203 réponses à ce sujet

[PWENER]

Absurd? It's a question. I want to know wich one is stronger in lore, not gameplay. Any takers?

[Nimander]

I honestly don't remember it mentioned, though I could be wrong. I read them a while ago. I just recall that you gotta be really strong to do a singularity and so on.

[krownhunter07]

Both are the staples of their class.



Adepts can create mini black holes, while vanguards zip across the battlefield and hit you with the force of a bomb...



I'd say equal in power, but completely different tactics.

[PWENER]

Black holes suck things and are never seen again. Singularity drops them in the ground just like it picked them 30 seconds later.

[krownhunter07]

Ehh, they make a pinprick in space have uber mass for s bit then...



Regardless, the both require similar expertise, training and have (losely) similar effects.



Application is vastly different, however.

[clennon8]

krownhunter07 wrote...

Both are the staples of their class.

Adepts can create mini black holes, while vanguards zip across the battlefield and hit you with the force of a bomb...

I'd say equal in power, but completely different tactics.

Yeah, except Charge is often a pretty stupid tactic on Hardcore/Insanity.  Here's the key to using Charge well:  Don't use it very often.  It's a win-more move.  In other words, about the only time it's a good idea to Charge is when you already pretty much won the fight and you're just mopping up.

Btw, it's pretty disingenuous to say Charge  take out multiple opponenets.  It can only do that at level 4, and only if you choose Area Charge.

I've done a couple of play-throughs with Vanguards, and it's probably my least favorite class out of all the ones I've tried (I've tried them all except Engineer).

[PWENER]

We're talking about lore, not gameplay.

[clennon8]

PWENER wrote...

We're talking about lore, not gameplay.

I don't know then.  Haven't read the books.

[PWENER]

Me neither. lol.

[fongiel24]

PWENER wrote...

Absurd? It's a question. I want to know wich one is stronger in lore, not gameplay. Any takers?

I would go with singularity. Charge is powerful, but it is essentially just using a turbo version of Push on yourself - a short burst of biotic power that propels a 150-250lb. humanoid biotic a relatively short distance. Singularity requires the biotic to create some sort of gravity well that can sustain itself long enough to suck in and hold several opponents in the air for an extended period of time. In Ascension, the description of singularity makes it sound like a kind of biotic hurricane, lifting up everything around it and throwing it around.

Modifié par fongiel24, 16 septembre 2010 - 05:07 .

[Nimander]

While I don't recall any lore reasoning either way, I would argue this. Charge is not simply a biotic push. You phase through solid matter. It's more a miniature mass relay. I could see that needing tons of power. But as for official stuff? Nothing that I remember.

[GnusmasTHX]

They both alter space-time, though in different ways, but I'd have to say Singularity is more useful when facing more enemies. It's basically a controlled-lift, plus continuous warp.

[atheelogos]

I believe bioware said themselves that Jack was the strongest biotic they've ever created. So she should be in everyone's first spot.

[krownhunter07]

It was said that she is the strongest 'human' biotic... and that was pre-shep Borg...

[VanTesla]

this is my list...



1. Samara

2. Jack

3.Liara

4.Wrex

5. Shepard(maybe for in all scenes he never uses his powers...)

6.Miranda or kaidan

7.either of 6.

8.Thane

9.Jacob



Reason is for counting factors of age, skill, experience, training, knowledge.



I did not count Morinth for I kill her every playthrough... Shepard is the major question of rank though in my opinion.



Liara is third for even though she is young for a Asari her knowledge and skill goes far beyond her years and her battles with Shepard have made her stronger than any high level training can give. In the cut scenes she was kicking the Asari Specters butt single handed. Liara is more defense though by story depiction though than offensive.

[PWENER]

Shepard should be in first place.



Krogan used to get biotic power artificially through surgery, but it was high risk and since the Krogan numbers are diminished, it 's not done anymore.



Cerberus did the same thing with Shepard. Since he/she was already dead, there was no risk and could fill his/her body with enough biotic energy to kill a Thrasher Maw.

[tonnactus]

clennon8 wrote...


Yeah, except Charge is often a pretty stupid tactic on Hardcore/Insanity. 

Nonsense.Take a look in the gameplay thread.

[clennon8]

tonnactus wrote...

clennon8 wrote...


Yeah, except Charge is often a pretty stupid tactic on Hardcore/Insanity. 

Nonsense.Take a look in the gameplay thread.

I've read the thread, or some of it anyway.  tldr all of it.  I'll just say this again:  The key to using Charge correctly on Insanity is to not use it very often.  I know you want me to think there's some tactical aspect to it that I'm not getting, but I'm not buying it.  Charge is a win-more move.  It's flashy and fun, but quite often strategically unsound on the harder difficulty levels.

[krownhunter07]

Ha, name another class that can go toe to toe with a scion (or krogan, Ymir, harbinger, etc) on insanity with no cover, and only a pistol and their staple power...



I've done this with a Vanguard and Sentinel. It was be far much easier with charge.

[Whatever42]

Are we talking most raw power or most effective with skill and training? For example, Liara might have more raw power than Shepard, but a savvy battle-hardened Shepard might dismantle her.

If going by raw power:

1. Jack
2. Liara
3. Samara
4. Wrex
5. Adept Shep
6/7. Kaiden/Miranda
8/9. Jacob/Thane

That said, I think Adept Shepard or Samara would probably own anyone else in a pure biotics fight. Wrex would rely too much on his physical strength to be top tier, Liara is too inexperienced, and Jack too undisciplined. Now in a straight up fight all way around, Shepard would own them all, especially with his ME2 upgrades.

Modifié par Whatever666343431431654324, 16 septembre 2010 - 07:13 .

[Spectre_907]

PWENER wrote...

Black holes suck things and are never seen again. Singularity drops them in the ground just like it picked them 30 seconds later.

A singularity is a black hole. We just never see enemies being pulled into the event horizon in game. I think it is primarily game mechanics or perhaps biotics powerful enough to create a singularity train to put up mass effect fields to prevent allies from being pulled in and to keep enemies in a stable orbit. Grayson uses a singularity on a group of asari in ME: Retribution and it is described similar to the way black holes behave.

[clennon8]

krownhunter07 wrote...

Ha, name another class that can go toe to toe with a scion (or krogan, Ymir, harbinger, etc) on insanity with no cover, and only a pistol and their staple power...

I've done this with a Vanguard and Sentinel. It was be far much easier with charge.

Yes, with an advanced Vanguard you can kick one opponent's ass pretty hard, even a "tough" opponent like a Scion or Harbinger.  CHARGE bang bang bang CHARGE bang bang bang etc.  However, when the battlefield is full of armored and shielded opponents, you're almost always going to be better off taking cover and whittling the bad guys down with guns and debuff powers.  Like I keep trying to say, Charge is mostly for mopping up.  And to be fair, it's occasionally a good "get the heck out of dodge" defensive move.

[AntiChri5]

@clenon: just because you cant get good results out of Charge on Insanity does not mean it isn't possible.



I only ever play on Insanity, and Charge is very effective at the beggining of battles. I have finished all classes on Insanity except Sentinel who i am halfway through.