332 réponses à ce sujet

[ErichHartmann]

Monica83 wrote...

we readed it and manu of us don't like what we read... All sounds static.. Warrior have alf ability removed and can't use dual or bows.. This is a smack in face for the roleplay.. In Dao you can build your character a way better you aren't forced to see warriors as muscolar one.. They changed it to keep the class distinct but in the same way they made them static and.. in terms of roleplay they don't give any valid explanation..So in this is not better is whorse for roleplay

You have too many arbitrary definitions for what an RPG is.  Have you ever played Planescape Torment?  You played a pre-defined character who could either be a mage, thief, or warrior.  Nothing complex but had an incredible storyline.  I just don't see how an RPG is shallow with fewer combat builds.  Story is way more important.     

[Kiely]

javierabegazo wrote...

Why do people insist that Length has anything to do with the quality of a game...?

Because of the cost.

[Kiely]

I'm caring less about the direction DA2 will take as NWN3 appears to becoming a reality.

[Monica83]

wel planescape is born to be an rpg like that dragon age no

[The Masked Rog]

Monica83 wrote...

wel planescape is born to be an rpg like that dragon age no

It's already been explained to you that Dragon Age 2 does not have static classes or adopts any mechanic that makes it an adventure game. You don't want to believe that, there's nothing anyone can do.

[Lumikki]

The Masked Rog wrote...

Frankly though, it doesn't matter. It allows us to get more distinct classes (very good) and they said you can still make thugish rogues or more lightweight warriors. So there is room for roleplay in character building. And now we have the dialogue wheel and a voiced protagonist which since he cames from a single Origin allow the game to be much more focused in roleplaying him, giving more sencible choices for humans, instead of generic ones which rarely account for the race you are. Pure roleplay win.

Actually I don't get this why is more district classes very good thing? I mean what's the good thing in it?

I can understand if there is player who plays game three times with all different three classes and likes roleplay very different styles or jumps between characters alot.

How ever, what about players who playes the games story only one time and are now forced more distruct choise of classes. They can't really customise they class how they want, because it's not allowed for any classes. Like something what they want is in one class while something else in other.

My point is that even if more district class roles are fine, it's not really that good thing for everyone. It can limit some options out, what player may like.

Modifié par Lumikki, 13 septembre 2010 - 07:16 .

[euramer1]

Some of the last extensions for DA are only battle oriented (I have done all of them except the witch hunt, i.e. the golem of Amgarrak), if DA2 follow that trend what will be DA2 extensions?

[Aran Linvail]

TMZuk wrote...

Maconbar wrote...

We should all be afraid because change is coming to the world.

Change is fine when it is change for the better.

-Removing our choise in race is not better. Especially not when the only reason is that you then are able to make a voiced protagonist.

-Removing our choise in background is not better.

-Removing our choise in what weapons we wish our characters to use is not better. Especially not when the reason is ... animations!

-Having a quadzillion loose ends dangling in the air after the first game, and then skip it and move on to the next is not better.

-Leaving a game unstable, and not properly patched, and then move on to the next is not better.

I'm a customer and I want a product that gives me what I want. I am not buying something hoping  it will do so, when all the information I have received indicates it will not.

Same here , but hey , our opinions dosen't matter anyway , i just dont get it , they already have Mass Effect ( Dont get me wrong , i like Mass Effect , is a great game , i just wish ME2 have more rpg and a little less FPS , but thats personal opinion ) , Why turn Dragon Age Franchise in the same direction ? They have a Action oriented Rpg ( ME ) , they are making a MMO ( KOTOR ) , why not have a Old School Like RPG ? I remember they saying that Dragon Age is The Spiritual Sucessor of Baldur's Gate , so people buy the game knowing that gonna be a Old Shool like RPG , did Dragon Age sell Bad ? But none of this matter anyway , because what i think or what i want dont change nothing ( Or so people say in the first 4 pages of this topic ) , so thats make me think : Why the hell i type all this stuff here ? I think im a delusional fanboy kind of person , well disregard my post , dosent mean nothing in the bigger picture of Bioware game directions ...

Obs : English is not my country Language so please forgive me for any grammar errors or any frases that dosent make any sense at all . and please dont think im a delusional fanboy Illiterate , im just a delusional fanboy from a not english speaking country , but not illiterate , Thanks

Modifié par Baldurs Gate Fanboy, 13 septembre 2010 - 08:40 .

