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[Someone With Mass]

NuclearBuddha wrote...
About how it wasn't so far from there that they met for the first time.

Oh, I thought you meant her comment from ME1.

I like how the tone in her voice is a little teasing when she says "interesting"

[NuclearBuddha]

FieryPhoenix7 wrote...
To be honest, topics like that almost never end well. I could compile an infinite list of reasons, but I'm sure you know what I'm getting at.

With that particular poll, the key word was "development". Ironically enough, there were people who simply took it all to mean your own personal favorite romance, hence the flame war.

You almost have to start by disqualifying the new ME2 characters, but that's definitely not going to sit well with some.  After all, it's a common argument (valid or not) that ME1 romances went too fast.

Then there's the matter of what counts as material, since some appeared to be saying that you couldn't count Tali's ME1 dialogue, or anything outside the romance conversations.

Edit:  the poll in question.

Modifié par NuclearBuddha, 21 septembre 2010 - 08:14 .

[NuclearBuddha]

Someone With Mass wrote...
I like how the tone in her voice is a little teasing when she says "interesting"

It's right up there with "definitely" or "I promise."

[Nilfalasiel]

Mesina2 wrote...

Why?
What if you didn't do any romance in previous games?
Or to start romance with someone from ME2 in ME3? Like Samara?

I think this is a good point...After all, if you didn't romance anybody, the ME2 people, at least, might still be interested. Especially Tali. If you haven't rejected her, that goes without saying, but why would you do that?  But since I don't think they should introduce any new characters in ME3, that would mean no brand new romance options. Of course, they might very well make all the previous squaddies cameos and introduce new people for novelty's sake, which would mean potentially new romances. I wouldn't like this to happen, but it probably could.

As an aside, I'm a bit conflicted about Samara...on the one hand, I think the way the "romance" is done now is surprisingly moving, and having her actually be romanceable would probably hurt that, as well as her character. On the other hand, she's the only asari I'd ever consider romancing, if it were possible.

NuclearBuddha wrote...

it's a common argument (valid or not) that ME1 romances went too fast.

If the ME1 romances went too fast, then the ME2 ones went at the speed of light...Much as I prefer the ME2 romance options, the actual pacing of the romances was just "*whooooosh!* what, that's it?"

Modifié par Nilfalasiel, 21 septembre 2010 - 08:21 .

[Eldareus]

NuclearBuddha wrote...

I'd disagree.  She's got some daddy issues, but that's hardly an indictment of her character.  Family is important, and she craved his approval.

Her daddy issues actually strengthened her as a character. She push herself  in an effort  get an emotional response from a Man incapable of providing one. Contrast that to Miranda obsession with her father and self worth issues. So I still think Tali handle her daddy issues adequately enough not to have them interfere with her life.

Modifié par Eldareus, 21 septembre 2010 - 08:21 .

[NuclearBuddha]

Nilfalasiel wrote...

NuclearBuddha wrote...
it's a common argument (valid or not) that ME1 romances went too fast.

If the ME1 romances went too fast, then the ME2 ones went at the speed of light...Much as I prefer the ME2 romance options, the actual pacing of the romances was just "*whooooosh!* what, that's it?"

While I do like some of them in theory, I'd have to agree that the ME2-only ones do go pretty quickly (again, depending on the material you consider.  I'd argue that Tali, Garrus, Liara, even Ash and Kai are better developed than any of the ME2-only options.  Ash/Kai just for the ability to read into what's behind their reaction on Horizon).  On the other hand, it can feel like you get more from the ME2 ones simply because the game is so character-focused.

[Someone With Mass]

mrsph wrote...

The Tali and Garrus romances are great because those two were already established characters and it actually forced Bioware to write the romances for them. And not write the character for the romance which they usually tend to do (and it always hurts that character's development)

In that way, I'm glad that they didn't make Tali a romance option in ME1. Gave her character a chance to build a good foundation first.

[Eldareus]

All romances in the game basically began with Shepard saying I'm interested in you. Once you made that choice on the ol selecto wheel the romance would continue onward. You could lead several of them on at the same time up to a point. I really didn't see much differences with any of the romances and all of them followed the same formula. I liked Tali the most out of all the LI characters Bioware present to me as a player. Simple as that.

[Nilfalasiel]

NuclearBuddha wrote...

