104 réponses à ce sujet

[Taleroth]

shazzmoe wrote...

Taleroth wrote...

shazzmoe wrote...
 This would be fairly easy to implement because bioware would have little to do besides reimplement dedicated servers.

WHAT?!  Dedicated servers and networking is neither little nor easy.

I've worked in QA on a retail shipped video game.  Almost half our QA department were doing some variation on networking testing.  There were full-time programmers on it for months.  And we were making a console game.  That was peer to peer, we didn't even have dedicated servers.

I would agree with this if they had not yet made a game with multiplayer access.  It would have been worth their time to go back and modify something like their NWN online client to fit this game.  Yes it would take more time but not only would it make the online community happier, it would greatly reduce piracy.  Less people are going to buy the game when single player games have little to no way to prevent downloading of their game.

It does not work that way.  Not all networking is automatically compatable with all other software.  Dragon Age is not NWN, it may have similarities to NWN, it may even have some shared code, but the difference is significant enough that you can't copy-paste it.  It's still going to take months of programming and QA. 

And people still pirate multiplayer games, so you're not resolving anything there.

People love first person shooters, too.  I'd wager that more people like FPS games than like small-scale multiplayer RPGs.  That does not mean they need to introduce that functionality into Dragon Age.

Modifié par Taleroth, 11 novembre 2009 - 08:04 .

[Dauphin2]

Warcraft started out a single player game, eventually they spun an MMO off from it, called World of Warcraft. Maybe you have heard of it.



I think they are going down the right path. The MMO should be separate from the Single Player game.

[spool32]

hannahb wrote...

Default137 wrote...

Are you still trying baby?

Thing is, we have two options.

More DLC, possible Expansions, and a well made Sequel, or CO-OP for DA:O.

It takes alot of hard work, money, and other resources to make a game multi compatible, and would take Biowares entire dev team most likely just to get it all up and running, which would mean the game would be left behind DLC/Expansion wise.

If you REALLY want CO-OP, try and set up a bunch of modders to make the game CO-OP compatible, you'll see what I mean when I say this is a monumental task your asking of Bioware, but hey, if you want it bad enough, maybe you can make us a CO-OP mod, but it will have to be you who made it.

And yes, CO-OP takes from games, it takes MONTHS to make a game CO-OP compatible, even if it was their original intention, this game was in development for 5 years I believe, and thats why its so polished, and so well done, but take the time and think how much might not be there if you removed 5-8 months worth of development, we could have lost a ton of quest chains, party members, items, endings, romance options, choices, all sorts of things could have been lost due to it.

More hogwash.

This game plays like NWN2  .. that's no accident. 

Also not necessarily a vote of confidence. I help run the largest NWN1 persistent world in the community, and the NWN2 implementation has always had MP issues... not to mention a dramatically substandard DM client (compared to NWN1) and constrictive requirements on area and world size inherent in the game engine.

NWN2 community members have done sme amazing things with the tools they have, and I hope that if Bioware does attempt a multiplayer port that they will learn from and extend NWN1, and avoid the OBStacles created with NWN2.

[babyjaws]

Dauphin2 wrote...

Warcraft started out a single player game, eventually they spun an MMO off from it, called World of Warcraft. Maybe you have heard of it.

I think they are going down the right path. The MMO should be separate from the Single Player game.

we arent talking about MMO's.
also, the path that seems to be the most favoured by SOME people here (we have all heard the SP enthusiasts POV now) is like that  what was in NWN and BG,  A good single player campaigns with the OPTION of playing through with a SMALL group friends (nothing massive about it), and of course making persistent worlds or multiplayer modules
would be so refreshing to not troll the virtues of SP over MP or vica versa for a proper chat on what this thread is about

spool32 wrote...

NWN2 community members have done sme
amazing things with the tools they have, and I hope that if Bioware
does attempt a multiplayer port that they will learn from and extend
NWN1, and avoid the OBStacles created with NWN2.

seeing that Obsidian developed NWN2, Bioware would, I hope, skip the NWN2 mess but probally theres good stuff to be learnt from NWN2 aswell.
for what everyone says about NWN style multiplayer games being a small market (read in other posts) I cant help think that actually the market is potentially huge, let alone all the original nwn community, but perhaps people bored with MMO grind and stupid fees aswell,
releasing DLC for that market would be a huge profit spinner, maybe too much to compete with the likes of TOR but then again its the same b*****dy company!
Grrrrrrrr.

[Dauphin2]

babyjaws wrote...
we arent talking about MMO's.

If you're talking about more than one person playing at once, you are. Anyway, it doesn't matter. Bioware isn't about to redo the whole game on your or anyone else's whim.

[kansadoom]

The only thing that I find bad at multiplayer it means less concentration on other things and therefore a weaker game, NWN had good multiplayer but the single player campaign....... Lets just say it wasnt the best they had ever done

[spool32]

babyjaws wrote...

Dauphin2 wrote...

