458 réponses à ce sujet

[AuraofMana]

Seifz wrote...

Marionetten wrote...
I'm saying that developers learn from each other. Do you honestly think CD Projekt designed The Witcher with no inspiration from games like Baldur's Gate? Of course not. CD Projekt used to translate BioWare titles.

Plus, CDProjekt licensed the Aurora Engine from BioWare to create The Witcher.  So, I'm pretty sure that BioWare is quite thrilled with how well the game did. 

Anyway, sex scenes are a distraction that shouldn't exist in these games.  When the romance becomes "talk until (s)he agrees to have sex with you", they're not fun anymore.  Either write a real romance or leave them out entirely, IMO.  The Witcher was different because the sex wasn't generally so much about, uh, romance.

How should video games describe the crescendo of a romance and the eventual apex without that (because honestly I can't think of anything :/)? It would be both hilarious and sad if Bioware represents that like in those cliche (probably a trope by now) Korean romance dramas where it's always a sad ending.

[Marionetten]

AuraofMana wrote...

Okay, you found one quest in DA:O with it, OMG! The Witcher is literally FILLED with quests like that. In fact, the 2 hours I've been playing that game, all I remember is running down some terrible sewer to kill some stuff, then realized I can't gather some brain parts because my character didn't study the monster enough to find where its brain is. After that, I uninstalled.

... Should I have linked this, this or this instead? 

While it's unfortunate that The Witcher was too complicated for you it was by no means a grindfest.

AuraofMana wrote...

I don't remember 95% of the quests in DA:O requiring me to kill thousands of darkspawns to gather some sort of darkspawn brain. I remember doing varied quests beside killing monsters and gathering monster parts. TW is just a RPG, without the actual storyline, RPG pith and left with just the killing part, with a huge amount of MMORPG grindfest mixed in.

Now you're just behaving like a fanboy. You even stated yourself that you only played The Witcher for two hours. How exactly does that account for 95% of the game?

Modifié par Marionetten, 06 septembre 2010 - 06:18 .

[Quercus]

AuraofMana wrote...

Marionetten wrote...
You mean like this?

Okay, you found one quest in DA:O with it, OMG! The Witcher is literally FILLED with quests like that. In fact, the 2 hours I've been playing that game, all I remember is running down some terrible sewer to kill some stuff, then realized I can't gather some brain parts because my character didn't study the monster enough to find where its brain is. After that, I uninstalled.

Marionetten wrote...
Of course the game is about monster hunting. The Witcher is a professional monster slayer. It really is no different from how the Warden is a professional darkspawn slayer.

I don't remember 95% of the quests in DA:O requiring me to kill thousands of darkspawns to gather some sort of darkspawn brain. I remember doing varied quests beside killing monsters and gathering monster parts. TW is just a RPG, without the actual storyline, RPG pith and left with just the killing part, with a huge amount of MMORPG grindfest mixed in.

Sounds like you didn't played the game, collecting quests were only side quests, all the other good quest which didn't involved collecting or killing x amound were all story quests. The detective chapter 2 part was especialy good, there was even a part were you needed to indentify the couse of dead on a body.

Modifié par Shiroukai, 06 septembre 2010 - 06:20 .

[AuraofMana]

simfamSP wrote...
Hah! The Witcher was made by a company with little money and a tweaked version of the infinty engine, and it did a BLOODY AMAZING job. Bioware have tones of money tones of recourses and they still don't produce 100%.

Aurora Engine, not Infinity.
Define amazing, because all I remember from that game was ****ty grindfest. A ton of low budget Asian game developers have done that too and they are call the generic Asian MMORPG grindfest. Go google it, you'll find tons.

simfamSP wrote...
I love Bioware and ALL their games. But you have to give those people over at Poland credit for making a good game with little stuff to work on.

No, I really don't. Flagship Studios tried to make the spiritual successor of Diablo 2 and it failed miserably. The fact that it had little money and time doesn't erase the fact that their game sucked and is a mockery of Diablo 2.
Petroglyph Games were also trying to cast themselves as the spiritual successor of Westwood, but the fact that Universe At War: Earth Assault was possibly the WORST RTS ever made is not excused just because the company had less time and resource.
I could go on, but the point is that there are tons of examples were Indie companies or other small companies that were low on resources and time end up making it big because, *surprise!*, they can actually make a good game.

simfamSP wrote...
And please, what is the difference with most RPGs you will ALWAYS get "kill x amount of x". Bioware did this too, and they are the masters of RPG.

