52 réponses à ce sujet

[xlavaina]

XX55XX wrote...

Yes, I do here you, Theodoric. At this point in time, only the hardcore fans are still remaining here. Many of the previous polls have indicated that while Tali was not the top character, she definitely fell into the top four most of the time.

I might run such a poll again when ME3 is announced or something... That will draw more people to this forum again.

Yeah good idea. As for now, it seems that at this point and time the opinions of the masses are quite tainted in one way or another, as you never see that kind of difference in popularity in any character. You're right, just hold the vote again in another couple months and we'll see what happens. 

[DigitalMaster37]

XX55XX wrote...

Yes, I do here you, Theodoric. At this point in time, only the hardcore fans are still remaining here. Many of the previous polls have indicated that while Tali was not the top character, she definitely fell into the top four most of the time.

I might run such a poll again when ME3 is announced or something... That will draw more people to this forum again.

XX55XX, YOu said something that is very noteworthy. The hardcore fans are in my opinion -- THE fans. So in essence the "real" fans of th game have spoken, not the fly by night fair weather fans. I think the Tali fans are here and I have seen a ton of "former" Tali fans shift to Liara side as a result of the LotSB, so I wouldn't be so sure what some people in this thread are claiming. I think some people just can't stomach that Tali isn't the "holy Grail" anymore. 

If you want to be honest, Liara had almost no face time when ME2 was first released coupled with her bad representation in ME2. Anyone could have argued that those polls were skewed. So I think the poll is more accurate than most think. Of course I'll be coined as being biased, but I no longer care about that. I will even admit some Liara fans complained in a similar manner when the first polls came out. It happens when someones favorite character is hated. So again, I think this poll is now more accurate because everyone has a clear idea of each persons character (Liara and Tali's) so now we see a fair comparison.


just my thoughts...

Modifié par Deltaboy37-1, 13 septembre 2010 - 01:18 .

[Mr.BlazenGlazen]

Really in my opinion we don't need to have so many popularity surveys. But I kind of understand that you wanted to make another poll after the lair of the shadow broker came out. And to reply to what Delta Boy said, you don't have to join the bioware forums to be a "real fan."



Hell, Mass effect 1 was probably one of my favorite games I have ever played in a lifetime but I never joined up with the bioware forums until after Mass Effect 2.

[DigitalMaster37]

Mr.BlazenGlazen wrote...

Really in my opinion we don't need to have so many popularity surveys. But I kind of understand that you wanted to make another poll after the lair of the shadow broker came out. And to reply to what Delta Boy said, you don't have to join the bioware forums to be a "real fan."

Hell, Mass effect 1 was probably one of my favorite games I have ever played in a lifetime but I never joined up with the bioware forums until after Mass Effect 2.

Overall my point is that Tali fans are still here and if not, then I think the same thing can be said for Liara fans back when ME2 first came out. So all of this crying about Tali is not being well represented is a load of horse crap.

I think people are just not ready to accept that Tali isn't all that is holy.

Trust me, sore losing is hard to swallow and some people have no shame in showing that in this thread.

It bothers me, because I kind of knew this would happen from the get go. Tali fans are made up of some genuine people and some seriously imature ones as the boards have confirmed time and time again which is why there is a Tali-ban in the forums. Do you see a liara fan ban? no, so what you are seeing (IMO) is a more well rounded vote.

Say what you will, but people romanced liara for a reason in ME1 and a lot of those people have learned the errors of their ways .

Modifié par Deltaboy37-1, 13 septembre 2010 - 01:39 .

[NuclearBuddha]

The high standard deviation RE: female LI is probably a result of downvoting.

[XX55XX]

Well, it's almost time for me to go to bed. I need to write a resume tomorrow for some career fair in the coming days...

At any rate, DeltaBoy, there is some skewing because the Tali thread isn't here anymore, but even if it were here, I highly doubt Tali's average would budge too significantly. But, if the Tali thread were here and all her fans were posting, I daresay that Tali's average may be more similar to Liara's.

The number of responses to the poll is starting to slow. I think almost nearly everyone who wants to answer the poll have already done so.

[XX55XX]

Shavon wrote...

My favorite romance was Thane's until the dlc (Liara was second in line, anyway).

At this point, we will have surveys until each romance is concluded. There really is no fair way to evaluate this question until every romance is concluded by the end of ME3. Just saying

I'll run a survey then, too. When is that? 2012? 2013?

[DigitalMaster37]

XX55XX wrote...

