211 réponses à ce sujet

[KLUME777]

at OP,



GTFO, Valena was my favorite party member in Awakening.

[Homebound]

KLUME777 wrote...

at OP,

GTFO, Valena was my favorite party member in Awakening.

OBJECTION!!

I hated her so much. She was very conceited. Then again, the same can be said about Morrigan and people still like her. Different strokes.


On an unrelated,related note, Elves in DA remind me of First Nation Americans. Their lands stolen, their heritage lost..Its all there.

[BroBear Berbil]

Disliked Velanna as well. At this point I don't even let her join my group after my first play through which is something I don't do for any other companion. I can't stand her. She's the epitome of the annoying victimized elf with a massive chip on her shoulder that I've come to hate in DA.



I hate being called "shem" too, it just bugs me, I want to punch any elf that says it.



Ariane is literally the only Dalish that I halfway like. She has a bit of a personality unlike everybody else.

[KLUME777]

Why does everyone hate Velana?

[BroBear Berbil]

KLUME777 wrote...

Why does everyone hate Velana?

In my case, for the reasons I outlined.

[C9316]

Asking why Elves have pointy ears is like asking why dwarves are always short, it's just a feature that these various races always have I mean you don't ask why humans never have pointy ears right?

[Captain Iglo]

How are you supposed to seperate them from humans if they dont have em o_O



Just like with Sten...I had no idea that the qunari are actually supposed to be another race till I researched for the qunari in wikis and codex.

[FDrage]

Velana was an interesting character and her reaction and character traits makes sense when factoring her "past experiences" in ... at least to me. While I personally don't agree with her attitude that still doesn't make her less "well developed". However there were other characters that were far far more annoying.



Anyway back to the "Cliché" part ... Is a cliché something that one doesn't like and only then does it become a cliche?
At least I get the impression when following discussion about "cliches", because most things have been done to some degree or another. Each race so far has their so called "cliches" and other things that makes them different. if you use popular names for races, etc. then they should be at least somewhat recognizable. Otherwise you can called dwarves, elves, etc. something else ... I know lets call the qunaries .. elves and not qunaris ... or so.

The Elves always are "tree hugging, pointed ears, chip on the shoulder, bow weildin  nature lovers", the dwarves are "stubby, bearded, stone hugging, axe loving, crafting, cutting height compensating gigantic caverns into deep rocks people", the humans are "racist, control everything, on-top of the food chain, largest (by number) and widest spread, ignorant to anything else freaks", mages are "robe and staff wielding, power crazy, arrogant, "we are better then everyone else people". ... Ok I tried to be over the top on purpose.

Personally I think, if you call something or someone a specific recognizable name tnen you better be able to recognize it. Otherwise what is the point ... ? 

Captain Iglo wrote...
Just like with Sten...I had no idea that
the qunari are actually supposed to be another race till I researched
for the qunari in wikis and codex.

I had kind of the same feeling with Stan ... he just looked like a tall massive human.

Modifié par FDrage, 09 septembre 2010 - 10:51 .

[Aeowyn]

I doubt OP actually knows the meaning of "cliche" but here goes. In my opinion the elves what everything but the typical elf cliche. Unlike other games, books and films they were not the superior race who were attuned to nature and whatnot. In Dragon Age they are race without history due to 2000 years of enslavement, they are lost and still treated like rubbish and while one part of this race (the City Elf) live in ghettos similar to the Afroamerican ghettos in the 60s the other one is similar to the gypsies.

Just because the dalish are aggressive and suspicious toward you (I hated Velanna) it doesn't mean that they are cliched. They are acting like a people who have lost a lot of who they were due to another race/Empire normally acts. I don't know how many books I had to read by carribean writers where they spur their anger at the British Empire and their colonialism. So yes it exists.

As to why elves have pointy ears...well that's what makes them elves is is not?

[Heimdall]

KLUME777 wrote...

Why does everyone hate Velana?

She annoys some people.  Personally she was one of my favorite companions in DA:A.  The fact that she didn't call my mage elf shem probably helped and I felt awsome for getting rid of that chip on her shoulder when the epilogue slide told me she saved a human village from darkspawn straglers.
:innocent:

[ashwind]

KLUME777 wrote...

Why does everyone hate Velana?