Except Bioware RPG's are not littered with it... no that's the wrong word. Let's put it this way: TW's gameplay is Kill X Gather Y. It's not a RPG, it's a SP MMORPG.

[Ayanko]

Talk about derailed, oh well.

[Seifz]

AuraofMana wrote...

Seifz wrote...

Marionetten wrote...
I'm saying that developers learn from each other. Do you honestly think CD Projekt designed The Witcher with no inspiration from games like Baldur's Gate? Of course not. CD Projekt used to translate BioWare titles.

Plus, CDProjekt licensed the Aurora Engine from BioWare to create The Witcher.  So, I'm pretty sure that BioWare is quite thrilled with how well the game did. 

Anyway, sex scenes are a distraction that shouldn't exist in these games.  When the romance becomes "talk until (s)he agrees to have sex with you", they're not fun anymore.  Either write a real romance or leave them out entirely, IMO.  The Witcher was different because the sex wasn't generally so much about, uh, romance.

How should video games describe the crescendo of a romance and the eventual apex without that (because honestly I can't think of anything :/)? It would be both hilarious and sad if Bioware represents that like in those cliche (probably a trope by now) Korean romance dramas where it's always a sad ending.

I disagree that sex is the apex of a romance.  Let's be honest for a minute, here.  Romances in BioWare games always follow this pattern.

1.  Introduction.  Nothing important happens here, but you learn a bit about the LI.  (S)he learns almost nothing about you.

2.  Important Decision!  There's a conversation somewhere that's super important.  If you respond one way, the romance begins.  If you don't, it doesn't.  Often, this conversation is not repeatable.  Best get that reload button ready!

3.  Romancing Time!  There are usually three to five conversations that need to happen, here.  In all of them, you just choose the answer that's most likely to please the LI.  You learn a lot about the LI, and (s)he learns almost nothing about you.  All of this takes place as the camp because, well, you can only love people at camp.

4.  Sex.  After saying the right things in those conversations, you get to have sex.  Then, you're done.  You might be fortunate enough to get one more conversation about the sex (e.g. Leliana), but that's about it.  Once you have sex, there's no more romancing.  It just... ends.

It's all quite silly.  Why would a romance end just because you have sex?  Why don't the personal dialogues continue?  Why doesn't your LI ever really get to know you?  Why are the "right" answers always so obvious?  Why don't you ever talk outside of camp?  Can we go to lunch, maybe?  Please?  Gah!

Anyway, ending the romance with a cheezy sex scene sucks.

[Dave of Canada]

This thread is now about Witcher vs Dragon Age. *sigh* I'll be in the bat cave.

[Quercus]

Dave of Canada wrote...

This thread is now about Witcher vs Dragon Age. *sigh* I'll be in the bat cave.

Will there be a female Qunari in a bat suit?

Modifié par Shiroukai, 06 septembre 2010 - 06:27 .

[Seifz]

Dave of Canada wrote...

This thread is now about Witcher vs Dragon Age. *sigh* I'll be in the bat cave.

To be fair, we've already had numerous long threads about sex and nudity in DA, too.  It's not like this thread really has a purpose.

[Dave of Canada]

Seifz wrote...

I disagree that sex is the apex of a romance.  Let's be honest for a minute, here.  Romances in BioWare games always follow this pattern.

*snip*

(not adding much to your point) The reason I love the Morrigan / Zevran romance is because sex is where it begins and it eventually grows more than that.

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 06 septembre 2010 - 06:27 .

[SmokePants]

Shiroukai wrote...

Here's a Witcher 2 example of a nude scene:

Well, that was gratuitous. But the thing that struck me most was how bad the dialogue in that game is. Sharp dialogue is why I play BioWare RPG's in the first place. Male-female interactions can fall into the territory of B-movie shlock very easily and that's what that video demonstates. It doesn't help that English probably isn't the first language of most of their writing staff.

The Witcher remains off my radar. Nice character models, though.

[ProudNegro]

inb4witcher is a repressentation of what hitler did to jews in ww2

[lv12medic]

Dave of Canada wrote...

