14 réponses à ce sujet

[Sic Semper Tyranis]

Just a few

1. Have NPCs romance each other, I'm thinking Sky and Dawn Star would be a great couple, especially if the Male PC winds up with Lian, you could play matchmaker with the two. 

2.  Add a third neurtal demon fighting for control of Wild Flower (I'm thinking a fox).

3.  Make more quarrels and even fights between opposite sided followers.

4.  If you save Kai Jong in Two Rivers make it possible to meet her later in the game.

Just my thoughts.

[Sparky The Barbarian]

I admit the list would be short and the changes minor. In Baldur's Gate and KOTOR I had the 'big surprise plot twist' figured out long before the dramatic revelations.



In JE I defeated the Emperor and thought, "Is the game over already?" I totally didn't see this coming.

[schalafi]

I would have Zu be the romance for female players, along with Sky, but I'd have Sky die in the fight with Death's Hand, and have Zu live. I thought he was the best male npc in the game. I'm still mad at Bioware for killing him!

Modifié par schalafi, 06 septembre 2010 - 03:41 .

[Tooneyman]

Yeha, when I found out ZU was killed I was like. NOOOOo. then I was like ok, moving on, but wouldn't you want the black whirl wind to be your romance lover?

[schalafi]

Tooneyman wrote...

Yeha, when I found out ZU was killed I was like. NOOOOo. then I was like ok, moving on, but wouldn't you want the black whirl wind to be your romance lover?

[Seagloom]

I wasn't a fan of Zu. Sky and Silk Fox were perfect for me, as I adore the sly and caustic rogue types respectively. If I had to change anything it would be extending the courtship phase of romances. Silk Fox's in particular felt too brief, but even Sky's was quick and that was when visiting the pirate hideout first to pick him up early. It also would have been nice if F/F and M/M pairings had their kissing scenes completed.



The big change though: Closed Fist. I would tweak every quest to allow a true Closed Fist option. I can only remember two of these off the top of my head. Freeing the girl from Tien's Landing and forcing her to kill the slaver and waiting to fight Bladed Thesis when he is at his full strength. Usually Closed Fist translated as evil. In the aforementioned slaver scenario you were awarded more points for selling her to the slaver than getting her to kill him. There were also no Closed Fist points for taking out the fox spirit *and* cannibals.



Finally, there were aspects of the story that were poorly fleshed out. They worked, but left me wanting more. That dark force you confront in Dirge when it takes on your character's form was built up so much only to end in climatic fashion. I also thought the logic behind using blood to poison the Water Dragon's waters was poorly explained. They described it as poisoning without telling the player exactly what the repercussions are.



On the whole though, Jade Empire told a well woven tale.

[schalafi]

Since I've never played closed fist, or an evil character in any game, I can't understand the reason anyone would want to do it. I guess I'm just a softie,(like Sten in DA). Sky bothered me because of his smile and his voice. He didn't seem to have any upper teeth, and his voice was odd. Also he just never seemed to get into the romance until the kiss, which surprised me the first time I played, because I had never encouraged him. After that I never pursued a romance, and just took Zu with me as my npc. I thought he was the most interesting character in the game.

Modifié par schalafi, 09 septembre 2010 - 11:30 .

[Seagloom]

I'm not into playing evil these days but back then I used to as often as good. In the case of Jade Empire, I thought evil had more cool moments than good. Open Palm topped Closed Fist in terms of heart-string tugging moments, but the latter had a bit of dark humor, and in my opinion the best (and also cruelest) evil finale BioWare has ever done. It was hokey in BioWare's traditional style though. That is, a Closed Fist character often came across as a thug.

I didn't notice that about Sky's teeth. Maybe it was because I played on Xbox using an old TV and didn't notice finer details. I actually liked that he wasn't into the romance at first. That was part of his charm. Most BioWare romances become too serious too quickly. You have three or four chats and then suddenly the character is getting clingy and swearing their neverending devotion to you. Even when it's dragged out somewhat, it feels corny once the romance reaches that stage.

I thought Zu was banal. He isn't my type in terms of looks and his archetype is one I find very, very tiresome unless superbly executed. I felt it wasn't in his case. I liked that Zu was wise and serious about the mission while still having a mild sense of humor. I didn't hate him. I just found him a bit illogical and couldn't overcome my distaste for his archetype. That he came across as much plot device as a sidekick didn't help matters. I still can't get over how contrived his speech to the Closed Fist Spirit Monk was during the mind battle with god-Li. He was one of the most developed characters though. Gotta hand him that.

Modifié par Seagloom, 10 septembre 2010 - 02:39 .

[Tooneyman]

Like I said Zu was well developed to a certain point. I just got tired of his character constantly complaining about. How the assassins will kill you. It was like in ever other conversation. When I first found out he died off. I was like actually kind of happy. I liked Zu's staff when I would fight with him however. It came in happy on Jade Master.



