203 réponses à ce sujet

[Shadow_broker]

DarthCyclopsRLZ wrote...

Shadow_broker wrote...

Gameplay biotic use and Story Biotic use are seperate don't mix the two together

Wasn't I *laughing* at how Samara's initial powerset proves just that?

Her Gameplay Is bioticly focused thus cooldown option is a Viable Strategy where as characters who only have 1 biotic power availbe for use it would be usless, Her powerset proves nothing.

[sinosleep]

Shadow_broker wrote...

Gameplay Biotic use and Story Biotic use a very diffrent and should not be grouped together

You keep saying that but clearly several of us disagree.

[Shadow_broker]

sinosleep wrote...

Shadow_broker wrote...

Gameplay Biotic use and Story Biotic use a very diffrent and should not be grouped together

You keep saying that but clearly several of us disagree.

Just because you disagree does not make it true.

[NICKjnp]

sinosleep wrote...

Shadow_broker wrote...

Gameplay Biotic use and Story Biotic use a very diffrent and should not be grouped together

You keep saying that but clearly several of us disagree.

It's ok... we know the truth sinosleep.

[Shadow_broker]

NICKjnp wrote...

sinosleep wrote...

Shadow_broker wrote...

Gameplay Biotic use and Story Biotic use a very diffrent and should not be grouped together

You keep saying that but clearly several of us disagree.

It's ok... we know the truth sinosleep.

Yet have no facts to back it up

You lost cerdibility when you asserted Thane is a tier 2 biotic since he has one offensive biotic power, But claim Miranda is a T3 even though she has 2 offensive biotic powers

[sinosleep]

Shadow_broker wrote...

Just because youdisagree does not make it true.

Same could be said for you couldn't it? 

[DarthCyclopsRLZ]

Shadow_broker wrote...

Her Gameplay Is bioticly focused thus cooldown option is a Viable Strategy where as characters who only have 1 biotic power availbe for use it would be usless, Her powerset proves nothing.

Her pre-Loyalty biotic damage output is still the second worst of all biotics.
Miranda and Thane get Warp while Jack gets shockwave. Keep in mind that I did say biotic damage since Jacob's squad ammo would tip the balance of overall party damage.

Are you going on about how her initial powerset isn't somewhat lackluster? Really?

[Shadow_broker]

sinosleep wrote...

Shadow_broker wrote...

Just because youdisagree does not make it true.

Same could be said for you couldn't it? 

I have facts and Ingame Refrences to back my claims that gameplay biotics and story Biotics are Seperate, you don't
So no same could not be said

[Mcovin]

I think we can all agree that Kaiden,Thane, and Jacob are the weakest three of the group. HOwever as to the strongest of the group, it's debatable

[NICKjnp]

Shadow_broker wrote...

NICKjnp wrote...

sinosleep wrote...

Shadow_broker wrote...

Gameplay Biotic use and Story Biotic use a very diffrent and should not be grouped together

You keep saying that but clearly several of us disagree.

It's ok... we know the truth sinosleep.

Yet have no facts to back it up

You lost cerdibility when you asserted Thane is a tier 2 biotic since he has one offensive biotic power, But claim Miranda is a T3 even though she has 2 offensive biotic powers

I gave you facts... you ignored them.  Thane is tier 2 because both his biotic powers are damaged based.  Miranda is tier three because only her warp is damaged based.  Slam is nothing more than a beefed up pull.

[RGFrog]

Shadow_broker wrote...
Just because you disagree does not make it true.

How does that taste, Shadow_B? The foot in your mouth, i mean?

You may disagree with others, but you've not provided anything concrete to defend your opinion nor invalidate those that you disagree with.

Here's a fact that supports them and not you. As an adept, gameplay and story-wise (the game is the story...) Sheppard time and again defeated Assari commandos... you know, those squid heads with more biotic potential and power than ANY human in Milky Way. Then, as an Adept, he defeated Liara's mother, Benezia, who was concidered a powerful biotic and revered Matriarch of a species to which it's been made abundantly clear is far and away ahead of humanity in the field of biotics.

That puts Shep, no matter what you think, in the same boat if not at the top of the pack where adepts are concerned. Jack is obviously meant to be stronger, so both are at the least a match for Samara if not slightly lower due to her experience which would win out over Jack any day.

