118 réponses à ce sujet

[Anacronian Stryx]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Whatever666343431431654324 wrote...

Have you seen her poor dating history? After those failures, I think she would stoop to anything to get some action.

The files are actually while she's on the Normandy SR2. While you're in Illium or something, she's sleeping with Hardcorepwner233424235r4.

Must be really fun to know if you're one of those who romanced her

[Breakdown Boy]

Reeeeeaaaaaaly old topic! This conversation (mind control chip one) is what usually scares of the wimpy Sheps from getting to know a great character. They (Yes,I am speaking in general, you are entitled to not like Miranda, so if you don't qualify then I'm not talking about you) prefer the squadies that are nice and sweet and agree to Shepard's every word. Yes my Shep, you know best my Shep...etc. Where as Miranda is a little bit more interesting, she is a challenge for Shepard, the same way Garrus had renegade inclinations in ME1, it is Shep's job to get him on the straight and narrow.



What fun is it to influence someone that is already good and nice and does everything Shepie says?



Anyway, Mrianda's willingness to leave Cerberus redeems her in my eyes completely.

[IoCaster]

Markinator_123 wrote...

She is starting to rub me the wrong way (her arrogance that masks her insecurities is starting to annoy me) and quite frankly I consider her quite evil for suggesting such a thing. Taking away someone's free will? I must say that it was actually a good thing that the Illusive man was in charge. Miranda was lucky for Shepard not to shoot her in the face after he/she discovered that.

That's one of the main reasons I despise the b!tch and make sure that she dies in every playthrough except one. I have one save in which she survives just in case there's a specific need for her in ME3. It would have to be a really compelling need though.

[Zan Mura]

Markinator_123 wrote...

_purifico_ wrote...

Just a question to the OP: did you destroy the heretics or overwrite them?

Irrevelent! The geth are nothing more than machines.

Then there's your answer. Or rather, our answer.

The geth are inorganic lifeforms, with independent thought and ability to understand and learn new information. They are different, and deemed dangerous because the organics are afraid of them, but they are no more machines than we are. So what I was referring to as I said there's your answer, is that your viewpoint is too biased and narrow to give you insight to the reality of the situation. As such, even if the answer and the justification to putting a control chip into Shepard's head was given to you, you would be unable to understand it. You are yourself blocking that information because of preconceptions and biased opinions.

To Cerberus, Shepard was a tool. It was as much her personality, knowledge, mental and physical prowess and charisma, as it was her reputation as a symbol that they were after. They brought Shepard back for one reason and one reason onle: to further their own goals. Had Shepard turned against them, it would have been stupid of them to not have any backup plans in place. The best example for this is probably gained by flipping their roles. If we assume that Cerberus is an "evil" organization that resurrects a "good / paragon" Shepard to further their own goals... then reversing that situation would be a good organization resurrecting an evil killingmachine. Would that good organization not want a control chip inside the killingmachine? Even if they needed its power, they would be pretty stupid not to expect it to turn against them sooner or later. And the only real difference here is the alignment of said parties.

TIM was pretty stupid not to put a control chip, even just an explosive / stunning device in Shep's head tbh. But from our perspective being the protagonists, we can all be glad that this was the case.

[Anacronian Stryx]

I don't hate Miranda i just find her utterly boring and whiny.

[Manton-X2]

In the context of the story, this is kind of a naive attitude. You are talking about the survival of the galaxy. Just from Shepard's actions in ME (whether you were Paragon or Renegade doesn't matter) he is pretty much impossible to control beyond his own personal code. I can easily see the question coming up "Why take the chance that he'll never work with us because we're seen as a terrorist organization and risk the survival of everything?"

When you're talking about the complete annihilation of everything, I think moral choices take on a whole different context and level. If this was a real world situation, I'd personally Snake Plissken him and wouldn't lose a minute's sleep over it.

MX2

Modifié par Manton-X2, 14 septembre 2010 - 08:11 .

[Breakdown Boy]

Wow people are so judgemental, it's like a soapie were the person who screws up is rediculed and judged by people who not a year ago dit similair evil things and such.



