1503 réponses à ce sujet

[Archereon]

The problem here is that if it's ever revealed what the true religion is in Dragon Age, its almost certain that Christia-err the Adrastian Chantry will be wholly, or at least mostly correct. That's a simple fact of marketing, there's less fanatic atheists and non-Christians in Bioware's target audience (Largely Canadian and American) than fanatic Christians (or children of those fanatics), and therefore much less possibility for backlash if they declare an obvious Christianity analogue to be the truth.

To clarify: I know of quite a few people who would start a near literal crusade against Dragon Age 2 if it (in their minds) implied that their religion was a load of crap by showing its fictional analogue to be false.  Several of those people have kids ages 15-17, still minors, but likely enough to be playing games like DA.

Modifié par Archereon, 20 septembre 2010 - 03:12 .

[Archereon]

MariSkep wrote...

Archereon wrote...

The problem here is that if it's ever revealed what the true religion is in Dragon Age, its almost certain that Christia-err the Adrastian Chantry will be wholly, or at least mostly correct. That's a simple fact of marketing, there's less fanatic atheists and non-Christians in Bioware's target audience (Largely Canadian and American) than fanatic Christians (or children of those fanatics), and therefore much less possibility for backlash if they declare an obvious Christianity analogue to be the truth.

I don't care what the 'true' religion is. It's not going to change how unjust and incompetent the Chantry is and it certainly isn't going to change my sense of right and wrong. Morality given by some bearded white guy atop a cloud palace is no more 'true' to me than anything else people can come up with.

Another added problem is that the same people tend to make a big deal and cry religious prejudice if ANYTHING negative is implied or said about their religion.  They're only willing to tolerate stuff like Dragon Age because they're not crazy...Well, not crazy enough to deny the historical wrongdoings of the Catholic church that the Chantry is modeled.
 

[ErichHartmann]

Burning the Chantry to the ground would destroy order and allow an even more oppressive group to step in.  That's how it works in an enviroment like Thedas.  Might makes right.  The question is who do you perceive as the bigger threat to external and internal security.  The Chantry is certainly not trying to emulate the Qunari's extreme views on social order.  Their actual control is questionable considering we could defy them in DAO.  So reform with an appropriate amount of force is preferable to outright destruction.  Unless there is no alternative or compromise. /rambling post  

[Archereon]

MariSkep wrote...

Archereon wrote...
To clarify: I know of quite a few people who would start a near literal crusade against Dragon Age 2 if it (in their minds) implied that their religion was a load of crap by showing its fictional analogue to be false.  Several of those people have kids ages 15-17, still minors, but likely enough to be playing games like DA.

Not sure how many people follow Final Fantasy but they've done just that in at least two of their games FFX and FF Tactics. Especially with FF Tactics. You could pretty much substitute Jesus for Ajora and Christianity for Church of Glabados and not change a bit of the games lore.

Meh, Japan can get away with that kind of stuff because the Japanese are largely atheists.  In America, or at least where I live, people tend to call BLASPHEMY as soon as you make any statement about their religion that is even mildly negative and isn't based on irrefutable history.

[Riona45]

Archereon wrote...

The problem here is that if it's ever revealed what the true religion is in Dragon Age, its almost certain that Christia-err the Adrastian Chantry will be wholly, or at least mostly correct. That's a simple fact of marketing, there's less fanatic atheists and non-Christians in Bioware's target audience (Largely Canadian and American) than fanatic Christians (or children of those fanatics), and therefore much less possibility for backlash if they declare an obvious Christianity analogue to be the truth.

I don't think BioWare cares about Moral Guardians as much as you seem to think.  After all DA:O allows PCs of either gender to pursue a gay romance. 

[Archereon]

Riona45 wrote...

Archereon wrote...

The problem here is that if it's ever revealed what the true religion is in Dragon Age, its almost certain that Christia-err the Adrastian Chantry will be wholly, or at least mostly correct. That's a simple fact of marketing, there's less fanatic atheists and non-Christians in Bioware's target audience (Largely Canadian and American) than fanatic Christians (or children of those fanatics), and therefore much less possibility for backlash if they declare an obvious Christianity analogue to be the truth.

I don't think BioWare cares about Moral Guardians as much as you seem to think.  After all DA:O allows PCs of either gender to pursue a gay romance. 

When dealing with such a sensitive topic as religion, its best not to risk going to far and giving those moral guardians a preface that might actually be defendable enough to put a dent in your sales.

[Riona45]

Archereon wrote...
When dealing with such a sensitive topic as religion, its best not to risk going to far and giving those moral guardians a preface that might actually be defendable enough to put a dent in your sales.

Uhh, we're talking about a game that already features many elements (and "sensitive topics") that said Moral Guardians would probably draw the line at.  I don't think they make up a sizable portion of DA customers. 

Modifié par Riona45, 20 septembre 2010 - 03:26 .

[Archereon]

MariSkep wrote...

Archereon wrote...
Meh, Japan can get away with that kind of stuff because the Japanese are largely atheists.  In America, or at least where I live, people tend to call BLASPHEMY as soon as you make any statement about their religion that is even mildly negative and isn't based on irrefutable history.

Yeah but I don't remember any real issues here stateside. And considering just how negatively both FFX and Tcatics portrayed the religions of their world (in Tactics not only do the call BS they make 'Jesus' actually the dragon age equivalent of Uldred.) I'd have expected something.

