315 réponses à ce sujet

[Collider]

Has any Bioware game done evil right? I hear criticisms that evil hasn't been done right or is often not done right. That the PC comes off as the idiotic mustache twirling villain rather than  true evil or intelligent evil. What do you think about that?

How should DA2 do evil? Should Hawke even be allowed?

[Lord_Valandil]

Better than Fable, at least.

[Hex of Hell]

Wouldn't that depend on your definition of evil?

[Aggie Punbot]

The thing with realistic evil is that it can easily be mistaken for being good, from a "certain point of view". I think they do evil just fine. After all, look at how many people sympathize with and even defend evil acts (in the games) right here on these forums.

[Anarya]

I think I remember David saying at some point that the PC is meant to be a hero and therefore can't really be evil. You can be an antihero/renegade, but to be truly evil isn't something the writers want for the PC.



But again, I guess you can have different definitions of evil.

[ErichHartmann]

I hate arbitrary lines between what is good and evil. It's all a matter of perspective.

[Dave of Canada]

I liked the evil ending of KOTOR. Other than that, I tend to like their "evil-but-not-evil" systems like Renegade and Closed Fist.

[SDNcN]

Collider wrote...

Has any Bioware game done evil right? I hear criticisms that evil hasn't been done right or is often not done right. That the PC comes off as the idiotic mustache twirling villain rather than  true evil or intelligent evil. What do you think about that?

How should DA2 do evil? Should Hawke even be allowed?

When you are playing an intelligent evil character you generally don't let people know you are evil. Those characters tend more subtle and opportunistic, which was doable within Origins. I don't see why we can't do the same in DA:2.

Modifié par SDNcN, 02 septembre 2010 - 01:28 .

[ObserverStatus]

Na, I think that Bioware should move away from "Good vs Evil" choices and more toward "Making the best of a bad situation" choices.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Captain Hex wrote...

Wouldn't that depend on your definition of evil?

No, as the definition is clear and universally accepted by every single philosopher, scholar and man in existence. 
I mean seriously, read a book. / sarcasm

Sigh, I for one hope that DA2 is mature enough to disregard such an empty label that only exists in people's heads.  

[Dr. wonderful]

You know, it depend on what evil is.

Fable have the Judeo-christian Evil and good, Star wars the Mindset of power and sacrfice. Jade empire, enlighten and COMPLETE MONSTER.

Dragon age? Hero and Anti-Hero.

EDIT: Also BEYOND good and evil

Modifié par Dr. wonderful, 02 septembre 2010 - 01:37 .

[Collider]

Dragon age? Hero and Anti-Hero.

Kind of. Certain options in DA:O seemed pretty...out there. Like killing the wounded soldier in the Korcari Wilds. Obviously evil is subjective, but I can't think of a good reason for killing that soldier besides being a psychopath.

[eucatastrophe]

I can't think of any decision in DA:O that was outright evil other than the stupid Connor ones.

[Dave of Canada]

Dr. wonderful wrote...

Jade empire, enlighten and COMPLETE MONSTER.

How is Jade Empire's closed fist a complete monster?

[ErichHartmann]

eucatastrophe wrote...

I can't think of any decision in DA:O that was outright evil other than the stupid Connor ones.

I don't see how you handled Connor is good or evil.  Way too subjective.

[Agamo45]

eucatastrophe wrote...

I can't think of any decision in DA:O that was outright evil other than the stupid Connor ones.

Murdering Genitivi for no reason.

[Dave of Canada]

Agamo45 wrote...

eucatastrophe wrote...

I can't think of any decision in DA:O that was outright evil other than the stupid Connor ones.

Murdering Genitivi for no reason.

Not evil, you're keeping the ashes from being exploited by the Chantry.

ErichHartmann wrote...

eucatastrophe wrote...

I can't think of any decision in DA:O that was outright evil other than the stupid Connor ones.

I don't see how you handled Connor is good or evil.  Way too subjective.

Letting the demon possess him is pretty bad.

[Dr. wonderful]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Dr. wonderful wrote...

Jade empire, enlighten and COMPLETE MONSTER.

How is Jade Empire's closed fist a complete monster?

You kick puppies...For health at max closed fist and did mention we can kill a god and doom Man?

[C9316]

I think Bioware tends to not define evil very well. It always seems to static to the point that you don't seem evil you just are a supreme douchebag.

[Quinnzel]

I have tried to play Evil a few times in Bioware games, but I always end up a sort of Chaotic Neutral charecter. I dont pay attention to laws or authority and Im about as likely to stab you in the back as a sociopathic turnip.

[Dr. wonderful]

Collider wrote...

Dragon age? Hero and Anti-Hero.

Kind of. Certain options in DA:O seemed pretty...out there. Like killing the wounded soldier in the Korcari Wilds. Obviously evil is subjective, but I can't think of a good reason for killing that soldier besides being a psychopath.

End his pain.

The one real evil act? Taking the money in City elf.

[Dave of Canada]

Dr. wonderful wrote...

You kick puppies...For health at max closed fist and did mention we can kill a god and doom Man?

Aside from the puppies (if true)...  it's all based off the Closed Fist ideal, the strong are better than the weak. You kill the Fox spirit because she's too weak to defend her forest, you kill the Water Dragon (is that it?) because she's failed in her duty and such. It's not evil, it's just the entire dog-eats-dog idea taken to extremes. Just like how good is extremely naive and generous to the extremes.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 02 septembre 2010 - 01:48 .

[Chippetg]

Dr. wonderful wrote...

Collider wrote...

Dragon age? Hero and Anti-Hero.

Kind of. Certain options in DA:O seemed pretty...out there. Like killing the wounded soldier in the Korcari Wilds. Obviously evil is subjective, but I can't think of a good reason for killing that soldier besides being a psychopath.

End his pain.

The one real evil act? Taking the money in City elf.

Nope. Being greedy and loving profits doesn't mean evil. It just means you're a ****.
How about killng the elves during the Landsmeet? Or killing all the Dalish?
Damn, Bioware hates elves...

[C9316]

Dr. wonderful wrote...

Collider wrote...

Dragon age? Hero and Anti-Hero.

Kind of. Certain options in DA:O seemed pretty...out there. Like killing the wounded soldier in the Korcari Wilds. Obviously evil is subjective, but I can't think of a good reason for killing that soldier besides being a psychopath.

End his pain.

The one real evil act? Taking the money in City elf.

What about condeming redcliffe by not helping them at all?

[Dr. wonderful]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Dr. wonderful wrote...

You kick puppies...For health at max closed fist and did mention we can kill a god and doom Man?

Aside from the puppies (if true)...  it's all based off the Closed Fist ideal, the strong are better than the weak. You kill the Fox spirit because she's too weak to defend her forest, you kill the Water Dragon (is that it?) because she's failed in her duty and such. It's not evil, it's just the entire dog-eats-dog idea taken to extremes. Just like how good is extremely naive and generous to the extremes.

And to me that is...morally objectionable behavior.