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[Fallschirmjager007]

Just out of curiosity, I'm wondering if they're any good or worth reading.  From what I've read online, it seems that the books... well, don't really do the game much justice.  Has anyone here read the novels and what did you think?

[Marty Silverblade]

First one is ok but forgettable. Other two are rubbish. Here's something I posted in another thread, don't know if you saw it.



I'd have had little motivation to read it if I didn't love the games as much as I do (just started another BG1 game last Sunday ). It doesn't follow the game completely either, but I don't think that was a priority for the author. As far as the SoA book goes, it was pretty bad. The ending was a complete failure. Basically Irenicus has everything under control and is about to complete his bad guy aspirations when he decides that the best way to get rid of Abdel is to cast Imprisonment (not actually called that, but it's the same effect) on both Abdel and himself. Jaheira starts crying which makes Abdel pop out of the ground (not exaggerating here, that's really what happens), and Irenicus just gets stuck there for eternity... fail.



I can barely remember the ToB book, except that the end sounded much too easy.

[Chebby]

No. They're horrible. To be honest it's like a Uwe Boll game to film in the shape of a novelization. I couldn't stand to read any further into the second book. All I can say is that you won't appreciate it. I let a friend read it, but within a day he decided we should burn it. I don't/can't/won't consider them part of the series.
Jaheira's a whiny damsel in distress with no strength, Khalid's an insipid cheating git, Xan's spider fodder, Xzar's some kind of prophet and the main character's some perfect invulnerable warrior who's seven feet tall and handsome. It was all written by a hack that believes the best way to develop a relationship is to have spiders jump down the female's cleavage so she panic-strickenly gets her breasts out. I've read better fanfiction.

Modifié par Chebby, 02 septembre 2010 - 07:57 .

[Chebby]

Marty Silverblade wrote...
Jaheira starts crying which makes Abdel pop out of the ground

Aerie should've had some form of spell-like ability that casts freedom, in that case. :>

[HoonDing]

Chebby wrote...

It was all written by a hack that believes the best way to develop a relationship is to have spiders jump down the female's cleavage so she panic-strickenly gets her breasts out.

Sword spiders?

[Seagloom]

Chebby wrote...

It was all written by a hack that believes the best way to develop a relationship is to have spiders jump down the female's cleavage so she panic-strickenly gets her breasts out. I've read better fanfiction.

I always found it mildly amusing that Philip Athans, who wrote the first two Baldur's Gate books has been Managing Editor for Wizards of the Coast since 1997. That's two years prior to the Baldur's Gate novel. Since Forgotten Realms novels are treated as canon and Philip Athans is Managing Editor, he may have written it in such a way that barely messes with continuity. Whatever the case may be, his writing is awful. I tried reading some of his Forgotten Realms novels. Each time, they ended up shelved halfway through.

The more amusing tidbit is that Drew Karpyshyn wrote the third book. I cut him a little slack though since he had to finish building on what Philip Athans started. Still, the idea that the same man who contributed to Throne of Bhaal, Mass Effect, Jade Empire, and Knights of the Old Republic also wrote the Throne of Bhaal novelization is vexing. I suppose he's better at video game plots.

[HoonDing]

I feel sad for the writers that TSR hired to write the novels that were supposed to introduce 4th edition... in other words, write stories full of holes & largely ignore decades of established lore.

Even R.A. Salvatore had to buckle down.

Modifié par virumor, 02 septembre 2010 - 12:49 .

[Seagloom]

I do feel sad for some of them. Namely Elaine Cunningham who had some of her characters used in ways she didn't seem to appreciate, and Ed Greenwood who had a massive chunk of his cast of thousands obliterated. Having your entire setting gutted like that has to hurt.

I'm not as sad for R.A. Salvatore. Granted, I did enjoy his Cleric Quintet and some of the Drizzt series. However, Salvatore had a bad habit of doing his own thing even when the lore directly contradicted him. I don't expect, nor do I think it's a good idea for a shared world author to slave themselves to canon. That said, Salvatore had a habit of ignoring details whereas most prolific FR authors colored within the lines, as it were.

Modifié par Seagloom, 02 septembre 2010 - 12:57 .

[HoonDing]

I read an excerpt about an Elminster book in a 2nd edition sourcebook about the 7 sisters and what was written there was pretty hair-rising as well... maybe it has the same author as the BG book?



