215 réponses à ce sujet

[Merlin Dawnweaver]

But it does not preclude certain humans with enough cunning from studying the technology, especially during a qunari invasion.
I play a mage too. But there is delicious irony in shooting a heavily armored warrior on the face with a firearm.
Like this

Modifié par Merlin Dawnweaver, 31 août 2010 - 08:21 .

[gotthammer]

Merlin Dawnweaver wrote...

gotthammer wrote...
I still say: Armoured Golems w/ breech-loading cannons mounted on 'em.

At last, back to war.

Just thinking about Caridin saying that make me burst out in laughter.

Hehehe. Yeah. When I met Caridin, one of the first things that came to mind was: "Eh? Dreadnought?"
(the notion only reinforced further when you find out more about DA's Golems....  )
Heck, the only thing lacking was the Assault Cannon arm and Imperial emblems. 

Re: Warmachine and an Industrial Revolution
Maybe not in the current Age (Dragon Age), but maybe the whole steampunk feel can come later (Steam Age? lol...then maybe a Cyberpunk-ish Age, followed by Mass Age?  ).

(I mean, you can even, kinda, break it down WM/Horde style, in a way: Chantry (Orlais?) = Menoth, Blight/Darkspawn = Cryx/Legion of Everblight, Tevinter = Khador? Cygnar? Qunari = Skorne? Elves/Dwarves = Elves/Dwarves, or something like that  )

IMHO, with some magic/tech, they can bring some level of firearms usage to the present setting, methinks, without having to go all Renaissance or Industrial Revolution. 

[zylas223]

You guys are weird. Why do you associate guns with Fable or WoW? Why not with Warhammer? It's an ultimate proof that guns DO fit dark fantasy even better than swords or bows.

[Merlin Dawnweaver]

You got me thinking - wouldn't a spin-off series set in a dark Renaissance be awesome ? It would be truly epic pitting the last blight against an industrial Theldas. Ranks of darkspawn advancing under Gatling gun fire ? Cannon armed golem battle ogres for the control of deep roads ? Fleets of Airships struggle for the ultimate destiny of the Imperium ? It cannot fail to be awesome. As for a name, I'd simply call it The Iron Age

think of it - there hasn't been much dark fantasy treatment of the renaissance/industrial age other then FMA ... And since machines are immune to the taint, they would present the ultimate solutions against the darkspawns.

Back to guns in DA - I think a DLC would be the best compromise between hardcore sword and sorcery fan and progressive fans looking for more options.

Modifié par Merlin Dawnweaver, 31 août 2010 - 08:51 .

[gotthammer]

zylas223 wrote...

You guys are weird. Why do you associate guns with Fable or WoW? Why not with Warhammer? It's an ultimate proof that guns DO fit dark fantasy even better than swords or bows.

Yup. At the very least Warhammer Fantasy makes it look cool: Imperial gunners and steam tanks and all that. If anything, it's an argument for having both magic and tech working together: you have spellcasters like Bright Wizards working together with gunners and cannon/mortar, even rockets, as well as using 'older' weapons, such as halberds and bows/crossbows.

Warmachine/Iron Kingdoms, tho', has Warjacks: which are, for all intents and purposes, steam-powered Golems (they're still magical, the just run on steam lol), some with guns.

Merlin Dawnweaver wrote...

You got me thinking - wouldn't a spin-off series set in a dark Renaissance be awesome ? It would be truly epic pitting the last blight against an industrial Theldas. Ranks of darkspawn advancing under Gatling gun fire ? Cannon armed golem battle ogres for the control of deep roads ? Fleets of Airships struggle for the ultimate destiny of the Imperium ? It cannot fail to be awesome. As for a name, I'd simply call it The Iron Age

think of it - there hasn't been much dark fantasy treatment of the renaissance/industrial age other then FMA ... And since machines are immune to the taint, they would provide the ultimate solutions against the darkspawns.

Yeah. I can imagine that that would be nice. Hmm. 'Iron Age'? Maybe another name (might be too close to Privateer Press' 'Iron Kingdoms', considering the theme of the idea  )

Back to guns in DA - I think a DLC would be the best compromise between hardcore sword and sorcery fan and progressive fans looking for more options.

