1339 réponses à ce sujet

[geth47]

Should they ever re-do the trilogy, they could use simbols when we make dialogue choices. One of the things they did right with DA2. So whenever there was a choice that would trigger a romance, we would be warned beforehand. I hated to talk to Jack with male-paragon shep choices because of this. 

[Mike Shepard]

My honest reason? When I played as Soldier Shepard (M or F) I didn't need another soldier (Ashley) in my crew. so I let her die. (and romanced Liara either way)...when I played as an Engineer or Adept I saved her (again regardless of Gender) so I could have a 'balanced' squad - Soldier/Adept/Engineer. And I romanced Liara either way...(see a pattern?)

 

Come ME3 I think the two are mostly unfortunately under-developed. Ash hardly says a word on Normandy after the Coup; Kaidan has suddenly become bisexual*

In another change to Kaidan, he's gotten past his personal issues (which were pretty intense)

Ashley seems to have cooled on her views against aliens. She considers Tali her sister. And I didn't even think of her as being "racist" at all -- her grandpa surrendered to the Turians and his family was shamed for it. If your grandfather was famous for surrendering to the Germans in WWII, you might have something against Germans.

 

But again for me it comes down to the practicality of it. Pure Tech/Biotics shepards saved Ash. Soldier Sheps saved Kaidan. Vanguard, Sentinel, and Infiltrator I close my eyes and pick one at random or have a friend pick a number 1-10 (1-5 = Ash 6-10 = Kaidan)

 

Because at the end of the day, my favorite character is Wrex. (Shepard.)

 

*I in no way have an issue with it. But it seems like a pretty intense shift in his character. Again, not an issue.

[Kiwiphoenix]

Speaking of practicality, feel that there's a solid in-character reason for saving Kaidan.

Not only is he a superior officer to Ash, he's a sentinel - a biotic combat engineer. Two specialisations, one of which is literally inborn.

He can hack open a blast door, drag a target out of hiding with his mind, and shoot them in the face. Ash can shoot someone in the face really well.

 

It sounds kind of ruthless, but realistically, the Alliance has truckloads of Soldiers for every one Sentinel.

[ahellbornlady]

I saved Kaidan, even though I never romance him and I think he's annoying. I just dislike Ashley's xenophobia even more.

[Mike Shepard]

Speaking of practicality, feel that there's a solid in-character reason for saving Kaidan.

Not only is he a superior officer to Ash, he's a sentinel - a biotic combat engineer. Two specialisations, one of which is literally inborn.

He can hack open a blast door, drag a target out of hiding with his mind, and shoot them in the face. Ash can shoot someone in the face really well.

 

It sounds kind of ruthless, but realistically, the Alliance has truckloads of Soldiers for every one Sentinel.

 

 

You could actually argue that you should save Ashley because she's the junior officer, a non-commissioned officer. She's younger meaning she has more opportunity, more years ahead of her to  and does not have a flawed implant from the universe's version of the mid 90s in her head which causes her massive amounts of pain. She also wants to redeem her family name, and while the initial period of aww, she's dead! How sad! will help, it can only do iso much. One of her sisters is a widow and the others it's unknown.

 

 

And can I just point out, the best way for her to clear her family name is not by matyring herself on Virmire. As I expressed above, that only lasts for so long. It's by helping Commander Shepard send the reapers back to the sci-fi hellscape they crawled out of, live to tell about it, and then give birth to a next generation of bad-ass Williams. (in other words: she dies on Virmire, people feel bad for a while -- a long while but a while nonetheless. She helps blow the Reapers to hell? She becomes a living legend and the Williams name is instantly associated with that rather than surrendering to Turians.

 

Again, I really don't have a overriding preference between the two. I chose based on practicality as I stated above in an earlier post.

[Farangbaa]

Ashley is only saved if my Shepard doesn't feel like humping the blue one.

[Kiwiphoenix]

You could actually argue that you should save Ashley because she's the junior officer, a non-commissioned officer. She's younger meaning she has more opportunity, more years ahead of her to  and does not have a flawed implant from the universe's version of the mid 90s in her head which causes her massive amounts of pain. She also wants to redeem her family name, and while the initial period of aww, she's dead! How sad! will help, it can only do iso much. One of her sisters is a widow and the others it's unknown.

