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Can non-mages become abominations?


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#1
silentassassin264

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 I was wondering about this when going through the Circle again and Uldred mentions your strength with a demon behind it being awesome but I was a rogue.  Is it even possible for non-mages to become abominations?

Sophia was already dead when her body was possessed so I assume she was more like Justice (although I never played awakening so what do I know :P).  

The kid was kitty could have been a mage but we are never really told one way or another.

And I couldn't think of else...

#2
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silentassassin264 wrote...


The kid was kitty could have been a mage but we are never really told one way or another.

And I couldn't think of else...

She is the granddaughter of Wilhelm the mage, is she not?

#3
David Gaider

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Regular people can be possessed by demons, and are still dangerous, but they are not abominations. Abominations have access to a mage's full power -- even a weak mage turned into an abomination is dangerous -- while a possessed human (or possessed anything) is only as dangerous as the demon that did the possessing.

#4
silentassassin264

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Isolde had mages in her family and wasn't a mage. Kitty Kid could have been one but the game doesn't explicitly say.

#5
Collider

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David Gaider wrote...

Regular people can be possessed by demons, and are still dangerous, but they are not abominations. Abominations have access to a mage's full power -- even a weak mage turned into an abomination is dangerous -- while a possessed human (or possessed anything) is only as dangerous as the demon that did the possessing.

Would Dwarves be able to get possessed? They do not dream.

#6
silentassassin264

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David Gaider wrote...

Regular people can be possessed by demons, and are still dangerous, but they are not abominations. Abominations have access to a mage's full power -- even a weak mage turned into an abomination is dangerous -- while a possessed human (or possessed anything) is only as dangerous as the demon that did the possessing.

Thank you Mr. Gaider!  Or is it David?  One of you said it made you feel old when I used Mr...

#7
Dynamomark

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Collider wrote...

David Gaider wrote...

Regular people can be possessed by demons, and are still dangerous, but they are not abominations. Abominations have access to a mage's full power -- even a weak mage turned into an abomination is dangerous -- while a possessed human (or possessed anything) is only as dangerous as the demon that did the possessing.

Would Dwarves be able to get possessed? They do not dream.

My understanding is that you don't have to dream to be possessed. Demons possess cadavers all the time, and they obviously don't dream. It's a good question about the dwarves though. I don't recall any possessed dwarves in the game now that I think about it.

#8
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Well, regarding dwarves. *Golems DLC spoilers ahead*

Dead dwarves are what the Harvester is made of, which, I believe, is controlled by a fade spirit. Although the process of creating that (those) thing(s) was no mere possession, as I understand it.

Modifié par filaminstrel, 15 septembre 2010 - 12:06 .


#9
HarryThePlotter

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David Gaider wrote...

Regular people can be possessed by demons, and are still dangerous, but they are not abominations. Abominations have access to a mage's full power -- even a weak mage turned into an abomination is dangerous -- while a possessed human (or possessed anything) is only as dangerous as the demon that did the possessing.


Hard definitions are always good! Thanks!

#10
HarryThePlotter

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David Gaider wrote...

Regular people can be possessed by demons, and are still dangerous, but they are not abominations. Abominations have access to a mage's full power -- even a weak mage turned into an abomination is dangerous -- while a possessed human (or possessed anything) is only as dangerous as the demon that did the possessing.


This begs the following question:

Do demons have no magic on their own SIMILAR to that of Mages? Clearly put, Do demons have only blood magic and not the normal "Fade" magic?

#11
silentassassin264

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HarryThePlotter wrote...

David Gaider wrote...

Regular people can be possessed by demons, and are still dangerous, but they are not abominations. Abominations have access to a mage's full power -- even a weak mage turned into an abomination is dangerous -- while a possessed human (or possessed anything) is only as dangerous as the demon that did the possessing.


This begs the following question:

Do demons have no magic on their own SIMILAR to that of Mages? Clearly put, Do demons have only blood magic and not the normal "Fade" magic?