As for doing closed fist. I've done everything in most Bioware games and the problem with only being good in a game is you hold yourself back from the story and see the possibilities you could open up schalafi. I'm one of those players who gets attached to a characters story. I've always been up for the character who starts off evil only to make an a final good decision in the end. I played a character of Closed fists throughout the entire game until the final moment when I choose the open palm ending. I felt more put towards the character after looking at the final moment of his evil tyranny I created only to have him take a different path in the final act. I still got goosebumps from that ending I made.



All I can say is someone who really enjoys Bioware games. I recommend doing everything. You would be suprise at some of the laughs you'll get.

[Sic Semper Tyranis]

I have similar thoughts on how the ending automatically determines the end of the game, it was a bit too duex ex machina for my tastes.



Anyway another thing I realized is more sidequests and more mythical creatures. I would have loved to see a Fenghuang or Qilin in the game perhaps a sidequest branching from Lord Lao's furnace or another heaven realm could lead to a kind of "park ranger" mini game where the upset of nature due to the Water Dragon led to the endangerment of mythical beasts that the hero has a chance to set straight.



Also the creature of "ultimate darkness" might be a good option for the villain in JE 2.

[Jadeling]

My only really major complaint is near the end with Death's Hand, you could only release him or bind him to you, where I really wanted to have an option of convincing him to seek redemption on his own or to leave him at Dirge to contemplate over his actions until you decide what to do with the Water Dragon. That way if you decided to be OP, you could have the Water Dragon decide his fate, or if you were CF, you could have the epilogue be that Death's Hand remained at the ruins of Dirge forever, never finding peace.

[dgcatanisiri]

Open up the story a little - although you can take the sidequests in any order, the most choice you get in where to go is in Tien's Landing when you have three tasks you can do in a different order. The main plot railroads our destinations - You always go to the Imperial City, the Palace, Dirge, and back to the Palace. I want some room to breathe. Although I realize doing a story about a chase DOES inherently limit you, couldn't there have been some false leads that would lead you elsewhere but still have some bearing on the plot?

Also, yes, give the romances some more time to simmer. The game seems to happen over the course of maybe a week, two at most, counting travel time, yet you find true love? At least give us the feeling that these characters have some connection beyond three or four conversations.

[Korva]

Jadeling wrote...

My only really major complaint is near the end with Death's Hand, you could only release him or bind him to you, where I really wanted to have an option of convincing him to seek redemption on his own or to leave him at Dirge to contemplate over his actions until you decide what to do with the Water Dragon. That way if you decided to be OP, you could have the Water Dragon decide his fate, or if you were CF, you could have the epilogue be that Death's Hand remained at the ruins of Dirge forever, never finding peace.

That's a great idea! It's not like Death's Hand has anywhere to go until the Water Dragon is reborn and reopens the gate to the Underworld, so an option for him to stay at Dirge as a contemplative spirit seeking redemption until she decides his fate would be a nice touch.

I also agree that, as someone else has already mentioned, the battle against the entity defiling the Temple is rather bland and bleh. Something unknowable from beyond reality, feasting on the endless misery and suffering of the dead, shouldn't just be able to be punched into submission like a common thug. A spiritual slant to that battle would have been great.

Finally, I'd like to have a little more Sprit Monk foreshadowing pre-death. It's actually interesting that it's Dawn Star who is more in touch with the beyond, but a few more twinges of the divine essence, spirits recognizing what you are and pleading for help or attacking in a mad rage, could be interesting.

As for Zu, his role is pretty much perfect IMO. He's an unlikeable arse much of the time, but nonetheless he redeems himself for his shady past by showing great courage and loyalty in life AND death. He has to die to come into his own. Plus, I love it when there are actually consequences and prices to pay and the protagonist can't just "talk everyone better" all the time. Zu ears his redemption the hard way, on his own, and although he IS an unlikeable arse before that he deserves kudos for having the guts to do what is right.

[Korva]

Another double post. *kicks unstable connection*

Modifié par Korva, 24 avril 2011 - 08:26 .

[L33TDAWG]

dgcatanisiri wrote...

doing a story about a chase DOES inherently limit you 

There isn't a story about a chase really, Zu suggested heading to the Imperial City to start the search for your master, but they ran into bad weather because they didn't have a wind map and landed in Tien's Landing.

I'd keep everything the same in Jade Empire except the arena. I was hoping I could go back to face any challengers. Also, I would change the handling of the golem factory in the neropolis. Rather than corrupting a Jade Golem, I would have put the elevator controler's soul in it and have the Mistress invite you in to her chamber for discussion. There, she detects you are a spirit monk. You fight her and kill her, from here you have 2 options: take control over the place, destroy it, or save it for personal use.