 

 

And can I just point out, the best way for her to clear her family name is not by matyring herself on Virmire. As I expressed above, that only lasts for so long. It's by helping Commander Shepard send the reapers back to the sci-fi hellscape they crawled out of, live to tell about it, and then give birth to a next generation of bad-ass Williams. (in other words: she dies on Virmire, people feel bad for a while -- a long while but a while nonetheless. She helps blow the Reapers to hell? She becomes a living legend and the Williams name is instantly associated with that rather than surrendering to Turians.

 

Again, I really don't have a overriding preference between the two. I chose based on practicality as I stated above in an earlier post.

 

You bring up a good point, she probably does have more to live for than Kaidan at that point in time, and from a personal standpoint, it does make more sense to save her.

That argument won't hold when the Alliance asks the Commander why he sacrificed a multitalented Lieutenant with a solid record to save an NCO with a few garrison postings. It's nasty, but militaries can't factor in hopes, dreams, or personal lives when choosing who lives or dies, unless they want to start putting 50-year-old Generals on the front lines to take bullets for 18-year-old Privates.

 

Exactly who was guarding the bomb could make for a good in-character reason to ignore protocol, though.

Or the whole Spectre thing. Forgot about that. Oops.

[SpiritMuse]

First time as FemShep I saved Kaidan because he was my LI (and I just really like him anyway, he's just my type). First time as ManShep I saved Kaidan because I intended him to be my LI in 3. I think I've played a renegade Shep where I saved Ash, but that was a while ago so I don't really remember.

 

I do usually make sure I send the one I want to save along with the Salarians though, that way the one left behind gets a cool heroic "last stand" scene just before the bomb goes off. Though I think the first time I had Kaidan on the bomb when my FemShep saved him. It was quite funny to see that tiny woman pick him up and carry him onto the Normandy. xD

 

The Salarians survive either way, by the way, as long as you do the side objectives to help them out. So that doesn't need to be a consideration.

[Mike Shepard]

First time as FemShep I saved Kaidan because he was my LI (and I just really like him anyway, he's just my type). First time as ManShep I saved Kaidan because I intended him to be my LI in 3. I think I've played a renegade Shep where I saved Ash, but that was a while ago so I don't really remember.

 

I do usually make sure I send the one I want to save along with the Salarians though, that way the one left behind gets a cool heroic "last stand" scene just before the bomb goes off. Though I think the first time I had Kaidan on the bomb when my FemShep saved him. It was quite funny to see that tiny woman pick him up and carry him onto the Normandy. xD

 

The Salarians survive either way, by the way, as long as you do the side objectives to help them out. So that doesn't need to be a consideration.

 

That's (the bolded part) the part I find funny.

 

Consider this scenario:

 

You send one to the AA tower, you go and rescue the one at the bomb site...and the Salarians (on the AA tower) survive but either Gunnery Chief Williams or Lieutenant Alenko dies.

It's like Shepard comes up and rescues the Salarians then sees the Virmire Casualty and is like "sorry, bro" and denies them access to the Normandy.

 

I get that for storytelling purposes, one of Ashley/Kaidan has to die (to give Shepard even more motivation to send the reapers back to whatever hole they came from)  but they (IMO) should have made it so if you rescue the one at the bombsite the Salarians die.

Modifié par Mike Shepard, 01 mai 2014 - 10:50 .

[Redbelle]

The reason why people don't like her, The Xenophilia, the religion etc etc.... is exactly why I love her in the same way I think character's like the Watchmen's Comedian was the best character. He didn't toe the line, have the same morality and was the kind of character who just brought drama to every scene he was in. He was also a major a-hole whose brutal outlook contrasted to Owlmans.... and that's why I liked him. He brought drama within the group because he was the one people could argue with.

 

Ashley is the one whose outlook is one you can clash against. For those who desire a yes man Kaiden is your guy. From the first moment you punch the first scientist on Eden Prime, Kaiden just gives a mild rebuff. He's the guy who supports Shepard.

 

Ashley is the survivor who has no problem speaking her mind, even going so far as to tell her commander when she thinks he's wrong. She has the stronger streak of the individual in her since she's arguably less secure than Kaiden in that she never had the support he had in his life growing up as a biotic.