Basically it involved Storm Silverhand undressing while Elminster was looking on & making some lurid comments.

[Humanoid_Taifun]

Rule 34. It applies even to old wizards with pointy hats.

[Crippledcarny]

Seagloom wrote...

The more amusing tidbit is that Drew Karpyshyn wrote the third book. I cut him a little slack though since he had to finish building on what Philip Athans started. Still, the idea that the same man who contributed to Throne of Bhaal, Mass Effect, Jade Empire, and Knights of the Old Republic also wrote the Throne of Bhaal novelization is vexing. I suppose he's better at video game plots.

I believe Karpyshyn at some point even said the Throne of Bhall book sucked.

[Sparky The Barbarian]

There is no word to describe how bad they are. They are truly bad in their own rite: Hurried, ill thought out, convoluted, and tedious. As representatives of the best CRPG series ever, they are down right criminal. It would be laughable, except that these piles of rancid excrement disguised as novels are now cannon in the FR timeline, while the marvelous story told in the games is forgotten.

[Sparky The Barbarian]

virumor wrote...

I feel sad for the writers that TSR hired to write the novels that were supposed to introduce 4th edition... in other words, write stories full of holes & largely ignore decades of established lore.

Even R.A. Salvatore had to buckle down.

Indeed. For RA Salvatorre it's twenty years of world building thrown away by the WOTC overlords. Fourth edition is one thing. The 100 year time jump caused every FR author to kill off their human characters and chuck their long story arcs in the dust bin. I've read over forty FR novels, but I'll never read another. 

[jaxsbudgie]

Although I thoroughly enjoyed R.A.Salvatore's earlier work with the Drizzt novels, it all became a bit too much. Surely there are only so many Drizzt books one author can write, after a while the same five characters lose their intrigue, in intrigue that keeps me turning pages. I lost interest in the characters first and foremost, and Salvatore definitely reprimands you if you don't enjoy his main cast. I found the 'evil' characters far more interesting and complex than any of the canonical characters. Tos'un and Kaer'lic for example, Shoudra and Vierna. Not saying anything in case I spoil it for someone else, but Salvatore sure does reprimand you for liking the characters you're not supposed to like (i.e. Drizzt, Bruenor, Catti-Brie, Wulfgar and Regis).

[Seagloom]

virumor wrote...

I read an excerpt about an Elminster book in a 2nd edition sourcebook about the 7 sisters and what was written there was pretty hair-rising as well... maybe it has the same author as the BG book?

Basically it involved Storm Silverhand undressing while Elminster was looking on & making some lurid comments.

It was likely Ed Greenwood. Any book with Elminster and Storm or the other sisters was done by his hand. The exception was when Storm Silverhand appeared in the Avatar trilogy. I think I'm familiar with the book you mention too--at least by reputation. I never read anything with Greenwood's name on it. He's a fantastic world builder but I find his writing bewildering... and not in a good way.

[Sparky The Barbarian]

IRT Jaxbudgie: Salvatorre's biggest problem with the Drizzt series was that it was too popular. His fans and publishers kept demanding sequels long after he finished telling his story. In my opinion, that occurred with the re-taking of Mithral Hall.

[casedawgz]

I used to love the drizzt books but I just couldn't get into the Orc King, or whatever the first book of that most recent trilogy was called.

[Sparky The Barbarian]

If you disliked The Orc King, stay away from the last two.

[jaxsbudgie]

I found The Orc King ... difficult to read, and I don't know why. I bought The Pirate King, but haven't really looked at it twice since. The Hunters Blades Trilogy was good, as was The Dark Elf Trilogy, all the other are fairly forgettable.



Anyone else know of any other good FR setting novels? Didn't R.A.Salvatore do a series set in the Underdark?

[Seagloom]

The Homeland Trilogy chronicling Drizzt's time in Menzoberranzan and his escape follows his journey there for the first two books. There is a sextet that has R.A. Salvatore's name on it, but each book was written by a different author. I disliked that series as it felt aimless and disjointed with each author trying to pick up where the last left off.

I liked Elaine Cunningham's Starlight & Shadows Trilogy. The books starring Liriel Baenre. A good one shot Forgotten Realms novel was Depths of Madness. It wasn't high literature or anything. (Is any FR book, really? ) It did however tell a fun, suspenseful story about an atypical band of adventurers trapped in dungeon. There is a short story in a Forgotten Realms anthology that introduces us to the main character in DoM, but it isn't required reading.

