38 réponses à ce sujet

[Sonny_]

The DLCs are great (although short), but I wished they could have extended the dialogue for every squad member. Sometimes it feels like I'm fighting with two mutes

[Inquisitor Recon]

Gotta agree.

[robtheguru]

It costs money to hire voice actors. I'd guess certain voice actors are in house anyway, but people like Yvonne Strahovski (voices Miranda) have other commitments. So going all the way to Bioware to record one line would probably not be high on her priority list. So yeah, thats probably why you won't see very many new lines from party members in DLC.

[Ziggy]

It's the same in all the loyalty missions too: no one else cares.

[Mr.BlazenGlazen]

Same here.

[Mr. MannlyMan]

VA would be a pain to implement for every squadmate (though I can see it happening for a HUGE expansion, maybe sometime nearer ME3's release).



I thought they got the hand of making the squadmates *seem* more active in LotSB, where there were several scenes that actually made use of them. Then again, the banter with Liara really made up for any silence on the regular squadmates' parts. But still...



For ME3, they should pre-record a whole bunch of ambiguous lines for DLC following the main game's release: that way, they can incorporate more team dialogue into each DLC, even for the smaller add-ons. I'd rather hear Garrus chime in with "That's not right, Shepard," or "How about we split up, meet back at the central base in a bit?"



With fairly general lines like that, the DLC writers could easily write them into the script... the squadmates may not have very specific things to say, but at least they'll play a part in the DLC. IMO, that's how Bioware should've planned for the mini-mission add-ons like Firewalker and Overlord. Then, during development of the main game, perhaps plan out a few specific conversations for some of the major DLCs and then record squadmates' lines for those; cutting and editing should be no problem from there. Again, if they did that they'd at least have some dialogue to draw from other than recycled lines from the main game.

[FuturePasTimeCE]

I like the squad dialogue system of mass effect 1... atleast they talked more during each level than in mass effect 2... i should play mass effect 1 and see what every squad member has to say per level.

press a to talk vs only blue markets points for dialogue (annoying and stupid)

Modifié par FuturePasTimeCE, 09 septembre 2010 - 04:39 .

[Shadow_broker]

Unless you wanna pay double, not gonna happen unfortunatley.



I thought they did a great job fleshing characyers out with intel center in LoTSB

[searanox]

Mr. MannlyMan wrote...

For ME3, they should pre-record a whole bunch of ambiguous lines for DLC following the main game's release: that way, they can incorporate more team dialogue into each DLC, even for the smaller add-ons. I'd rather hear Garrus chime in with "That's not right, Shepard," or "How about we split up, meet back at the central base in a bit?"

I really agree with this, and I think it's even been done before once or twice in BioWare games, but not nearly often enough.  Even though it's additional work that isn't really necessary, in Mass Effect 2 especially, I feel like once I'm done with their loyalty missions, my companions are mindless, interchangeable drones.  I'd be more willing to care about who I have with me at a time if it actually made a difference to anything.

[KreeCapt]

I noticed the lack of Squad chatter in the Main Mission immediately. It was one of the charms of ME1 when you'd take a squad member and he/she would chime in. Then take completely different squaddies and have a completely different conversation.



ME2 lacked that.



For the DLC I don't really mind. Esp. with LotSB since the dialogue bet. Liara and Shep was hilarious and that's all that really mattered.

[Terror_K]

I don't expect it in the DLCs because getting 12 voice actors to come in just to make small comments for a DLC would be expensive. But I do definitely think that ME2 needed far more comments, input and involvement from the squaddies in the vanilla game.

[Marta Rio]

robtheguru wrote...

It costs money to hire voice actors. I'd guess certain voice actors are in house anyway, but people like Yvonne Strahovski (voices Miranda) have other commitments. So going all the way to Bioware to record one line would probably not be high on her priority list. So yeah, thats probably why you won't see very many new lines from party members in DLC.

So just FYI, voice actors don't actually have to fly across country to record a line of dialogue.  They can record it in a studio where they are, with their director talking to them over the phone (I think this is how they do it on the Venture Bros.).  They can also even do it over the phone, if needed (this is how Al Gore's guest lines on some episodes of Futurama were done, IIRC.).

