212 réponses à ce sujet

[Pious_Augustus]

I kind of felt for the The Architect and his minions. For one he can think and in a way he is not all that evil as with the messanger who you can let go, only problem is they spread the ghoul diease just by existing....I want to save them and let them be but I am not sure if its the right idea for my next game.

[Dean_the_Young]

He's amoral. He isn't evil, but he isn't good either. Not by a long shot. He, or his followers, are potentially more dangerous than the darkspawn already are, and their species is a parasitic one depending not only on Grey Warden blood, but on the continual introduction of Brood Mothers.

[Pious_Augustus]

If only they released an expansion featuring the The Architect as a main to try to understand him more but sadly this will never be....

[Giggles_Manically]

The devs said the DA2 wont feature the Architect.



Outside of that he has to be the most pathetic leader ever.

Some I wake up go crazy and are now talking darkspawn who are smart, and violent!

Oh I made the mother too! She went crazy and started a war!

Oh I attacked you, knocked you out, sent dragons after you, and experiemented on you!

And thats just the stupid stuff he pulls in game, read the books for more of the facepalm inducing story.



Never spare really, See A Darkspawn, Kill A Darkspawn. Works for me.

[fantasypisces]

Yeah it should have been a longer game, because you learn nothing about him or his plans. Heck I had to read the novels just so I could make an informed decision about helping him or not.



I killed him, without hesitation, and I do not regret it one bit, in many ways he is more dangerous than a blight.

[LadyKarrakaz]

I've done both, killing him, and siding with him. if you side with him, you learn that the latest Blight was one of his failed experiment. You should thank him, without him, no Dragon age origins games XD

Siding with him is the hope to have no more Blights, but it also threatens the world with sentient darkspawn. I think I'll stick to killing him in the future.

[Giggles_Manically]

This why my face at the end of talking to him:

[thesuperdarkone]

I always spare him. I may have intelligent darkspawn, but they have been shown to basically disappear from the deep roads, possibly ending blights, and some are shown to be good like the Messenger. While he may have made some mistakes, his epilouge shows that he is indeed a bit trustworthy and his research does work.

[TJPags]

I kill him, every time.



1. him darkspawn, me grey warden. Grey warden kill darkspawn.

2. he attacked me, held me captive, experimented on me, tried to kill me when I tried to escape.

3. His chance to win me over was when we first met. Instead, he kidnapped me (see 2, above). When he does make his little sales pitch, it's too late.



4. I don't really understand the concept of "side with him". It's presented during the game as sort of a choice between him or The Mother, but after killing him, you don't get an option to let the Mother live (not that I would), so it's really just a choice of, kill him or let him live. Me, I kill.

[Blacklash93]

You think the darkspawn will all become sentient at once when all the Old Gods are killed? Their Calling is the only thing keeping them mindless monsters. If that's the case, the "awakening" is inevitable. The Architect won't matter.

In fact, it may be wiser to let them evolve slowly over time than allow that to happen. Think of the chaos that would ensue if they all became Diciples at once with no one to keep them in line.

Modifié par Blacklash93, 10 septembre 2010 - 12:12 .

[EnchantedEyes1]

thesuperdarkone wrote...

I always spare him. I may have intelligent darkspawn, but they have been shown to basically disappear from the deep roads, possibly ending blights, and some are shown to be good like the Messenger. While he may have made some mistakes, his epilouge shows that he is indeed a bit trustworthy and his research does work.

Except that one of his mistakes was a HUGE one. We have him to thank for the latest Blight.

He is deceitful and self-serving at best. I spared him once but now he dies. Every time.

[thesuperdarkone]

EnchantedEyes1 wrote...

thesuperdarkone wrote...

I always spare him. I may have intelligent darkspawn, but they have been shown to basically disappear from the deep roads, possibly ending blights, and some are shown to be good like the Messenger. While he may have made some mistakes, his epilouge shows that he is indeed a bit trustworthy and his research does work.

Except that one of his mistakes was a HUGE one. We have him to thank for the latest Blight.

He is deceitful and self-serving at best. I spared him once but now he dies. Every time.

 

But if it wasn't for him, you'd be dead. I say this because Duncan needed recruits against the blight in Ostagar, but no blight means no need for recruitment and thus you dieing in some way in all origins. And if you say that Duncan would recruit you anyway, say no blight means that you don't become a hero and the werewolves still plague the elves, Eamon is still poisoned I think, and Orzammar is still in chaos, and the blight let Cailan die, which was a positive when you think about it. So the Architect basically helped make Ferelden a better place and saved you.

[EnchantedEyes1]

thesuperdarkone wrote...

