106 réponses à ce sujet

[Moondoggie]

[Re: Killing Morrigan] Forgetting that she is probably not dead etc etc. Having seen that ending (didn't do it myself) it was kinda strange they use the same sad music as when Duncan  dies. Maybe one of the good guys really did get offed.

Or i could just be proved wrong and Morrigan will come back to haunt me one day in a later DA since i let her walk away.

Modifié par Moondoggie, 12 septembre 2010 - 06:55 .

[Sarah1281]

No, not at all. If you did the DR then what's going to happen to her child now that she's not there to raise and protect it? Maybe Flemeth will get her hands on it. If you didn't do the DR then why kill her? I know some have said that they're upset she won't tell you more about the OGB plan but...that ship has sailed. There will be no OGB so by that point it doesn't matter if she wanted to raise it lovingly as her own or eat it, it's just not going to happen.

[CalJones]

I go the distinct impression shanking Morrigan was EVIL.

[Dean_the_Young]

Well, I never felt there to be real reason to kill Morrigan. She may as well be a Ayn Rand follower, but she's never been malevolent, and that's if you never connected with her. If you did, you can easily see that she does have her own morality and sense of responsibility, and that she's carrying it out.



Once the child's born, I'd far more trust Morrigan in raising it than let no one raise it, or especially someone worse. (And the fact I can't recover the child at this point means that I can't think that killing Morrigan will recover the child either.)







On the other hand, I don't know what WH is like without the ritual: I've yet to do a playthrough without doing it.

[Morrigans God son]

If you kill Morrigan, whos going to breastfeed the child?

I don't know about you guys but I got the impression that she didnt die, if you killed her. Oh but that killing scene was so sad! *sob*

[Maconbar]

The OGB isn't with Morrigan at least not until Morrigan can port back to Thedas.

[Sarah1281]

The OGB isn't with Morrigan at least not until Morrigan can port back to Thedas.

Or the baby already went through the portal.

[Zjarcal]

Sarah1281 wrote...

No, not at all. If you did the DR then what's going to happen to her child now that she's not there to raise and protect it? Maybe Flemeth will get her hands on it. If you didn't do the DR then why kill her? I know some have said that they're upset she won't tell you more about the OGB plan but...that ship has sailed. There will be no OGB so by that point it doesn't matter if she wanted to raise it lovingly as her own or eat it, it's just not going to happen.

This.

While I won't deny anyone the right to roleplay a spiteful or cruel character that will kill her "just cause", there's no logical reason to do it if you didn't do the DR. With no OGB she's not a threat (or at least not as much as she could've been) and why would you kill her just because she doesn't want to let you know more info about the OGB well over a year after the DR was turned down?

If you did the DR, it's still a horrible thing to do since you're leaving a child motherless, as well as making it easy prey for someone like Flemeth to get her hands on (which is what she wanted from the first place). Some have mentioned that they do it because they're having regrets about doing the DR. While a more understandable approach to the first one, it's still a bit hypocritcal to do that considering that when the DR was there to save your life you took it, but now that you're safe and sound it's time off the one that made it possible?

[Maconbar]

Sarah1281 wrote...

The OGB isn't with Morrigan at least not until Morrigan can port back to Thedas.

Or the baby already went through the portal.

hmm I had interpreted what Morrigan said to the warden implied that she hadn't been through a portal yet but leaving OGB in Thedas would be risky.

[Gilsa]

I shanked her because I felt it was better than letting her saunter off. I've taken some heat for this decision so I'll explain it from my canon's perspective. (For what it's worth, I do have a warden that went through the mirror with her and an orlesian that let her go.)

- I built up a friendship with Morrigan and took down Flemeth at her request, despite the fact that Flemeth was the one that saved my life in the first place.
- Morrigan never revealed what was in the books.
- Morrigan refused to reveal why she wanted the dark ritual done.
- Morrigan admitted that the dark ritual was part of her plan with Flemeth from the beginning.
- Morrigan got pissy when I declined the dark ritual and left.