I am taking a wild guess here. (apply to males only)

Because she is annoying at times - not unlike Morrigan -AND- most importantly, you cant get her into bed... 

Morrigan is all but forgiven when she says "My tent is so cold..."

 There's the answer!

[Erynor]

Elves always have pointy ears because humans always have flat ears and short necks (as opposed to giraffes). It's in their genes.

[Skalman91]

Why does the pope have a funny hat?

Modifié par Skalman91, 09 septembre 2010 - 01:01 .

[nuclearpengu1nn]

why doesn't humans have pointy ears?

[Leonia]

Why are some humans born as mages? Why do some become Grey Wardens?

[Gavinthelocust]

Because then they'd just be shorter skinnier versions of us and god knows we can't have a serious fantasy game with cookie elves.

[nikki191]

well bows and spears make more sense for a hunter gatherer group like the dalish, actually being transient like they were, the dalish are pretty unique.. yes we saw them in a forest but we dont find out exactly how extensive the tribes travel...  the dalish seem to be pretty self sufficient. hence i wouldnt expect them to be wearing plate.. a group of city elves i would however.. its as much a cultural philosophy as much as economics

As for the ears yes elves having pointy ears is a cliche, but frankly without it i doubt you could even tell they were elves otherwise, they would just be slightly built humans.

Modifié par nikki191, 09 septembre 2010 - 01:31 .

[Maconbar]

I think that the like of plate armor and alike in the Dalish setting that we see is more a function of economics and their situation. They are depicted as a nomadic group. The ability to make that type of armor requires fixed capital that a nomadic group can't access the necessary equipment. Nor do they appear to have the money to equip their warriors in heavy gear. Again the example of the plate-wearing tevinter elf.



In my mind the city elves were less an elven cliche and more resembled the medieval Jews of the ghettos in Europe.



The Dalish seemed more like certain Native American people or Gypsies.

[Maconbar]

Gavinthelocust wrote...

Because then they'd just be shorter skinnier versions of us and god knows we can't have a serious fantasy game with cookie elves.

Haha. When I first played Dungeons and Dragons my only concept of elves were the Keebler variety.

[Wishpig]

Saibh wrote...

It's a quality associated with the archetype, similar to dwarves being short.

Seriously, if they didn't have pointy ears they'd be short humans.

Also.

I have never once seen an elf have to "rise up from the slums despite racial disadvantages" in any other medium but DAO. The City Elves themselves were a massive subversion of the character archetypes.

I wouldn't say many of the elves came across as gentle tree-huggers--they were a species, with a history and a cultural identity, and yeah, that reflects back on their personality, but they didn't fall under the same tired stereotypes.

The Witcher

[Kritanakom]

Is Arianne from Witch Hunt also stereotypical? She wears awesome heavy armor and doesn't afraid of anything!

[Zreon]

Maconbar wrote...
...

In my mind the city elves were less an elven cliche and more resembled the medieval Jews of the ghettos in Europe.

The Dalish seemed more like certain Native American people or Gypsies.

That's the impression I got too. If I think of cliche elves there are two (highly subjective) images in my head:
1. A people of a declining and magical high culture which is way past its "golden age". These elves are proud and snobish and look down on other, lesser races. (High Elves)
2. A people of the mysterious and elusive kind, living hidden in forests, being one with nature and generally being more like nature spirits than anything else. ("Wood Elves", Fey)

I think neither of these fit the DA elves well. In fact, apart from the Witcher game, I haven't seen a lore where the elves are a beaten and defeated people, which are forced to live as either hardly tolerated servants for humans or as unwelcome nomads.
It feels everything but cliche to me.
Same applies for the other DA races. While they are physically like you expect them, their lore and history is quite different.

[Kritanakom]

Judging from the replies, I guess few people share your opinion, OP.



Sorry.



Maybe Arlathan will reveal stuff about the elves that will make them less cliche to you? Like they are all actually the third children of the maker that he had made on a small moon but who used their transmutation magic (like that which they used to make their walker guardians in Witch Hunt) to turn their moon into a SPACE GRASSHOPPER, which leapt from planet to planet until colliding with Thedas just north of the Anderfels, causing the flooding that would make the Free Marshes all marshy and creating a tidal wave that would hit the Qunari homeland, triggering the resource scarcity that made them such a warlike and stoic race!



It all makes sense!

[Beerfish]

This is the reason: