massive cognitive dissonance whether they act consistently or not. Seriously, there isn't a lot of subtlety in the Warden or Shepard's playbook, you either rescue the kitten or burn down the tree. It must be tough to reconcile such extremes into a single personality.

Which leaves us with those for whom the possiblity existing apparently defines their character, that it makes them by default bisexual. This is probably just me, but it never occured to me that Lielana might be bisexual until I read it on the forum. In one playthrough she slept with a guy, and was straight, in another she slept with a woman and was a lesbian. In no one playthrough did she sleep with both (though I understand this is possible, so perhaps she's not a great an example). In one playthrough my Warden was helpful and kind, in another he was a complete tool. This did not mean he was both at once, what it meant was that it was two different stories, with the personalities determined by my actions. Similarly the companions engage in a new, independant story, acting differently, maybe changing in ways they might not have in other playthroughs. It's not static like a novel or a film, where rereading introduces you to the same characters again and again. They are functionally different people, despite maintaining the same template.

This is really my long drawn out way of saying that (and please correct me if I'm wrong and I've missed a viewpoint) in order for potentially homosexual relationships in an RPG to be a problem for your character, it is my beliefe that you have to stretch definitions to place it there. You have to impose that sexual preference there yourself, and has little or nothing to do with the game and the way it is written.

Modifié par ziggehunderslash, 06 novembre 2010 - 02:38 .


#1342
Collider

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Well Leliana is a bit different because she mentions having a female lover. And Zev is a bit different because he says something to the effect of appreciating both men and women.

#1343
highcastle

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imyangxp wrote...

I hope in DAO2 we can romance anyone we really love XD

but it seems impossible


The thing with keeping LIs restricted to a handful of choices is that it means they are more fleshed-out. Look at Fable and it's system of letting you "romance" anyone you want. There's no real, meaningful interaction. I'm fine with 3-4 LIs per gender as long as their stories are interesting and the characters engaging.

#1344
Ziggeh

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Collider wrote...

Well Leliana is a bit different because she mentions having a female lover. And Zev is a bit different because he says something to the effect of appreciating both men and women.

Aha, perhaps I missed that. Like I say, she's clearly not a great example, but the point still stands.

#1345
highcastle

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ziggehunderslash wrote...

This is probably just me, but it never occured to me that Lielana might be bisexual until I read it on the forum. In one playthrough she slept with a guy, and was straight, in another she slept with a woman and was a lesbian. In no one playthrough did she sleep with both (though I understand this is possible, so perhaps she's not a great an example). In one playthrough my Warden was helpful and kind, in another he was a complete tool. This did not mean he was both at once, what it meant was that it was two different stories, with the personalities determined by my actions.


Here's the thing, your Warden is a product of your making. S/he can behave anyway you want. But Leliana is a defined character. She might modify her behavior based on your influence over her, but her past, personality, and sexuality remains defined. Calling her straight because she sleeps with a man or lesbian because she sleeps with a woman is a huge mistake. She's bisexual. Interested in both sexes. Both she and Zevran repeatedly mention this. I know another poster already pointed out this mistake, but I just wanted to reiterate that whoever Zev or Leliana sleeps with in the game, it doesn't change their orientation. They are bisexual, regardless of the Warden's gender, regardless if s/he sleeps with them.

#1346
Ziggeh

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highcastle wrote...

Here's the thing, your Warden is a product of your making. S/he can behave anyway you want. But Leliana is a defined character. She might modify her behavior based on your influence over her, but her past, personality, and sexuality remains defined. Calling her straight because she sleeps with a man or lesbian because she sleeps with a woman is a huge mistake.

I'm not calling her that, I was saying that it didn't occur to me, presumably bceause I missed or overlooked a dialogue key. I was trying to give an example of something that was contained wholy within the current playthrough and not effected by external knowledge, clearly it was a poor example.

#1347
Jimmy Fury

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ziggehunderslash wrote...

highcastle wrote...

Here's the thing, your Warden is a product of your making. S/he can behave anyway you want. But Leliana is a defined character. She might modify her behavior based on your influence over her, but her past, personality, and sexuality remains defined. Calling her straight because she sleeps with a man or lesbian because she sleeps with a woman is a huge mistake.

I'm not calling her that, I was saying that it didn't occur to me, presumably bceause I missed or overlooked a dialogue key. I was trying to give an example of something that was contained wholy within the current playthrough and not effected by external knowledge, clearly it was a poor example.