[euramer1]

I agree that NWN3 would be good news, but it's far away and I hope that all these discussions will advance the idea of the kind of game I have enjoyed playing for so long. I will wait for the first reviews in Europe and the forum comments of the first users before making my choice. If they have modified too much the way I like playing a RPG...

[euramer1]

(Sorry for the double sending)

Modifié par euramer1, 13 septembre 2010 - 08:36 .

[Cariborne]

Think of it this way, we're shaping the world, which means indirectly we'll be seeing a LOT of different stuff throughout our many characters. Say the game is 15 hours per class, That's 45 hours to "beat" the game's main storyline, then throw in all the Mini-Quests, Companion Stories, Dungeon Exploration, etc. And you can add another 10 hours, so to do everything the game can throw out you "beating" the game will take 55 or so hours.



Beating this game with one/character class with certain choices just means you finished the main story, you didn't beat the game.

[The Hardest Thing In The World]

Length really isnt that important. Look at the Nature of the Beast quest fir example. The game made you fight all these werewolves and undead only for the werewolves to finally agree to talk to you. Lengthening the game in this sense is not fun at all.

[The Masked Rog]

We're trying to encourage many possible effective builds with each class.

Peter Thomas



So there for the ones saying that classes will be static.

[AlanC9]

Monica83 wrote...

wel planescape is born to be an rpg like that dragon age no

Monica, what on earth are you trying to say here? Dragon Age 2 shouldn't be like PS:T because DAO wasn't like PS:T? Then you're not making an argument about whether the game will or won't be good; you're just posting a desire that they shouldn't make any changes whatsoever because you don't like change.

[Sylvius the Mad]

Torment's great strength was in the roleplaying. The Nameless One got to be whomever you decided he should be. He had this tremendous backstory, but who he was (as a person) now was entirely up to the player, and how he felt about that backstory was entirely up to the player.

KotOR actually did something very similar, which is why I like it so much.

It remains to be seen if the player will have anywhere near as much control over Hawke's personality. I had thought we would when David described him as "a blank slate" but David then told me I'd misinterpreted the label.

A blank slate is only valuable if I'm the one with the chalk. Torment gave us the chalk, and that's why Torment was a terrific RPG.

Modifié par Sylvius the Mad, 14 septembre 2010 - 06:52 .

[EpicBoot2daFace]

I think they should make changes, but they should be careful what they change. I was fooled into buying ME2 because I thought it would be the sequel to the first game in terms of gamplay, RPG mechanics, and the like. Little did I know that almost everything was scrapped and replaced with something different, or in some cases, not replaced at all... just scrapped.



I want to go into DA2 knowing that it's the sequel to the first game. I don't want it to be so different that I end up not liking it as much as the first, or not liking it at all. I'm always willing to give it a shot, but after ME2, I think I'm going to be more cautious with BioWare sequels. Especially now that EA is involved... they cannot be trusted.

[Alodar]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

Torment's great strength was in the roleplaying. The Nameless One got to be whomever you decided he should be. He had this tremendous backstory, but who he was (as a person) now was entirely up to the player, and how he felt about that backstory was entirely up to the player.

KotOR actually did something very similar, which is why I like it so much.

It remains to be seen if the player will have anywhere near as much control over Hawke's personality. I had thought we would when David described him as "a blank slate" but David then told me I'd misinterpreted the label.

A blank slate is only valuable if I'm the one with the chalk. Torment gave us the chalk, and that's why Torment was a terrific RPG.

I never made it past a couple of hours with Torment because the Nameless One wasn't a blank slate -- he was a defined drawing.

I didn't get to choose what the protagonist looked like, or sounded like, or even their name. If I don't have any choice in the main character I might as well read a novel. So I never picked up the chalk because too much was already drawn for me.



Alodar

[Rieverre]

Let's put it like this - Torment told the best story because it had the Nameless One there as a strong foundation for that story. For that reason, it was also the most ... hmm ... personal story. BG and BG2 did something similar because, hey, Forgotten Realms ... not too much difference between how various of the races you can play may or may not be treated by the people around you, and it still gave you the solid foundation of Grew Up In Candlekeep -> Bhaalspawn ->etc.



In this way, I actually do have a good feeling about DA2 - it should offer a more focused RPing experience than DA:O did, if only because instead of having to make allowances for a number of different races/origins, you get the firm foundation of your character being from Lothering, having a family, etc. Who the character is and how he/she interacts with things, that's still up to you, but this 'fixing' of said character in the world does give you a certain amount of added depth to play with.