He said they are only as powerful as the demon so I guess if the demon had magic he could bring it into his host but he can't uses the awesome supply of magic that a mage has inherently.  At least I think that is what he meant.

#12
andar91

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One thing I've always wondered is how possesion works. Is it by force or do they have to tempt and trick the mage? If it IS by force, is it a battle of wills or an actual fight with fireballs and everything?

#13
HarryThePlotter

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silentassassin264 wrote...

He said they are only as powerful as the demon so I guess if the demon had magic he could bring it into his host but he can't uses the awesome supply of magic that a mage has inherently.  At least I think that is what he meant.


Right now, the lore evidence tells us that Demons have their own magic. That means the possesed individual according to David's post also should have it..... Also, I am sure I have seen many Desire demons casting cones of colds...

Modifié par HarryThePlotter, 15 septembre 2010 - 12:13 .


#14
silentassassin264

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andar91 wrote...

One thing I've always wondered is how possesion works. Is it by force or do they have to tempt and trick the mage? If it IS by force, is it a battle of wills or an actual fight with fireballs and everything?

No no.  You have to let me in.  Hurry, can't you feel the templars sword at your neck.  While you are in here you are everything that they hate...

#15
Maverick827

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David Gaider wrote...

Regular people can be possessed by demons, and are still dangerous, but they are not abominations. Abominations have access to a mage's full power -- even a weak mage turned into an abomination is dangerous -- while a possessed human (or possessed anything) is only as dangerous as the demon that did the possessing.

So it is only possible for a possessed person to propagate an abomination if said possessed person, whom I shall proclaim the possessee, is a part of the magical persuasion, whereas if the possesee is prevalently prosaic, then the power of proceeding product of the pairing of possessor and possessee is precisely parallel to that of the possessor’s incipient power?

Modifié par Maverick827, 15 septembre 2010 - 12:14 .


#16
David Gaider

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Collider wrote...

David Gaider wrote...

Regular people can be possessed by demons, and are still dangerous, but they are not abominations. Abominations have access to a mage's full power -- even a weak mage turned into an abomination is dangerous -- while a possessed human (or possessed anything) is only as dangerous as the demon that did the possessing.


Would Dwarves be able to get possessed? They do not dream.


They do not dream naturally, but that does not mean they do not have a connection to the Fade-- otherwise they wouldn't be able to enter it at all (and they can, if they are dragged in). That's different from Tranquil. Tranquil have no connection to the Fade and cannot be possessed, ever.

#17
Collider

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They do not dream naturally, but that does not mean they do not have a connection to the Fade-- otherwise they wouldn't be able to enter it at all (and they can, if they are dragged in). That's different from Tranquil. Tranquil have no connection to the Fade and cannot be possessed, ever.


So it is because Dwarves (and other races - would simpler creatures like animals also be the same?) have emotions that they are able to connect to the Fade?

#18
Dave of Canada

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David Gaider wrote...

They do not dream naturally, but that does not mean they do not have a connection to the Fade-- otherwise they wouldn't be able to enter it at all (and they can, if they are dragged in). That's different from Tranquil. Tranquil have no connection to the Fade and cannot be possessed, ever.


This made me think of something. Can the demons still go inside a dead Tranquil's body? I know when a demon goes into the body of something, they become those undead-thingies but I'm not sure if the bodies have a link to the fade or no.

#19
HarryThePlotter

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David Gaider wrote...

Collider wrote...

David Gaider wrote...

Regular people can be possessed by demons, and are still dangerous, but they are not abominations. Abominations have access to a mage's full power -- even a weak mage turned into an abomination is dangerous -- while a possessed human (or possessed anything) is only as dangerous as the demon that did the possessing.


Would Dwarves be able to get possessed? They do not dream.


They do not dream naturally, but that does not mean they do not have a connection to the Fade-- otherwise they wouldn't be able to enter it at all (and they can, if they are dragged in). That's different from Tranquil. Tranquil have no connection to the Fade and cannot be possessed, ever.