 

As such, I take Ashley because I think she'll tell me the things I need to hear. Not what I want to hear. Playing as the captain of the ship I can put up with her attitude as long as she brings her skills to bear.

 

That said.... I'm playing through ME1 again and am resolving to pick Kaiden...... just need to remember to have him guard the bomb because ultimately, the choice comes down to guarding the asset that will blow the facility up.

[Legbiter]

I always saved Ashley, cuz boobs.

[Mike Shepard]

Speaking of practicality, feel that there's a solid in-character reason for saving Kaidan.

Not only is he a superior officer to Ash, he's a sentinel - a biotic combat engineer. Two specialisations, one of which is literally inborn.

He can hack open a blast door, drag a target out of hiding with his mind, and shoot them in the face. Ash can shoot someone in the face really well.

 

It sounds kind of ruthless, but realistically, the Alliance has truckloads of Soldiers for every one Sentinel.

 

And if Shepard is a Sentinel, s/he has Kaidan's abilities without the drawbacks of the L2 implant. Kaidan even notes that his L2 spikes higher than most L3s but not Shepard's.

 

I agree with your point in general though.

[I Tsunayoshi I]

And if Shepard is a Sentinel, s/he has Kaidan's abilities without the drawbacks of the L2 implant. Kaidan even notes that his L2 spikes higher than most L3s but not Shepard's.

 

I agree with your point in general though.

That becomes generally irrelevant in ME2/3 when Shepard is upgraded to L5 model implants, meaning that Shepard at that point can be said to only be a stronger biotic because he has THE top of the line implants

[Sequin]

I didn't use Ashley or Kaidan a whole lot in my squads after the Citadel and so it certainly had nothing to do with skill sets. I remember saving Ashley on my first play-through because I felt a stronger connection to her character at the time and felt like she needed the opportunity to develop more as a character - at the time I was assuming the trilogy would keep the same teammates for all three games and so I thought it would be good for her to get over her dislike of aliens and outlive the 'Williams Curse' by helping me defeat Saren.

 

Post-ME2 play-throughs, I no longer care as much about which one I save.

[KaiserShep]

I don't think I had much of a reason either way when I first got to the Virmire decision. I quite liked both characters after going through their dialogue, and honestly, if I wasn't flying blind in my first run and could just choose which to save, I probably would have saved Ashley. I wasn't certain which would end up where at the end of the mission, and I randomly picked Kaidan, who happened to end up at the bomb site. Since then I've stuck with that decision, and now Kaidan is a character I can't really replace in my main FemShep's story.

 

Ashley was saved in my alternate M!Shep playthrough, but she was also the LI, which admittedly factors into that, since I preferred the LI path to be someone who has been there since the beginning.

[Pirate Queen Isabela]

On my canon!Shep, I saved Ash. I played ME2 before playing ME1, and I played as fem!Shep, so I always automatically got Kaidan. A lot of people were telling me Ashley was xenophobic, terrible, etc so when I finally started playing ME1 I thought I wouldn't like her. I couldn't be anymore wrong because I ended up absolutely loving her and though I understand the reason why people aren't fond of her, I feel like their reasons are a bit.. well, skewed. Especially the xenophobia one.

 

She isn't xenophobic, her comments were a bit off-putting but other than that all I felt she was doing was being cautious. You can see her intent was good, she just was raised in a very certain way to be cautious of aliens but the moment you tell her to get over it and that she has to work with them, she has no objections. Caution =/= xenophobia.

 

Garrus tries to justify the genophage, Wrex talks about his hatred for Salarians and Turians as a whole, Mordin assumed all Krogan to be aggressive and brutal and was surprised that "one of his own" could be like that. Hell, even Kaidan can have borderline xenophobic moments.

 

Grunt laughs about tortured Turians but just because Ashley cautions the player from trusting the Council too much and speaking against giving Garrus/Tali full access to Alliance data, people call her out?

[I Tsunayoshi I]

I will give credit that Ash isnt Xenophobic. Maybe a tendency or two in that direction but nothing close to bigotry that is worth worrying about. Now your average Terra Firma Party member... Well I dont have to really explain this do I? Not after we meet Saracino.