Don't bother Zigge. For some reason NPC sexuality is automatically metagamed no matter what. Trying to explain how it's illogical will never work. I've tried.

#1348
Tae Jir

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ziggehunderslash wrote...

The point that I find harder to grasp however; there have been numerous posts in this and other threads that take the position that if a gay relationship is possible, that this possiblity becomes a part of the character they might be playing. That homosexuality will be thrust upon them, so to speak.

I've read it written that some people see the dialogue options provided as the main characters thought process, that all of them occur yet only one acted upon, and this makes sense until you think about what that actually means: that they suffer from massive cognitive dissonance whether they act consistently or not. Seriously, there isn't a lot of subtlety in the Warden or Shepard's playbook, you either rescue the kitten or burn down the tree. It must be tough to reconcile such extremes into a single personality.

Which leaves us with those for whom the possiblity existing apparently defines their character, that it makes them by default bisexual. This is probably just me, but it never occured to me that Lielana might be bisexual until I read it on the forum. In one playthrough she slept with a guy, and was straight, in another she slept with a woman and was a lesbian. In no one playthrough did she sleep with both (though I understand this is possible, so perhaps she's not a great an example). In one playthrough my Warden was helpful and kind, in another he was a complete tool. This did not mean he was both at once, what it meant was that it was two different stories, with the personalities determined by my actions. Similarly the companions engage in a new, independant story, acting differently, maybe changing in ways they might not have in other playthroughs. It's not static like a novel or a film, where rereading introduces you to the same characters again and again. They are functionally different people, despite maintaining the same template.

This is really my long drawn out way of saying that (and please correct me if I'm wrong and I've missed a viewpoint) in order for potentially homosexual relationships in an RPG to be a problem for your character, it is my beliefe that you have to stretch definitions to place it there. You have to impose that sexual preference there yourself, and has little or nothing to do with the game and the way it is written.


Hey ziggehunderslash...

I liked your post. It would be like if players complained that because they could create either a male or female character that it then followed that their character must be a hermaphrodite! No, of course, and the same when there is the option of a gay choice (as opposed to the gay/bi backstory).

But, (dude), the ugly truth is that some guys are just bigots and any mention/possibility of m4m action, no matter the ability to NOT act on it, raises their ire. Your intelligent reasoning ain't going to touch those guys! Those guys are after an inquisition (sp?) world: pure and unsullied as they understand it.

#1349
Tae Jir

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I had a post earlier detailing what I'd like to see for Hawke's squeeze time. But I've been thinking since then and would have to say that any type would do:



An allusion to a past encounter, a one off current boink, an ongoing romance, a Spartan pairing.

Quanari, human, dwarf, elf.

Good guy, bad guy.



So yeah, anything goes.



And that's because of the poverty of same sex attraction in video games. I wouldn't care so much that Dragon Age have another, or care so little about its type if dude action was commonplace, if any old game I played included it. You know: I 'm playing some mindless 'pick up a gun and shoot anything that moves' and some random voice over goes:

"Watch your back!"

Oh yeah! Going to keep it pretty for you, bossman!"



But, as it is, it's (we are) pretty rare. So it has increased importance.



For you young uns in the age of Obama, and media visibility of racial diversity: its a bit like before that. When the appearance of any race other than European background in any major position was a breakthrough.



So, yeah, I guess what I'm saying is I'll even be (somewhat) happy with a gay Darkspawn pairing that Hawke has to fight.



sigh



Talk about reduced expectations...


#1350
Ziggeh

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Tae Jir wrote...

I liked your post. It would be like if players complained that because they could create either a male or female character that it then followed that their character must be a hermaphrodite! No, of course, and the same when there is the option of a gay choice (as opposed to the gay/bi backstory).

Hah, indeed, that's it, that's it exactly.

I guess you can't really blame people for thinking this way, it's a rare situation, to have optional elements of the narrative that don't take part within the individual story you're seeing, I guess it's unique to roleplaying forms.

And I don't really blame people who take offense at such things, as I said, I myself was uncomfortable with Zevran's openness, and I can easily see how people could turn that into external anger rather than deal with it emotionally. I guess that's why, as you and jimmy said, it comes across as illogical, because it's people trying to rationalise an emotional effect.

Slightly fascinating. I guess it's a good job I'm not a game writer, I don't think I could resist questioning peoples irrrationality.