73 réponses à ce sujet

[Boombox]

I generally love co-op games but I really think ME3 should stay single player. I'd be happy if any other Mass Effect related games after ME3 were co-op but I really just wanna finish the trilogy and Shepards story focusing just on single player.

[Zavox]

Yisrael-Shepard, maybe it's a good idea to also listen to the opposite arguments... It's obvious you cannot in any way see what they are talking about.


In a faint, but hopeful attempt I'll try to explain:

Mass Effect has a very immersive storyline contrary to most other games. This is prohibitive to co-op play for only the first player can role play, as in.. join in conversations. Either Bioware has to make extra lines for whatever character the 2nd player is playing (thus more development time) or the 2nd player doesn't have the same experience as the other, thus making Mass Effect no RPG anymore.

In conclussion, implementing co-op in a satisfactory way will require immense development time and resources. If you choose to have a not so satisfactory co-op it will still cost development time and resources, albeit not that much. Though I recon Bioware doesn't want to spend ANY development time and resources on something that's not that worthwhile.

Addition: Half-life 2 would be a very doable co-op experience because of the way the storytelling is structured, Mass Effect isn't. You might also want to try to understand that not every game can or wants to be co-op, and you willing it doesn't make that any more viable. Me wanting Half-Life 3 to have a dialogue wheel as an OPTIONAL experience doesn't make it viable you know.... <_<

[bluesparrow94]

Having co-op may makes the game more complicated and may eat a lot of space in your hard drive.

[Symji]

Yisrael-Shepard wrote...

Do you understand the definition of O P T I O N A L? It seems to be a lost word in the english language, I hope this helps everyone out:

optional
Adj.1.optional - possible but not necessary; left to personal choice
adjective voluntary, open, discretionary, possible, extra, elective, up to the individual, noncompulsory Some people feel sex education should remain an optional school subject.


Negativity is never cool.

Putting multiplayer in as an option would have to totally change the structure of the game for all parts other than straight up action. It would require either 
A: Removing all dialogue from whatever mission you are in. Or
B: Removing control of your friends co-op character from them during the dialogue scenes. Or even scarier
C: Allowing your friend to decide that characters dialogue choices.

Two of these options alter the fundamental principles of a game like this, and the other would put your co-op partner in the back seat on a regular basis, as there are a large amount of conversations interspersed through the missions. Also, I doubt your buddy would actually like to sit there while you take care of the large amount of non-combat stuff that's in this game.

[robtheguru]

I think it's probably safe to say that if the Old Republic does well then there is a large chance Bioware may run an MMO in either the Mass Effect or Dragon Age series'.

[Darc_Requiem]

Boombox you make good point. A co-op game in the ME universe would be great. ME3 being co-op, not so much. I like co-op games but I also like the single player experience and the single player experience almost always suffers in games with co-op.

@OP

Creating this thread was optional. You did so even though in the initial post you knew this wasn't a popular idea. It was your personal choice. If you can't deal with dissenting opinions or negativity, then posting on internet forums is an option you may want to avoid in the future.

Modifié par Darc_Requiem, 31 août 2010 - 12:56 .

[Zavox]

robtheguru wrote...

I think it's probably safe to say that if the Old Republic does well then there is a large chance Bioware may run an MMO in either the Mass Effect or Dragon Age series'.

I doubt it, those 2 MMO's will then clash against eachother, thus they do not gain that much. It would probably be better to focus on one MMO for a few years to get it as expansive as WoW.

[gi0m]

pjotroos wrote...

How would Thane, Samara and Kasumi loyalty missions work in co-op? How would you handle all the lengthy dialogues? The renegate and paragon choices? The time you spend on Normandy? This game is designed for solo gameplay. Shooting takes maybe half of the total gameplay time, everything else is handled by single person, while their team idles in the background. Converting it into co-op title would be absolutely impossible without extensive rewrite, that would effectively cheapen the experience and replay value. There's great many co-op titles out there, just stick to one of them instead.