The idea of voice acting being expensive is funny to me because I always thought that VAs get paid a pittance.  I've spoken (or rather, geeked out) with a casting director for an animated show and he was describing their rates to me, and I was rather shocked at how little they are paid (especially given how talented many of them are).  And this article says their annual average salary is just under $50,000 a year - so I can't imagine that a few lines of dialogue would be all that expensive.  Although I guess if it's all 12 squadmates that could get a little pricey.  And people like Yvonne Strahovski might be a little more expensive than most.

I wonder if it's more of a logistics hassle than anything else - e.g. you have to schedule studio time for all the VAs in different locations or fly them all to one place, you have to work out contracts with the actors and the individual studios, etc.  It makes sense to do these things if you're recording a large amount of dialogue at once, but for one or two lines maybe it's just not worth the effort? (Well it would be to us fans ...but maybe not to the dude/gal/team at Bioware who has to deal with it.)

EDIT: Whoops I should have read to the very bottom of that article I linked: "According to Screen Actors Guild rules, union voice actors can expect to be paid $760 for one four-hour recording session."
I don't know if the a four hour session is the minimum you can hire someone for under union rules, but if it's just DLC banter they probably don't need the full four hours.  So if you say half of that ($380 for two hours) then multiply it by 12, it comes to $4560.  Someone else is going to have to tell me if that's a lot compared to how much it costs to develop a DLC mission like Overlord or LotSB, as I have no idea.

Modifié par Marta Rio, 09 septembre 2010 - 05:57 .

[Arijharn]

robtheguru wrote...

It costs money to hire voice actors. I'd guess certain voice actors are in house anyway, but people like Yvonne Strahovski (voices Miranda) have other commitments. So going all the way to Bioware to record one line would probably not be high on her priority list. So yeah, thats probably why you won't see very many new lines from party members in DLC.

That would be true if BioWare wasn't patently planning and developing DLC at various stages together. Consider for example Lair of the Shadow Broker, who's to say that BioWare isn't already developing other post mission expansion data as well at various stages of development.

To expand upon this, maybe Yvonne Strahovski would be tapped to providing VO talent for post mission dlc pack #2 (which is nearest to release) and provide voice over talents for #3 & 4 at about the same time because other than re-recording and various dialogue rewrites/fixes, surely the lions share of the work would be finished.

[DarthCaine]

Even for a single line they'd have to pay the VA a full day's pay. With 13 voice actors that's a lot of money

Marta Rio wrote...

So just FYI, voice actors don't actually have to fly across country to record a line of dialogue.  They can record it in a studio where they are, with their director talking to them over the phone (I think this is how they do it on the Venture Bros.).  They can also even do it over the phone, if needed (this is how Al Gore's guest lines on some episodes of Futurama were done, IIRC.).

No, all the recording is done at BioWare studio. Only SOME of the VAs have their own studios (like DC Douglas I think)

Modifié par DarthCaine, 09 septembre 2010 - 06:06 .

[dm3565]

This is a company that:

1. Is developing a completely voice-acted MMO.
2. Is managing what might be the largest VO project of its kind in history.
3. Is coordinating internationally and at multiple studio locations.
4. Hired screen and television actors to do VO work in DAO and ME2.

I'm pretty sure they have the finances to swing some more voiceovers for major DLC installments. The major hassle is scheduling.

All I ask for is the level of banter, interaction and inter-group awareness they had for DAO. If they need to schedule ahead and keep some type of standing contract terms with the voice actors to ensure their availability, then I can pay a little more for my DLC for the privilege of more immersion. For that matter, I can say the same for ME3. Give me characters who talk to each other.

Modifié par dm3565, 09 septembre 2010 - 06:22 .

[DarthCaine]

dm3565 wrote...

This is a company that:

1. Is developing a completely voice-acted MMO.
2. Is managing what might be the largest VO project of its kind in history.
3. Is coordinating internationally and at multiple studio locations.
4. Hired screen and television actors to do VO work in DAO and ME2.