[Farangbaa]

I didn't use Ashley or Kaidan a whole lot in my squads after the Citadel and so it certainly had nothing to do with skill sets. I remember saving Ashley on my first play-through because I felt a stronger connection to her character at the time and felt like she needed the opportunity to develop more as a character - at the time I was assuming the trilogy would keep the same teammates for all three games and so I thought it would be good for her to get over her dislike of aliens and outlive the 'Williams Curse' by helping me defeat Saren.

 

Post-ME2 play-throughs, I no longer care as much about which one I save.

 

My current Shep only used Ashley and Kaidan until Virmire. 

 

Lets just say Virmire was very traumatic for him

[Kurt M.]

I save Kaidan every time. Ashley is a cynical and has always kinda ruined my mood. Kaidan is much more reasonable.

 

Besides, being both my Shep and him biotics is always a plus.

[Mordokai]

Ash is an annoying ******.

 

Kaidan is a cool, mellow guy.

 

The decision is not hard at all.

[Mike Shepard]

I've thought about this from a tactical perspective now

 

In Mass Effect 1:

The focus on weapon combat (I actually have gone entire ME1 playthroughs without accessing the power wheel) means Ashley > Kaidan.

She has access to all four weapon groups, Kaidan barely has access to pistols (as in, he's useless with the others)

In Mass Effect 3:

The focus on power combos as a large part of combat strategy (especially for the caster classes: Adept, Engineer, Sentinel) means Kaidan > Ashley.

He can set up and detonate a few of the more powerful combos (setting up a cryo explosion and detonating biotics with Reave)

 

 

Also....REAVE. Amiright? He even calls this out as being notable at the party. ("...I can reave now!")

 

 

Their dialog in 3 mirrors each other pretty well. Both have a personal stake in the war from the personal loss perspective. Kaidan has interactive Normandy dialog while Ashley has most of her off-mission interactions on the Citadel (at the Cafe and memorial wall)

 

In the end, a lot of it comes to personal taste and playstyle. A ME3 team of Sentinel Shepard, Kaidan, and Garrus or James could be pretty deadly

[Shady Koala]

Couldn't stand Ashley hating on my boys, Garrus and Wrex

and also Kaiden was my LI 

No brainer bye bye Ashley

Cruel Shepard Cruel

[Shuidizi]

I always save the one that is the same gender with my Shepard, mostly because I have no intention of romancing VS in any of my playthroughs. The way they treat you in ME2 is probably okay for a friend, but definitely not okay in my book for a lover.

[Farangbaa]

I've thought about this from a tactical perspective now

 

In Mass Effect 1:

The focus on weapon combat (I actually have gone entire ME1 playthroughs without accessing the power wheel) means Ashley > Kaidan.

She has access to all four weapon groups, Kaidan barely has access to pistols (as in, he's useless with the others)

In Mass Effect 3:

The focus on power combos as a large part of combat strategy (especially for the caster classes: Adept, Engineer, Sentinel) means Kaidan > Ashley.

He can set up and detonate a few of the more powerful combos (setting up a cryo explosion and detonating biotics with Reave)

 

 

Also....REAVE. Amiright? He even calls this out as being notable at the party. ("...I can reave now!")

 

 

Their dialog in 3 mirrors each other pretty well. Both have a personal stake in the war from the personal loss perspective. Kaidan has interactive Normandy dialog while Ashley has most of her off-mission interactions on the Citadel (at the Cafe and memorial wall)

 

In the end, a lot of it comes to personal taste and playstyle. A ME3 team of Sentinel Shepard, Kaidan, and Garrus or James could be pretty deadly

 

Ashley can prime just as well. Disruptor Ammo can prime for a tech burst, her grenade can prime for an eh.. fire combo, or w/e it's called.

 

And on what difficulty did you play ME1? I can't imagine doing insanity without using the power wheel. Plus, floating enemies can't shoot you, and Shepard is always the main damage dealer, your squadmember can´t aim for ****. Countless times your squadmates are just shooting a wall or crate. Liara + Kaidan, or Wrex + Kaidan is far more deadly than Liara + Ashley or Wrex + Ashley, irrelevant of Shepard´s class. And why you´d spec Ashley to wield any weapon but an assalt rifle is beyond me. Her having access to all weapons is irrelevant, because the assault rifle trumps all.

 

Adept Shepard + Liara + Kaidan makes the final battle in ME1 a breeze btw, even on insanity. Ashley is pretty much useless in that battle.