123 réponses à ce sujet

[Homebound]

Which one is better and why?

[sinosleep]

I've been doing some testing and they're pretty damned close in damage with AR active, they each take to ARs to take down YMIR armor. I haven't posted any videos because stopping the second AR is done every time is a pain in the ass and so I can't replicate results and it would throw off the vid.

They're pretty much apples and oranges though. Ammo capacity makes the rev a better option to get in close range against multiple enemies even though the mattock does comparable damage if only cause it will prevent reloads mid battle. The mattock is of course far superior from range since it could hit a nickel from 400 yards out.

[edit here] scratch that, finally figured out how the hell I managed to get a YMIR down to health in one AR, the mattock will take down YMIR armor in one AR burst at point blank range. So actually yeah, dps wise it crushes the revenant.

Modifié par sinosleep, 11 septembre 2010 - 05:13 .

[Kronner]

I like both.

Mattock + Widow is crazy good.

Revenant + Viper is also very good and I enjoy this loadout even more than the Mattock-Widow one.

[sinosleep]

I definitely still prefer the revenant if only for the rambo factor, but DPS wise the mattock is head and shoulders above it both at point blank range (due to firing rate and damage per shot) and from distance (due to far higher accuracy).

[Kronner]

sinosleep wrote...

I definitely still prefer the revenant if only for the rambo factor, but DPS wise the mattock is head and shoulders above it both at point blank range (due to firing rate and damage per shot) and from distance (due to far higher accuracy).

Yeah I know, I also like it for the Rambo factor

[Khuutra]

sinosleep wrote...

I definitely still prefer the revenant if only for the rambo factor, but DPS wise the mattock is head and shoulders above it both at point blank range (due to firing rate and damage per shot) and from distance (due to far higher accuracy).

I think this is to be expected for a semi-automatic, to a degree.

Does the Revenant's spread give it any advantage over the Mattock when firing on relatively tightly clustered groups of enemies?

And would it matter as much if I go Hardened instead of Heightened Adrenaline Rush?

[rumination888]

You can fire off 16 shots in Heightened and 16 shots in Hardened, so the former is better. Meshes well with the Widow/GPS, too.

Outside of AR, its actually worse than both the Vindicator and Revenant since no human can click fast enough to achieve its theoretical DPS. The Mattock's refire rate is crazy.

[Comrade Bork]

I love the Revenant/Viper combo with Hardened AR. It is by far the best combo I use. Now some people might really like the Mattock/Widow or Mattock/Whatever, it is just not my gun.

[Khuutra]

rumination888 wrote...

You can fire off 16 shots in Heightened and 16 shots in Hardened, so the former is better. Meshes well with the Widow/GPS, too.

Outside of AR, its actually worse than both the Vindicator and Revenant since no human can click fast enough to achieve its theoretical DPS. The Mattock's refire rate is crazy.

Well I know Heightened is better for the Mattock, but I know it's not for the Revenant. I'm just wondering how big the damage difference is in Heightened vs. Hardened for the Revenant.  But then I guess you do the same amount of damage with the Revenant in either. Ah well.

[sinosleep]

rumination888 wrote...

You can fire off 16 shots in Heightened and 16 shots in Hardened, so the former is better. Meshes well with the Widow/GPS, too.

Outside of AR, its actually worse than both the Vindicator and Revenant since no human can click fast enough to achieve its theoretical DPS. The Mattock's refire rate is crazy.

You don't need to reach theoretical dps to match the vindicator.

[mosor]

They're both excellent guns. What is better depends on how you play your soldier, If you're going to crouch behind cover and shoot at range, then the mattock is a lot better. However, if you're going to assault a position, then revenant is a lot better. It might be just me, but it seems like when I use the revenant, the inferno ammo seems to ignite enemies more often than the mattock.



What I like to do with the revvy is have someone cast area overload, run in when the defences are striped and spay the group with my gun. People catch fire, and the gun mows down a group better than the semi auto mattock.

[Alamar2078]

I was a huge Revvy fan-boy and defended it against other ARs because they either didn't feel natural [Vindicator] or they weren't "manly" enough.



After playing a Mattock / Widow / Phalanx / Geth Shotty Soldier for a while I have the say that the poor Revvy just has a hard time competing assuming a moderate skill level.



The advantages of the Revvy [as already stated] are:

-- Huge Ammo capacity

-- High ROF

-- Decent damage per shot which combined with high ROF gives a high theoretical DPS



The problem with the Revvy is that most of it's theoretical advantages don't really translate into real advantages during a battle.



I virtually NEVER run out of ammo with either the Mattock or the Revvy so the Revvy's huge ammo count really doesn't come into play. The Mattock has enough ammo, hits hard enough, and is accurate enough that a somewhat low ammo count isn't really a factor.



The high ROF with the Revvy is great at times [esp. fun vs. Husks] but I quite often fire in controlled bursts so I can keep my hit rate fairly good because of accuracy problems. If you get close enought to really take advantage of the ROF you run the danger of being overrun because even the Revvy / AR can't deal enough damage vs. damage you take to keep you from being overrun sometimes. Seeing that I HATE to reload this is a big downside.



To summarize the Mattock can deal fiendish levels of damage because you have huge rates of fire during AR and the accuracy is extremely high so you'll often be getting headshot bonuses on top of everything else. I virtually never run out of Mattock ammo so the Revvy's big ammo count doesn't make a real difference to me. I virtually never get overrun because I can stay a whisker further back and I can do full damage with the Mattock at much longer effective ranges than the Revvy.



