585 réponses à ce sujet

[Dave of Canada]

Mecha Tengu wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

1) "Save the Council" - no negative side effects. None.

uh a lot of humans die

They are considered heroes, the Alliance love you, the Aliens love you and the entire damned galaxy loves you.

[PWENER]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

Barquiel wrote...
If Barquiel was writing that final decision, the choice "Concentrate on Sovereign" would have resulted in geth ships attacking Hacketts fleet while they're fighting Sovereign, making it take 2X as long to bring down...

Then why bother having a choice at all? There's already a negative side effect of "Concentrate on Sovereign" - the Geth blow up the Destiny Ascension.

The whole point of this discussion is:

1) "Save the Council" - no negative side effects. None.
2) "Concentrate on Sovereign" - negative side effect, Council dies.
3) "Forget the Council" - negative side effect, Shepard is a total jerk

You let 10,000 lives die out of spite for the council and his a jerk?

*cough* understatement *cough*

Modifié par PWENER, 13 septembre 2010 - 01:01 .

[Dean_the_Young]

But it never effects the gameplay or later opportunities, which is what he meant. Nothing changes for the worse from it.

[jbblue05]

ME2 was to punish Renegades and reward Paragons



ME3 better reward Renegades and punish Paragons



The only thing Renegades gained in ME2 was 4 more cruisers in the Alliance and got a big F U from them

we got the same Council but no dialogue with them and we are hated by aliens and no love from humans

It seems like we lose more and gain next to nothing

[MhorRioghain]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Just_mike wrote...

You forget about that Asari Eclipse Merc in Samara's recruitment. The Paragon way is to let her go. Then you find out she killed that Volus. The Renegade way is to shoot her.

One time out of a thousand. And the cops are tracking her down.

The option of letting her go isn't a paragon choice insomuch as a naive one considering that you are told explicitly that membership into the Eclipse necessitates murder as a rite of entry. Not a morally ambiguous choice IMO if you are paying attention to the dialogue.

Modifié par MhorRioghain, 13 septembre 2010 - 01:01 .

[Dave of Canada]

MhorRioghain wrote...

The option of letting her go isn't a paragon choice insomuch as a naive one considering that you are told explicitly that membership into the Eclipse necessitates murder as a rite of entry. Not a morally ambiguous choice IMO if you are paying attention to the dialogue.

You also can't kill her if you missed the Renegade prompt.

[upsettingshorts]

Barquiel wrote...
I had the impression that most renegades like the "concentrate on Sovereign" outcome...humans dominate the galaxy.

I chose it as a Paragon in my first playthrough, and rebuild a multiracial Council.  

The difference between "Concentrate on Sovereign" and "Forget the Council" is all intent.  The former doesn't want the Council to die, but can't risk Sovereign succeeding.  The latter views it as an opportunity to kill off the Council.

Totally, totally different.

Mecha Tengu wrote...
uh a lot of humans die

Yeah, and you really get taken to task for it in Mass Effect 2.  Pro-human organizations won't even talk to you!  You're hounded by Terra Firma and demonized by the Alliance for your callous disregard for human life!

But seriously, the only time anyone ever calls you out for it is Al-Jilani, and everyone knows she will look to get a rise out of you no matter what, because she's a yellow journalist.

So yeah, no negative side effects.

[Xilizhra]

jbblue05 wrote...

ME2 was to punish Renegades and reward Paragons

ME3 better reward Renegades and punish Paragons

The only thing Renegades gained in ME2 was 4 more cruisers in the Alliance and got a big F U from them
we got the same Council but no dialogue with them and we are hated by aliens and no love from humans
It seems like we lose more and gain next to nothing

I don't care what happens to Renegades, but why do you care about punishing Paragons?

[MhorRioghain]

Dave of Canada wrote...

MhorRioghain wrote...

The option of letting her go isn't a paragon choice insomuch as a naive one considering that you are told explicitly that membership into the Eclipse necessitates murder as a rite of entry. Not a morally ambiguous choice IMO if you are paying attention to the dialogue.

You also can't kill her if you missed the Renegade prompt.

Really? That's actually rather silly.