Other than that I enjoyed Salvatore's Cleric Quintet. Cadderly is a more appealing protagonist than Drizzt and Pikel Bouldershoulder is awesome. If you don't mind lots of wizards and undead, the Haunted Lands trilogy chronicling the events that lead into Thay's 4e incarnation was good. I may dislike 4e Realms with a passion, but an entertaining read is an entertaining read.

Modifié par Seagloom, 05 septembre 2010 - 11:13 .

[HoonDing]

Seagloom wrote...

It was likely Ed Greenwood. Any book with Elminster and Storm or the other sisters was done by his hand. The exception was when Storm Silverhand appeared in the Avatar trilogy. I think I'm familiar with the book you mention too--at least by reputation. I never read anything with Greenwood's name on it. He's a fantastic world builder but I find his writing bewildering... and not in a good way.

Yes, I looked into it and the book it was from is titled "Crown of Fire", by Ed Greenwood.

This is the part about Elminster I referred to earlier:

Storm took off her second boot and stretched, catlike.
Across the leaping flames of the fire from her, Elminster sucked
his pipe into life in a cloud of drifting, snapping white sparks
and curling green smoke.
“"The wards, El?"” the silver-haired bard asked.
Elminster nodded. “"Set as strong as my Art can make them
in these troubled times. None can see us or reach us, short of
the gods. Ye can lay blades aside, take thy ease and undress, if
that’s what ye're asking.”"

Storm grinned at him and began unbuckling and unlacing.
Then she frowned. “"What do you mean, ‘in these troubled
times’?”"
Elminster puffed on his pipe; a small inferno went up.
“"Magic’s not the sure thing it was a winter ago,” he said. “It’'s
going wild now, sometimes, and not even Mystra herself will
answer me over it.”"
Storm met his eyes for a long breath of silence, and then
shivered. “"Alaundo",” she almost whispered, and he nodded.
Storm stared at him a moment longer and then sighed,
shrugged, and went on disrobing. Silver hair curled free about
her shoulders and down her back. She removed dagger
sheaths and safe-pouches from where they were strapped next
to her skin, and rubbed away the marks they left behind with
obvious pleasure, relaxing.

The old man across the fire had seen her do this many a
time before, since the days he had changed her himself when
she was only a babe. He sat and smoked companionably,
directing discarded apparel away with magic that spun unseen
from one lazy finger. Clothing floated silently through the air at
his direction; more than once Storm smiled her thanks at him.
When she was done, he said merely, “"Ye still look magnificent,
lass.”"

"“It’'s a good thing ye’'re the great age you are, isn'’t it?"” Storm
teased him, in mimicry of his own voice and manner, before he
could utter the same sentence. Elminster chuckled, and wiggled
his eyebrows. Obediently his pipe went out, rose up into
the darkness overhead, and vanished.
The fire followed it, leaving behind only a warmth and a
glowing in the air.
Storm stared at it, and then looked at Elminster, mouth
open. “"Ye gods",” she whispered, “"was that— spellfire? I
thought you’'d used fire spells to ignite real wood . . ." ”
Elminster shrugged. “"The little lass isn’'t the only one alive
who can work such tricks. She merely does it naturally. Azuth
taught me, long ago. It drains me overly much, mind you. I
don’'t do it lightly”"
“"But you did it just for me",” Storm protested.
"“That was not a light thing,” Elminster said, deadpan, and
winked at her."

Storm reached a hand out through the faint glow to clasp
the Old Mage’s hand. “"You are a delight, El. I love you, Old
Mage.”"
“"Oh, good",” was the dry reply, and she felt him wriggling
closer. “"Then ye won'’t mind if I lie beside ye here. Being old
and shy an’ all that, I’l'l be leaving my clothes on, though.”"
“"You? Shy?"” The bard snorted, and then wrinkled her nose.
“"I forgot to get our blankets".
"They’'re on the horses where they should be, keeping the faithful
beasts warm",” Elminster replied tranquilly “"Ye'll find ye won’t
need blankets—, my Art'’ll keep us as if we were bundled up,
but without getting too hot or the like, and make the ground
beneath gentle to lie upon, as well. Trust me.”"

