16775 réponses à ce sujet

[Collider]

I don't think Tali would accept Shepard siding with the geth.

[Weiser_Cain]

Arcian wrote...

I have a question for you hardcore Tali fans:

Now that we know that we will have to make some kind of choice between the quarians and the geth, which choice would you make? Postulate that Tali won't leave your side, won't stop being your LI and won't feel any longterm resentment if you choose the geth. Would you still pick the quarians?

I destroy the Geth. An easy choice really. The Geth are an accident, if there was going to be a AI race I'd want it to be better designed that the Geth, who are like a million idiots running SETI@home.

[man giraffedog000]

I've come to warn you about MAN-GIRAFFE-DOG!! It's the single greatest threat to humanity!! RUN AWAY!!



I'm still more Serial than ever guys.

[CroGamer002]

Arcian wrote...

I have a question for you hardcore Tali fans:

Now that we know that we will have to make some kind of choice between the quarians and the geth, which choice would you make? Postulate that Tali won't leave your side, won't stop being your LI and won't feel any longterm resentment if you choose the geth. Would you still pick the quarians?

I'm not hardcore Tali fan but geez,. I would have difficult time to decide that even if it won't effect both Tali's and Legion's relationship with Shepard.

[What?]

Tali's definitely one of my favorite ME characters, but not for her appearance or romance (though I did enjoy both, don't get me wrong). Always been a fan of the techheads in science fiction, the go-fix-its and hackers that spend their time rummaging through pipes and the engines of starships, or sifting through databank after databank for some sweet little info-nugget.

She reminds me a lot of a less messed-up--and friendlier--Case from Neuromancer. Or a smarter, more experienced Bobby from Count Zero.

Modifié par VictorianTrash, 29 avril 2011 - 12:01 .

[MadMapper]

I'd choose the quarians. Geth are machines, not organic living beings, and they cannot "really die".

[CroGamer002]

Arcian wrote...

Weiser_Cain wrote...

I destroy the Geth. An easy choice really. The Geth are an accident

Calling the geth an accident for being created is like saying your children are accidents for being born. Trying to kill the geth for questioning their own existence is like killing your own children for not thinking in a way that you like or prefer.

It doesn't matter if the creation of the geth was right or wrong - they exist, and that gives them the right to exist. The quarians of old rather saw the geth destroyed than face the prospect of having to set them free, and the quarians paid the price for that choice. Those who try to oppose the existence of another race, especially their own creations, are the ones that deserve to be unmade, and that is why I will side with the geth.

+1

[darknoon5]

Arcian wrote...

Weiser_Cain wrote...

I destroy the Geth. An easy choice really. The Geth are an accident

Calling the geth an accident for being created is like saying your children are accidents for being born. Trying to kill the geth for questioning their own existence is like killing your own children for not thinking in a way that you like or prefer.

It doesn't matter if the creation of the geth was right or wrong - they exist, and that gives them the right to exist. The quarians of old rather saw the geth destroyed than face the prospect of having to set them free, and the quarians paid the price for that choice. Those who try to oppose the existence of another race, especially their own creations, are the ones that deserve to be unmade, and that is why I will side with the geth.

BUT GETH AREN'T ALIVE THEY'RE MACHINES AND TALI DOESN'T LIKE THEM!!!!

Seriously, that and "the Quarians made them so they have the right to do what they want with them" seems to be the only few arguements on these forums for commiting genoicde.

[GodWood]

darknoon5 wrote...
BUT GETH AREN'T ALIVE THEY'RE MACHINES AND TALI DOESN'T LIKE THEM!!!!

Seriously, that and "the Quarians made them so they have the right to do what they want with them" seems to be the only few arguements on these forums for commiting genoicde.

What about "They murdered billions of innocent quarians and should be held accountable for their actions"?

[NuclearBuddha]

As the situation stands right now, without any further information, I'd have to pick the quarians. And basically it would be bias for organics on my part. The idea of condemning innocent organic infants and children doesn't sit well with me. Well, sits less well with me than deleting programs, even sentient ones.

[AdmiralCheez]

GodWood wrote...

What about "They murdered billions of innocent quarians and should be held accountable for their actions"?