While I do like some of them in theory, I'd have to agree that the ME2-only ones do go pretty quickly (again, depending on the material you consider.  I'd argue that Tali, Garrus, Liara, even Ash and Kai are better developed than any of the ME2-only options.  Ash/Kai just for the ability to read into what's behind their reaction on Horizon).  On the other hand, it can feel like you get more from the ME2 ones simply because the game is so character-focused.

I dunno, I started out my ThaneShep playthrough genuinely interested in his romance, because I'd heard so many good things about it. But now, I've got it locked in, with only the Omega 4 scene to go (still have to do the Derelict Reaper 'n stuff), and...I have to admit I'm disappointed. Considering his emotional baggage, the romance is almost pedestrian. Matter-of-fact, if you will. It makes my Shepard feel...old  Not sure what I expected, since Thane is a pretty tame guy, emotion-wise, but it would've been a lot more satisfying with more convos. I know the Omega 4 scene is more emotional, and I know about the heart-wrenching LotSB letter, but if I remove that, the rest of the content is rather threadbare. I can only imagine how much more rushed the Jack romance must seem, since she's got a LOT more issues than Thane.

Tali and Garrus don't have this problem (or, at least, not as much as the ME2-only people), because they already had a basis for the relationship in ME1, Tali even more so with the ME2 retcon that she was always attracted to Shepard. But even so, they could only have benefited from more dialogue and more interaction. If you only look at what's in ME2, it's pretty much:

"I like you"
"Orly?!"
"Yeah, let's do it."
"Yay!...But, are you sure of this?"
"Yeah, I'm sure."
"100%?"
"Yeah."

And then Omega 4...

Modifié par Nilfalasiel, 21 septembre 2010 - 08:48 .

[NuclearBuddha]

Nilfalasiel wrote...
Tali and Garrus don't have this problem (or, at least, not as much as the ME2-only people), because they already had a basis for the relationship in ME1, Tali even more so with the ME2 retcon that she was always attracted to Shepard. But even so, they could only have benefited from more dialogue and more interaction.

"Awestruck" isn't necessarily "attracted to."  It's a matter of interpretation.

[Volrath937]

NuclearBuddha wrote...

Nilfalasiel wrote...
Tali and Garrus don't have this problem (or, at least, not as much as the ME2-only people), because they already had a basis for the relationship in ME1, Tali even more so with the ME2 retcon that she was always attracted to Shepard. But even so, they could only have benefited from more dialogue and more interaction.

"Awestruck" isn't necessarily "attracted to."  It's a matter of interpretation.

She definitely felt something for Shepard in ME1, even if it was just a little crush. It probably didn't bloom until ME2, when it still took her having a fever to get it out of her.

Modifié par Volrath937, 21 septembre 2010 - 08:57 .

[NuclearBuddha]

Volrath937 wrote...
She definitely felt something for Shepard in ME1, maybe just a little crush. It probably didn't bloom until ME2, when it still took her having a fever to get it out of her.

Sure.  Hero worship or whatever; she says as much (the "dashing captain" convo).  But it was always her intent to return home from pilgrimage.

[Nilfalasiel]

NuclearBuddha wrote...

Volrath937 wrote...
She definitely felt something for Shepard in ME1, maybe just a little crush. It probably didn't bloom until ME2, when it still took her having a fever to get it out of her.

Sure.  Hero worship or whatever; she says as much (the "dashing captain" convo).  But it was always her intent to return home from pilgrimage.

Oh, that's a given. But I'm not sure why her being attracted to Shepard would prevent her from completing her Pilgrimage...Especially since he wasn't displaying any interest in return.

[Someone With Mass]

Well, she never expected anything good to come out of her little crush on Shepard until he made a move in ME2.

[Adhin]

I personally think Jack's is the best paced. Mostly because its easier to pretend every conversation with her, outside of blowing up the base, is Shepard trying to get her to let down some walls. I think the biggest issue if you look at just ME2 romances, Tali's included is that they all got conversation stuff up to there Loyalty mission (usually only 1-2 conversations, some have 3, maybe 4...think jack has 3) but these tend to be more encyclopedia oriented like Tali stuff in ME1.

Other then Jack, anyways who's mostly Shepard trying to bludgeon his way through the walls. Tali's is all just quarian history time... which isn't bad, mind you I still like that stuff. It's just often times a bit less personal then some of the others. Though a lot less of that in ME2 on her end then ME1, ME1 was like 90% history channel, quarian week.