Hmmmm........

So all the sentient species in thedas have this common trait. Connection to fade..... That is a good indicator to write the book "Origin of Species in Thedas" - by Chantry Brother Darvinus.

#20
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David Gaider wrote...

Collider wrote...

David Gaider wrote...

Regular people can be possessed by demons, and are still dangerous, but they are not abominations. Abominations have access to a mage's full power -- even a weak mage turned into an abomination is dangerous -- while a possessed human (or possessed anything) is only as dangerous as the demon that did the possessing.


Would Dwarves be able to get possessed? They do not dream.


They do not dream naturally, but that does not mean they do not have a connection to the Fade-- otherwise they wouldn't be able to enter it at all (and they can, if they are dragged in). That's different from Tranquil. Tranquil have no connection to the Fade and cannot be possessed, ever.


Wait a second... in the mage tower, there was a room with a powerful Shade in it... there were a few tranquils standing there around a central statue-type thing, and the Shade would convert them into lesser Shades over time. Kind of like Uldred with the mages.

Was the shade just using their life essence to summon another Shade or something?

#21
silentassassin264

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HarryThePlotter wrote...

Hmmmm........

So all the sentient species in thedas have this common trait. Connection to fade..... That is a good indicator to write the book "Origin of Species in Thedas" - by Chantry Brother Darvinus.

But but, then babies do (or did) come from fade spirits.  Wynne was wrong.  Everything I know is a lie!

Modifié par silentassassin264, 15 septembre 2010 - 12:23 .


#22
andar91

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And another thing I've wondered, is why don't abominations in the Tower use magic? Probably more of a gameplay issue than a lore issue, hence the discrepancy, but I also found it strange. Also, is the strength of the abomination dependant upon the power of the possessed mage? I.E. possessing the senior enchanter is much better from the demon's point of view as opposed to an apprentice.

#23
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Dave of Canada wrote...

David Gaider wrote...

They do not dream naturally, but that does not mean they do not have a connection to the Fade-- otherwise they wouldn't be able to enter it at all (and they can, if they are dragged in). That's different from Tranquil. Tranquil have no connection to the Fade and cannot be possessed, ever.


This made me think of something. Can the demons still go inside a dead Tranquil's body? I know when a demon goes into the body of something, they become those undead-thingies but I'm not sure if the bodies have a link to the fade or no.


I would guess the body is still unconnected from the Fade, so when a demon comes to possess a corpse, the demon can't even "see" the tranquil's corpse.

#24
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Can anyone offer details into the tranquilizing process? What does the process entail?

Modifié par scyphozoa, 15 septembre 2010 - 12:28 .


#25
Nerdage

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filaminstrel wrote...

David Gaider wrote...

Collider wrote...

David Gaider wrote...

Regular people can be possessed by demons, and are still dangerous, but they are not abominations. Abominations have access to a mage's full power -- even a weak mage turned into an abomination is dangerous -- while a possessed human (or possessed anything) is only as dangerous as the demon that did the possessing.


Would Dwarves be able to get possessed? They do not dream.


They do not dream naturally, but that does not mean they do not have a connection to the Fade-- otherwise they wouldn't be able to enter it at all (and they can, if they are dragged in). That's different from Tranquil. Tranquil have no connection to the Fade and cannot be possessed, ever.


Wait a second... in the mage tower, there was a room with a powerful Shade in it... there were a few tranquils standing there around a central statue-type thing, and the Shade would convert them into lesser Shades over time. Kind of like Uldred with the mages.

Was the shade just using their life essence to summon another Shade or something?

From the codex:
"In time, such a demon will learn to drain energy from the psyche of those it encounters, just as it did in the Fade. Once it has drained enough, it has the power to manifest and will forever after be known as a shade."

So yes, I think it is more a case of using their essence/energy to physically manifest, rather than a posession.

Modifié par nerdage, 15 septembre 2010 - 12:46 .