16775 réponses à ce sujet

[Evil_Sarevok]

I can imagine its for the reason I stated, you add everyone as Bi in a game and you can only speak to one character else the rest go ape**** that you've had a conversation with someone else, that and too many variables, they'd have to change the entire romance system, the one in DA was worse for that for reasons again, stated previously.

Besides, I prefer, and I suspect many bar a small 'niche market' prefer that Garrus is your 'male friend' and Tali is your 'female friend', you dont have to have a game where the sole purpose is getting into that character's underwear... or suit. I can imagine if you want something like that you can go find something from Japan, god only knows the stuff that comes from there.

Oh and Goat, what was this about the Witcher for you? I had mine mailed today >.>

Not seen this picture in a while, so, here we are.

Modifié par Evil_Sarevok, 16 mai 2011 - 01:56 .

[Goat_Shepard]

Formis_Sage wrote...
What can I say, I'm a terrible person :innocent:
That doesn't change the fact it's true.
It's either male or female, can't be both (Not in ME's case) and the charater development depends on that.

Only because in one reality the character is heterosexual and different reality is homosexual, you can't immediately assume he/she is bisexual in each of these realities until he/she shows that kind of affection to both genders in each of them.

That requires intense roleplaying. You have to ignore the fact that if you played the game as a different gender, you're not really a different gender as per the game mechanics. That's why I like the linearity of the the ME romances, because having a bromance with Garrus as maleShep, and being able to romance Garrus as femShep, makes a distinction between male and female Shepard, and (I can't believe I'm saying this) I feel more like a woman when I play femShep.

Zall wrote...
Preparing oneself to die sounds pretty much like distress to me...

She's in distress, but she's not standing there trembling like Princess Peach screaming "Oh save me!" as some like to think.

Tali is not the right person to be in command, for she neither radiates authority or confidence during her
times as a leader, nor can I imagine her shouting orders during a battle. As a subordinate, on the other hand, she would be an immense help on account of being a great techincian. Same is with Mordin. Genius doctor, but squishy and not much of a leader, but the thing is - nobody cares about his flaws.

Funny you should say that, because I recently stumbled across these lovely nuggets of information



So Tali can lead in certain situations (just not in intense combat situations as you said, like inflitrating a CB like mah man Garrus can). Praza and his squad were simply so paranoid that they rushed off and got slaughtered by a mech. Even Shepard wouldn't be able to keep his squad in line if they had that mentality.

Evil_Sarevok wrote...
Oh and Goat, what was this about the Witcher for you? I had mine mailed today >.>

Digital download on Steam so I don't get the preload

I agree with your expressed frustration from your post, btw. And nice pic, never seen that mod.

Modifié par Goat_Shepard, 16 mai 2011 - 02:16 .

[Capt_Flashheart]

Collider wrote...

What Kelly says about Tali has no gender pronouns recognizing Shepard's gender so far as I know, so it's not really a matter of being "there" or not. It just doesn't trigger for female Shepard.

Interestingly though, I've just looked and there is some recorded dialog for female Shepard where she tells Kelly that "I've always thought there was some chemistry there" about Tali.

The fact remains that this and any other phantom FemShep dialogue you've mentioned cannot be considered as canonical evidence of Tali being bi. In the unmodded game Kelly says this to ManShep, not FemShep. No gender pronouns are needed to determine that.  Considering this in relation to every other cut dialogue, all in game evidence that Tali is anything but straight is either circumstancial or very open to interpretation. More importantly it is overwhelmingly out numbered by all the canonical evidence confirming Tali is straight (as if the fact that she's unromanceable by FemShep isn't enough).
It is absolutely mind boggling that some people (of which none are regular posters, coincidently) continue to insist that Tali might be bi dispite the lack of evidence for it and all the evidence against it.
With regards to reasons why Tali should not be made into a bi LI, well I'm sure you've read and reread the majority of arguments already.

Zall wrote...

Preparing oneself to die sounds pretty much like distress to me...