Warcraft started out a single player game, eventually they spun an MMO off from it, called World of Warcraft. Maybe you have heard of it.

I think they are going down the right path. The MMO should be separate from the Single Player game.

we arent talking about MMO's.
also, the path that seems to be the most favoured by SOME people here (we have all heard the SP enthusiasts POV now) is like that  what was in NWN and BG,  A good single player campaigns with the OPTION of playing through with a SMALL group friends (nothing massive about it), and of course making persistent worlds or multiplayer modules
would be so refreshing to not troll the virtues of SP over MP or vica versa for a proper chat on what this thread is about

spool32 wrote...

NWN2 community members have done sme
amazing things with the tools they have, and I hope that if Bioware
does attempt a multiplayer port that they will learn from and extend
NWN1, and avoid the OBStacles created with NWN2.

seeing that Obsidian developed NWN2, Bioware would, I hope, skip the NWN2 mess but probally theres good stuff to be learnt from NWN2 aswell.
for what everyone says about NWN style multiplayer games being a small market (read in other posts) I cant help think that actually the market is potentially huge, let alone all the original nwn community, but perhaps people bored with MMO grind and stupid fees aswell,
releasing DLC for that market would be a huge profit spinner, maybe too much to compete with the likes of TOR but then again its the same b*****dy company!
Grrrrrrrr.

I can't speak for the whole Team, but my personal opinion is that were NWN1 style multiplayer possibilities offered for purchase, and the toolset allowed us to re-create The World of Avlis as it feels in NWN1 today, we'd probably migrate everything to a DA client even if it meant asking our playerbase to buy new software.

As it is, we'll be sticking with NWN1 and NWN2 multiplayer worlds and hoping we see some developments on this front in the future...

If you're really craving a persistent mp environment with awesome story and roleplay over pretty graphics, I strongly suggest you reinstall NWN1 and give Avlis a try!

-spool32

[babyjaws]

kansadoom wrote...

The only thing that I find bad at multiplayer it means less concentration on other things and therefore a weaker game, NWN had good multiplayer but the single player campaign....... Lets just say it wasnt the best they had ever done

Not true : )
NWN campaign not being to everyones liking was not due to the game having a MP capability!
the community would put in the hours to build content, also the SP campaignt would work in co-op if the other players could just control the henchmen instead of 1 player controlling them all....

[babyjaws]

spool32 wrote...

I can't speak for the whole Team, but my personal opinion is that were NWN1 style multiplayer possibilities offered for purchase, and the toolset allowed us to re-create The World of Avlis as it feels in NWN1 today, we'd probably migrate everything to a DA client even if it meant asking our playerbase to buy new software.

As it is, we'll be sticking with NWN1 and NWN2 multiplayer worlds and hoping we see some developments on this front in the future...

If you're really craving a persistent mp environment with awesome story and roleplay over pretty graphics, I strongly suggest you reinstall NWN1 and give Avlis a try!

-spool32

Cheers Ill definetly check that out! thanks...

[Aidunno]

sorry but it could cater for everyone and still be polished, with enough resources.
again, havin the MP networking backend implemented within the engine and in the toolkit

Never come across a moddable multiplayer game that wasn't ruined by a minority.

[Wishpig]

Give me a game that focuses on single player over multiplayer any day... I get my fantasy multiplayer fix from mmo's

Aion kicks anus and w/ guild wars and the unannounced Salvatore/spawn artist game on the way, I welcome any and all single player games.

[Auraad]

Here comes another statement: the SP fans got what they wanted (a great story), now it's about time the MP fans get what they want ... and we don't want something completely impossible - after all, it has been done before ... (I hate to repeat myself, but I'll do it as often as it's required) ... BG, BG2, NWN, NWN2, ... just to name a few.

And all these games have been great games. It would even enhance the re-playability: after all, each player (in a coop team) would like to play the main char for at least one playthru

[GreenSoda]

The sp-campaign in NWN1 was horrible -mainly because the focus of that game was entirely MP.

[babyjaws]

Auraad wrote...

Here comes another statement: the SP fans got what they wanted (a great story), now it's about time the MP fans get what they want ... and we don't want something completely impossible - after all, it has been done before ... (I hate to repeat myself, but I'll do it as often as it's required) ... BG, BG2, NWN, NWN2, ... just to name a few.
And all these games have been great games. It would even enhance the re-playability: after all, each player (in a coop team) would like to play the main char for at least one playthru

HEAR HEAR!  
the arguments for MP completely outweigh the arguments against! Ive heard them all now, class balance, resources and time, quality of story, ETC ETC ETC................. OMG what  HOGWASH!!!!!!
PEOPLE WANT MULTIPLAYER IN DRAGON AGE!
we are NOT a MINORITY!

[spool32]

Development IS a zero-sum game. It's true that adding mp to the initial release would have taken away something from the game we have now... I'm glad they didn't do that, but I would very much like to see a quality mp engine to work with, now that the game is released.