[Shadow_broker]

DarthCyclopsRLZ wrote...

Shadow_broker wrote...

Her Gameplay Is bioticly focused thus cooldown option is a Viable Strategy where as characters who only have 1 biotic power availbe for use it would be usless, Her powerset proves nothing.

Her pre-Loyalty biotic damage output is still the second worst of all biotics.
Miranda and Thane get Warp while Jack gets shockwave. Keep in mind that I did say biotic damage since Jacob's squad ammo would tip the balance of overall party damage.

Are you going on about how her initial powerset isn't somewhat lackluster? Really?

Im trying to say The use of Biotics in gameplay are not equal to that of Story, Liara is a great squadmate gameplay wise without doubt. But does not make her character as powerful as Samara or jack would be Story wise

[Malanek]

RGFrog wrote...

1. Sheppard, Morinth, Samara, Jack, Liara
2. Thane, Miranda, Wrex
3. Jacob
4. Kaiden

Kaiden is an early form of human biotic with L2 biotics. No matter what you want him to be, he's outdated. Being Alliance and a mere naval Lt., it's unlikely he would warrant the cost of upgrades.

Sheppard would have been given at least L3 durring his rebuild. Jack, I assume, has L2 as well, but with the LX5 upgrade, she's now a touch more powerful than Shep and his L3's.

Jacob has what, pull? Even if he's got more in story land, it's not much. But, without a doubt, Cerberus would've upgraded him. So, he's more bombastic than Kaiden.

Assari's make L3's look like jokes, though. But still Shep and Jack are right up there with them. Otherwise, Liara's mom would have turned him into paste and fed him to the Rachni Queen.

Most logical post on this subject.

[hawat333]

Speaking story and character wise, not stat wise:

Let's categorize them in tiers
Tier 1:
Jack,
Morinth (don't forget she consumes the energy of others like a good ol' highlander)
Samara,

Tier 2:
Miranda,
Liara (she may have raw strength but lacks the experience of a trained and tried asari like Samara... yet),
Kaidan (those L2 implants flare high. @ RGFrog: Actually, that's the point. It's outdated. The newer L3 or L4 implants are somewhat weaker as they were made to be more safe. It's even mentioned in ME1 if you play an Adept. L2s are stronger the newer, updated biotics, but also have nasty side effects. Except for Shepard, who, despite being an L3 is stronger than even most L2s.)
Adept Shepard (Because hey, he's de big goddamn hero)

Tier 3:
Wrex,
Thane,
Jacob (neither of them is relying heavily on biotics which means lack of experience or simply they know they aren't strong in that aspect of combat so they use different methods. Unsure about Jacob though. He could be tier 2,5

Modifié par hawat333, 09 septembre 2010 - 12:42 .

[Shadow_broker]

NICKjnp wrote...

Shadow_broker wrote...

NICKjnp wrote...

sinosleep wrote...

Shadow_broker wrote...

Gameplay Biotic use and Story Biotic use a very diffrent and should not be grouped together

You keep saying that but clearly several of us disagree.

It's ok... we know the truth sinosleep.

Yet have no facts to back it up

You lost cerdibility when you asserted Thane is a tier 2 biotic since he has one offensive biotic power, But claim Miranda is a T3 even though she has 2 offensive biotic powers

I gave you facts... you ignored them.  Thane is tier 2 because both his biotic powers are damaged based.  Miranda is tier three because only her warp is damaged based.  Slam is nothing more than a beefed up pull.

In order for any of those Facts to be Valid you need to show me an actual reason Why Gameplay Biotic use is Cannon for a characters Biotic abilities story wise

I think you may be mistaken to thinking im arguing about a characters usefulness gameplay wise, I am not.
I am arguing their tier story wise

[Taritu]

I don't know, everyone who mentions Liara's biotics seems to think they're pretty strong, including Wrex in game 1.



Liara finds Kaiden's biotics impressive in ME1 as well, I'd say he's quite a powerful human biotic. There is also a comment that Kaiden is better than almost any human biotics, except Shepard (if Shep is an adept.)



It's hard to say who's at the top in tier 1, but I'd give Samara the edge, and put Jack as slightly more powerful than Liara, but with Liara a lot more skilled than Jack.