May I suggest that you look up the meaning of distress?

@Goat_Shepard
I find myself agreeing a lot with your response to Formis_Sage, just so you know.

Modifié par Capt_Flashheart, 16 mai 2011 - 02:33 .

[Evil_Sarevok]

I think they could easily have made some 'side' DLC for companion characters during those two years you were MIA getting rebuilt, suprised they didnt, even if short some DLCs can be interesting to view, more so if you have less control of the dialogue and can see a character deal with it, you just play as them.

Its like the original one sided conversations you get in Icewind Dale/Baldurs Gate that just tell a story rather than have you choose answers, better for storytelling and if your character's personality is already defined, easier to produce, creates the ability for more single player modes too, sometimes more fun than having to direct a group around all day, that still managed to stick their head over a box when enemies are firing just to get themselves downed... again.

Oh and Steam wise, always overpriced (unless its a year later and on offer), so I bought it from game £25 rather than £30, AND they often get it to be pre-release date, plus its cheaper and I get money off points, so win win. Granted then not every game connects to steam but... self updaters on most games these days that and more content for limited editions, bar the fact that the ME2 CE didnt come with the soundtrack and the digital one did...

[Homebound]

In conclusion,
Tali only pounces MaleShep 100% of the time.

[Formis_Sage]

Goat_Shepard wrote...
That requires intense roleplaying. You have to ignore the fact that if you played the game as a different gender, you're not really a different gender as per the game mechanics. That's why I like the linearity of the the ME romances, because having a bromance with Garrus as maleShep, and being able to romance Garrus as femShep, makes a distinction between male and female Shepard, and (I can't believe I'm saying this) I feel more like a woman when I play femShep.

I know I have high expectations but I just can't ignore the fact the characters are actually not all bisexual only because you can romance them no matter what gender you play for. I'm stubborn and I'm fully aware of it. :innocent:
But it's not important much for this topic so I'll let it be.
I think I'll try femShep when I finish my lastest ME2 playthrough to see the game from different point of view.
And I can finally make my own custom Shepard then. Was never good at creating male characters but will try to make nice femShep.

Goat_Shepard wrote...
Funny you should say that, because I recently stumbled across these lovely nuggets of information

*snip*
So Tali can lead in certain situations (just not in intense combat situations as you said, like inflitrating a CB like mah man Garrus can). Praza and his squad were simply so paranoid that they rushed off and got slaughtered by a mech. Even Shepard wouldn't be able to keep his squad in line if they had that mentality.

Interesting, I never completed those side quests in ME1 but was curious what's the reward. This is better than I expected
And I agree, not everyone is versatile leader like Shep but even Tali would be able to lead a team in certain situation.

Modifié par Formis_Sage, 16 mai 2011 - 02:46 .

[Goat_Shepard]

Capt_Flashheart wrote...

Zall wrote...

Preparing oneself to die sounds pretty much like distress to me...

May I suggest that you look up the meaning of distress?

Hey, apparently I need to look up the meaning, too. You see, Zall, we can't all haz intelligence

@Goat_Shepard
I find myself agreeing a lot with your response to Formis_Sage, just so you know.

Same to you. I find you're eloquence matching with Hellbounds inarticulateness in a lovely union of the same logic

@Sarevok

Man, that's cheap. Especially for such a good game

@Formis

Agreed, I'm going the same after this next ME2 playthrough. A tip for creating females: go for the BIG features.

And yes, I wasn't even aware of and am impressed by the fact of Tali leading recon teams in ME1, Alliance teams at that.

[Pride Demon]

Goat_Shepard wrote...

Hey, apparently I need to look up the meaning, too. You see, Zall, we can't all haz intelligence

Look at the bright side, at least we can all haz Tali...

[Goat_Shepard]

Pride Demon wrote...