This thread is now about Witcher vs Dragon Age. *sigh* I'll be in the bat cave.

DA vs. Witcher arguments now look like this:

POW!
WHACK!
BANG!
CRACK!
BIFF!
KA-POW!

[Marionetten]

SmokePants wrote...

Well, that was gratuitous.

I fail to understand how a topless woman being tortured is gratuitous. Unless you're a sadist, that is.

[AuraofMana]

Marionetten wrote...
... Should I have linked this, this or this instead? 

While it's unfortunate that The Witcher was too complicated for you it was by no means a grindfest.

Yeah, it was so complicated that those quests were just CNP'd in generic Asian MMORPG's. Well, it's apparent you obviously don't understand the difference between:
1. Having quests that defined the game because the overwhelming majority of them are in the game AND
2. Having quests in the game that does NOT define the game and is a small percentage out of the total amount of quests in the game.

Here's a thought for you: see, in TW I have to go down some sewer ESPECIALLY to kill some monsters (and iirc, they only spawn after you accept the quest and if multiple quests are in the same area, you get to go down multiple times). Gathering poultrices and killing drakes were not grindfests because it is inevitable you'll encounter them along the way if you just PLAY THE GAME. Finishing a quest on the way to a main quest is not the same thing.

Marionetten wrote...
Now you're just behaving like a fanboy. You even stated yourself that you only played The Witcher for two hours. How exactly does that account for 95% of the game?

Reading reviews and such. I still had a glint of hope for the game after I ragequit, but apparently that's what most of the game is about so why would I bother suffering more?
This is just one terrible aspects of the game. I am not even going to go into the combat system and the overly-complicated and ****ty alchemy system.
And I am being a fanboy? Well geez, I thought it was pretty obvious I am a Bioware fanboy by this point. Is there some sort of shame to it I should feel? It's not exactly my fault Bioware has defined RPG for me and you are trying to compare some sort of husk of a RPG to a Bioware game. Just because I am a fanboy doesn't mean I like everything about Bioware and hate everything that is not made by Bioware. I also happen to be a Blizzard fanboy, and I enjoyed Diablo 2 (zomg a RPG not made by Bioware). I didn't like the entire KotOR series and couldn't stand ME1.

Shiroukai wrote...
Sounds
like you didn't played the game, collecting quests were only side
quests, all the other good quest which didn't involved collecting or
killing x amound were all story quests. The detective chapter 2 part was
especialy good, there was even a part were you needed to indentify the
course of dead on a body.

Too bad the entire game was littered with these side quests. Don't speak as if the game had ****ty part it was only in the side quests then the entire game is still okay. ME1 had all those terrible planets you get to visit with the same building layout and boring quests. That wasn't required and it still made the game terrible for me. BG1 had a little of that with the abundance of random areas with terrible quests (in comparison, BG2 had amazing side quests). A more recent example is ME2 and the resource gathering system that was just ...

slimgrin wrote...
Completely untrue. The game requires patience and a willingness to read. Grinding is never necessary, even though it is possible. But then you've played 2 hrs of 70 hr game so you know all about it right?

If a game hasn't gotten interesting if I've been playing for 2 whole hours then I am not sure it'll be amazing later on, and I am not willing to commit more times for a chance for the game to actually get good. There are other things I can spend my time on, like a game that actually doesn't suck.

slimgrin wrote...
I
have to say, I get tired of people like you outright dismissing games
because they're not up their alley. It's like The Witcher took away your
birthday and you feel obligated to come in here and spew a bunch of
nonsense. 

Why the hell would I not dismiss a game if I don't like it? Am I supposed to play it so I can see your point of view? I only started talking about TW because people were comparing it in this thread and I was expressing my opinion. Not everyone has to agree with you, and people who do not isn't raging or trolling, and they are definitely not trying to destroy the game by commenting on it.
If you want to talk to people who share your point completely, then the only one left in this world to talk to is yourself. Until you understand what difference of opinions mean, GTFO.

Modifié par AuraofMana, 06 septembre 2010 - 06:38 .

[ObserverStatus]

I think ME1 had it about right, Bioware shouldn't let Fox News define what is appropriate, that's what ESRB is for.

[ProudNegro]

My face when This became a  Witcher VS Dragon age thread

[img]http://images.4chan.org/v/src/1283797794866.png[/img]