Well, it's almost time for me to go to bed. I need to write a resume tomorrow for some career fair in the coming days...

At any rate, DeltaBoy, there is some skewing because the Tali thread isn't here anymore, but even if it were here, I highly doubt Tali's average would budge too significantly. But, if the Tali thread were here and all her fans were posting, I daresay that Tali's average may be more similar to Liara's.

The number of responses to the poll is starting to slow. I think almost nearly everyone who wants to answer the poll have already done so.

That sounds accurate. The last time you did these surveys you have always been fair about it, so I wouldn't accuse you of skewing anything as I have also put together some results from your former polls. I will say that I agree with you though regarding if the Tali thread was still alive. I think it may have increased her results, but I will stand by my conviction that what we are seeing is also a more accurate survey due to people not being able to double dip in this one. I like your methods and I think that is another reason we are seeing such (dare I say?) "jarring" results.

[Redcoat]

NuclearBuddha wrote...

The high standard deviation RE: female LI is probably a result of downvoting.

Possibly, but this poll is set up that forumites can only vote once. People shouldn't be able to repeatedly vote down a character they don't like.

My own theory is that female characters are, in general, much more polarising than male ones. For example, Garrus is second in popularity after Tali, yet how often do you see people posting things like, "GARRUS SUCKS - DEAD IN MY PLAYTHRU LOL!!!11?" Almost never. I'm guessing it might have something to do with the fact that most players are male and thus tend to be more conscious of female characters than male ones.

But if Liara is experiencing a surge in popularity, then you can bet that reams of "LIARA SUX I HATE HER!11! and "NO LIARA IN ME3 FOR ME!1!! posts will follow.

[XX55XX]

Compared with the last several surveys, the only huge eyepopping differences are Tali's and Liara's averages, at least on the surface. Once we start breaking down the results by demographic, only will the dynamics at work be clear.

Everything else appears to be similar to what we have seen in previous surveys. Mordin and Legion having low standard deviations compared to everyone else, etc. Jacob/Morinth being the lowest ranked, etc.

A previous poster mentioned that ME2's characters are relatively static, so I think the next time a poll like this should be run is when ME3 is released.

[XX55XX]

Redcoat wrote...

NuclearBuddha wrote...

The high standard deviation RE: female LI is probably a result of downvoting.

Possibly, but this poll is set up that forumites can only vote once. People shouldn't be able to repeatedly vote down a character they don't like.

My own theory is that female characters are, in general, much more polarising than male ones. For example, Garrus is second in popularity after Tali, yet how often do you see people posting things like, "GARRUS SUCKS - DEAD IN MY PLAYTHRU LOL!!!11?" Almost never. I'm guessing it might have something to do with the fact that most players are male and thus tend to be more conscious of female characters than male ones.

But if Liara is experiencing a surge in popularity, then you can bet that reams of "LIARA SUX I HATE HER!11! and "NO LIARA IN ME3 FOR ME!1!! posts will follow.

That is why I am breaking the data down by demographic for the final analysis.

And additionally, nearly a third of all players taking this survey are female...

[NuclearBuddha]

Redcoat wrote...

NuclearBuddha wrote...
The high standard deviation RE: female LI is probably a result of downvoting.

My own theory is that female characters are, in general, much more polarising than male ones.

Uh, this is what I was saying.

[TheodoricFriede]

Deltaboy37-1 wrote...

Mr.BlazenGlazen wrote...

Really in my opinion we don't need to have so many popularity surveys. But I kind of understand that you wanted to make another poll after the lair of the shadow broker came out. And to reply to what Delta Boy said, you don't have to join the bioware forums to be a "real fan."

Hell, Mass effect 1 was probably one of my favorite games I have ever played in a lifetime but I never joined up with the bioware forums until after Mass Effect 2.

Overall my point is that Tali fans are still here and if not, then I think the same thing can be said for Liara fans back when ME2 first came out. So all of this crying about Tali is not being well represented is a load of horse crap.

I think people are just not ready to accept that Tali isn't all that is holy.

Trust me, sore losing is hard to swallow and some people have no shame in showing that in this thread.

It bothers me, because I kind of knew this would happen from the get go. Tali fans are made up of some genuine people and some seriously imature ones as the boards have confirmed time and time again which is why there is a Tali-ban in the forums. Do you see a liara fan ban? no, so what you are seeing (IMO) is a more well rounded vote.

Say what you will, but people romanced liara for a reason in ME1 and a lot of those people have learned the errors of their ways .