Maybe its because the moral guardians would never think to examine a game that hasn't received the dreaded "M" rating?  (seriously, has Jack Thompson or any of those other media hounds gone on a crusade against a game that wasn't rated mature?  Its like the think anything not rated M is all rainbows and sunshine and good Christian morals )

[Archereon]

Riona45 wrote...

Archereon wrote...
When dealing with such a sensitive topic as religion, its best not to risk going to far and giving those moral guardians a preface that might actually be defendable enough to put a dent in your sales.

Uhh, we're talking about a game that already features many elements (and "sensitive topics") that said Moral Guardians would probably draw the line at.  I don't think they make up a sizable portion of DA customers. 

You'd be surprised how many people Fox News and their like (basically the mouthpiece for moral guardians whenever it comes to video games) hold sway over in these parts.  Its like they think the "big guy on the news" can't be wrong and is the literal voice of God?

Okay, I'm sorry, that's going a bit far.  Maybe its because I'm one of the only non-Christians in a town deep in the bible belt?  

[Archereon]

MariSkep wrote...

Archereon wrote...

MariSkep wrote...

Archereon wrote...
Meh, Japan can get away with that kind of stuff because the Japanese are largely atheists.  In America, or at least where I live, people tend to call BLASPHEMY as soon as you make any statement about their religion that is even mildly negative and isn't based on irrefutable history.

Yeah but I don't remember any real issues here stateside. And considering just how negatively both FFX and Tcatics portrayed the religions of their world (in Tactics not only do the call BS they make 'Jesus' actually the dragon age equivalent of Uldred.) I'd have expected something.

Maybe its because the moral guardians would never think to examine a game that hasn't received the dreaded "M" rating?  (seriously, has Jack Thompson or any of those other media hounds gone on a crusade against a game that wasn't rated mature?  Its like the think anything not rated M is all rainbows and sunshine and good Christian morals )

Then maybe we should label all future games T. Nothing in Origins that wasn't in the old FF games I used to play except for character initiated sex. We had rape, assualt, murder, genocide. Of course it was very poorly rendered in those days. Maybe that's it.

Hear that developers? Down grade your graphics and you can put whatever you like in your videogames. The freedom's worth it.

Probably not.  I'm just sort of worried what kind of reaction people like most of my neighbors will have to what they'll most likely perceive as an allegorical insult towards their belief system.

[Riona45]

Archereon wrote...


Probably not.  I'm just sort of worried what kind of reaction people like most of my neighbors will have to what they'll most likely perceive as an allegorical insult towards their belief system.

Why?  I don't think the developers ever declared that they would reveal the true nature of the Maker (and whether or not he exists) in DA2.

Modifié par Riona45, 20 septembre 2010 - 03:39 .

[Morroian]

EmperorSahlertz wrote...

Yep. As I recall I didn't even once open my mind a tiny bit and let go of my ant-mage bias. And as i recall, most (if not all) pro-mage did the exact opposite and refused to see it from a non-mage viewpoint, or at least agree.

Actually I reckon we did. Not many on the mages side have said there shouldn't be some form of control, we've just been debating what form that control should take.

[Archereon]

Riona45 wrote...

Archereon wrote...


Probably not.  I'm just sort of worried what kind of reaction people like most of my neighbors will have to what they'll most likely perceive as an allegorical insult towards their belief system.

Why?  I don't think the developers ever declared that they would reveal the true nature of the Maker (and whether or not he exists) in DA2.

God (hehe, pun) I hope they don't.  The sheer amount of whining and rants that would result would make this board uninhabitable FOREVER, and might even be powerful enough to get some media backlash going.

[DMC12]

Riona45 wrote...

Archereon wrote...


Probably not.  I'm just sort of worried what kind of reaction people like most of my neighbors will have to what they'll most likely perceive as an allegorical insult towards their belief system.

Why?  I don't think the developers ever declared that they would reveal the true nature of the Maker (and whether or not he exists) in DA2.

I'm fairly certain that the Maker exists, given all the crazy crap going on in the DA world, but I agree that his intentions should be left in the dark.

As for the Chantry, what I would really like to do is somehow put someone in charge of it that my character can control. Like maybe an Alistair type person. That way you'll be able to control the masses of people as a shadowy dictator.

[Everwarden]

Well, there is likely a deity in Thedas, but I don't think we will ever get any insight on his intentions, thoughts, or motivation. Which is for the best, really, I don't want it confirmed or denied.



The people who said the Christians would go on an angry rampage were right, I can almost see Glenn Beck scribbling frantically on that chalk board of his about how Dragon Age 2 will lead your children to sex, rap music, drugs, and a refusal to go to church. 

[ShrinkingFish]

If the overzealous Templars give my apostate sister a hard time... better know I'm going to be slitting some uppety Templar throats.



Noone messes with the family.

[Razored1313]

what i would do is not eliminate the chantry, but "shake the foundation", get some of their dirty little secrets public, some people will begin to question their methods and when the inevitable backlash truly begins, they will either fight against a nation or take the sticks out of their arses

[DMC12]

MariSkep wrote...

Everwarden wrote...

Well, there is likely a deity in Thedas, but I don't think we will ever get any insight on his intentions, thoughts, or motivation. Which is for the best, really, I don't want it confirmed or denied.

I agree with you but I wish it weren't the case. Western fantasy sure does love itself some pointless gods. Even when they have no real bearing on the story or development of the world. Still gotta have them.

They do have a bearing on the story and developement, and a pretty large one too. The Maker, Old Gods, Dalish gods, etc...