Questions I had to ponder:

- If she cared about my life so much to offer the dark ritual, why didn't she stay to try to protect me after I declined it and asked her to stay? She wouldn't tell me what she wanted the baby for and acted like I was the one who betrayed her instead.
- What proof did I have that Morrigan didn't want me to eliminate the competition? (Flemeth)
- What proof do I have that she does not continue to work for Flemeth? Flemeth knows how to find her and Morrigan said she wouldn't be able to prevent Flemeth from inhabiting her. At some point she'd either become Flemeth reincarnated or she'd be kissing Flemeth's rear big time.
- How did she get the dark ritual knowledge and why wouldn't she share it with the Grey Wardens? If this could help us with future Blights, it was my job as a warden commander to investigate (hence tracking her down) our options. The blood mage in Warden's Keep was unethical, but his goals were meant to help the Grey Wardens and he was completely upfront about his work. Morrigan was all crossed-arms, la la, I'm not telling.

The situation I faced in Witch Hunt:
- She was uncooperative.
- She admitted she had deceived me.
- She had stolen books and played games to reach the mirror, a powerful artifact.
- Claimed she was wrong about Flemeth and insisted once again I hunt Flemeth down. I had no way of knowing if she was trying to deflect the attention off of her by offering up someone that is more powerful so she could escape in the meantime.

My conclusion:
- She was a security risk and it was not in my best interest to let her walk off. My choices were to wave goodbye or attack her. I would have rather broken the mirror instead so she couldn't use it. She probably isn't dead and maybe she'll be be pissy the next time their paths crossed, but that's nothing new. At least my canon did something about it. There's a saying that all that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing. Morrigan may or may not be evil, but idly standing by was simply not an option in this scenario.

That's it.

Modifié par Gilsa, 10 septembre 2010 - 08:01 .

[Blacklash93]

She falls back through the mirror, right? She doesn't die.

Flemeth is the real enemy and Morrigan will oppose her.

Modifié par Blacklash93, 10 septembre 2010 - 08:03 .

[Sarah1281]

Claimed she was wrong about Flemeth and insisted once again I hunt Flemeth down.

Minor point but she does no such thing. She tells you that if you must spend your time hunting someone down, Flemeth is the real threat. She'd be just as happy if you stayed out of it. Her reasoning for saying this and the results of any subsequent decisions aren't really relevant to that.

[Lumikki]

I don't really know what you talk, because I only played DAO base and nothing else. How ever, everyting bad sayed about Flemeth so far has been come from Morrigans saying. Meaning I have not seen Flemeth to do any bad action at all, totally opposite, she has been very helpful.



If You look Morrigan, you can understand her conserns, but is it truth? Example Dark ritual was not about saving Warden, it was something about what Morrigan wanted. I did not see any reason to try save ArchDemons soul and put it to child what Morrigan would raise. Morrigan had not compassion at all, she was manipulative and hard to read as what her real motives where. In simple way I did not trust Morrigan. To have trust you need do something worth of earning it.

[Sarah1281]

Does not trusting Morrigan enough to do the DR and thus NOT doing it justify killing her months later because you didn't do it and Alistair or Loghain died? Plus, there are lots of bad things you hear about Flemeth. All those 'Witch of the Wilds' legends are about her. Morrigan is the only source of ANY Flemeth information from someone who actually knows her.

[Morrigans God son]

Blacklash93 wrote...

She falls back through the mirror, right? She doesn't die.

Flemeth is the real enemy and Morrigan will oppose her.

Well said. This kind of talk gets me hyped for DA3. I wonder if there will ever be a Morrigan vs Flemeth showdown.

[Gilsa]

Mistrust wasn't the sole reason for declining the dark ritual. My canon was also of the opinion that it was better off to have the archdemon absolutely dead. Five down, two to go. The choice was also presented to Loghain and he turned it down.



You were in a romance with Alistair and you still executed him at Landsmeet for RP reasons. I'm surprised to see you taking the stance that there's no reason at all to attack Morrigan when there are certainly valid RP reasons to do so.

[Sarah1281]

You were in a romance with Alistair and you still executed him at Landsmeet for RP reasons. I'm surprised to see you taking the stance that there's no reason at all to attack Morrigan when there are certainly valid RP reasons to do so.

No, my stance is that there is no reason good enough to justify killing her no matter how you're RP-ing. For the Alistiar issue, executing a rival claim to the throne helps prevent rebellions. You can find a valid RP reason to kill Leliana because you're convinced she's still an Orlesian bard and is out to kill you in your sleep but that doesn't make the decision to walk up to her and stab you any better. Just because you can find an RP reason to do something doesn't make it a good idea.