Look at the bright side, at least we can all haz Tali...

snp

Clearly we ALL can't. Not sexually, anyway. I find it curious that so many people are just now crawling out of the woodworks to talk about Tali only when there's news she could be made bi. It's unfortunate that so many don't seem to care about Tali unless they can f*ck her (this goes for straight people, too. I'm looking at you, Rune)

Seems aggressive of me to say, and I know people are ready to say "AHH, I DO TOO care about Tali as a friend!". If you do, that's great, but doesn't change the fact that so many showed up, and so many remain here, only because of the romance.

Modifié par Goat_Shepard, 16 mai 2011 - 03:49 .

[Collider]

That's what all of the love interest threads are going through, goat. Except Jacob because his thread always moves slow as molasses. But even they're talking about it too.

[MICHELLE7]

Casey's latest tweet:

Some game sites saying "previously straight chars now available for both m&f chars" not necessarily true. Will have some new LI's in #ME3

[Collider]

Thanks for the info, Michelle7

[ADLegend21]

Goat_Shepard wrote...
Mods =/= canon. You realize you're inadvertently hurting your arguments by trolling, right?

Now You see why people say you can't debate with Tali mancers. you're enforcing a sterotype since you're dismissing my negative assesment of your favorite Character as "trolling" now If I posted that gif of people celebrating with Tali takes a Rocket to the face during the SM then THAT is trolling,
 
I am comparing her to a stronger female characterthan her but you are considering it trolling. also who kills wrex when he's out of line and Shepard can't negotiate with him? Ashley Williams. Where is Ms Zorah during all of this? On the other side of the camp in a tent not even bothering to care about her commanders well being against an obviously enraged Krogan. Ashley protects Shepard, Damsels do not protect people, therefore she cannot be a damsel in distress. I am not expecting Tali to defend Everyone from a geth drop ship, even though Ashley herself has fought against a Geth drop ship in Virmire alone when she's placed with the bomb.

Whatever happens in my game = canon as it is with all the other millions of copies, which has been said by Casey Hudson and content has been made FOR said canon's in LoTSB. Even in said LoTSB where Tali can't hesitate with female Shepard on the romance path, it still shows she masturbates to human porn like a honry school girl as she does in Male shep playthroughs. It's plain to see she wants to be with female Shepard so bad, but is unable to take the necessary steps because she could be new to the whole female/female relationship.

[Someone With Mass]

MICHELLE7 wrote...

Casey's latest tweet:

Some game sites saying "previously straight chars now available for both m&f chars" not necessarily true. Will have some new LI's in #ME3

Good. 

Glad that's over with.

[Collider]

Someone With Mass wrote...

MICHELLE7 wrote...

Casey's latest tweet:

Some game sites saying "previously straight chars now available for both m&f chars" not necessarily true. Will have some new LI's in #ME3

Good. 

Glad that's over with.

I doubt it's over. They're saying "not necessarily true" about a lot of things, and many times when they say that, it is actually true. But it is nice to see them say it, regardless.

If we're going to have new love interests (who knows whether they mean
"pre-existing characters who didn't have a romances already" or "new
characters altogether who are love interests) and one of them is female,
they may as well make her the new female bisexual love interest.

[ImmortalWarrior]

Evil_Sarevok wrote...

I can imagine its for the reason I
stated, you add everyone as Bi in a game and you can only speak to one
character else the rest go ape**** that you've had a conversation with
someone else, that and too many variables, they'd have to change the
entire romance system, the one in DA was worse for that for reasons
again, stated previously.

Besides, I prefer, and I suspect many
bar a small 'niche market' prefer that Garrus is your 'male friend' and
Tali is your 'female friend', you dont have to have a game where the
sole purpose is getting into that character's underwear... or suit. I
can imagine if you want something like that you can go find something
from Japan, god only knows the stuff that comes from there.

Oh and Goat, what was this about the Witcher for you? I had mine mailed today >.>

Not seen this picture in a while, so, here we are.
 *snip*

Okay this thread has been madness for the past day and I'm now just catching up.  So I'm going to drop my 2 cents.  Ultimately, I don't care if they make all exisiting LI's bi as it is their decision BUT most characters should not be because it does not fit their characters.  You just make make a character ****** or bi sexual just to please the niche crowd.