Miranda first of all helped resurect the most important human in the galaxy, she swollowes her pride and followes his lead anyway even if she is more experienced, older and most likely smarter then him and in the end shows she is not evil by leaving Cerberus.



But I guess one bad idea means we need to kill her, right? Why not kill Mordin for the genophage work? Or kill Garrus for wanting kill Sadonis? Or kill all the Quarians for creating the Geth?



"Don't be so quick to deal out death and judgment!"

[Estelindis]

Personally, what I don't understand is why Miranda *tells* Shepard that she wanted to include a control chip but wasn't allowed to do so. I mean, the idea of a control chip might not have even occurred to Shepard at that point. But, once it's mentioned, if Shep feels s/he doesn't yet have a reason to trust Miri, her denial of the chip is no real reassurance at all and is more likely to estrange Shepard...



Ah, maybe it's a combination of Miranda's pride in her abilities and intelligence with a (comparative) lack of interpersonal skill or warmth. She doesn't feel like she needs to apologise for doing what she did, because she believes it was right, and would have done more if she could. If Shepard can't deal with that, Miri reckons that's his/her problem.

[Christmas Ape]

I think it's kind of a polite gesture on Miranda's part, she's just terrible at it. She's giving you a free look at her dedication to the cause, her willingness to do the necessary no matter how abhorrent. She's as much telling Shepard "I won't bat an eye if this gets ugly" as she is trying to sell you on tIM not being a monster. My nickel about it, anyway.

And while I find Miranda's mattress-cover catsuit kind of laughable, I don't hate it, and remind people that the majority of the present North American female population is dressed in a manner that residents of 1835 (equally behind our era as ME is ahead of us) would consider inappropriate for wh-res.

Modifié par Christmas Ape, 14 septembre 2010 - 02:04 .

[Killjoy Cutter]

Markinator_123 wrote...

_purifico_ wrote...

Just a question to the OP: did you destroy the heretics or overwrite them?

Irrevelent! The geth are nothing more than machines.

So are you.  An organic machine.

[Elyvern]

Estelindis wrote...

Personally, what I don't understand is why Miranda *tells* Shepard that she wanted to include a control chip but wasn't allowed to do so. I mean, the idea of a control chip might not have even occurred to Shepard at that point. But, once it's mentioned, if Shep feels s/he doesn't yet have a reason to trust Miri, her denial of the chip is no real reassurance at all and is more likely to estrange Shepard...

Ah, maybe it's a combination of Miranda's pride in her abilities and intelligence with a (comparative) lack of interpersonal skill or warmth. She doesn't feel like she needs to apologise for doing what she did, because she believes it was right, and would have done more if she could. If Shepard can't deal with that, Miri reckons that's his/her problem.

Miranda's forthright and blunt nature comes across extrremely strongly in the game not just in this instance, it's the defining thing about her character. For example, she needn't have said Jack was a mistake when Jack confronts her after their loyalty mission, thereby putting the fault entirely on Jack. She also needn't tell TIM that she's quitting Cerberus when Shepard refuses to hand over the base. Turning off the omni-tool would leave so much more salvage room. Pile all the faults you want on Miranda, but she always says what she thinks, regardless of the fact that a lie or outright silence would do the job better. And for some people, that's a character strength, not a flaw.

Modifié par Elyvern, 14 septembre 2010 - 02:58 .

[ExtremeOne]

Elyvern wrote...

Estelindis wrote...

Personally, what I don't understand is why Miranda *tells* Shepard that she wanted to include a control chip but wasn't allowed to do so. I mean, the idea of a control chip might not have even occurred to Shepard at that point. But, once it's mentioned, if Shep feels s/he doesn't yet have a reason to trust Miri, her denial of the chip is no real reassurance at all and is more likely to estrange Shepard...

Ah, maybe it's a combination of Miranda's pride in her abilities and intelligence with a (comparative) lack of interpersonal skill or warmth. She doesn't feel like she needs to apologise for doing what she did, because she believes it was right, and would have done more if she could. If Shepard can't deal with that, Miri reckons that's his/her problem.

