47 réponses à ce sujet

[yasuraka.hakkyou]

I'm just curious, how much will would you put on a mage? Now, I understand some of you don't put any will on a mage, and I'm fine with that, it's just not how I play (I like actually having mana ). 20? 30? 40? I'm curious about this.

[Gloatie]

It's been a while since I rolled a new one, but I seem to remember doing more-or-less 2x magic to 1x wp 'till it suited my need/desire.

[yasuraka.hakkyou]

that's what I tended to do, as well. I'm wondering if it may be a little better to just go to 30 or so then go all magic.

[DWSmiley]

None. There's lots of other things to do when mana runs low - shapeshift, blood magic, staff mastery, arcane warrior. Not often I need more and if I do a little blue bottle takes care of it.

[yasuraka.hakkyou]

DWSmiley: 1) shapeshifting I feel was horribly implemented. 2) True, you have me there. 3) Plinking away with staff bolts is slow, not always a good option, and is visually lame. this is personally why I pump will, to a certain point. 4) not sure I played it right, but AW just doesn't work well for me. Strange, since I usually love that kinda class / spec / etc.



Shall we agree to disagree on needing to pump will?

[Elhanan]

I tend towards 30 Will in Origins; 40 in Awakening.

And staff fire appears to have RoF increses thru Rapid Aim devices; not bad for auto-hits.

[ussnorway]

I find my 20 (includes 6 from gear and the fade) gets me past the game on hard but If you do pump Will then you would be better to do it early because (max) mana is linked to your level...
p.s. shapeshifting would be fine if they stop putting cut scenes in every 2 seconds.

Modifié par ussnorway, 02 septembre 2010 - 07:24 .

[termokanden]

For my first mage, I put 2 points in Magic and 1 in Willpower every level.



For my second one, I put every single point into Magic. I didn't notice I had less mana at all.



But I did some quick calculations the other day and saw that the damage difference between a 2-1 split and 3-0 is actually rather small. But then again, so is the difference between the number of spells each mage can cast. Furthermore, the game claims you regenerate mana more easily when you are low on mana, but it's unclear to me what exactly this means.



I personally consider extra willpower redundant. Even without blood magic and potions, I rarely run out. If I do, lesser lyrium potions are so damn cheap you could afford to drink one every 2 seconds if you wanted.



In Awakening, I find it even clearer. You have a high level and a high base mana, and you get skills that give you a mana boost.

[DWSmiley]

yasuraka.hakkyou wrote...

DWSmiley: 1) shapeshifting I feel was horribly implemented. 2) True, you have me there. 3) Plinking away with staff bolts is slow, not always a good option, and is visually lame. this is personally why I pump will, to a certain point. 4) not sure I played it right, but AW just doesn't work well for me. Strange, since I usually love that kinda class / spec / etc.

Shall we agree to disagree on needing to pump will?

Shapeshifter is decent if you know the tricks of the trade, which I did thanks to a lot of research by TBastian - here is one of them:
http://social.biowar...24503/1#4488938

The staff is quicker than described in the game and with the right gloves does nice damage.

I can't agree that putting points in willpower has a good cost/benefit ratio but my #1 rule in character building is do whatever provides the most satisfaction.    And, in fact, I usually do drop a few points in there for flavour.

[Mr_Raider]

You need it early on when you can't afford the good items. The rule I use is 30 in origins, respec to 20 in Awakenings.

[beancounter501]

I am with Smiley - no willpower. If you want Willpower then I would suggest 8-10 points. But no more then 30.

[Jacks Smirking Revenge]

I agree willpower sucks. Base+Fade is more than ample. Especially when mage's spellpower scaling is ridiculous. The only thing you need for a fight is Fireball->Cone of Cold->Virulent Walking Bomb which is about a 150 mana cost you have about that much when you get to Ostagar. Also if you have problems with mana I suggest Spellbloom or Mass Rejuvenation both are wonderful. Spellbloom is awesome if you only care about your own mana .

[Maverick827]

I always have 20 Willpower on Mages. No more, no less.  I rarely use potions even at 20 Willpower, and almost always only if I want to overextend for the fun of it.

Modifié par Maverick827, 02 septembre 2010 - 09:08 .

[Elhanan]

I prefer to have a higher base Willpower than rely on having items or other spells for the refills. While some may be sipping on the next Lyrium potion, I can cast. While some may be running spells for extra Mana, I already have it and am casting Mana Clash, running another mode, etc.