Either way then you get to the romance on ANY of them and you get 2 conversations after you've said you want it, 3rd one is the repeat 'ARE YOU STILL SURE?' With your 3 responses, 1 of which is the yes the other 2 are 'nope, and not a chance'.  Which is kind of sad, I personally hope they put more into it with ME3. But I figure they wont be doing loyalty missions in ME3, more like ME1 in that area so all the character dialog will hopefully go into ship-time conversations. And Squad-back and forths elsewhere, LotSB back and forth stuff with Liara/Shep was priceless, want more.

Modifié par Adhin, 21 septembre 2010 - 09:44 .

[Water Dumple]

Adhin wrote...

I personally think Jack's is the best paced. Mostly because its easier to pretend every conversation with her, outside of blowing up the base, is Shepard trying to get her to let down some walls. I think the biggest issue if you look at just ME2 romances, Tali's included is that they all got conversation stuff up to there Loyalty mission (usually only 1-2 conversations, some have 3, maybe 4...think jack has 3) but these tend to be more encyclopedia oriented like Tali stuff in ME1.
Other then Jack, anyways who's mostly Shepard trying to bludgeon his way through the walls. Tali's is all just quarian history time... which isn't bad, mind you I still like that stuff. It's just often times a bit less personal then some of the others. Though a lot less of that in ME2 on her end then ME1, ME1 was like 90% history channel, quarian week.
Either way then you get to the romance on ANY of them and you get 2 conversations after you've said you want it, 3rd one is the repeat 'ARE YOU STILL SURE?' With your 3 responses, 1 of which is the yes the other 2 are 'nope, and not a chance'. Which is kind of sad, I personally hope they put more into it with ME3. But I figure they wont be doing loyalty missions in ME3, more like ME1 in that area so all the character dialog will hopefully go into ship-time conversations. And Squad-back and forths elsewhere, LotSB back and forth stuff with Liara/Shep was priceless, want more.

Definitely want to see more Dragon Age-style squadmate banter. The best ME1 could come up with was two elevators, and ME2 didn't even try to recover it. The numbered approval system could work as well, putting characters on more of a Renegade/Neutral/Paragon scale. It also adds a different style to the romances which makes more sense--Tali's had a good buildup, but when you get down to the mechanics, it's easy to see "this is normal convo," "this is romance convo #2," etc.

[Adhin]

Yeah no real path or branching to any of it. It would also be nice if they brought back some of the KotOR stuff back. That game had a TON of just random crap pop up when you got back to your ship, you know? Kinda like they had conversations randomly pop up in BG2. Added more life/flavor to the world in general then the bizar staticness of ME stuff. Though they did try to do a little bit of it in ME1 and ME2. ME1 had the romance oriented Ash/kaiden vs liara thing where you had to pick. ME2 had the Tali/Legion and Miranda/Jack but they where all very specific for when they showed up. Basically you did the 2 chars loyalty mission and... that was it. It wasn't random, it wasn't based off some kind of favor like in DA. All felt to obvious I guess, they need to mask that better.

Anyways I can see why ME2 is the way it is, hard to get around it with how it was setup. ME1 had more of a movie-flow to it because you got all your squadies immediately, there was more room for that. ME2 you can't really account for the order you'll get folks in or if they'll all be in the room on any given mission thing so that's why the end-mission stuffs so damn empty feeling.

Just looking forward to more stuff with Tali either way, hopefully 1 massive story mission involves the quarian's in a multi-part scenario thing.

[Gust4v]

I suppose this is relevant.

[Someone With Mass]

I'd love more interaction between teammates in general. It's like almost everyone exists in their own little world.

[NuclearBuddha]

“I thought he was full of it,” Jack went on with relish. From the corner of her eye she could see the alien had stopped and was watching her. “But along comes Shepard, and boom! No more Purgatory. Came close to beating my record for guards killed in a single prison stay. Hear he shot that ****** of a warden right in the mandibles, too.”

Silence filled the hole after Jack punctuated the story with a nasty chuckle. Flames rose around her, their crackling accompanied by the zip of bullets and the shrill blat of decompression alarms. Blue Suns guards were tossed like toys, fetching up against bulkheads before sliding down, broken.

“It’s good you’ll have a chance to see the other side of him, then,” Tali replied simply.

---

Hole

[Spartanburger]

It would be interesting to see team members walk around the ship on some kind of schedule... Like, every now and then they go to mess so they can... you know... eat... so they don't starve...