That being said, I do not think Tali, Garrus, Jacob or Thane would be homosexual/bisexual.  Jack I can see, Miranda I can see (much less so than Jack, as Jack is totally sexually deviant) but imo, it doesn't fit Tali's character.

They could really screw this up, if I go to "chat" with Garrus, Thane and Jacob and they start getting "friendly" with me at the slightest hint of politeness in the conversation I'm going to be pissed.  I am with you on that Evil_Sarevok, that would annoy the p*ss out of me and make my ME3 experience much less enjoyable.

Now they could make it where once you start to pick a team (ie. if maleshep starts to romance a female) that those conversation options immediately become unavailable.  Then that could work.

MICHELLE7 wrote...

Casey's latest tweet:

Some game sites saying "previously straight chars now available for both m&f chars" not necessarily true. Will have some new LI's in #ME3

Looks like that's the case then.  Contradicting what they said earlier about no new love interests.  But he did tweet that, just checked it myself.  I don't think we need to worry about existing characters being altered now.

[ADLegend21]

Collider wrote...

I doubt it's over. They're saying "not necessarily true" about a lot of things, and many times when they say that, it is actually true. But it is nice to see them say it, regardless.

If we're going to have new love interests (who knows whether they mean
"pre-existing characters who didn't have a romances already" or "new
characters altogether who are love interests) and one of them is female,
they may as well make her the new female bisexual love interest.

it's far from over. They have plenty of time do make any pre-existing characters bisexual and make new characters who are bisexual and as you said "not necessarily true" could be a retraction so that they maintain a certain amount of secrecy until certain points before release.

[Goat_Shepard]

ADLegend21 wrote...
Now You see why people say you can't debate with Tali mancers. you're enforcing a sterotype since you're dismissing my negative assesment of your favorite Character as "trolling" now If I posted that gif of people celebrating with Tali takes a Rocket to the face during the SM then THAT is trolling,

Definition of an internet troll: someone who posts inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community or blog with the primary intent of provoking readers into an emotional response.

Which is what you just did. You are a troll, and I do not argue with them.

kthxbye

Collider wrote...

That's what all of the love interest threads are going through, goat. Except Jacob because his thread always
moves slow as molasses. But even they're talking about it too.

The Love threads are a stupid, stupid concept. The Site is where it's at.

Modifié par Goat_Shepard, 16 mai 2011 - 04:17 .

[Troodon80]

I doubt it's over. They're saying "not necessarily true" about a lot of things, and many times when they say that, it is actually true. But it is nice to see them say it, regardless.

Of course it's not over, there will always be opponents and proponents. But it is nice to see them say something like that. The different threads about for those things gives proof of that.

Casey Hudson

.@trickfred "no new LI's" was an oversimplification of an answer I gave back in early Apr. And things always evolve in mid-production.

Well, it's good to know that it can at least rest for a while.

Modifié par Troodon80, 16 mai 2011 - 04:24 .

[ADLegend21]

[quote]Goat_Shepard wrote...

[quote]ADLegend21 wrote...
Now You see why people say you can't debate with Tali mancers. you're enforcing a sterotype since you're dismissing my negative assesment of your favorite Character as "trolling" now If I posted that gif of people celebrating with Tali takes a Rocket to the face during the SM then THAT is trolling,
[/quote]
Definition of an internet troll: someone who posts inflammatory, extraneous, or off-topic messages in an online community or blog with the primary intent of provoking readers into an emotional response.

Which is what you just did. You are a troll, and I do not argue with them.

kthxbye
[/quote]
I see how it is. You can't take someone NOT worshipping your cahracter so you just accuse them of trolling. What I'm saying about Tali is not imflammatory it is based on facts in game and based on her behavior in multiple situations I've given you examples of trolling and as usual since it is againstyour way of thinking you ignore it. What's os hard about seeing flaws in your favorite character? I see them in mine and acknowledge them as such, if any one is a troll it is you, since you and your fellow posters here have posted numerous inflammaotry comments about other characters under the banner of "but tali is teh awethum" so not only are you the most obvious oh hypocrites, you continue to perpetuate the stereotype of "Talimnacers are stupid" and I was REALLY hoping you were above that goat, since you have admitted to liking and romancing  a character other than tali and even having an Avatar of her.