It's easy to make anything sound stupid by exaggerating and make him say what he didn't.
He didn't say that the second player will play the character in the normandy, choose dialogues or else, or even that a second player is compulsory, or on every missions.


Just during missions, a second player can choose between one of the 2 squadmates the 1st player has chosen and control him, IF POSSIBLE. 
If you played Baldur's Gate 2 you'd see that there are no repercussions whatsoever on the game as every time a dialogue is triggered, it's the host that choose the options.

I don't see what's wrong for a 2nd player you invited to kick in during a mission and play with you as one of your squadmate.

[Jebel Krong]

there is no discussion because it wouldn't work - mass effect (trilogy) is the story of shepard. maybe a future game in the universe will have it (or multiplayer) but not this.

[PsyrenY]

Yeesh, no need to quintuple post all the time.



I think ME would be great with co-op. For those worried about the story, immersion etc. - just make it apply only in the combat sections, and have the second player float around the rest of the time.



They've already compartmentalized the shooter sections and separated them from the story areas, so this isn't a huge step. And it's not like being able to whip out my gun anywhere in ME1 let me do anything with it anyway.

[pjotroos]

gi0m wrote...

pjotroos wrote...
How would Thane, Samara and Kasumi loyalty missions work in co-op? How would you handle all the lengthy dialogues? The renegate and paragon choices? The time you spend on Normandy? This game is designed for solo gameplay. Shooting takes maybe half of the total gameplay time, everything else is handled by single person, while their team idles in the background. Converting it into co-op title would be absolutely impossible without extensive rewrite, that would effectively cheapen the experience and replay value. There's great many co-op titles out there, just stick to one of them instead.

It's easy to make anything sound stupid by exaggerating and make him say what he didn't.
He didn't say that the second player will play the character in the normandy, choose dialogues or else, or even that a second player is compulsory, or on every missions.

Just during missions, a second player can choose between one of the 2 squadmates the 1st player has chosen and control him, IF POSSIBLE. 
If you played Baldur's Gate 2 you'd see that there are no repercussions whatsoever on the game as every time a dialogue is triggered, it's the host that choose the options.

I don't see what's wrong for a 2nd player you invited to kick in during a mission and play with you as one of your squadmate.

Where exactly do I exaggerate? He said he wants the game playable in co-op. Both "Mass Effect" games, due to their story-based, cinematical style are continued experience - with the action sections interlaced with all that stuff I mentioned. Other that having your two buddies sit through these, there's only two other options - having them leave and rejoin the game all the time, or cutting out those sections. First is no better than idling by, second requires to change the game drastically. I didn't pull anything out of a dark place, it's just facts you just don't like hearing.

Besides, I did play both parts of "Baldur's Gate". I had a quick look at the multiplayer mode there, and it was showing all the problems I mention. I didn't like riding a shotgun and I don't know anyone that did. The game was ultimately more enjoyable when played solo, and you're the first person I see claiming otherwise. And that's a game that was much less cinematic. Face the facts. This series is really not fit for multiplayer. There's no way around it. Mass Effect universe is, very much so, and I dearly hope it will be followed by some other games in some other genres once the trilogy is done. But Shepard's story was made with a very specific type of gameplay in mind. It's this gameplay that made is so wildly popular and got it its most dedicated fans. Demanding to drastically change the game to fit your taste is obviously annoying for the people that like the game for what it is. Adding the mode you want on top of existing ones without taking away anything from the single player content is not possible. You can try and understand it, or you can keep pretending there's no such thing as development time, any type of gameplay can be implemented instantly and games take years to release simply because developers are spiteful little people.

Modifié par pjotroos, 31 août 2010 - 02:49 .

[PsyrenY]

pjotroos wrote...

The game was ultimately more enjoyable when played solo, and you're the first person I see claiming otherwise.

Consider me the second, then; I see no problem with co-op during combat and "riding shotgun" at other times, especially since nobody is forcing you not to play single-player if you prefer that.

BW has already clearly separated the action sequences - so much so, that you can't even go back to an action area once completed. So I don't see co-op gunplay interfering with the story in the slightest.