Hmm. Maybe. Having it in the core game would be nicer, tho'. 

Modifié par gotthammer, 31 août 2010 - 08:50 .

[Merlin Dawnweaver]

Each age of Thedas is named after some omen at beginning at it. How about The age of ashes, named after the soot smoke that hangs over cities in this age?

We are really getting ahead of ourselves here, but the idea is novel to say the least Perhaps it'd benefit us to start another thread to discuss alternative setting of Thedas ? 

Modifié par Merlin Dawnweaver, 31 août 2010 - 08:56 .

[Lord Gremlin]

I suppose guns can be included. If in DA2 we'll fight qunari at some point we can loot some trophy guns or a cannon, but ammo will be a problem. Also 1-hit kill weapons can be too much
[off-topic image removed]
TOO much. They should be balanced somehow. Remember Mirabel from Jade Empire? Damn thing was way too weak to be useful, it's also a bad thing.

Modifié par Stanley Woo, 31 août 2010 - 08:33 .

[gotthammer]

Merlin Dawnweaver wrote...

Each age of Thedas is named after some omen at beginning at it. How about The age of ashes, named after the soot smoke that hangs over cities in this age?

Something like that, I guess.

We are really getting ahead of ourselves here, but the idea is novel to say the least Perhaps it'd benefit us to start another thread to discuss alternative setting of Thedas ? 

Nah, no need (and, yes, perhaps too far ahead). I'm off to play hehehe *toss coin between DA:O and Hearts of Iron 2 w/ the Kaiserreich mod lol*

It would be nice if the story of Thedas were to progress as w/ games like Arcanum or the Iron Kingdoms setting, tech-wise, anyway. 
(would be even cooler: if, somehow, the Warden and Morrigan can be in said progress through the centuries/millennium)
As I said earlier (I think), I wouldn't mind seeing the setting progress up to the point of tech in Mass Effect, but with the elements that make the DA setting what it is (magic, lyrium, the Blights, the Fade, Morrigan  )


In the meantime, I'd like to see some guns. 
A rifle/musket/brace of pistols for Hawke (and...guns for the Warden, too? For DA3? 4? 5?  )
(come on! gimme a golem that I can up-armor and mount multiple breech-loading  cannons on! )

Modifié par gotthammer, 31 août 2010 - 09:06 .

[Gwinever]

I wouldn't mind the Qunari using actual cannons, but as for the other races, no.

Seriously, why would they want weapons that implode on a regulair basis (early cannons/muskets did that alot) over mages that are a tad more reliable and can easely have a higher rate of casting devastating spells. also bows/crossbows are far more reliable.

As for the Qunari using them, they don't trust mages at all wich is possibly the very reason they develloped gunpowder in the first place.

[shootist70]

Nooo, no firearms please. If firearms are even fairly commonplace then you have to change ALL the armour in the game or it just becomes daft. Nobody in their right mind would be running around in full plate armour, and chainmail becomes pretty useless, as does most light armours.



The odd cannon would be ok, I guess.

[Jahay]

Nooooooo, way too farfetched for Dragon Age.

Modifié par Jahay, 31 août 2010 - 11:22 .

[wowpwnslol]

shootist70 wrote...

Nooo, no firearms please. If firearms are even fairly commonplace then you have to change ALL the armour in the game or it just becomes daft. Nobody in their right mind would be running around in full plate armour, and chainmail becomes pretty useless, as does most light armours.

The odd cannon would be ok, I guess.

Easily remedied by adding power armors into the game. I am thinking something like this:

[shootist70]

I like your thinking. Insanity always offers a refreshing perspective.

[Behindyounow]

Early firearms would be ok. I just can't stand idiots who think guns kill Fantasy.

[gotthammer]

Ooh. 'Powered armor' would be nice. Maybe have it lyrium-fueled?