[quote]Collider wrote...

That's what all of the love interest
threads are going through, goat. Except Jacob because his thread always
moves slow as molasses. But even they're talking about it too. [/quote]

The Love threads are a stupid, stupid concept. The Site is where it's at.
[/quote]
So this thread is stupid then? insulting a thread by calling it stupid, oh that's trolling Goat. seriously.

[Goat_Shepard]

ADLegend21 wrote...
So this thread is stupid then? insulting a thread by calling it stupid, oh that's trolling Goat. seriously.

You're unsubstantial interpretations are berating one character in favor for another in the fan thread of the character you're berating to trigger a negative emotional response.

Troll.

Modifié par Goat_Shepard, 16 mai 2011 - 04:28 .

[Captain Crash]

 

MICHELLE7 wrote...

Casey's latest tweet:

Some game sites saying "previously straight chars now available for both m&f chars" not necessarily true. Will have some new LI's in #ME3

not necessarily true, meaning it could happen?   Arghh theres not going to be a straight answer for a few months is there     Really does look like hes still unsure if to confirm or deny it.     Means at least they are still considering it right?   

Modifié par Captain Crash, 16 mai 2011 - 04:30 .

[Runescapeguy9]

Goat_Shepard wrote...
It's unfortunate that so many don't seem to care about Tali unless they can f*ck her (this goes for straight people, too. I'm looking at you, Rune)

Where did I ever say this? Don't put words into my mouth please.

[Troodon80]

ADLegend21 wrote...

Whatever happens in my game = canon as it is with all the other millions of copies, which has been said by Casey Hudson and content has been made FOR said canon's in LoTSB. Even in said LoTSB where Tali can't hesitate with female Shepard on the romance path, it still shows she masturbates to human porn like a honry school girl as she does in Male shep playthroughs. It's plain to see she wants to be with female Shepard so bad, but is unable to take the necessary steps because she could be new to the whole female/female relationship.

I find that line almost offensive, does it have to come down to things like this?

Now you are hurting your arguments. Please refrain.

[Pride Demon]

Goat_Shepard wrote...

Pride Demon wrote...

Look at the bright side, at least we can all haz Tali...

snp

Clearly we ALL can't. Not sexually, anyway. I find it curious that so many people are just now crawling out of the woodworks to talk about Tali only when there's news she could be made bi. It's unfortunate that so many don't seem to care about Tali unless they can f*ck her (this goes for straight people, too. I'm looking at you, Rune)

Seems aggressive of me to say, and I know people are ready to say "AHH, I DO TOO care about Tali as a friend!". If you do, that's great, but doesn't change the fact that so many showed up, and so many remain here, only because of the romance.

Uhm... I understand where you come from, but... was this specifically directed at me? Did my post offend?
If so it wasn't my intention... It was meant to be, you know, just being friendly to a fellow poster who also likes Tali...
I wasn't implying any kind of dirty of perverted thing there, seriously...

Besides, sexually, no one can have Tali... She's fictional... Mixing fiction and reality is not completely healthy...
I do think however, she and Male!Shep make for a nice couple, they have a strong bond but there's a lot of difficulties in their relationship (tali's heatlh is one of them, but there's others...) and I find myself rooting for them, hoping they'll overcome them...
What a curious thing empathy is...

I'd also like to point out I came here before this news was released, and would have come sooner had it not been for the uncanny number of trolls that seemed to crawl around, just to bash people liking Tali (both here and in other threads)...

Again, I seriously hope I haven't said anything you deemed offensive, if so, I'm deeply sorrow and publicly apologize to you (and anyone who might have taken offence) in front of the other users in this thread...