89 réponses à ce sujet

[horacethegrey]

Hello folks. Longtime lurker here who's posting for the first time. Figured my first time ought be asking a question that's been nagging me for awhile.

Most Asari are natural biotics, it says so on the ME codex. But not all Asari biotics are equal in ability, so it stands to reason that training is the difference. If an Asari wants to be effective with her powers, she needs to work her ass off the show of her strength in manipulating dark energy.  Another farctor is age. It's been demonstrated in both games that elder Asari are stronger in biotics as well. 

So how come Liara T'soni is exceptionally powerful with her biotics?

As far as we know from both games, Liara has had no military training whatsoever. She's a scientist and an archeologist to boot. Add to the fact that she's an asari maiden at only 106, she's barely out of her teens by asari standards. But the games and the Redemption comic have shown that she can disarm a number of armed men with just a thought, or crush a geth Armature with a wave of her hand. 

I mean let's look at the Asari in the games who've demonstrated their biotic ability:

Benezia: She's a Matriarch with a troop of Asari commandos under her command. Pretty good reasons why she'd be powerful. 

Shiala: Asari commando and a Matron from the look of things. Judging from the power of the asari clones that the Thorian throws at you, it's obvious she's quite a skilled biotic as well.

Wasea: Leader of the Eclipse sisters on Ilium who shows a certain "biotic god" what a Warp really does to an organic.

Samara: An almost Matriarch and former mercenary who's now an Asari Justicar. Most Asari ( and some aliens) are scared to death of Justicars and for good reason. The Dossier even says what Samara's biotics rival that of a Matriarch. 

Morinth: An Ardat Yakshi who's spent the last 400 years killing people and becoming steadily more powerful from it. By the time she and Samara have their final confrontation, they're pretty equal with the stalemate only broken by Shepard. 

As I've said before, all these Asari have had the benefit of age and training to kick ass with their biotics. But Liara has had neither, yet she's shown to be equal or even greater than the examples I've posted above. And the latest trailer for the Lair of the Shadow Breaker DLC shows that her biotics are as strong as ever despite 2 years since the first game. 

Anyways, I'd like to hear your thoughts on this.

[crimzontearz]

uhm....some people are just talented you know?



there is a 13 years old girl somewhere in the central US if I remember right that can rock-climb faster than the national champions who have been practicing since she was born

[adneate]

Because BioWare needed a squadmate who was an Adept?

[Shadow_broker]

She isn't

No where in the league of Samara or mornith, she was mostly part of the crew due to her prothean knowledge

[thespianicism]

Genes, perhaps? Benezia is a strong biotic and since Liara essentially has her genes just scrambled around a bit by her 'father', it would make sense the she is a strong biotic (if such things are genetic). Also, I think I read somewhere that she'd honed her skills defending against pirates on dangerous digs. But really, these are all just excuses for the reason stated above by adneate.

[Solaris Paradox]

She's young by asari standards, but it's still been a hundred years and more, and she's only spent fifty of those in a dig site. Plenty of time for hardcore biotic training in there, and given that the maiden stage is a stage of life where an asari restlessly seeks new knowledge and experience, I doubt she was unenthusiastic about it.

[Ramgigon]

Eyebrows imbue Asari with greater biotic power.

[horacethegrey]

adneate wrote...

Because BioWare needed a squadmate who was an Adept?

I can understand that. But Liara's ability is still inconsistent with what we know of Asari and biotics. The age and training that I mentioned.

[TelexFerra]

She can hit 'em with the gooder stuff

[Pacifien]

I've always wondered about Liara's powerful biotic abilities. The gameplay reason is that the developers needed someone to fill the Adept role in ME1, with all the abilities and power as you'd have if you played an Adept Shepard. So since she shows considerable biotic power in that game, I guess they felt like they should stick with it.

I've seen people mention how Liara's been on archeological digs fending for herself for awhile, so that would give her a reason to hone her biotics in order to protect herself. I only buy this explanation up to a point. It might explain her having a good biotic technique, since she would use it on occasion to defend herself, but the key word there is "occasion." It's not like she's putting herself into combat situations on a regular basis.

Could be that all asari are given training in using their biotics and Liara's time fighting alongside Shepard gave her the combat training she needed to make her a powerful biotic above other Asari. Doesn't explain her time in ME1, though.

So my own personal explanation is to look at her mother. The Asari councilor describes Benezia as a powerful matriarch who had many followers, something confirmed by Shiala. Why exactly does Benezia have followers? Sounds like she was the head of some particular movement, one that started out with the belief that Asari should take a more active role in galactic affairs that became twisted once she joined with Saren. I mean, she even had Asari Commandos under her command.

So considering Liara was raised by Benezia, she may have been raised with better combat training than your typical Asari by benefit of being surrounded by Benezia's movement. Even if she took a much more sedate path than her mother, she still has her mother's power and knowledge of how to use it. And being with Shepard just reminds her of her training and she changes her focus to keep up with it from then on.

Just speculation, though. Really no reason given within the game itself. She just is.

[DarthCaine]

Erm... where did it say she IS a very powerful biotic? The powers she has are all due to gameplay. We never saw her "strong" powers in the story. It's like saying ME1 Tali is stronger than ME2 Tali. Story and gameplay aren't related

She IS a good biotic, just nowhere near as strong as Samara, Morinth or Jack in terms of storyline

Modifié par DarthCaine, 05 septembre 2010 - 03:53 .

[Solaris Paradox]

If you're wondering about comics and cutscenes, it's because videogames are always inconsistent about that kind of thing and Mass Effect is no exception. Think about Miranda's epic ownage of that Eclipse chick during her loyalty mission. Why can't she do THAT in-game?

