94 réponses à ce sujet

[xlavaina]

Lizardviking wrote...

Not at all. Jacob is pretty much the captain douchebag of the Normandy SR-2 Enterpriiiiiize.

Someone had to do it... 

[Raizo]

As a man of color I was initially happy to learn that I was going to get a 'black squadmate' in ME2 however compared to most if not all of the squadmates on the Normandy Jacob is the most boring character in the game and as such I just don't really think all that much about him or ever use him. It's not a problem that's exclusive to him, my attitude to Kaiden in ME1 is more or less similar. I guess that if you are playing as a Male Shepard then charcters like Jacob and Kaiden who are both human and male don't really show up on the radar at all ( no real incentive to talk to them since you don't plan on romancing them ).

Coming from an Aliance background has also hurt Jacob's personality alot. I find his personality to be stiff and rigid, whenever I see him saluting Shepard the first thing that springs to mind is "kiss ass" even though I know Jacob does this partly out of respect for Shepard but also out of habbit. It's even worse when he goes from his 'military boy' phase to speaking casually, the shift is just too much too quickly. As a black man I used to think that 'Augustus Cole' from Gears of War was an offensive 'black stereotype' character but in time I have come to love the charcter and aprreciate him for what he is ( reading the book helps alot, probably one of the most intersting fictional characters I have ever come across ), Jacob on the other hand just rubs me the wrong way when goes from having a stick stuck up his ass to being 'gangsta' all of a sudden.

On paper, Jacob is not a bad character, I dare even say he is interesting, it's such a shame that he that his dialogue is soo meh most of the time and ( un-intentionally ) comical the rest of the time. If he is coming back for ME3 the some minor improvements could do wonders for him. Don't let him go from one extreme personality to another, keep him more or less a s nuetral as male Shepard's nuetral dialogue. Make him less whiny, between Miranda and him, Jacob was supposed to be the more open minded Cerebus Agent and yet you get more crap from him then you do Miranda. As for charcter design, lose some ( or alot ) of the razor stubble from around his neck ( surely there are more efficinet ways to shave in the ME timeline ) and give the man some hips for christ's sake, what the hell is going on with the man below the waist, the guys built like a top and it's distarcting everytime I see him standing there.

Modifié par Raizo, 12 septembre 2010 - 02:40 .

[mosor]

tommyt_1994 wrote...

-He starts lashing out at Thane for being a "precise mercenary", when a mercenary could arguably describe Jacob's involvement with Cerberus. TIM refers to him as "just a soldier", and Jacob was working with an organization he stronly disagrees with when he really didn't have to. He joined Cerberus pre-ME2. He isn;' working with them because they're a necessary evil to stop the collector's like Shep is. Jacob had the Alliances support, and the apparently really wante him to remain in service form what we've seen on his dossier in LotSB. Shep didn't have the Alliance's supoort like Jacob did. (in ME2 at least).

You're probably skipping the Jacob dialogue. Jacob makes it pretty clear that he joined Cerberus because he doesn't like the red tape and bureaucracy of the alliance that stymies mission effectiveness. He joined the corsair's. Same bull there. So he joined cerberus after teaming up with miranda in ME galaxy. Although the collectors didn't start their attack until just prior to ME2, he obviously believes Cerberus info on the reapers. He's with cerberus as long as they focus on taking out threats rather than creating them. Jacob isn't a mercenary that's motivated by money. He's motivated by idealism. Assasins are traditionally motivated by money. That's why Jacob is suspecious of Thane. We later find out that Thane isn't motivated by money. That he was just a Hanar robot killer. Frankly I don't know what is worse.

-He tries to ****** of Tali in the debriefing room after you recruit her, I can't see how some people try and play it off as a mistake on his part and try and say he didn't mean to be mean towards the new crew member. Who actually has very good reason to distrust Cerberus.

That being an absent minded thought is more consistant with his character than a malicious attempt to hurt Tali. EDI is an important part of Normandy after all that she's going to have to interact with. Quite frankly there is no way of informing her without her reacting badly given her history with the geth.

He's a solid 5/10 on my scale, somethings I like, some things I do not. I really don't understand where Bioware went with his character.

He could have been better. That's true. Bioware could have fleshed out his character LotSB dossiers and vids, but they alas, all we get are his workout routines. How sad.

[Redcoat]

As an aside, I wonder if the person at BioWare responsible for writing "the priiize..." line ever realised that it would become this memetic.

