42 réponses à ce sujet

[godlike13]

termokanden wrote...

About Shredder: The problem with it is that an enemy that is down to health is basically dead already. Defenses are what's difficult to deal with, and it doesn't help you one bit there.

This.

The 10%/20%/30% extra it does on organic's heath over AP, Inferno, and Warp is just not worth the 0% it does on every thing else. AP, Inferno, and Warp will do more then enough bonus damage on organic's health for ya, not to mention something like Reave. Im sorry but shredder's is just a pure waste when u have much better options.

Modifié par godlike13, 17 septembre 2010 - 07:18 .

[JaegerBane]

godlike13 wrote...

termokanden wrote...

About Shredder: The problem with it is that an enemy that is down to health is basically dead already. Defenses are what's difficult to deal with, and it doesn't help you one bit there.

This.

The 10%/20%/30% extra it does on organic's heath over AP, Inferno, and Warp is just not worth the 0% it does on every thing else. AP, Inferno, and Warp will do more then enough bonus damage on organic's health for ya, not to mention something like Reave. Im sorry but shredder's is just a pure waste when u have much better options.

I agree. Once an opponent hits health he's just meat for your powers. It's warp bombs, fire dancing and telekinesis tomfoolery galore at that stage, and shredder ammo's extra smidgen of damage doesn't really make up for that.

Plus it only works on organics, despite only affecting health. Lame.

[RGFrog]

Warp and Inferno are good all around ammo powers. I mainly use warp on an smg since it adds to the smg what it lacks. The smg with shield upgrade and it's already buffed sheild damage is good.

For instance, with the tempest or shuriken you already have 50% against shields from the get go. With warp you also get 50 against barrier, against armor and against health. You also get a buff against targets affected by biotics. It's not as effective with the squad version at 35% but still it's a good all around choice vs. pretty much everything this way.

It's even better on the Locust after sheild penetration upgrade giving you pretty much 75% against everything.

Inferno is my next choice as it does similarly against everything but barriers. But the smg is already good against those, so again a good all around choice and has the extra buff of setting things and nearby things ablaze.

Cryo is just a touch under Inferno and only because it doesn't buff until you get past protections. But it's buff is almost instant at that point.

AP is almost the same level as cryo except for it only working on armor and health and not providing the instantaneous side effect on health as cryo has.

Finally, shredder. It comes in last as the ammo power to take only if there's nothing else available. By the time it becomes useful, there's really no need for it in most cases. Unless you're playing on Normal where a high percentage of everything is unprotected meat. Then I can see it as a viable choice. But without side effects like the top 3, it's still in last place as it really doesn't do much more than AP ammo. But, I'd still use it as it's obviously better than nothing.

However, none of this is even necessary. Especially after all the weapon upgrades. You really can get through the game without any of them. But if they are available, why not?

[Zan Mura]

Optimystic_X wrote...

You don't need to hotkey ammo powers anyway, they last for the whole mission.

I haven't checked if it's just the visual effect, but every reload causes the ammo powers to be disabled from your teammates. Since insanity - especially with an Adept - comes with a lot of reloading, the ammo powers are a real pain. Especially on those autosave parts where you have a cutscene that puts you straight into combat, and you basically have to reactivate the ammo powers for two sets of guns first.

Other than that, especially Warp ammo is insanely useful to have, but it's also quite boring. Much as any passive power. I don't care as much for plain power and boost in ability, as I do in completely new abilities altogether. I'd much rather spam Overload, Incinerate and AI hack with adept powers on the targets, than just plain shoot and have some passive ammo powers do the trick. The combat is by far more exciting with active abilities instead.

[godlike13]

Zan Mura wrote...

Optimystic_X wrote...

You don't need to hotkey ammo powers anyway, they last for the whole mission.

I haven't checked if it's just the visual effect, but every reload causes the ammo powers to be disabled from your teammates. Since insanity - especially with an Adept - comes with a lot of reloading, the ammo powers are a real pain. Especially on those autosave parts where you have a cutscene that puts you straight into combat, and you basically have to reactivate the ammo powers for two sets of guns first.

Actuality im pretty positive that every reload does not cause the ammo powers to be disabled for your teammates, unless ur talking about reloading the save file and not ammo. They usually last for the whole mission with out me having to worry about them, unless i reload the file.