[The Big Nothing]

MhorRioghain wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

Just_mike wrote...

You forget about that Asari Eclipse Merc in Samara's recruitment. The Paragon way is to let her go. Then you find out she killed that Volus. The Renegade way is to shoot her.

One time out of a thousand. And the cops are tracking her down.

The option of letting her go isn't a paragon choice insomuch as a naive one considering that you are told explicitly that membership into the Eclipse necessitates murder as a rite of entry. Not a morally ambiguous choice IMO if you are paying attention to the dialogue.

A paragon is not naive when letting her go when the options are a) Let her go and Shoot her in cold blood

Plus, she's a girl.

Modifié par The Big Nothing, 13 septembre 2010 - 01:04 .

[upsettingshorts]

PWENER wrote...
You let 10,000 lives die out of spite for the council and his a jerk?

*cough* understatement *cough*

I had "total somethinghole" written there, but it was censored. So I edited it out to be more mild. But you get the idea.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 13 septembre 2010 - 01:04 .

[Dave of Canada]

Xilizhra wrote...

I don't care what happens to Renegades, but why do you care about punishing Paragons?

Because they always get patted on the back and told how they did a good job.

[Xilizhra]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

I don't care what happens to Renegades, but why do you care about punishing Paragons?

Because they always get patted on the back and told how they did a good job.

If you're not making the Paragon choices, just ask for better Renegade options. Don't worry about something you're not participating in.

[Dean_the_Young]

Big Nothing, when the obvious consequence of (a) is that she'll go back to being an Eclipse once your back is turned...

Unless, of course, you think she wouldn't. Which really would be naive.

Modifié par Dean_the_Young, 13 septembre 2010 - 01:06 .

[Mecha Tengu]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Mecha Tengu wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

1) "Save the Council" - no negative side effects. None.

uh a lot of humans die

They are considered heroes, the Alliance love you, the Aliens love you and the entire damned galaxy loves you.

if they love me so much why does the council still not believe me even after I've saved their asses T_T

[MhorRioghain]

The Big Nothing wrote...

MhorRioghain wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

Just_mike wrote...

You forget about that Asari Eclipse Merc in Samara's recruitment. The Paragon way is to let her go. Then you find out she killed that Volus. The Renegade way is to shoot her.

One time out of a thousand. And the cops are tracking her down.

The option of letting her go isn't a paragon choice insomuch as a naive one considering that you are told explicitly that membership into the Eclipse necessitates murder as a rite of entry. Not a morally ambiguous choice IMO if you are paying attention to the dialogue.

A paragon is not naive when letting her go when the options are a) Let her go and Shoot her in cold blood

Plus, she's a girl.

LOL! Tell me you're joking and pray tell why her being a "girl" should matter?

Modifié par MhorRioghain, 13 septembre 2010 - 01:06 .

[upsettingshorts]

Mecha Tengu wrote...
if they love me so much why does the council still not believe me even after I've saved their asses T_T

They're politicians?

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 13 septembre 2010 - 01:08 .

[The Big Nothing]

Dean_the_Young wrote...

Big Nothing, when the obvious consequence of (a) is that she'll go back to being an Eclipse once your back is turned...

Unless, of course, you think she wouldn't. Which really would be naive.

That would be meta-gaming. All you know at the time is that she is seemingly a new recruit who, after being confronted by Mr. or Mrs. Shepard, might re-think her career. And she is pathetically praying for her life in hiding.

Modifié par The Big Nothing, 13 septembre 2010 - 01:09 .

[stewie1974]

Major Decisions and my rational for making them outside of meta info.

All other decisions like saving feros or what not I had no choice in really..... it just kinda went that way, I saved it because I could. When I finally figured out how to switch grenades anyhow.....

But these to me were the "big decisions".


ME1. Save the Rachni Queen./Kill her.

A gamble, she made a compelling argument, I took her at her word. The war was something pre humanity. Rachni are potential allies In the future.

ME1. Save the council/allow them to be wiped out.

I saved them. It was a pure gamble, but I thought if it payed off, I'd be able to get soverign and save the council too, and humanity would be in a better bargining position in the future...

ME1. Undina/Anderson for councilor.... 