Maturity isnt the issue here, niether is how hardcore the fans are. The issue is that its difficult to get an accurate result when the entire fanbase for a character has been declared unwelcome. I assure you that if if the "Mature" Liara fans wernt allowed to have a thread, they probably wouldnt get an accurate vote either.
For the record, my opinion of Liara skyrocketed with the release of Lair of the Shadowbroker, so her scoring high isnt a shock to me, but theres no way a character can go from (a very conservative estimate of) number 3 to number 7 in an accurate vote. It just doesnt happen.

[Redcoat]

NuclearBuddha wrote...

Uh, this is what I was saying.

Then I must have misunderstood...I thought you meant that Tali's drop in position was the result of people repeatedly taking the survey just to vote her down. But I can definitely see people taking the survey for no other reason than sticking it to characters they don't like..."haters" can be rather creepy like that.

Personally, I'd like to see Tali's popularity go down a bit. Let some other character's fanbase be the ones everyone thinks are obnoxious and perverted.

[DigitalMaster37]

TheodoricFriede wrote...

Deltaboy37-1 wrote...

Mr.BlazenGlazen wrote...

Really in my opinion we don't need to have so many popularity surveys. But I kind of understand that you wanted to make another poll after the lair of the shadow broker came out. And to reply to what Delta Boy said, you don't have to join the bioware forums to be a "real fan."

Hell, Mass effect 1 was probably one of my favorite games I have ever played in a lifetime but I never joined up with the bioware forums until after Mass Effect 2.

Overall my point is that Tali fans are still here and if not, then I think the same thing can be said for Liara fans back when ME2 first came out. So all of this crying about Tali is not being well represented is a load of horse crap.

I think people are just not ready to accept that Tali isn't all that is holy.

Trust me, sore losing is hard to swallow and some people have no shame in showing that in this thread.

It bothers me, because I kind of knew this would happen from the get go. Tali fans are made up of some genuine people and some seriously imature ones as the boards have confirmed time and time again which is why there is a Tali-ban in the forums. Do you see a liara fan ban? no, so what you are seeing (IMO) is a more well rounded vote.

Say what you will, but people romanced liara for a reason in ME1 and a lot of those people have learned the errors of their ways .

Maturity isnt the issue here, niether is how hardcore the fans are. The issue is that its difficult to get an accurate result when the entire fanbase for a character has been declared unwelcome. I assure you that if if the "Mature" Liara fans wernt allowed to have a thread, they probably wouldnt get an accurate vote either.
For the record, my opinion of Liara skyrocketed with the release of Lair of the Shadowbroker, so her scoring high isnt a shock to me, but theres no way a character can go from (a very conservative estimate of) number 3 to number 7 in an accurate vote. It just doesnt happen.

Fair enough. My thoughts are that you may be right only in that the anti_tali people are possibly downplaying her a bit due to whatever reason. I didn't I am objective enough to know you don't base your opinion of a character on their fans. I voted Tali high, but obviously not as high as Liara. I gave Tali a 7, because that is genuinely how I feel about her. She is a great teammate with a great story and personality, but Liara does it for me. Now what XX55XX will be able to do is isolate those who downplayed characters. He'll see that some Miranda fans bashed Tali for no apparent reason other than obvious padding techniques. Here is the thing though, many, many, many Tali fans bashed Liara in a much similar way and Liara still had a middle range showing. So it goes to tell you some things. Again, what I think we are seeing and what we will see is that we are eliminating a lot of the skewness more than creating it. Liara will score high as a result of two things: LotSB and her fans, which believe it or not are many. In addition to that, some "cheaters" have now converted back to Liara giving her an added edge. Now I will say Tali will always be popular, but we are indeed seeing more realistic results since now everyone gets to see the real Liara as it pertains to the culmination of ME2's story.

Everybody knows Tali's ME2 story, now they finally got closure on Liara's ME2 portion of the story. It has in a sense evened out. This is IMO what we are seeing, nothing more. The proof is that XX55XX has even said that the other characters are showing very similar results to former polls. I know people want to think something is wrong with the poll or the results, but in fact we are seeing more accuracy if you ask me. XX55XX will post the results when ready and we will see if I am wrong or right. If I am wrong I will stand corrected.

Modifié par Deltaboy37-1, 13 septembre 2010 - 02:23 .