[GreenSoda]

babyjaws wrote...


HEAR HEAR!  
the arguments for MP completely outweigh the arguments against! Ive heard them all now, class balance, resources and time, quality of story, ETC ETC ETC................. OMG what  HOGWASH!!!!!!
PEOPLE WANT MULTIPLAYER IN DRAGON AGE!
we are NOT a MINORITY!

Ahem -yes, you are. BW kept track on how many people actually played mp in NWN1 vs. sold copies. It was somewhat around 10-12%.

Imo I really don't want BW to make another RPG with MP-capacity...simply because it takes away resources for the sp-campaign.

[Ghandorian]

the only way to do it is port out toons to a pvp adventure zone. It has to happen out of the story line.

[babyjaws]

GreenSoda wrote...

Ahem -yes, you are. BW kept track on how many people actually played mp in NWN1 vs. sold copies. It was somewhat around 10-12%.

Imo I really don't want BW to make another RPG with MP-capacity...simply because it takes away resources for the sp-campaign.

with an online security anti piracy check those figures would be substantially different.
show me your source of that information

[NecroZombie]

spool32 wrote...

All we need are the tools. The NWN community has been making great mp worlds for 7 years now... all we need are the tools and a DM client.

Perfect example: The World of Avlis

AMEN!!

To me, it's not about being able to play the DA:O storyline with other players.  It's more about having the DA:O setting to create the truely immersive world to share with others.

[spool32]

GreenSoda wrote...

babyjaws wrote...


HEAR HEAR!  
the arguments for MP completely outweigh the arguments against! Ive heard them all now, class balance, resources and time, quality of story, ETC ETC ETC................. OMG what  HOGWASH!!!!!!
PEOPLE WANT MULTIPLAYER IN DRAGON AGE!
we are NOT a MINORITY!

Ahem -yes, you are. BW kept track on how many people actually played mp in NWN1 vs. sold copies. It was somewhat around 10-12%.

Curious where you got those numbers from? Also, curious to know if this fact takes into consideration the long tail that multiplayer in NWN1 has created... Bioware still sells copies of NWN 1 Diamond Edition today.

[Dragon Age1103]

babyjaws wrote...

Habsown wrote...

Hey since this took prox 5 years to make. Let's wait another 20 years for the next one, because we want more dialogue...
This is def not a mutiplayer storyline and i hope it never becomes, so don't be giving them any ideas

yeh well.
lets hope DA:O 2 is MP then

p.s im getting so tired of the single player fans fraternity failing to see it WONT ruin their game!
it will only enhance it! i mean cmon! at least let people build their own MP campaigns with the toolset if they want to.
seems to me a lot of the people that object to MP are being pretty selfish.
this could be a good game for everyone, leaving the 'precious' single player campaign completely intact.

depending on how it is doen yes it could ruin the game. Example if i had to play KotOR with my friend Jared, he would be in pain from me beating him within 20 minutes of playing. I LOVE the diaolgue & greatly appreciate the voice acting...he reads all the subtitles then clicks past which drives em crazy. If one of the players or both could choose to skip it would ruin things.

  If not implemented properly u could be treated like 2 heros which kind of seems dumb...like hurray for McCloud!! oh & Goliath! or the other way around...it could be awesome but since it would be something new i really doubt it plus it would leave game sind development for twice as long if not longer & in all multiplayer games you lose options. AI, loot, graphics, something is lost to make room.

[Aidunno]

..I would very much like to see a quality mp engine to work with, now that the game is released...

Think that is the crux of the matter. how adaptable is the engine to allow multiplayer? How could Bioware get a return of investment, not just in the short term but long term with support/balance issues which may come along ? Single player games have the advantage they are out the door, may be patched for a while but then left while the next game is being created, possibly using the same engine. This is not the case the case with multiplayer games as balancing issues do need to adapt to how people play especially as play evolves over time. I know some people roll their eyes at this but in my opinion this can make or break multiplayer as well as quite a few other issues.

Single player game has (at least I hope) made money... how could adding multiplayer make money (especially if given away) and what is the difference between a multiplayer version in that case rather than new game designed from scratch ?

Crying (as in loud not tears) for multiplayer having brought a single player game is like closing the stable door after the horse has bolted anyway. If people buy a multiplayer game they do not expect 60+ hours single player time to magically appear afterwards.

As a close: What I gather people ideally want, isn't multiplayer Dragon Age, it's a multiplayer core engine and mod kit.

Modifié par Aidunno, 12 novembre 2009 - 03:54 .

[spool32]

That's certainly what ~I~ want. I think the NWN 1&2 modding community does as well... we can handle the balance issues and so forth on our own worlds, just as we have been doing for over 7 years now.



I have no idea if it's possible to give us that functionality though...

[Spawn305]

I love how you say Multi player and every one thinks MMO. hahahaha



Multi Player DOES NOT MEAN MMO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!