Heck, the Blood Dragon armor for DA:O almost looks like powered armor (what with the glowing visor thingy). lol



I do get the point on making firearms commonplace, particularly in terms of armor (then again, can't we assume that some materials in the setting would perform better than what our world had? I mean, I don't recall seeing any sets of Drakescale or Dragonbone armor in the museums I've visited ). The more common armor would become obsolete, yes...but isn't escalation a pretty thing (tragic, yes, but still pretty...e.g., if the Soviets didn't have the T-34, we'd probably never have seen something like the Panther, etc.)? lol



Still, it'd be nice to see some in-game (better yet if your character can use them).

[Kiely]

Sure put in guns but make them matchlock or flintlock muskets (because realistically that's the maximum tech level of the world) and make them as effective as you'd expect them to be, (i.e., totally inaccurate, barely capable of denting thick armour and with a reload time in minutes).



The animation of a guy getting his head loped off by a two-handed sword as he tries to reload his musket should be worth a laugh.

[Arrtis]

I doubt they will have small arms.

It will likely be restricted to artillery.

[gotthammer]

Kiely wrote...

Sure put in guns but make them matchlock or flintlock muskets (because realistically that's the maximum tech level of the world) and make them as effective as you'd expect them to be, (i.e., totally inaccurate, barely capable of denting thick armour and with a reload time in minutes).

Yup.
One shot per fight, per firearm, sounds about right.
If they ever put in a firearm for the setting, I wouldn't expect it to be anything more complex than a flintlock (while something simpler, like a matchlock may seem more apt, I'd think there's enough allowance thanks to magic and 'fantasy metalworkers').
As for the capabilities, maybe no more accurate than a crossbow, but with more 'punch' (again, allowances for magic and whatnot).
 

P.S.: an M-8 Avenger assault rifle (or the Revenant) would be 'amusing', tho' ("ooh, look, that darkspawn/qunari dropped a thermal clip"). 

Modifié par gotthammer, 31 août 2010 - 02:08 .

[zylas223]

I think the argument that only fools would run around in plates while enemy has guns is not good enough - I mean, many armours are magical anyway - and that's pretty much equivalent of power armour. We can't really tell if magical armour is bulletproof - so if they say it is, then it is.

[shootist70]

zylas223 wrote...

I think the argument that only fools would run around in plates while enemy has guns is not good enough - I mean, many armours are magical anyway - and that's pretty much equivalent of power armour. We can't really tell if magical armour is bulletproof - so if they say it is, then it is.

Necessity is the mother of invention -bear that in mind. If most armour is magically capable of repelling musket-balls then the firearm will never evolve. Something as complex and materially costly as a firearm will only evolve if the pay-off is right - ie: it can defeat most armoured opponents.

Modifié par shootist70, 31 août 2010 - 02:51 .

[Risax]

I don't know about this.

It could be possible to include cannons or rifles in the game.

But they have to be owned by Qunari, I mean I doubt that they give away the only edge they have against mages.

[Wulfram]

Firearms never seem to end up balanced. People seem to want them "realistic", which always end up translating as either



1. Ignoring armour, killing anything in one hit.

2. Taking forever to reload, probably with some ridiculously complicated misfire rules to make sure you don't want to use them.



I mean, some people talked about Arcanum? The setting was interesting, but the guns seemed rather less attractive than the boomerangs from a practical point of view

[Vandrayke]

Behindyounow wrote...

Early firearms would be ok.

werd

like the early crappy guns that had a horrible rate of fire and were inaccurate and not all that powerful.  Only worth using by a bunch of untrained peasants.  It would certainly make the peasants more menacing than they would be if they had their usual shovels and quarterstaffs

[Kiely]

Vandrayke wrote...

Behindyounow wrote...

Early firearms would be ok.

werd

like the early crappy guns that had a horrible rate of fire and were inaccurate and not all that powerful.  Only worth using by a bunch of untrained peasants.  It would certainly make the peasants more menacing than they would be if they had their usual shovels and quarterstaffs

Don't forget the pitchforks!

[darthbeermonkey]

If DA2 has lots of invading qunari (as it looks like it might) then I think it would be odd if we didn't see cannons. I think personal firearms is a bit of a stretch though. As has been said before (either in the codex or in a dev quote, can't remember which) the rest of Thedas don't really care about guns when they can bring a mage along instead.