In terms of skill required to use the Mattock [not much] and its efficiency in killing I don't really see how it can be beat.



IMHO the Revvy has really been relegated to a strictly role-playing choice as opposed to being an efficient weapon.

[Snowship]

+ the Mattock fires as quick as you can hit the button during adrenalin rush

[Homebound]

Next Bioware will release weapons that renders the Claymore or Widow obsolete...Whats the point of naming the Revenant as the ultimate Soldier weapon if it can be overpowered by a non-specialized weapon?

[numotsbane]

The GPS already renders the claymore obsolete on soldiers, vanguards less so, though if you cant get the reload trick down its probably a good idea to stay with the geth shotty. nothing could make the widow obsolete on a soldier; though on an infiltrator it competes with the GPS now. hmm.

well unless they bring out an even more insane anti-tank sniper rifle that fires napalm and/or mini cain shots.

[sinosleep]

If you can get in close the mattock already out does the widow as well. The mattock is the ONLY weapon in the game that can one shot YMIR armor in one adrenaline rush. It's a positively ridiculous weapon in the hands of soldiers.

[Kronner]

For me, Mattock is not Revenant replacement. One is AR, the other is LMG. Depends on what you prefer..totally different playstyles and experiences. I like and play both, but Revenant is more fun for me. Mattock is too easy to use, allows you to stay back and rarely, if ever, die. Rushing enemy positions with Revenant will have you in red more often and it can certainly lead to more deaths..but for me it is fun to play this way. I really do not give a damn about the fact that Mattock can kill YMIR Mech 8s faster or whatever.
It is the same with GPS - it is nothing special in close combat, I couldn't care less about shotgun's mid-range capabilities when playing Vanguard.
As for Widow, no other SR can one shot an enemy. Even if they added Viper on steroids with explosive rounds, it would not replace the Widow.
Weapon choice is purely personal preference and the actual effectiveness is hardly the most important thing considering ME2 Insanity is not really challenging.

Modifié par Kronner, 13 septembre 2010 - 12:42 .

[sinosleep]

Like I said earlier, I'm with you Kronner. I personally prefer using the mattock on my non-soldier classes and the rev on my soldiers but since the question was posed and dps seems to be the barometer by which these things are measured well then I brought it up cause the mattock during adrenaline rush is an absolute beast in that regard and even outside of it is a damned good all around weapon.

[Kronner]

sinosleep wrote...

Like I said earlier, I'm with you Kronner. I personally prefer using the mattock on my non-soldier classes and the rev on my soldiers but since the question was posed and dps seems to be the barometer by which these things are measured well then I brought it up cause the mattock during adrenaline rush is an absolute beast in that regard and even outside of it is a damned good all around weapon.

Yeah, I know, I just thought I'd point out DPS, accuracy etc. do not always have to be the most important and that it can also be secondary to playstyle/preference
I mean Mattock+Widow Soldier is absolutely devastating combo, but you can have just as much, or even more, fun with Revenant+Viper. etc.
If you do not look at the weapons as competitors, but rather different playstyles, no DLC can possibly replace this or that..it can always only offer more fun.

Modifié par Kronner, 13 septembre 2010 - 01:05 .

[Mark B]

EDIT: I agree with Kronner, mix and match for the most fun, then try something different.

My issue with the Widow/Mattock/GPS/Phalanx build is you have no fully automatic firepower. I know it's headshots all the time and having a mini heavy weapon in the GPS is so handy, but really wouldn't it be nice to dump the Phalanx (or any other pistol) for the Tempest? Would fill a gap that the pistol just emphasises.

Modifié par Mark B, 13 septembre 2010 - 01:10 .

[XCPTNL]

I played a Revenant/Viper soldier and didn't like it at all. Recently I played a Mattock/Widow soldier with Heightened AR and it's just so much fun I deleted my widow infiltrator - never liked it very much for anything else than the widow. And I like the Mattock so much, I now also use it on my Sentinel and will choose AR training for my soon to come Vanguard - although I don't use it very often on the Sentinel and probably also won't on the Vanguard but at times it might come in very handy.

[ezrafetch]

I prefer the Mattock. I'm that douchebag in MW2 who likes to find a spot really far away and get clean sniper or super-long range AR/BR kills, so Widow/Mattock is more of my dig (though sometimes I go crazy and run CQB all the time). Mattock has higher DPS, but the Revenant is definitely that "Soldier" weapon, so the answer is: play with which one suits you most. If you like getting into short-medium range, then use the Revenant. If you don't, then get the Mattock.

It's a single player game, so it's not like there's a wrong answer.  Getting caught up in DPS and min/max can definitely get in the way of enjoying the game.

Modifié par ezrafetch, 13 septembre 2010 - 04:27 .

[Sparda Stonerule]

It's actually kind of funny, with my Soldier I rarely use any weapons besides the GPS and Revenant. I use the Viper sometimes now for really long shots, but I do not use it nearly as much as I used to.



The Mattock is good, but for a Soldier I just like using the Revenant more. It's not like either of them are bad guns, they are both fun and quite good. But as stated the Mattock does have better DPS and fires faster in AR. So in practical terms it is better, but is it more fun? That's really up to the player to decide.

[sumof all fear]

the revenant is my preference, come arround a corner and open up to watch everything wilt before you. It also tends to do more dps than your heavy weapon when you use the correct ammo upgrade.



mattock is fun, and my infiltrator is glad that I got it, but its not as sweet as the machine-gun.

[DetailedSubset]

Geth Pulse Rifle.