So yes, I'm actually hopeful here.



I don't care much for the weapon restrictions - feels too much like an MMO, the way things are being described, but I suppose I could live with it if it's done right.



The length, or rather the breadth of the gameplay experience is a bit of a sticking point with me. ME already gave us tightly focused and cinematic. While that is indeed nice, I do expect a different sort of experience from a Dragon Age game. After all, isn't it the side-quests, the 'fluff', as it were, that help us define just who our character is, in-game, as much as the main storyline quests do? And apparently this - defining our personal take on Hawke, who he/she is, why he/she acts the way he/she does - is going to be what DA2 is about. Which is why I'm concerned when the devs start saying it'll be shorter than Origins.

[The Hardest Thing In The World]

Sometimes the game reminds me of King's Quest with the way my PC not smart enough to run around a path blocking it's way.



King's Quest is an adventure game.

[Sylvius the Mad]

Alodar wrote...

I never made it past a couple of hours with Torment because the Nameless One wasn't a blank slate -- he was a defined drawing.

I didn't get to choose what the protagonist looked like, or sounded like, or even their name. If I don't have any choice in the main character I might as well read a novel. So I never picked up the chalk because too
much was already drawn for me.

Customisation of that sort is less important to me than the ability to customise the character's personality.

Rieverre wrote...

Let's put it like this - Torment told the best story because it had the Nameless One there as a strong foundation for that story. For that reason, it was also the most ... hmm ... personal story. BG and BG2 did something similar because, hey, Forgotten Realms ... not too much difference between how various of the races you can play may or may not be treated by the people around you, and it still gave you the solid foundation of Grew Up In Candlekeep -> Bhaalspawn ->etc.

I think Torment succeeded in allowing a wholly personal story because it worked regardless of what the PC's personality was.

I think BG also did this well, as did DAO, KotOR, and NWN (both the OC and SoU).

A game like ME or KotOR2 fails to tell a personal story, I think, by not allowing the player to know the PC well enough.  By having a pre-defined personality or background that actually matters to decision-making and demeanour, the player either is forced to dance to someone else's tune, or asked to follow along without having any idea what is going on.

A book or movie can have a well-defined protagonist because the reader isn't asked to take part.  But in an RPG, the player is routinely asked for input, and without knowing the PC's personality inside and out the player is ill-equipped to make any decisions on the PC's behalf.

Modifié par Sylvius the Mad, 14 septembre 2010 - 09:02 .

[Rieverre]

More or less, this^.



Hawke has a foundation. It's a more than decent foundation. But other than that, defining his/her personality, actions and reasons is what DA2 is supposed to be about.

[Sylvius the Mad]

Rieverre wrote...

More or less, this^.

Hawke has a foundation. It's a more than decent foundation. But other than that, defining his/her personality, actions and reasons is what DA2 is supposed to be about.

That remains to be seen.  Ideally, yes, defining Hawke's personality would be the core gameplay in DA2.

But in the only other BioWare games with voiced protagonists, the Mass Effect games, the player is given remarkably little freedom to define the PC's personality.

A good test for DA2, I think, would be to take two of your more unusual character designs from DAO and try to transplant those personalities - or something like them - into Hawke.  If they both work, then DA2 has succeeded in allowing the player to define Hawke's personality.

For an added challenge, make both of those characters the same gender.  That way you avoid just getting lucky with having the voice-over work for that particular character.

So, for example, in DAO I played a Male Elf Rogue who had no ambition, and generally went where life led him.  He didn't like to make decisions or take command, and would always do whatever his companions suggested.  He also didn't engage in combat if he could at all help it.  He wouldn't ever take a principled stand on anything, because he was afraid of having opinions or letting others know what his opnions were for fear of being ridiculed.

Would that pesonality work on Hawke in DA2?

And if so, would any other?  In DAO I also played a Male Human Mage who was entirely self-interested.  He was charismatic and was nice to people, but he never really cared about any of them.  His closest friends in the party were Morrigan and Wynne, because he only respected Mages and he viewed everyone else as subnormal.  His one failing was he would often forget to react emotionally in times when it was expected of him, and thus his caring facade was revealed to be nothing more than just a facade.

What are the odds I can play both of those characters in DA2 and have them be coherent characters who don't say or do things I wouldn't have chosen?

This will liely be the standard by which I judge the game.  I fully expect one of these character concepts to be broken irreparably the first time Hawke speaks aloud.  He'll probabaly sound altogether too sure of himself to credibly be that first character I described.