Finally, any discussion of "development time" is pointless. None of us - not you, not me, not anyone on these forums without the company logo under their name - knows anything about BW's dev process, or how long it would take to implement something like this. In fact, if they announce in 2011 that the game was delayed a couple of months, they don't even have to say why.

Modifié par Optimystic_X, 31 août 2010 - 03:15 .

[sanadawarrior]

I think they should make a spin off mass effect game that still uses the ME2 gunplay but is for all intents and purposes a diablo/borderlands style co-op experience. Call it Mass Effect: Mercenaries or something like that. You can choose pre set classes to play as (asari adept, salarian engineer, krogan soldier, etc..) then you go off and do missions for xp, loot, money and glory!



However I think co-op should stay out of the main series, it wouldn't fit and would be boring for the people playing the party members, as they would have no say in how money is spent, dialouge choices play out, or where to go next.

[KOKitten]

For those worried about the story, immersion etc. - just make it apply only in the combat sections, and have the second player float around the rest of the time.

Wouldn't that be incredibly boring for the second player?  Not to have any impact on the story other than occasionally firing a weapon?

I love co-op.  Games such as Gears 1 & 2, Rainbow Six Vegas 1 & 2, and GRAW 1 & 2 were more fun played co-op.  Borderlands was a hell of a lot of fun.  However, Borderlands' premise is very simple - ride around and shoot things.  There's no dialogue between party members or even to NPC's.  You pick up a misson from a bounty board or an NPC, do the mission, and return.  There are no story choices.  Other than the beginning and a brief intro of bosses there are no cutscenes.  There's barely a plot.  

I wouldn't care if co-op was implemented in ME3 as long as the plot, characters and game mechanics were not sacrificed.  I wouldn't want BioWare shortening conversations and cutscenes, and removing tactics.  The first Rainbow Six Vegas had up to four player co-op but in this mode you did not experience the same story as when you played solo.  Rainbow Six Vegas 2 remedied this by including the cutscenes into two player co-op.  However, R6V2 has a predetermined storyline, no dialogue and no decisions.

Despite my usual love of co-op I don't think I'd utilize this feature in ME3 if it were available.  In RPG's I like to explore and interact with the NPC's.  I don't want to worry if another player is getting bored or if the other player wants to explore somewhere else.  I have plenty of non-RPG's which have co-op for when I want to socialize.

[Comrade Bork]

Yisrael-Shepard wrote...

 This post will remain an open forum for about 5 minutes until I am censored. Here is my complaint. Mass Effect would be a GREAT Co-Op game (not sure about Multi-player) Just having your friends play as Shepard's Crew would be cool (with extra achievements and unlocks as incentives). This would, just like it is in **ALL OTHER GAMES**, be optional. O-P-T-I-O-N-A-L, what perplexes me is how this community  tries to silence those who wish to have that option, as if they bought me the game.

Personally, I would want Co-Op saved for a spin-off game, but if for some reason it is in ME3, I would like to say NO to extra achievements and unlocks. I am a completionist, and enjoy having maxed-out achievements, and everything in a game unlocked. When you dictate that to get those unlocks I have to play with other people then I have to make that extra effort to find people to play with, and then it might not even be that enjoyable. While Co-op is fun (I really really like it), please save it for a spin-off game.

[Khayness]

Wow, nice spam there OP, bit of a zealot aren't you.

Yisrael-Shepard wrote...

If you don't like the idea of lacking co-op, don't play the game, but DICTATING the developers to do as you wish, is barbaric. I loved ME1 and ME2, but games without Co-op or Multiplayer are like reappearing bacon: once it is eaten, it comes back thanks to the replay value.

I get so sick of the constant demands due the false sense of entitlement. When I read all those comments, it makes me want to leave the entire community, and give up on future Mass Effect games.

The bottom line is games aren't designed for YOU, thay are designed for EVERYONE, and if BioWare has no plans of adding co-op to this series, I accept it.

There, added some fixes.