In gameplay terms, of course, Samara and Liara both are vastly more useful than Jack's lousy selection of biotic powers.

[sinosleep]

Shadow_broker wrote...

Im trying to say The use of Biotics in gameplay are not equal to that of Story, Liara is a great squadmate gameplay wise without doubt. But does not make her character as powerful as Samara or jack would be Story wise

What about her combat abilities in the comics, how she easily defeated the spy in her office, or the ass kickery she puts down on random mooks during the LotSB dlc? 

[DarthCaine]

In terms of storyline?

Jack
Samara
Morinth
Liara
Kaidan
Miranda
Jacob
Wrex
Thane

[hawat333]

@Taritu

I don't know about Liara being more skilled than Jack.
Jack is fighting for her life using biotics ever since she was a child. Liara was a more or less peaceful scientist, with the field of archeology until a couple of years back.
I'm pretty much convinced that Jack has more experience using biotic powers in a fight. Well, she's not that subtle, that's for certain too.

Modifié par hawat333, 09 septembre 2010 - 12:45 .

[sinosleep]

Taritu wrote...

In gameplay terms, of course, Samara and Liara both are vastly more useful than Jack's lousy selection of biotic powers.

Unless you're playing a warp bomb sentinel, in which case Jack and Samara pulling while you bomb will result in more damage than any other warp bomb combination. I felt the same way into I played with a sentinel and crunched the numbers.

[Shadow_broker]

RGFrog wrote...

Shadow_broker wrote...
Just because you disagree does not make it true.

How does that taste, Shadow_B? The foot in your mouth, i mean?

You may disagree with others, but you've not provided anything concrete to defend your opinion nor invalidate those that you disagree with.

Here's a fact that supports them and not you. As an adept, gameplay and story-wise (the game is the story...) Sheppard time and again defeated Assari commandos... you know, those squid heads with more biotic potential and power than ANY human in Milky Way. Then, as an Adept, he defeated Liara's mother, Benezia, who was concidered a powerful biotic and revered Matriarch of a species to which it's been made abundantly clear is far and away ahead of humanity in the field of biotics.

That puts Shep, no matter what you think, in the same boat if not at the top of the pack where adepts are concerned. Jack is obviously meant to be stronger, so both are at the least a match for Samara if not slightly lower due to her experience which would win out over Jack any day.

Shepard always had two Squadmates with him when he won those fights, Debunked as speculation on how much they contributed to the fight

[NICKjnp]

Someone else want to explain to Shadow Broker... because I'm done with it.

[Shadow_broker]

DarthCaine wrote...

In terms of storyline?

Jack
Samara
Morinth
Liara
Kaidan
Miranda
Jacob
Wrex
Thane

I'd argue that Kadian and Miranda are interchangable but this is about the only list on this thread other than mine that i agree with on the most part

Thank you sir!

[DarthCaine]

sinosleep wrote...

Shadow_broker wrote...

Im trying to say The use of Biotics in gameplay are not equal to that of Story, Liara is a great squadmate gameplay wise without doubt. But does not make her character as powerful as Samara or jack would be Story wise

What about her combat abilities in the comics, how she easily defeated the spy in her office, or the ass kickery she puts down on random mooks during the LotSB dlc?

Jack took down several Mechs. Liara is nowhere near Jack's, Samara's, Morinth's or Benezia's level

[Unit-Alpha]

Shadow_broker wrote...

1:Wrex is a battle master,
Likley better than jacob thane and Even maybe Miranda/kadian
2:Liara has no indication through dialagoue,codex, or entires on suicide mission that shes a better biotic than any other asari and is definatley not on the same level as jack
3:Jack took 3 heavy mechs down and a space station in minutes, she is by far the strongest

Uh, no. That makes no sense. Asari have a natural affinity for biotics; humans do not. Therefore, Liara is probably (90%) more powerful. Jack's cutscene is just stupid how it makes her look so great, but in game she is terrible. Stop bringing up the damn cutscene! It's called dramatic hyperbole, people!

It should be:

Samara
Mornith
Liara
Jack
....

Modifié par Unit-Alpha, 09 septembre 2010 - 12:51 .