Miranda's forthright and blunt nature comes across extrremely strongly in the game not just in this instance, it's the defining thing about her character. For example, she needn't have said Jack was a mistake when Jack confronts her after their loyalty mission, thereby putting the fault entirely on Jack. She also needn't tell TIM that she's quitting Cerberus when Shepard refuses to hand over the base. Turning off the omni-tool would leave so much more salvage room. Pile all the faults you want on Miranda, but she always says what she thinks, regardless of the fact that a lie or outright silence would do the job better. And for some people, that's a character strength, not a flaw.

  


Thats why i like her so much she is a ruthless and dedicated woman that cares about getting the job done no matter what it takes. she gives a lot at  the end of the  game and most people on here are not even willing to see that. 

[Estelindis]

Elyvern wrote...

Pile all the faults you want on Miranda, but she always says what she thinks, regardless of the fact that a lie or outright silence would do the job better. And for some people, that's a character strength, not a flaw.

Miranda is a talented woman and she knows it.  I think her strong belief in her cause and methods has advantages and disadvantages; I have no interest in pigeonholing it as a strength or a flaw.

Miranda is the "perfect woman" for a certain definition of perfection, but I thought that the main point about her character is that she's still human, with all the shades of grey that implies.

[Killjoy Cutter]

ExtremeOne wrote...

Elyvern wrote...
Miranda's forthright and blunt nature comes across extrremely strongly in the game not just in this instance, it's the defining thing about her character. For example, she needn't have said Jack was a mistake when Jack confronts her after their loyalty mission, thereby putting the fault entirely on Jack. She also needn't tell TIM that she's quitting Cerberus when Shepard refuses to hand over the base. Turning off the omni-tool would leave so much more salvage room. Pile all the faults you want on Miranda, but she always says what she thinks, regardless of the fact that a lie or outright silence would do the job better. And for some people, that's a character strength, not a flaw.

   

Thats why i like her so much she is a ruthless and dedicated woman that cares about getting the job done no matter what it takes. she gives a lot at  the end of the  game and most people on here are not even willing to see that. 

Like many of the new squadmates for ME2, Miranda has something in her past that drives her to sometimes do things that make her a hard person to like.

Her lack of reticence isn't always the most efficient, professional attitude -- she gains nothing by playing into Jack's confrontations, for example, and yet cannot keep her comments to herself long enough for Jack's rage to lose steam.  I actually blame Jack more for those exchanges, but that's another discussion. 

I get Miranda.  I don't always like the things that she does and says, but I get it.  She'd just be a hard person to co-exist with if you actually knew her.

[ExtremeOne]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

ExtremeOne wrote...

Elyvern wrote...
Miranda's forthright and blunt nature comes across extrremely strongly in the game not just in this instance, it's the defining thing about her character. For example, she needn't have said Jack was a mistake when Jack confronts her after their loyalty mission, thereby putting the fault entirely on Jack. She also needn't tell TIM that she's quitting Cerberus when Shepard refuses to hand over the base. Turning off the omni-tool would leave so much more salvage room. Pile all the faults you want on Miranda, but she always says what she thinks, regardless of the fact that a lie or outright silence would do the job better. And for some people, that's a character strength, not a flaw.

   

Thats why i like her so much she is a ruthless and dedicated woman that cares about getting the job done no matter what it takes. she gives a lot at  the end of the  game and most people on here are not even willing to see that. 

Like many of the new squadmates for ME2, Miranda has something in her past that drives her to sometimes do things that make her a hard person to like.

Her lack of reticence isn't always the most efficient, professional attitude -- she gains nothing by playing into Jack's confrontations, for example, and yet cannot keep her comments to herself long enough for Jack's rage to lose steam.  I actually blame Jack more for those exchanges, but that's another discussion. 

I get Miranda.  I don't always like the things that she does and says, but I get it.  She'd just be a hard person to co-exist with if you actually knew her.

  


She might be hard for a paragon Shepard because of her ruthless attitude but for my renegade Shepard she fits with him perfectly. She is a strong woman and one that says what is on her mind and does not care if anyone likes or not. she is much like i am in real life. 