But if it wasn't for him, you'd be dead. I say this because Duncan needed recruits against the blight in Ostagar, but no blight means no need for recruitment and thus you dieing in some way in all origins. And if you say that Duncan would recruit you anyway, say no blight means that you don't become a hero and the werewolves still plague the elves, Eamon is still poisoned I think, and Orzammar is still in chaos, and the blight let Cailan die, which was a positive when you think about it. So the Architect basically helped make Ferelden a better place and saved you.

That's not really the point. This is about the architect's motives and his plans for humanity. I think I would rather sacrifice one life to prevent the blight from happening. One does not necessarily justify the other, at least not to me.

[TJPags]

thesuperdarkone wrote...

EnchantedEyes1 wrote...

thesuperdarkone wrote...

I always spare him. I may have intelligent darkspawn, but they have been shown to basically disappear from the deep roads, possibly ending blights, and some are shown to be good like the Messenger. While he may have made some mistakes, his epilouge shows that he is indeed a bit trustworthy and his research does work.

Except that one of his mistakes was a HUGE one. We have him to thank for the latest Blight.

He is deceitful and self-serving at best. I spared him once but now he dies. Every time.

 

But if it wasn't for him, you'd be dead. I say this because Duncan needed recruits against the blight in Ostagar, but no blight means no need for recruitment and thus you dieing in some way in all origins. And if you say that Duncan would recruit you anyway, say no blight means that you don't become a hero and the werewolves still plague the elves, Eamon is still poisoned I think, and Orzammar is still in chaos, and the blight let Cailan die, which was a positive when you think about it. So the Architect basically helped make Ferelden a better place and saved you.

Well, that's a stretch, I think.

Maybe in some origins you die, but as HN, Howe only murders the Couslands because everyone is off fighting the blight.  No blight, no murder.  Maybe Eamon still gets poisoned, but who cares?  He wasn't supposed to die anyway, remember?

And maybe Loghain kills Caillan without killing half an army - after all, no blight, no huge darkspawn invasion.  Or maybe Loghain plots to kill Caillan, but gets caught and dies for treason.

Dalish?  Werewolves?  Dalish leave, werewolves till werewoves, life goes on.

Dwarves would have eventually figured out a king, just have done it without you.  Although maybe your DN character would die in the deep roads.

Your forgetting that without the architect, if he caused the blight, there's no large darkspawn horde, so nothing involving that occurs.

[phaonica]

I kill him because I perceive him to be too dangerous. He says he wants to end the Blights for good, but the cost is the sentient darkspawn, which I don't think the world is ready for.

[thesuperdarkone]

TJPags wrote...

thesuperdarkone wrote...

EnchantedEyes1 wrote...

thesuperdarkone wrote...

I always spare him. I may have intelligent darkspawn, but they have been shown to basically disappear from the deep roads, possibly ending blights, and some are shown to be good like the Messenger. While he may have made some mistakes, his epilouge shows that he is indeed a bit trustworthy and his research does work.

Except that one of his mistakes was a HUGE one. We have him to thank for the latest Blight.

He is deceitful and self-serving at best. I spared him once but now he dies. Every time.

 

But if it wasn't for him, you'd be dead. I say this because Duncan needed recruits against the blight in Ostagar, but no blight means no need for recruitment and thus you dieing in some way in all origins. And if you say that Duncan would recruit you anyway, say no blight means that you don't become a hero and the werewolves still plague the elves, Eamon is still poisoned I think, and Orzammar is still in chaos, and the blight let Cailan die, which was a positive when you think about it. So the Architect basically helped make Ferelden a better place and saved you.

Well, that's a stretch, I think.

Maybe in some origins you die, but as HN, Howe only murders the Couslands because everyone is off fighting the blight.  No blight, no murder.  Maybe Eamon still gets poisoned, but who cares?  He wasn't supposed to die anyway, remember?

And maybe Loghain kills Caillan without killing half an army - after all, no blight, no huge darkspawn invasion.  Or maybe Loghain plots to kill Caillan, but gets caught and dies for treason.

Dalish?  Werewolves?  Dalish leave, werewolves till werewoves, life goes on.

Dwarves would have eventually figured out a king, just have done it without you.  Although maybe your DN character would die in the deep roads.

Your forgetting that without the architect, if he caused the blight, there's no large darkspawn horde, so nothing involving that occurs.