I chose Anderson cuz I trust him. Udina I don't. purely based on how they spoke to me. Anderson is a soilder...so is shep, it's the natural choice to make. Justification? I'd rather have someone I could influence on the council.

ME2. Rewrite the heretics/destroy the heretics.

I rewrote them. A legion of Legions at my side in a battle against other sapient machines is another gamble I'm hoping pays off.

ME2 Keep/Destroy the Collector base.

Another gamble, I destroyed it. Based on what i've learned from reaper tech leading us into traps, I didn't want to trip this one. Theres nothing amazing about collector tech outside particle cannons , I already have one...so nuff said... the making human reapers as a counter reaper dosn't work for me......tricking us into assimilating ourselves is not on my agenda.....besides, I think it's a trojan horse.

Modifié par stewie1974, 13 septembre 2010 - 01:15 .

[Mecha Tengu]

MhorRioghain wrote...

LOL! Tell me you're joking and pray tell why her being a "girl" should matter?

hes joking, chill

[Dave of Canada]

Xilizhra wrote...

If you're not making the Paragon choices, just ask for better Renegade options. Don't worry about something you're not participating in.

I could ask for better Renegade options but the thing is, Paragons always get rewarded for their choice.

Saved the Rachni Queen? RACHNI HELP YOU!
Saved Shiala? SHE HELPS THE COLONY.
Saved the Council? EVERYBODY LOVES YOU.
Blow up the Collector Base? EVERYBODY ON YOUR CREW PATS YOU ON THE BACK (even if they told you to keep it.)

You're taking huge risks with no reward. If I let a Terrorist go, I should expect to hear about how he attacked a building later and killed thousands. If I spare dangerous species 2.0, I should hear about how they slaughtered an entire colony and nested there.

Risks often come with failure unless you're a Paragon.

[The Big Nothing]

MhorRioghain wrote...

The Big Nothing wrote...

MhorRioghain wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

Just_mike wrote...

You forget about that Asari Eclipse Merc in Samara's recruitment. The Paragon way is to let her go. Then you find out she killed that Volus. The Renegade way is to shoot her.

One time out of a thousand. And the cops are tracking her down.

The option of letting her go isn't a paragon choice insomuch as a naive one considering that you are told explicitly that membership into the Eclipse necessitates murder as a rite of entry. Not a morally ambiguous choice IMO if you are paying attention to the dialogue.

A paragon is not naive when letting her go when the options are a) Let her go and Shoot her in cold blood

Plus, she's a girl.

LOL! Tell me you're joking and pray tell why her being a "girl" should matter?

Because everybody knows killing girls is wrong unless they have charge and/or shockwave.

Modifié par The Big Nothing, 13 septembre 2010 - 01:11 .

[upsettingshorts]

The Big Nothing wrote...

All you know at the time is that she is seemingly a new recruit an initiate who earned her uniform through at least murder who, after being confronted by Mr. or Mrs. Shepard, might re-think her career clearly eyes her weapon and then, at the moment the Renegade interrupt option appears, is in the act of pulling her shotgun

FTFY

The "pay off" is that we find out she was responsible for a specific murder.  The fact she killed someone is self-evidence, she's in an Eclipse uniform.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 13 septembre 2010 - 01:12 .

[Xilizhra]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Xilizhra wrote...

If you're not making the Paragon choices, just ask for better Renegade options. Don't worry about something you're not participating in.

I could ask for better Renegade options but the thing is, Paragons always get rewarded for their choice.

Saved the Rachni Queen? RACHNI HELP YOU!
Saved Shiala? SHE HELPS THE COLONY.
Saved the Council? EVERYBODY LOVES YOU.
Blow up the Collector Base? EVERYBODY ON YOUR CREW PATS YOU ON THE BACK (even if they told you to keep it.)

You're taking huge risks with no reward. If I let a Terrorist go, I should expect to hear about how he attacked a building later and killed thousands. If I spare dangerous species 2.0, I should hear about how they slaughtered an entire colony and nested there.

Risks often come with failure unless you're a Paragon.

So you're a Paragon player who wants more bad things to happen to make it interesting?