Modifié par godlike13, 17 septembre 2010 - 10:40 .

[RGFrog]

Zan Mura wrote...

I haven't checked if it's just the visual effect, but every reload causes the ammo powers to be disabled from your teammates. Since insanity - especially with an Adept - comes with a lot of reloading, the ammo powers are a real pain. Especially on those autosave parts where you have a cutscene that puts you straight into combat, and you basically have to reactivate the ammo powers for two sets of guns first.

Other than that, especially Warp ammo is insanely useful to have, but it's also quite boring. Much as any passive power. I don't care as much for plain power and boost in ability, as I do in completely new abilities altogether. I'd much rather spam Overload, Incinerate and AI hack with adept powers on the targets, than just plain shoot and have some passive ammo powers do the trick. The combat is by far more exciting with active abilities instead.

The only time you should have to reload the ammo power is if you initiate the load of a save, or you die and the game loads the latest save for you.

I've never had the ammo powers (squad or otherwise) go away due to a cut scene.

The cd on the ammo power is so small you should be able to at least get your primary weapons initiated before any real trouble

[ryoldschool]

I play Xbox and it is when you manually load a save ( to get the 10% spare ammo if you wear that arm piece - bug forces you to save and reload to get it to work sometimes ) or game reloads for you when you die. On kusumi mission opening battle its always disabled even if you had it active on previous mission.

[OniGanon]

Ammo powers disappear on reloading a save or any time your weapon loadout changes.

Modifié par OniGanon, 18 septembre 2010 - 02:40 .

[Zan Mura]

godlike13 wrote...

Actuality im pretty positive that every reload does not cause the ammo powers to be disabled for your teammates, unless ur talking about reloading the save file and not ammo. They usually last for the whole mission with out me having to worry about them, unless i reload the file. 

RGFrog wrote...

The only time you should have to reload the ammo power is if you initiate the load of a save, or you die and the game loads the latest save for you.

Hmm. My English failed hardcore there, apparently. Yes what I meant was loading a saved game. Especially on insanity, you will die a lot, often even due to reasons not of your own, such as telling the squad to move to a certain point and instead having them yank around back and forth and die. Hardcore and less are forgiving enough that it doesn't matter there. And loading a saved game should NOT deactivate ammo powers. There's just no reason for it to do that, other than being a bug.

And yes for gameplay, the guy about the shortcuts and mouse scrolling was spot-on too. I mean, while ME2 has excellent gameplay for PC, compared to a most of the consol ports (or games developed for both consoles and PC at the same time in general), how they overlooked the mouse wheel scrolling in all of the windows that so clearly demand it, is surprising. And annoying. Something I've gotten so much used to I didn't even remember that before someone pointed it out here.

Modifié par Zan Mura, 18 septembre 2010 - 07:15 .

[Astranagant]

Merlin 47 wrote...

Optimystic_X wrote...

I love them on the combat classes. On casters I prefer powers.

You don't need to hotkey ammo powers anyway, they last for the whole mission. Put them on the gun that matches that defense for best results. (For example, put Incendiary or AP on your heavy pistol and put disruptor or warp on your SMG.) Even squad ammo powers only stick to that specific weapons when used.

And above all, make sure Shredder Ammo pisses off and dies somewhere.

Actually, I found Warp ammo to be USELESS.

WORST.....LOYTALTY POWER....EVER!  I always used Shredder Ammo and I found it more useful than a maxed out Inferno ammo (for some reason, the Inferno ammo didn't do enough, even the additional burn damage).  I have yet to find a reason for Armor Piercing ammo.  To me, the only two ammo types you need are Disruptor and Shredder.  Which originally, I would use both Inferno and Cryo, only to find Shredder was way better.  I never cared for Cryo; and I originally felt Disruptor was pointless.  Yeah....won't make THAT mistake again!  Haestrom on Hardcore....Disruptor is my friend there!

So...don't waste time with Warp ammo; you're better off using the actual Warp power.  If you don't have Overload, or aren't using Garrus, Miranda or Kasumi, keep Disruptor ammo handy against Geth primarily.  Especially on Hardcore/Insanity mode.