[DWSmiley]

More mana is good but it's not free. Sip the occasional potion or pay the price of less spellpower, with spells doing less damage and being resisted more often.

[eucatastrophe]

I find I get plenty of mana from gear.



With few points in WP, and most of hem concentrated in Magic, things die super fast. If I absolutely need mana, I pot it up!



Typically stuff dies super fast so I rarely am chugging pots.

[Lumikki]

I think it's more a question how much lyrium potions you want to drink. On my healer mage has 30 will what seem to be enough and damage dealer mage has 40 will.

Modifié par Lumikki, 03 septembre 2010 - 11:42 .

[termokanden]

I think it's funny how some people make it sound like you're always out of mana and drinking potions when you don't put points in willpower. As I wrote above, I thought the same until I tried it.



It gets even clearer if you are a blood mage. What I would do is the following:



1. Empty my whole mana pool (usually NOT possible).

2. Switch to Blood Magic.

3. Cast Blood Wound and a few spells.

4. Switch back.

5. Cast Heal or Group Heal.



At this point I am at full health and with an almost full mana pool. No potions used.

[Elhanan]

I have only found lyrium potions needed in a few places in the game:

* Harvester - some active modes really drain mana quickly.

* Architect - Mr Top Hat kept tossing those draining Glyphs.

* Mother - same as above.

But I had plenty of them, as I not used much in Origins at all other than for party or quest requirements.

Personally, I am not thhat impressed with Blood Mage. While I like the varied items they can use, there are many monsters running about that do not have blood.

[termokanden]

It is indeed of no help against some of the hardest enemies, like golems or Harvester's little buddies. In general I think Golems of Amgarrak is kind of mage unfriendly in the first place.



I still think Blood Mage is worth it simply because Blood Wound is an amazing ability. It may not work against all enemies, but still it's worth it to me. I'm sure you also use Mana Clash yourself even though it only works against mages. There are loads more enemies with blood than there are mages.

[Elhanan]

termokanden wrote...

It is indeed of no help against some of the hardest enemies, like golems or Harvester's little buddies. In general I think Golems of Amgarrak is kind of mage unfriendly in the first place.

I still think Blood Mage is worth it simply because Blood Wound is an amazing ability. It may not work against all enemies, but still it's worth it to me. I'm sure you also use Mana Clash yourself even though it only works against mages. There are loads more enemies with blood than there are mages.

Mana Clash also works against demons and their ilk; very handy against shades and the like. Just used respec tome before facing the Harvester so not to lose 4 spells slots.

[DWSmiley]

Lumikki wrote...

I think it's more a question how much lyrium potions you want to drink. On my healer mage has 30 will what seem to be enough and damage dealer mage has 40 will.

It's more a question of how powerful you want your spells to be.  40 will means your spellpower is 20 less than it could have been, which means you are always doing less damage and the difference is even more significant when it lets an enemy successfully resist paralysis, sleep, etc.

[Lumikki]

If you have low "will" you spells are maybe little more powerfull, but you also waste casting time to drink potions, because out of mana.

Modifié par Lumikki, 03 septembre 2010 - 07:48 .

[DWSmiley]

Putting the points in magic instead of willpower means your spells are always more powerful - no maybes about it.  And drinking potions is needed far less often than you may think.  I'll quote termokanden here:

termokanden wrote...

I think it's funny how some people make it sound like you're always out of mana and drinking potions when you don't put points in willpower. As I wrote above, I thought the same until I tried it.

Our brains are pattern-seeking.  That's why people end up thinking that points in willpower make a big difference in the availability of mana.  Put a point per level in willpower and, lo, by the time you have willpower of 30 you rarely need to drink a potion (elf + Fade + 10 levels).  "Willpower 30 must be really useful!" concludes our brian.  But don't put points in willpower and you will still by level 10 rarely need to drink a potion.

There just isn't a lot of mileage from points in willpower.  Take one of the more popular spells for example.  Cone of Cold = 50 mana = 10 willpower.  Cast it once and you've used up the attribute gains from 3+ level ups.  Meanwhile, everytime you levelled up you automatically got more mana without putting anything in willpower.

[Lumikki]

I ques it depends how passive mage is. If you don't cast spells no need mana.