I'm pretty sure they have the finances to swing some more voiceovers for major DLC installments. The major hassle is scheduling.

Don't you think that after doing all that you should give them a break? Nobody else, invests so much into their games (well except Rockstar)

Modifié par DarthCaine, 09 septembre 2010 - 06:34 .

[dm3565]

No. I don't expect them to die in game development labor camps, but excellence is what they're in the business of doing. I'm a grateful fan, appreciative of their work, and I'm willing to pay for the quality. If games are to be pushed forward as a medium of art and entertainment, then onward and upward we must go.

Modifié par dm3565, 09 septembre 2010 - 06:57 .

[Ch40sFox]

KreeCapt wrote...

I noticed the lack of Squad chatter in the Main Mission immediately. It was one of the charms of ME1 when you'd take a squad member and he/she would chime in. Then take completely different squaddies and have a completely different conversation.

ME2 lacked that.

For the DLC I don't really mind. Esp. with LotSB since the dialogue bet. Liara and Shep was hilarious and that's all that really mattered.

Its why Mass Effect still rates higher in my book compared to ME2.

ME2, squadmates are just that, squadmates.

In Mass Effect, they are teammates, and have actual opinions. They talk to each other, share information with each other, ask each other about themselves, pose questions to them. It was a living breathing, actual team.

Mass Effect 2, some of the squadmates act like others dont exist.

Jack and Samara dont fight

Tali and Mordin dont have tech conversations.

Garrus and Grunt dont have combat strategy sessions.

Miranda doesnt visit Mordin for STG stories and tactical advice.

Garrus and Miranda dont have leadership discussions.

No dispute is made over whom is actually second in command.

Tali, Garrus, and Liara act like they dont exist to each other, same for Wrex.

Samara, Garrus, and Grunt dont exchange battle stories, or weapon customization tips.

The list goes on and on.....

If ME2 had been done in the style of Mass Effect, it most likely would have been 90% better than it is now.

It goes to show how impactful Shadow Broker was..... in my opinion, considered better than the game itself.

[FuturePasTimeCE]

Ch40sFox wrote...

KreeCapt wrote...

I noticed the lack of Squad chatter in the Main Mission immediately. It was one of the charms of ME1 when you'd take a squad member and he/she would chime in. Then take completely different squaddies and have a completely different conversation.

ME2 lacked that.

For the DLC I don't really mind. Esp. with LotSB since the dialogue bet. Liara and Shep was hilarious and that's all that really mattered.

Its why Mass Effect still rates higher in my book compared to ME2.

ME2, squadmates are just that, squadmates.

In Mass Effect, they are teammates, and have actual opinions. They talk to each other, share information with each other, ask each other about themselves, pose questions to them. It was a living breathing, actual team.

Mass Effect 2, some of the squadmates act like others dont exist.

Jack and Samara dont fight

Tali and Mordin dont have tech conversations.

Garrus and Grunt dont have combat strategy sessions.

Miranda doesnt visit Mordin for STG stories and tactical advice.

Garrus and Miranda dont have leadership discussions.

No dispute is made over whom is actually second in command.

Tali, Garrus, and Liara act like they dont exist to each other, same for Wrex.

Samara, Garrus, and Grunt dont exchange battle stories, or weapon customization tips.

The list goes on and on.....

If ME2 had been done in the style of Mass Effect, it most likely would have been 90% better than it is now.

It goes to show how impactful Shadow Broker was..... in my opinion, considered better than the game itself.

zaeed and grunt seem like they'd be bestest buds:blink: and don't talk about combat

[JnEricsonx]

FuturePasTimeCE wrote...

Ch40sFox wrote...

KreeCapt wrote...

I noticed the lack of Squad chatter in the Main Mission immediately. It was one of the charms of ME1 when you'd take a squad member and he/she would chime in. Then take completely different squaddies and have a completely different conversation.

ME2 lacked that.

For the DLC I don't really mind. Esp. with LotSB since the dialogue bet. Liara and Shep was hilarious and that's all that really mattered.

Its why Mass Effect still rates higher in my book compared to ME2.

ME2, squadmates are just that, squadmates.