[Valmarn]

DarthCaine wrote...

Erm... where did it say she IS a very powerful biotic? The powers she has are all due to gameplay. We never saw her "strong" powers in the story. It's like saying ME1 Tali is stronger than ME2 Tali. Story and gameplay aren't related

She IS a good biotic, just nowhere near as strong as Samara, Morinth or Jack in terms of storyline

And there it is.

Liara was given a variety of biotic powers in Mass Effect 1 similar to that of an Adept Shepard merely for the purpose of gameplay.

And I agree 100% that Liara has nothing on Jack, Samara, or Morinth.

Liara may have extensive training/practice in biotics, but so do Jack, Samara, and Morinth, and the latter two have several centuries on Liara. Jack's just wicked good because of the effed up things that Cerberus did to her.

[horacethegrey]

DarthCaine wrote...

Erm... where did it say she IS a very powerful biotic? The powers she has are all due to gameplay. We never saw her "strong" powers in the story. It's like saying ME1 Tali is stronger than ME2 Tali. Story and gameplay aren't related

She IS a good biotic, just nowhere near as strong as Samara, Morinth or Jack in terms of storyline

I do realize that gameplay and story are two separate things, but there have been a number of times in the ME story where Liara's exceptional ability in biotics has been noted:

- When you first recruit her on Therum, Shepard and the crew agree that having Liara on the Normandy is an asset because of her knowledge of the Protheans along with her connection to Benezia. But it's Wrex, the aging and hardened Krogan battlemaster who points out that her biotics will be an asset as well. And Wrex should know, he is a Battlemaster, one of the rare Krogan who can wield biotics.

- When Shepard first meets her on Ilium after 2 years, he/she asks her to be part of the Normandy crew once more. I don't think Shepard would make such a request based on their friendship alone. He/She know what kind of ability Liara posseses, which must be exceptional.

- Liara killed her assistant Nyxeris, who was really an agent of the Shadow Broker. Do you think the Broker would send some wimpy Asari to kill her? No. He'd send a skilled assassin who can deal with a powerful biotic like Liara who messed with his plans to retrieve Shepard's body. The Broker saw first hand what kind of power Liara possessed, so whoever he hired to kill her would have to be damn good at their job. Liara even notes that had she not known of Nyxeris' true colors, she'd be dead already.

[DarthCaine]

horacethegrey wrote...

- When you first recruit her on Therum, Shepard and the crew agree that having Liara on the Normandy is an asset because of her knowledge of the Protheans along with her connection to Benezia. But it's Wrex, the aging and hardened Krogan battlemaster who points out that her biotics will be an asset as well. And Wrex should know, he is a Battlemaster, one of the rare Krogan who can wield biotics.

Any biotic would be useful. They never said she was exceptionaly good.

- When Shepard first meets her on Ilium after 2 years, he/she asks her to be part of the Normandy crew once more. I don't think Shepard would make such a request based on their friendship alone. He/She know what kind of ability Liara posseses, which must be exceptional.

Shepard asked everyone of his/her previous team (don't forget Kaidan). They're all good, but not THAT good. In biotics Liara is good as Miranda/Jacob/Thane, but nowhere near as Jack or Samara.

- Liara killed her assistant Nyxeris, who was really an agent of the Shadow Broker. Do you think the Broker would send some wimpy Asari to kill her? No. He'd send a skilled assassin who can deal with a powerful biotic like Liara who messed with his plans to retrieve Shepard's body. The Broker saw first hand what kind of power Liara possessed, so whoever he hired to kill her would have to be damn good at their job. Liara even notes that had she not known of Nyxeris' true colors, she'd be dead already.

Liara had the upper hand. And like I said, she's good, but not THAT good

Liara's skill is basicaly Kaidan's/Wrex's/Miranda's/Jacob's/Thane's level, but Samara, Jack, Benezia and Morinth are much more powerful than any one of them

Modifié par DarthCaine, 05 septembre 2010 - 05:43 .

[Lee-gion]

 Because she hangs around Shepard long enough.

[Dinkamus_Littlelog]

For the same reason Shepard has accomplished amazing feats early in his career - some people are naturally gifted. Liara is amazingly driven for an asari her age, and dedicates herself to her goals. Her studies of the protheans, and her biotic abilities are two of those things.

[horacethegrey]

I AM CAMACHO wrote...

because she is an asari duh?

And not all Asari are biotics. And some Asari biotics are no match for some human biotics.  What's your point?

Modifié par horacethegrey, 05 septembre 2010 - 04:40 .

[HomicidialFrog]

She was just born with it.



Someone who's been training themselves to be an excellent sprint runner there whole life can be beaten by someone who was just born with natural talent.

[Psearo]

horacethegrey wrote...

I AM CAMACHO wrote...

because she is an asari duh?

And not all Asari are biotics. And some Asari biotics are no match for some human biotics.  What's your point?

All Asari are natural born biotics. It's just that not all Asari train in and develop their biotic abilities beyond having them.

[jbblue05]

I'm sure Benezia trained Liara extensively before Liara moved out

Liara is advanced for her age but I don't think she is as powerful as an asari commando and matriarch.

But in time I'm sure Liara will be just as powerful

[Shadow_broker]

I think Pacifen got it Mostly summed up.

But i Don't think Benezia is an exscuse for her being a better biotic than any other asari her age considering we don't even know at what age Liara left to become a Prothean Hermit.

As others have pointed out it was probaly purley for gameplay purposes, and the real reason she was on the squad story wise was due to her prothean knowledge.

I doubt she is considerably better biotic than thane or jacob and would probaly be on par with Miranda. The real reason shep would want her on his crew is due to her hookups as a Info broker and having another person he can trust never hurts.