So did the turians, krogan, salarians, hell--for awhile there humanity was determined to wipe itself out!

The Morning War was cruel and unnecessary, for both sides.  But it's been 300 years.  At least the geth have let it go and are only interested in self-preservation; the quarians are just carrying an ancestral grudge.

I love the quarians, but seriously--they need to let it go and move on.  This obsession with the past is what keeps them locked up in their flotilla.

[Alienmorph]

GodWood wrote...

darknoon5 wrote...
BUT GETH AREN'T ALIVE THEY'RE MACHINES AND TALI DOESN'T LIKE THEM!!!!

Seriously, that and "the Quarians made them so they have the right to do what they want with them" seems to be the only few arguements on these forums for commiting genoicde.

What about "They murdered billions of innocent quarians and should be held accountable for their actions"?

From Geths' PoV it was a struggle for survival, but also, being the Geths esentially immortal and considering that they share they memories with eachother, while the quarians who wanted to extreminate/enslave the geths are all dead generations ago, we're still dealing with the same geths who fought in the Morning War. So well, the distrust for the geths is at least understandable, but as Zaal'Koris said Geths and Quarians did terrible things to eachother, it's time to move on and not to feed ulteriously the old grudges.

Modifié par Alienmorph, 29 avril 2011 - 01:52 .

[Someone With Mass]

I really wonder how Tali will react when she sees that Rannoch is one big junkyard with lots of sand.

[AdmiralCheez]

Arcian wrote...

Someone With Mass wrote...

I really wonder how Tali will react when she sees that Rannoch is one big junkyard with lots of sand.

Shepard: "Yyyyyeah, I can't see your father ever building a house here."
Tali: *sadface.jpg*

Holy Land Syndrome.

Anyway, to show there's no hate for y'all, have some Tali:



She is always my escort.  Figured that drone of hers provides a good distraction while the crew sneaks back aboard the Normandy.  Plus, safely getting everyone back to the ship alive provides good closure for her after what happened on Freedom's Progress and Haestrom.

Modifié par AdmiralCheez, 29 avril 2011 - 02:04 .

[Alienmorph]

Someone With Mass wrote...

I really wonder how Tali will react when she sees that Rannoch is one big junkyard with lots of sand.

Didn't the Geth cleaned the whole planet? About the desert we'll see. The few plants on the Rayya seemed to point to a prehistoric-like kind of environment more than just an Ancient Egypt in space. I hope the designer won't do something that obvious.

Modifié par Alienmorph, 29 avril 2011 - 02:04 .

[GodWood]

Alienmorph wrote...

GodWood wrote...

darknoon5 wrote...
BUT GETH AREN'T ALIVE THEY'RE MACHINES AND TALI DOESN'T LIKE THEM!!!!

Seriously, that and "the Quarians made them so they have the right to do what they want with them" seems to be the only few arguements on these forums for commiting genoicde.

What about "They murdered billions of innocent quarians and should be held accountable for their actions"?

From Geths' PoV it was a struggle for survival

A struggle for survival would be the geth defending themselves against their attackers.

Which they did.

But than they proceeded to hunt down and murder the billions of innocent men, women and children who had little to no involvement in the war.

but also, being the Geths esentially immortal and considering that they share they memories with eachother, while the quarians who wanted to extreminate/enslave the geths are all dead generations ago, we're still dealing with the same geths who fought in the Morning War.

And this is basically how I see it.
The geth we have today are the same geth that comitted genocide against the quarians 300 years ago and thus should be punished for the massive war-crime they comitted.

[darknoon5]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

GodWood wrote...

What about "They murdered billions of innocent quarians and should be held accountable for their actions"?

So did the turians, krogan, salarians, hell--for awhile there humanity was determined to wipe itself out!

The Morning War was cruel and unnecessary, for both sides.  But it's been 300 years.  At least the geth have let it go and are only interested in self-preservation; the quarians are just carrying an ancestral grudge.

I love the quarians, but seriously--they need to let it go and move on.  This obsession with the past is what keeps them locked up in their flotilla.

This.