Back on topic, does anyone else get the impression that Jacob acts utterly annoyed by the simple act of going to talk with him? His "no new dialogue" line is a put upon "Already? I'm not big on forcing these talks, Shepard." At least other characters like Garrus and Tali say they're busy and have to work to do. I can see how people might interprate that as Jacob being a "private" person, but the game initially sets him up as a "buddy" character that can be trusted, then turns him into someone who seems passive-aggressive and repressed once he's aboard the Normandy. It's the exact opposite of what happens with Miranda, who is noticebly more hostile and unfriendly before she comes aboard.

[lazuli]

Redcoat wrote...
Back on topic, does anyone else get the impression that Jacob acts utterly annoyed by the simple act of going to talk with him? His "no new dialogue" line is a put upon "Already? I'm not big on forcing these talks, Shepard." At least other characters like Garrus and Tali say they're busy and have to work to do.

I've noticed that too.  It's another mark against him.  Poor guy.  Add that to the reasons already listed and it's hard to deny that the odds are stacked against Jacob.  Additionally, he's an over-sexualized male in a game targeted primarily at young heterosexual males.

[ADLegend21]

tommyt_1994 wrote...

ADLegend21 wrote...

Jacob being mean to Tali yeah "Cerberus saw footage of you in action, you'll be a good asset to the team" is only something an ass would say to someone when they join a team.

*sighs* I was referring to the "Oh make sure to introduce yourself to the ship's AI" comment. Nice try though.

How is that being an ass, would you prefer if Tali was doing something that EDI doesn't approve of then she's lsot because she didn't know about it? Jacob was being helpful.

[CroGamer002]

Shadow_broker wrote...


4:He's Black, Yes i'm going there. This is not the main reason but i think Jacobs Very african Appearnce made some people dislike him. Kadian was just as boring but SOME people like him

EPIC FAIL AHOLE!

[Elyvern]

Redcoat wrote...

As an aside, I wonder if the person at BioWare responsible for writing "the priiize..." line ever realised that it would become this memetic.

Back on topic, does anyone else get the impression that Jacob acts utterly annoyed by the simple act of going to talk with him? His "no new dialogue" line is a put upon "Already? I'm not big on forcing these talks, Shepard." At least other characters like Garrus and Tali say they're busy and have to work to do. I can see how people might interprate that as Jacob being a "private" person, but the game initially sets him up as a "buddy" character that can be trusted, then turns him into someone who seems passive-aggressive and repressed once he's aboard the Normandy. It's the exact opposite of what happens with Miranda, who is noticebly more hostile and unfriendly before she comes aboard.

Definitely. It feels almost bi-polar the way Miranda and Jacob acts. One starts off really cold and b-itchy but warms up to you, the other lulls you into almost liking him, and then becomes defensive and suspicious. I did start off the game liking Jacob, then conversations when he gets all prickly when you ask him about Miranda, his "no new dialogue" line just pisses me off. I get that he has a history with her and doesn't want to talk about it, but all I feel is waves of hostility directed at me.

If he was a character that had a more distinctive personality, I think he'd probably make it to my hate list. But generally I just ignore him.  

[ADLegend21]

Mesina2 wrote...

Shadow_broker wrote...


4:He's Black, Yes i'm going there. This is not the main reason but i think Jacobs Very african Appearnce made some people dislike him. Kadian was just as boring but SOME people like him

EPIC FAIL AHOLE!

Not really. besides possibley Shepard Jacob's like the only black guy with dialogue besides the bouncer at flux

[Adhin]

I think Raizo managed to say what I was trying to say. The way he talks sometime feels horribly out of place. Where as I didn't really like that kinda thing in GoW specifically (or dislike it really) It at least felt more like that person was comfortable with it. Jacob a lot of the stuff he says just doesn't... fit, or feel right. And the fact this is all taking place so far into the future makes it seem even more jarring for me I think.



As to the 'He's black' as a reason? sorry but no that's not a reason. Him randomly spouting out US-stereotypical black lines (with a side of porno lines?) is just offputting for me, more so when it just doesn't seem to fit.

[XX55XX]

Jacob... I liked him in the beginning, when the Cerberus facility was under attack and he helps Shepard get out of there with Miranda. But, however, as the game wore on, it felt like his character didn't have as much to say as the other characters did, thereby reducing his value as a character.