"“Oh, I do".” They lay side by side in the darkness, holding
hands, and looked at the silent stars glimmering high overhead.
As Selûne rose and grew bright, Elminster let the faint
spellglow fade until they were in darkness under the night sky.
They lay together in silence for a time, watching the stars
wheel overhead. Although a stranger looking down on them
would have placed Storm in her lush late thirties, despite hard
muscles and white sword-scars aplenty, and Elminster somewhere
the gray side of sixty, both bard and archmage were
hundreds of winters older than that.

Elminster stroked the hand that he held with his fingers and
thought about the secret he shared with the woman who lay
beside him in the grass. The secret that had shaped both their
lives. Both of them carried some of the immortal magefire
locked forever inside their bodies, small parts of the divine
power of Mystra placed in mortals of Faerûn to maintain some
great and mysterious balance. They could be slain, releasing
the power of Mystra— as Storm’'s sister Syluné had been, not
long ago—, but grew old only slowly, aged more by the care of
responsibilities and the grief of outliving even elven friends
than by physical causes. Sometimes, though, they felt very old.
Elminster was wise enough to give Storm this time to drift
into slumber under the watching stars. It eases the heart, he
knew.

For himself, it was enough to have her beside him. Of the
sisters he had reared, Storm was the most his friend, even if he
loved the Simbul more as mate and companion. Elminster
smiled up at the stars and was happy
“"El",” the beloved voice beside him came softly, "“you know I
love riding the Realms with you— but tell me, where are we
bound this time, and why?”"
“"We go to meet a certain old enemy of mine and do a certain
thing",” Elminster said carefully. “"Is that enough?”"

He heard the grin in her voice. “"Of course. You phrase
‘nothing’ so eloquently".” She rolled up to one elbow with easy
grace, and looked down at him. “"And the ‘why’?”"
Elminster looked into her level gaze and melted. “"It is part
of an ongoing game I play against— certain folk. A very old
and deep game to limit the power of those who watch from the
shadows in this world. The Malaugrym—aye, ye remember
them, I know— are after Shandril of Highmoon. Her affair’s by
no means clear and done yet. We'’ll doubtless meet in Silverymoon,
these Shadowmasters and I, to do spell battle over her.
What we do now will become important then. ’Tis more
important that the Shadowmasters have no benefit from what
I’'ve left undone than that the Harpers or Shandril—or Toril
itself— gain strength by what we do. If we prevail. . . ”"

Storm laughed softly and kissed him. “"I love it, Old Mage,
when you'’re so forthcoming and open".” She lay down again
beside him. “"Never change, will you? Promise me that.”"
“"Ah, lass",” he said sadly, “"That’s one of the promises none
of us can keep.”"

He lay there in silence until she slept, holding her hand
tightly. When her slumber was deep, he waved his free hand,
and a spellbook floated silently out of the night to hang above
his nose. Spellfire was but one of Elminster’'s little secrets.
Another was the fact that he no longer needed to sleep.
The old, familiar symbols and phrases filled his mind again
as they had so many times before, but he did not let go of
Storm’'s hand, even for a moment. Throughout life, one does
not miss any chance to hold onto the things that are really precious,
if one is truly wise.

Only thing that's missing, is the Simbul appearing and frying them both in anger.

Modifié par virumor, 07 septembre 2010 - 07:21 .

[Morbidest]

After reading that I feel a diabetic attack coming on. UGH.

[Seagloom]

virumor wrote...

Only thing that's missing, is the Simbul appearing and frying them both in anger.

I don't know about that. Remember Ed Greenwood wrote this. Knowing him it would end in a ménage à trois. Subject matter aside, this excerpt is a keen reminder of why I dislike his writing style too. I did like his ending to the Spellfire trilogy though, so who knows... maybe he could surprise me.

[HoonDing]

The premise of the book actually seems interesting, but lore-wise it doesn't really seem to make much sense.

[Seagloom]

It is his setting. It doesn't need to make sense? XD I didn't realize Crown of Fire was the second book in the Spellfire trilogy until looking it up minutes ago. I'm hesitant to reveal how it ends in case you ever decide to read it. Suffice it to say it was controversial enough to annoy a good many Realms fans. I also noticed that excerpt above is repeated in the 2e Seven Sisters book. (Yes, I own it. Don't laugh too hard. )

Modifié par Seagloom, 10 septembre 2010 - 02:50 .