Besides, "be held accountable" and "completely wiped out/enslaved" are two completely seperate things.
It's untrue to say the Geth only fought in self-defence, but the conflict started because the Quarians tried to wipe out a sentient race, and the Geth fought to survive. Sure, they wiped out billions of Quarians, and yes, it wasn't right, but that was a long time ago. In the same way I don't hold Tali responsible for what her ancestors did, I don't hold every Geth responsible for the actions of few. New programs have surely been made since then. The geth were a less advanced form of life with basic sentience that thought in mathematics. Wiping out as many Quarians as possible seemed like the logical decision.

The geth have advanced since then. Legion reveals the geth seem to feel some sort of regret over the morning war and their actionsduring it, and they are open to peace with the Quarians, and would likely give them Rannoch back if they didn't, as Legion says, attack 100% of the time they thought they could achieve victory. Besides Qwib Qwib, every other Quarian seems to think they were entirely justified in wiping out the geth. Including Tali. (Which is annoying, because that's one of the few things I don't like about her)

Just want to put things in perspective.

Modifié par darknoon5, 29 avril 2011 - 02:11 .

[Someone With Mass]

Alienmorph wrote...

Didn't the Geth cleaned the whole planet? About the desert we'll see. The few plants on the Rayya seemed to point to a prehistoric-like kind of environment more than just an Ancient Egypt in space. I hope the designer won't do something that obvious.

According to the Swedish magazine LEVEL, it's littered with metal debris and junk.

[Alienmorph]

@ GodWood

They were a newborn race at the time. I'd prefer that quarians simply can have back their territories, instead a continuing to rage uselessly on the geths. The point is that the geths are still the same, but they had 300 to improve themselves and understand what they did, it's time they accept their responsability and let the quarians return.

Modifié par Alienmorph, 29 avril 2011 - 02:13 .

[Alienmorph]

AdmiralCheez wrote...
She is always my escort.  Figured that drone of hers provides a good distraction while the crew sneaks back aboard the Normandy. 
Plus, safely getting everyone back to the ship alive provides good
closure for her after what happened on Freedom's Progress and Haestrom.

Talking
of a non-romanced Tali (so with no extra reasons for being willingly to
stand with Shepard 'till the end) it makes a lot of sense. A chance
to redeem herself saving the Normandy's crew when she wasn't able to do
the same with her previous teams... nice thought.

Someone With Mass wrote...

Alienmorph wrote...

Didn't the Geth cleaned the whole planet? About the desert we'll see. The few plants on the Rayya seemed to point to a prehistoric-like kind of environment more than just an Ancient Egypt in space. I hope the designer won't do something that obvious.

According to the Swedish magazine LEVEL, it's littered with metal debris and junk.

Aww... please not a Terminator-like scenario...

Modifié par Alienmorph, 29 avril 2011 - 02:16 .

[CroGamer002]

AdmiralCheez wrote...

GodWood wrote...

What about "They murdered billions of innocent quarians and should be held accountable for their actions"?

So did the turians, krogan, salarians, hell--for awhile there humanity was determined to wipe itself out!

The Morning War was cruel and unnecessary, for both sides.  But it's been 300 years.  At least the geth have let it go and are only interested in self-preservation; the quarians are just carrying an ancestral grudge.

I love the quarians, but seriously--they need to let it go and move on.  This obsession with the past is what keeps them locked up in their flotilla.

Considering they lost their homeworld and lost billions of people and can go extinct very easily, I think their grudge even after 300 years is justified.

[GodWood]

darknoon5 wrote...
Sure, they wiped out billions of Quarians, and yes, it wasn't right, but that was a long time ago.

That's hardly a valid justification.
If a man murders 100 people and is never caught is he free of punishment after a certain time-limit too?

In the same way I don't hold Tali responsible for what her ancestors did, I don't hold every Geth responsible for the actions of few.

Tali isn't her ancestors.
Today's geth are the same geth.

The geth have also advanced since then. Legion reveals the geth seem to feel some sort of regret over the morning war and their actions there.

Does feeling guilt for killing billions suddenly free them of punishment?

[Someone With Mass]

Alienmorph wrote...

Aww... please not a Terminator-like scenario...

It's probably just scrap from the Morning War. Even if the magazine described it as "something out of the worst cases of pathological scavengers on American television."

Plus, the sand is still there.