The numberds do back this one up. In my recent survey, Jacob's overall average is less than a four on a scale of ten. He is the second lowest-ranked character, besides Morinth.

[Arbalest7]

I think the reason that Kaiden is generally liked more than Jacob is that Kaiden, while a bit dull, felt more generally nice and up front. Jacob in his dealings with Tali, Thane and some dialouge trees felt really passive aggressive to me.

[Adhin]

Agreed Arbalest7. I liked Kaiden cause he just seemed like a 'friend' I guess, or well was neutral leaning on the side of really liking him. Where as Jacob im more neutral leaning on the side of throatpunching.

[xlavaina]

Mesina2 wrote...

Shadow_broker wrote...


4:He's Black, Yes i'm going there. This is not the main reason but i think Jacobs Very african Appearnce made some people dislike him. Kadian was just as boring but SOME people like him

EPIC FAIL AHOLE!

Yeah seriously. Its his personality that pisses people off, his odd talking animation and teeth just amplified it, but it has nothing to do with his skin color. 

[lizzbee]

ADLegend21 wrote...
Not really. besides possibley Shepard Jacob's like the only black guy with dialogue besides the bouncer at flux

Errr...  Anderson?  Who also happens to be one of my favorite characters in the series, actually.  Seriously, though, the whiteness of the ME universe is a little ridiculous, especially considering the current population distribution of Earth.

lazuli wrote...
So you're going to blame a person for
reacting emotionally when he finds out someone close to him has been
lying, perhaps about everything?  In those situations, I think humans
are expected to act a little impulsively or otherwise "out of line."

I personally blame a person for showing racial bias when emotions make them let their facade down.  Really, he could have found a lot of *other* things to focus on during said breakup scenes.  "You're dumping me for an *assassin?*  Someone who kills for payment?"  or "That nerd?  What does he think you do with a woman?  Calibrate her?"

lazuli wrote...

I've noticed that too.  It's another
mark against him.  Poor guy.  Add that to the reasons already listed and
it's hard to deny that the odds are stacked against Jacob. 
Additionally, he's an over-sexualized male in a game targeted primarily
at young heterosexual males.

Jacob is the sum-total of his writing.  And that includes his "out-of-character" moments.  As a heterosexual female, I find him borderline sexist and repugnant.  'Course the way they scripted FemShep in dealing with him doesn't help much either.  I'm wondering if the people who like him most have information most of us PC-only, ME2-only, players have.  I don't have an i-device of any kind, so I haven't played his mini-game.  Maybe I'd think differently about him if I played it.

Modifié par lizzbee, 12 septembre 2010 - 11:18 .

[Shadow_broker]

xlavaina wrote...

Mesina2 wrote...

Shadow_broker wrote...


4:He's Black, Yes i'm going there. This is not the main reason but i think Jacobs Very african Appearnce made some people dislike him. Kadian was just as boring but SOME people like him

EPIC FAIL AHOLE!

Yeah seriously. Its his personality that pisses people off, his odd talking animation and teeth just amplified it, but it has nothing to do with his skin color. 

I'm not simply reffering to skin color, But his heavily Black appearnce (lips hair teeth ect...)
Kadian was just as stable and boring as jacob but still has a large following when jacob is the least favoirte character in the series.

[Adhin]

Kaiden wasn't an ass to anyone, on your squad or other wise. Kaiden didn't have bizar porno-esk 1 liners pop up randomly that just seemed horribly off. And yeah I mean that outside of just the romance stuff. A lot of the stuff I didn't like he would say I realized after awhile is because its crap you'd find in bad pornos.



"Mmm aahh yeah baby, here comes the good stuff!"

"Ahh mm, Oh this is gettin' intense!"



.....so yeah no, just no. He was just badly writen, someone was trying to hard to make him one way or another and it just didn't mesh right. His appearance didn't bug me at all. Other then whole body thing someone pointed out. Dude has no hips, which sounds weird but seriously. He looks like he had a horrible accident at some point and needed hip/leg replacement and hes lower half is someone else's body.

[Kitteh303]

"The prize" comment is what ticked me off. I don't like the idea of my Shep being some kind of sex object. I know he probably didn't mean it like that, but...

And in combat it takes him 2 seconds to drop like a ragdoll.



What is it exactly he says about Garrus and Thane? Cuttlebone and... something?

[Shadow_broker]

Adhin wrote...