[Killjoy Cutter]

ExtremeOne wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

ExtremeOne wrote...

Elyvern wrote...
Miranda's forthright and blunt nature comes across extrremely strongly in the game not just in this instance, it's the defining thing about her character. For example, she needn't have said Jack was a mistake when Jack confronts her after their loyalty mission, thereby putting the fault entirely on Jack. She also needn't tell TIM that she's quitting Cerberus when Shepard refuses to hand over the base. Turning off the omni-tool would leave so much more salvage room. Pile all the faults you want on Miranda, but she always says what she thinks, regardless of the fact that a lie or outright silence would do the job better. And for some people, that's a character strength, not a flaw.

   

Thats why i like her so much she is a ruthless and dedicated woman that cares about getting the job done no matter what it takes. she gives a lot at  the end of the  game and most people on here are not even willing to see that. 

Like many of the new squadmates for ME2, Miranda has something in her past that drives her to sometimes do things that make her a hard person to like.

Her lack of reticence isn't always the most efficient, professional attitude -- she gains nothing by playing into Jack's confrontations, for example, and yet cannot keep her comments to herself long enough for Jack's rage to lose steam.  I actually blame Jack more for those exchanges, but that's another discussion. 

I get Miranda.  I don't always like the things that she does and says, but I get it.  She'd just be a hard person to co-exist with if you actually knew her.

  


She might be hard for a paragon Shepard because of her ruthless attitude but for my renegade Shepard she fits with him perfectly. She is a strong woman and one that says what is on her mind and does not care if anyone likes or not. she is much like i am in real life. 

Has nothing to do with paragon or renegade.  Very few people find it easy to be around someone who never knows when or cares when to keep a comment to themselves. 

Modifié par Killjoy Cutter, 14 septembre 2010 - 07:52 .

[ExtremeOne]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

ExtremeOne wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

ExtremeOne wrote...

Elyvern wrote...
Miranda's forthright and blunt nature comes across extrremely strongly in the game not just in this instance, it's the defining thing about her character. For example, she needn't have said Jack was a mistake when Jack confronts her after their loyalty mission, thereby putting the fault entirely on Jack. She also needn't tell TIM that she's quitting Cerberus when Shepard refuses to hand over the base. Turning off the omni-tool would leave so much more salvage room. Pile all the faults you want on Miranda, but she always says what she thinks, regardless of the fact that a lie or outright silence would do the job better. And for some people, that's a character strength, not a flaw.

   

Thats why i like her so much she is a ruthless and dedicated woman that cares about getting the job done no matter what it takes. she gives a lot at  the end of the  game and most people on here are not even willing to see that. 

Like many of the new squadmates for ME2, Miranda has something in her past that drives her to sometimes do things that make her a hard person to like.

Her lack of reticence isn't always the most efficient, professional attitude -- she gains nothing by playing into Jack's confrontations, for example, and yet cannot keep her comments to herself long enough for Jack's rage to lose steam.  I actually blame Jack more for those exchanges, but that's another discussion. 

I get Miranda.  I don't always like the things that she does and says, but I get it.  She'd just be a hard person to co-exist with if you actually knew her.

  


She might be hard for a paragon Shepard because of her ruthless attitude but for my renegade Shepard she fits with him perfectly. She is a strong woman and one that says what is on her mind and does not care if anyone likes or not. she is much like i am in real life. 

Has nothing to do with paragon or renegade.  Very few people find it easy to be around someone who never knows when or cares when to keep a comment to themselves. 

    


I can see how some do not like that. 

[ExtremeOne]

Anacronian Stryx wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

Whatever666343431431654324 wrote...

Have you seen her poor dating history? After those failures, I think she would stoop to anything to get some action.

The files are actually while she's on the Normandy SR2. While you're in Illium or something, she's sleeping with Hardcorepwner233424235r4.

Must be really fun to know if you're one of those who romanced her

  


it does not bother me 

[Killjoy Cutter]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Whatever666343431431654324 wrote...