[Zjarcal]

Sarah1281 wrote...
Just because you can find an RP reason to do something doesn't make it a good idea.

And that's a bingo.

A character can do something crazy, stupid, uncalled for, disgusting, or anything else, and you can always find valid RP reasons for why the character would do it. That doesn't instantly turn an "in character decision" into a good one.

Modifié par Zjarcal, 10 septembre 2010 - 09:42 .

[CalJones]

I just thought it was a spiteful, horrible thing to do. I didn't even realise it was possible until I saw it on YouTube. Her betrayed expression was heartbreaking.

[phaonica]

My conclusion:

She was a security risk and it was not in my best interest to let her walk off. My choices were to wave goodbye or attack her. I would have rather broken the mirror instead so she couldn't use it. She probably isn't dead and maybe she'll be be pissy the next time their paths crossed, but that's nothing new. At least my canon did something about it. There's a saying that all that is necessary for evil to triumph is for good men to do nothing. Morrigan may or may not be evil, but idly standing by was simply not an option in this scenario.

I agree. I killed her, too. I felt that her plan sounded too risky to let happen, and even if I made it worse, that was better than just letting her walk away and doing nothing to even attempt stopping her.

Modifié par phaonica, 10 septembre 2010 - 09:50 .

[Zjarcal]

I really don't want to drag this too much since I've already stated that I have nothing against people RPing their characters however they want to, but to kill someone just because their plan "sounds risky" is a bit extreme in my opinion.



For all you know (and you both have stated that you aren't sure about Morrigan's intentions) you may as well have killed an innocent. Or maybe not. But you don't know and that's why I find it a harsh decision to "kill" Morrigan.

[Avilia]

I'm not a Morrigan fan. I don't trust her and haven't done the DR.

Having said that - I didn't kill her. I didn't see the point of it. The two chars I ran through WH questioned her then waved her off. They were as ambivilent as I was about the thing whole thing ;-)

I'm hoping she's not a major player in a future game but that's Bioware's decision and mine whether or not to buy it

Modifié par Avilia, 10 septembre 2010 - 10:52 .

[this isnt my name]

No, its clear to me Morrigan is actually a good person, she is a **** some times (helping people loses approval) but I think she is a good person and flemmeth is the bad one. Me thinking she is good aside, even if she wasnt good, more neutral,the lookon her face from betrayal she dosent deserve it, honestly its one of the times a game genuinely makes me sad, her face made me sad, shes like "WTF why" you have no real good reason.

[Gilsa]

Sarah1281 wrote...

You were in a romance with Alistair and you still executed him at Landsmeet for RP reasons. I'm surprised to see you taking the stance that there's no reason at all to attack Morrigan when there are certainly valid RP reasons to do so.

No, my stance is that there is no reason good enough to justify killing her no matter how you're RP-ing. For the Alistiar issue, executing a rival claim to the throne helps prevent rebellions. You can find a valid RP reason to kill Leliana because you're convinced she's still an Orlesian bard and is out to kill you in your sleep but that doesn't make the decision to walk up to her and stab you any better. Just because you can find an RP reason to do something doesn't make it a good idea.

She isn't killed. The question she asked was "will you let me go?" and the dialogue options presented were: "let her go" or "attack." It didn't say "kill her." I just didn't want her to go through the mirror. It isn't until we see the cutscene that it becomes clear what happened. Some people have said they thought she'd fight back when they selected that option. There's a lot of moral outrage because now that people have seen what happened and what a kicked puppy Morrigan looked like, it's easy to villify those who choose not to let her walk away.

Bhelen passed off Trian as a threat so the DN would take him out and Bhelen could make his power grab. I have no reason to believe that Morrigan isn't doing the same thing in trying to eliminate Flemeth via the warden when she's already admitted that she has been deceptive in the past. ("My mother has tricked her way past death and more. She is no more finished than I am.") Looks like we're just going to have to disagree and leave it at that.

Modifié par Gilsa, 10 septembre 2010 - 10:26 .

[DWSmiley]

CalJones wrote...

I just thought it was a spiteful, horrible thing to do. I didn't even realise it was possible until I saw it on YouTube. Her betrayed expression was heartbreaking.

And after the happy reunion between her and dog, too!  Dog is a good judge of character and killing her is only an option for those who see people as disposable commodities, imo.