Kaiden wasn't an ass to anyone, on your squad or other wise. Kaiden didn't have bizar porno-esk 1 liners pop up randomly that just seemed horribly off. And yeah I mean that outside of just the romance stuff. A lot of the stuff I didn't like he would say I realized after awhile is because its crap you'd find in bad pornos.

"Mmm aahh yeah baby, here comes the good stuff!"
"Ahh mm, Oh this is gettin' intense!"

.....so yeah no, just no. He was just badly writen, someone was trying to hard to make him one way or another and it just didn't mesh right. His appearance didn't bug me at all. Other then whole body thing someone pointed out. Dude has no hips, which sounds weird but seriously. He looks like he had a horrible accident at some point and needed hip/leg replacement and hes lower half is someone else's body.

Kadian was an ass to Ashley at certain points and renegade shepards.
And purley Male shep players were never exsposed to his romance or porno lines, They have no reason to hate him.
His body was made to be Ideal to Females as Mirandas was made to be Ideal to males

[Kitteh303]

Shadow_broker wrote...

Adhin wrote...

Kaiden wasn't an ass to anyone, on your squad or other wise. Kaiden didn't have bizar porno-esk 1 liners pop up randomly that just seemed horribly off. And yeah I mean that outside of just the romance stuff. A lot of the stuff I didn't like he would say I realized after awhile is because its crap you'd find in bad pornos.

"Mmm aahh yeah baby, here comes the good stuff!"
"Ahh mm, Oh this is gettin' intense!"

.....so yeah no, just no. He was just badly writen, someone was trying to hard to make him one way or another and it just didn't mesh right. His appearance didn't bug me at all. Other then whole body thing someone pointed out. Dude has no hips, which sounds weird but seriously. He looks like he had a horrible accident at some point and needed hip/leg replacement and hes lower half is someone else's body.

Kadian was an ass to Ashley at certain points and renegade shepards.
And purley Male shep players were never exsposed to his romance or porno lines, They have no reason to hate him.
His body was made to be Ideal to Females as Mirandas was made to be Ideal to males

I think the dude looks deformed from the neck down.

[Adhin]

Only his romance oriented ones, Broker. A lot of the crap he says just doesn't fit. And Kaiden wasn't ever an ass to Ashley that I remember. They had that whole rank/formality thing the 2 did early on, they swapped rolls based off what gender you where playing. But that wasn't being an ass, that was more of a friendly reminder of being on duty.

As for being an ass to renegade shepard? Of course he would speak his mind and come off an an ass for some stuff you could do. But that's all warrented at the situation. Jacob can come off an an ass almost for the sake of it (kinda like a lot of renegade crap in ME2 shep does, seems more like just 'because he can' not cause theres a good reason).

[PrinceLionheart]

Jacob has the least quriky personality making him stand out the least, and since, by standard, there's always one character that recieves the majority of the hate that duty ended up going to Jacob. Hell, I'm willing to bet if there's a "Generic Guy" in the third game, Jacob will suddenly lose some of the hate against him just like Kaidan did.

[Mike2640]

I liked Jacob for the most part. There were some spots I didn't, but that goes for pretty much all of the squad at one point or another. He's a good guy. The fact that he doesn't have crazy skills or super powers like the rest of the team and yet can still keep up with them says a lot about his will and his commitment to the mission. But then again, i've always liked the more normal characters in settings with uber-powerfuls.

Also his line with Tali was just really funny. You have to admit she had some attitude in that scene. Jacob getting a good line in at her expense doesn't make him a douche or insensitive. We've all teased someone before, it's not a big deal.

Modifié par Mike2640, 13 septembre 2010 - 01:52 .

[PrinceLionheart]

Mike2640 wrote...

Also his line with Tali was just really funny. You have to admit she had some attitude in that scene. Jacob getting a good line in at her expense doesn't make him a douche or insensitive. We've all teased someone before, it's not a big deal.

In all seriousness, even if Jacob had said it out of spite, Tali was the one who had started the spat in the first place.

[Adhin]

Yeah, because hes Cerberus. They're evil. The only good they do is get Shep back and you know that's mostly so TIM can save his skin and hopefully get his hands on doomday **** so he can play overlord to the galaxy.



The only time I don't really agree with Tali (but understand it) is in her opinion on the Geth. but she'd had a life time of hearing them be demonized as a means to rationalize what her people did. It's very common in war time, more so if the war was started cause you tried to nuke your kids.