[TheodoricFriede]

Indeed, when the results are posted we shall see. And should i be proven wrong then i will hold no animosity toward the you, Deltaboy, or the Liara fans in general. After all, I was a Liara fan during the course of mass effect 1, and her resolution in the DLC defiantly makes me think shes the second best choice for a male Shepard. At least we can all agree that female alien love interests are awesome.

[DigitalMaster37]

TheodoricFriede wrote...

Indeed, when the results are posted we shall see. And should i be proven wrong then i will hold no animosity toward the you, Deltaboy, or the Liara fans in general. After all, I was a Liara fan during the course of mass effect 1, and her resolution in the DLC defiantly makes me think shes the second best choice for a male Shepard. At least we can all agree that female alien love interests are awesome.

Well I have a male Sheperd, so I just can't agree with you on your first statement, but female alien love ftw!

At the end of the day you like whoever it is you like for your Shep's no# 1 love, me you already know Liara takes the cake, so we just have to enjoy the game our own way and have fun given that we werent forced into one way or the other. That is what makes this game great!

[TheodoricFriede]

To clarify, when i said "female alien love interests" i meant alien love interests who are female. But yes, the great thing about mass effect is that regardless of another opinion, whoever you want your Shepard to love is your choice and yours only. So long as no one is left out in the next game, we all win.

[DigitalMaster37]

TheodoricFriede wrote...

To clarify, when i said "female alien love interests" i meant alien love interests who are female. But yes, the great thing about mass effect is that regardless of another opinion, whoever you want your Shepard to love is your choice and yours only. So long as no one is left out in the next game, we all win.

I totally agree! now that is how fellow gamers get along without necessarily agreeing on everything. Kudos to you sir!

Modifié par Deltaboy37-1, 13 septembre 2010 - 02:58 .

[Moondoggie]

I wouldn't know much about the old polls or what happened to the Tali thread only joined the board recently through finding it from my DA profile (started playing DA much after ME 2) But i can guess that some sort of OTT Tali flame war happened that the Moderators got sick of so banned it.



I guess the change in results has as been said a lot to do with LotSB. Fresh material always catches more interest plus Liara opened up in it which she really didn't in ME 2 before that so it bought opinions of how well her character was written down and they have now risen because people discovered the things they enjoyed about romancing her in the first game again. She gets some well written dialogue in her romances. It's the same in my case for Tali if you asked me 1-10 on my like for Tali in ME i would have probably said 5 but in ME 2 it's a lot higher because i felt she was much better written and that seems to have more to do with popularity than anything else. The lowest Morinth and Jacob seem to have the least interesting dialogue in the game. Though opinions on that do vary the major results seem to show it.

[StefanBW]

Am I the only one who didn't give a 10/10 to anyone?

I'll admit that I gave Morinth a 1/10 and have never used her once, but since I denied her offer like a dozen times now I think she deserves a 1 regardless.

[Moondoggie]

stefanbw wrote...

Am I the only one who didn't give a 10/10 to anyone?

I'll admit that I gave Morinth a 1/10 and have never used her once, but since I denied her offer like a dozen times now I think she deserves a 1 regardless.

It's kinda funny to turn on Samara and see her look of shock before Morinth kills her though XD

Modifié par Moondoggie, 13 septembre 2010 - 10:51 .

[Tyrium]

TheodoricFriede wrote...

For the record, my opinion of Liara skyrocketed with the release of Lair of the Shadowbroker, so her scoring high isnt a shock to me, but theres no way a character can go from (a very conservative estimate of) number 3 to number 7 in an accurate vote. It just doesnt happen.

Yes, yes it can. One need only look to the recent Australian election for an example ... It's not often, but public opinion can change very drastically very fast.

Of course, The Tali fans probably aren't visiting so much, as stated before, and LOTSB certainly improved people's perceptions of Liara - for me she went from annoying whiny in ME1 -> annoying in ME2 -> awesome in LOTSB

Modifié par Tyrium, 14 septembre 2010 - 03:07 .

[PrinceLionheart]

stefanbw wrote...

Am I the only one who didn't give a 10/10 to anyone?

I'll admit that I gave Morinth a 1/10 and have never used her once, but since I denied her offer like a dozen times now I think she deserves a 1 regardless.

Honestly speaking, i don't see any character deserving 10s or 1s. Hell, most time I see people complain about Jacob it's normally "Well he's not that bad, he's just boring" yet he's pretty much filled with ones just like Morinth. 

I believe I voted Morinth the lowest as well, but I gave her a 4 because she at least had some interesting aspects to her even if I hated the things she did.