Have you seen her poor dating history? After those failures, I think she would stoop to anything to get some action.

The files are actually while she's on the Normandy SR2. While you're in Illium or something, she's sleeping with Hardcorepwner233424235r4.

If I were a woman, I think that screen-name alone might make me look elsewhere...

[Onyx Jaguar]

Because its cool



Cool beans



COOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOL BEANS



Cool beans.



Cooo-ooo-ooo-oool BEANS

[Markinator_123]

Personally, this is just something that annoys me about her. @Iedra2 I have addressed this before in the past but I let it slide before and I am not doing it now. It is just hard to forget whenever I look at her and I keep remembering, "you wanted to put a control chip in Shepard's head." This sounds like something a cartoon villain would do and would really make her no different than the reapers.

[Giggles_Manically]

Personally it bugged me a little.

However after her LM and romancing her it dosent. She isint the same person you know at the start of the game, so its not really a factor anymore. There is a real person under her cold exterior it just takes Shep to find that person.



So no even though I play a Paragon, it dosent bug me that much. Although her and Jacob's final scene does bug me a little, but thats another thing altoghther.

[Collider]

Cerberus Station Miranda and Normandy Miranda are pretty much different people.

Obviously, the whole control chip thing plays into Miranda being an Ice Queen, an ends to the means Cerberus enthusiast and human supremacist, thing. This is the fate of mankind as we know it. Cerberus Station Miranda says that morales get in the way.

But like giggles said, despite the grave human rights issue, Miranda isn't the same person. She goes from Ice Queen to friendly secretary in a snap of one's thumbs. No melting or peeling away at layers involved.

Modifié par Collider, 15 septembre 2010 - 12:13 .

[yummysoap]

Estelindis wrote...

Personally, what I don't understand is why Miranda *tells* Shepard that she wanted to include a control chip but wasn't allowed to do so. I mean, the idea of a control chip might not have even occurred to Shepard at that point. But, once it's mentioned, if Shep feels s/he doesn't yet have a reason to trust Miri, her denial of the chip is no real reassurance at all and is more likely to estrange Shepard....

That's the issue with her, I think. It felt like she told me that just so she could let me know how cold-hearted and superior she is, and to establish herself as a dominant character. It makes her ice-queen facade very obvious when she spouts such an un-needed, emotionally-driven declaration of her distinct lack of empathy, and it ironically points out just how contradictory she is - a true unemotional, unsympathetic character would have known that revealing information like that to the person she's going to be following into battle isn't a smart move. It's strange how this line actually summarises Miranda's character as a whole.

I've always loved the ice-queen-in-denial characters, and I've always loved watching all their emotional armor crack and fall apart as the game/series progresses. Miranda could have done with a smoother transition, I think, but I still think she's wonderfully written.

Modifié par yummysoap, 15 septembre 2010 - 12:22 .

[Markinator_123]

yummysoap wrote...

Estelindis wrote...

Personally, what I don't understand is why Miranda *tells* Shepard that she wanted to include a control chip but wasn't allowed to do so. I mean, the idea of a control chip might not have even occurred to Shepard at that point. But, once it's mentioned, if Shep feels s/he doesn't yet have a reason to trust Miri, her denial of the chip is no real reassurance at all and is more likely to estrange Shepard....

That's the issue with her, I think. It felt like she told me that just so she could let me know how cold-hearted and superior she is, and to establish herself as a dominant character. It makes her ice-queen facade very obvious when she spouts such an un-needed, emotionally-driven declaration of her distinct lack of empathy, and it ironically points out just how contradictory she is - a true unemotional, unsympathetic character would have known that revealing information like that to the person she's going to be following into battle isn't a smart move. It's strange how this line actually summarises Miranda's character as a whole.

I've always loved the ice-queen-in-denial characters, and I've always loved watching all their emotional armor crack and fall apart as the game/series progresses. Miranda could have done with a smoother transition, I think, but I still think she's wonderfully written.

You are perfectly right about one thing. The way she treats you at the beginning of the game was not a smart move at all. I wonder if she ever understands why people like Jack and Garrus can't stand her.