Warp Ammo does increased damage to pretty much everything. Shredder ammo only does increased damage to health. AP/Tungsten ammo does increased damage to both health and armor. So... how is Shredder the best?

[Phaelducan]

I haven't played on normal, but I imagine Shredder would be one of the better options there.



On Insanity... well lets just say it's the reason I never take Thane anywhere.

[OniGanon]

That's just silly. Thane could have no powers and still be awesome. Just max his passive, give him an Incisor and go grab a beer while Thane wins the battle for you.

[JaegerBane]

OniGanon wrote...

That's just silly. Thane could have no powers and still be awesome. Just max his passive, give him an Incisor and go grab a beer while Thane wins the battle for you.

Agreed. Ignoring Thane's Incisor and Warp just because he's got Shredder is the gaming equivalent of cutting your nose off to spite your face.

[Wolf Warden]

Astranagant wrote...

Merlin 47 wrote...

Optimystic_X wrote...

I love them on the combat classes. On casters I prefer powers.

You don't need to hotkey ammo powers anyway, they last for the whole mission. Put them on the gun that matches that defense for best results. (For example, put Incendiary or AP on your heavy pistol and put disruptor or warp on your SMG.) Even squad ammo powers only stick to that specific weapons when used.

And above all, make sure Shredder Ammo pisses off and dies somewhere.

Actually, I found Warp ammo to be USELESS.

WORST.....LOYTALTY POWER....EVER!  I always used Shredder Ammo and I found it more useful than a maxed out Inferno ammo (for some reason, the Inferno ammo didn't do enough, even the additional burn damage).  I have yet to find a reason for Armor Piercing ammo.  To me, the only two ammo types you need are Disruptor and Shredder.  Which originally, I would use both Inferno and Cryo, only to find Shredder was way better.  I never cared for Cryo; and I originally felt Disruptor was pointless.  Yeah....won't make THAT mistake again!  Haestrom on Hardcore....Disruptor is my friend there!

So...don't waste time with Warp ammo; you're better off using the actual Warp power.  If you don't have Overload, or aren't using Garrus, Miranda or Kasumi, keep Disruptor ammo handy against Geth primarily.  Especially on Hardcore/Insanity mode.

Warp Ammo does increased damage to pretty much everything. Shredder ammo only does increased damage to health. AP/Tungsten ammo does increased damage to both health and armor. So... how is Shredder the best?

Shredder does increased damage to organic health only.  AP ammo does more damage to all heath and armor as well.  Incindiary ammo is great because it acts as crowd controll for organics (only reason why I pick it over AP ammo)  Shredder ammo is definately too specific for me especially on Insanity where you need something that can help strip protections away.

[fegede]

OniGanon wrote...

That's just silly. Thane could have no powers and still be awesome. Just max his passive, give him an Incisor and go grab a beer while Thane wins the battle for you.

Thane is awesome on collectors missions. With vanguard, soldier or infiltrator, you can take slam as a bonus and max squad cryo to make your own warpexplosions and have him freeze everything with his sniper. For sentinel, adept and engineer, I often take him and jacob to have close and long range covered, warp explosions and squad incendiary.
I also had one very fun playtrough on collectors missions with a sentinel and area reave as a bonus, taking samara (another area reave) and thane with shredder ammos for the laughs.

[RaffyS]

Shredder is hands down the worst ammo type on Insanity since everything, even the goddarn husks have some form of protection, often times, multiple layers. 90% of the time, your shredder ammo will be doing nothing except giving your gun an ugly glow. Warp all the way.

[Sidesalad]

Man I love ammo powers; I feel lost without at least one.

My current experiment playing on Xbox is Heavy Shredder on RB, Heavy Disruptor on LB and Inferno on Y (zero points in Adrenaline Rush since I finished an Insanity run while using it and it really can be crazily overpowered). Annoyingly it means I have to rely on squadmates to do the heavy lifting on Barriers, but for everything else I have each type easily at hand for a quick switch so I'm always using the ideal type.

I wouldn't say it's stupid not to use ammo powers, but I find they really are useful.

[Ahglock]

At earlier levels in the game ammo powers boost damage a bit. But once you have upgraded your guns the amount of extra damage will rarely save you a single shot. The only benefit is the CC effects that come with them. I don't feel that I need them in the slightest on any play through, they do help though.