 

Loghain did everyone a favor by killing Cailan, as he was going to marry Celene in the "Why Cailan did this" thread. Eamon would have been poisoned in the normal campaign and wasn't supposed to kill him, but it was going to anyway, so he would've died as there is no excuse for some grey wardens to chase rumors for a mythical object. For elves, if the elves could've left, don't you think they would have? and I recall that most of their warriors were infected, so no leaving. For dwarves, the assembly would have still been in chaos if not for the paragon crown, so their would still be a dispute over the crown if not for your Warden. All these things occur even if their is no blight. And the architect saves all your characters, except a HN, as all other origins would have died or disappeared if not for him. If he didn't do anything, we would still have problems and a moron on the throne, or be nobodies who will fade into obscurity, so yes, I support the architect.

[TJPags]

Hey, you're choice to support him, and it's a valid choice.



It's my choice not to like Loghain and what he did, and not to think Caillan was all that bad for marrying Celene.



And I did say that while most characters may be dead, the HN wouldn't have been.



As for everything else, the elves deserved what they got, IMO, and would have left, or, well, so they die.



The dwarves would have eventually figured out a king . . may have taken years and maybe civil war, but they would have.



Those things occurred without the blight, and so would have occurred even if the architect did nothing.



Besides, as I said before, my view on the architect is, his chance to talk was before he attacked, captured, and experimented on me, not after. So, his choice, his loss.

[Reika]

TJPags wrote...


Besides, as I said before, my view on the architect is, his chance to talk was before he attacked, captured, and experimented on me, not after. So, his choice, his loss.

Totally agree here. My thought on this also was if he really wanted some sort of peace between at least the Wardens and his followers, he wouldn't have helped an army of darkspawn attack Vigil's Keep in the first place. While he may not understand how the surface races work, he did have Utha with him and Seranni to try to explain that wasn't a good idea.

Of course I get the impression that Utha was just insane anyway, so maybe she didn't see anything wrong with attacking the people whose help you want.

[redloz]

Well, I sided with him. A) I thought it would make the final fight easier and I was so drunk I couldn't remember who he was.



I have yet to play through a second time.

[kaiki01]

If darkspawn didn't need broodmothers to reproduce then I would have let him live. But since they need to abduct human, dwarf, elf and qunari females in order to survive as a species I always kill him. Peace will never last between two races where one depends on the violation of the other.

[Reika]

kaiki01 wrote...

If darkspawn didn't need broodmothers to reproduce then I would have let him live. But since they need to abduct human, dwarf, elf and qunari females in order to survive as a species I always kill him. Peace will never last between two races where one depends on the violation of the other.

As a female player, I think how Broodmothers are made is one of the most disturbing things I've encountered in a game. I'm not saying that there aren't other horrific events in different games, including DA, but that one hits on a visceral level other things haven't managed to hit.

But I could just be weird.

[Dean_the_Young]

The 'best' choice for the future of the Surface with the Architect has to be one made with emphasis going forward, not looking backward. What the Architect did in the past by mistake is far less important than what he aims to do in the future. If you decide on account of personal insult and harm, you can only be as shortsighted as Loghain was about the Orlesians.



It can't even be dismissed as 'Architect darkspawn Architect kill.' The Grey Wardens don't kill Darkspawn simply because they're darkspawn: the Grey Wardens kill Darkspawn because the bestial darkspawn are an undeterrable threat. If the Darkspawn aren't such a threat, don't have to be such a threat, then the Grey Wardens reason for being is in part resolved.



The Architect doesn't succede in sensible diplomatic actions, but he does try. Their ignorance and youth to the world, however, undermine his position, but ignorance of humanity is not a permanent state.





There are good reasons to kill the Architect. A lack of trust that he can do as he says: a fear that he can do what he says, and that it could be even worse. But these are reasons that look forward, at what the Architect can do (or not do) for the non-Blighted races. Killing him for past missteps is reactionary, not visionary.

[CalJones]

Mm I don't think you're weird - broodmothers are plain disturbing.



I've let him live in some games and killed him in others. I have to keep in mind that my warden hasn't read The Calling. If they had, he'd be dead every time.

[Bruddajakka]

Spare him almost always. Mostly because I don't care what he is isn't doing to the Darkspawn. Hell if what he's doing leads to a civil war between them fought in the Deep Roads all the better. Hell the only bad thing about what he was doing as far as I'm concerned was it spilling over onto the surface in the case of the Blight, and the Civil War. If the Darkspawn want to kill each other great.

[jsachun]

As oppose to moral choices, it goes like this.

He has a decent loot for mages, but it's nothing to kill for. So if you want his gear kill him.

If you side with him you get some extra free spells to use against the mother so if you want his spells then side with him.

I kill him because he sucks wardens' blood just so that he can be intelligent.

I'd rather have to fight dumb enemies as oppose to intelligent ones.

Modifié par jsachun, 10 septembre 2010 - 09:45 .