In Mass Effect, they are teammates, and have actual opinions. They talk to each other, share information with each other, ask each other about themselves, pose questions to them. It was a living breathing, actual team.

Mass Effect 2, some of the squadmates act like others dont exist.

Jack and Samara dont fight

Tali and Mordin dont have tech conversations.

Garrus and Grunt dont have combat strategy sessions.

Miranda doesnt visit Mordin for STG stories and tactical advice.

Garrus and Miranda dont have leadership discussions.

No dispute is made over whom is actually second in command.

Tali, Garrus, and Liara act like they dont exist to each other, same for Wrex.

Samara, Garrus, and Grunt dont exchange battle stories, or weapon customization tips.

The list goes on and on.....

If ME2 had been done in the style of Mass Effect, it most likely would have been 90% better than it is now.

It goes to show how impactful Shadow Broker was..... in my opinion, considered better than the game itself.

zaeed and grunt seem like they'd be bestest buds:blink: and don't talk about combat

I'd pay another 10 odd bucks to get some more team mate dialogue.

[Marta Rio]

DarthCaine wrote...

Even for a single line they'd have to pay the VA a full day's pay. With 13 voice actors that's a lot of money

Marta Rio wrote...

So just FYI, voice actors don't actually have to fly across country to record a line of dialogue.  They can record it in a studio where they are, with their director talking to them over the phone (I think this is how they do it on the Venture Bros.).  They can also even do it over the phone, if needed (this is how Al Gore's guest lines on some episodes of Futurama were done, IIRC.).

No, all the recording is done at BioWare studio. Only SOME of the VAs have their own studios (like DC Douglas I think)

Where are you getting this info?  Is there some awesome Bioware VA interview/article thing that I should read?  Or are you on the inside? 

I'm asking because it makes no logical sense to me that they'd have to shell out a full days pay for a few lines of dialogue, unless it's some actor's union rule that I'm not aware of.  Also, I can understand them having done the recording at a Bioware facility for the main game dialogue, but for a few lines?  I didn't mean to imply that all the VAs have their own private studios, I mean that if they live in a sizable city (I think a fair number of them are based in LA) they can rent time in a studio.  (Musicians do this all the time, and I don't think it's unprecedented for VAs.)  Which for few lines of dialogue might be cheaper, and definitely would be easier schedule-wise.

[Iakus]

KreeCapt wrote...

I noticed the lack of Squad chatter in the Main Mission immediately. It was one of the charms of ME1 when you'd take a squad member and he/she would chime in. Then take completely different squaddies and have a completely different conversation.

ME2 lacked that.

For the DLC I don't really mind. Esp. with LotSB since the dialogue bet. Liara and Shep was hilarious and that's all that really mattered.

I miss it too.  Bioware used to do that for all their games.  If Bioware's going to have fully voiced characters, let them be fully voiced!

Ch40sFox wrote...

Its why Mass Effect still rates higher in my book compared to ME2.

ME2, squadmates are just that, squadmates.

In Mass Effect, they are teammates, and have actual opinions. They talk to each other, share information with each other, ask each other about themselves, pose questions to them. It was a living breathing, actual team.

Mass Effect 2, some of the squadmates act like others dont exist.

Jack and Samara dont fight

Tali and Mordin dont have tech conversations.

Garrus and Grunt dont have combat strategy sessions.

Miranda doesnt visit Mordin for STG stories and tactical advice.

Garrus and Miranda dont have leadership discussions.

No dispute is made over whom is actually second in command.

Tali, Garrus, and Liara act like they dont exist to each other, same for Wrex.

Samara, Garrus, and Grunt dont exchange battle stories, or weapon customization tips.

The list goes on and on.....

If ME2 had been done in the style of Mass Effect, it most likely would have been 90% better than it is now.

It goes to show how impactful Shadow Broker was..... in my opinion, considered better than the game itself.

All I gotta say, is:  This.  A lot. 

[shinobi602]

Sonny_ wrote...

The DLCs are great (although short), but I wished they could have extended the dialogue for every squad member. Sometimes it feels like I'm fighting with two mutes

Agree 100%