1279 réponses à ce sujet

[lazuli]

The first game’s conversations were stilted, awkward things, obscuring
the quality of the writing and the impact of the game’s choices with
stop-start vocal cues and a character perpetually staring into the
middle distance.

Maybe I have poor taste, but I really enjoyed the conversations in Dragon Age: Origins.  If you can't suspend your disbelief about the pause that occurs while you choose a dialogue option, perhaps it's time to abandon the medium and start reviewing movies.

I'm eager to see what Dragon Age 2 will be like, but I don't think that DA:O warrants this bad treatment, at least not on the subject of conversations.

[joriandrake]

lazuli wrote...

The first game’s conversations were stilted, awkward things, obscuring
the quality of the writing and the impact of the game’s choices with
stop-start vocal cues and a character perpetually staring into the
middle distance.

Maybe I have poor taste, but I really enjoyed the conversations in Dragon Age: Origins.  If you can't suspend your disbelief about the pause that occurs while you choose a dialogue option, perhaps it's time to abandon the medium and start reviewing movies.

I'm eager to see what Dragon Age 2 will be like, but I don't think that DA:O warrants this bad treatment, at least not on the subject of conversations.

QFT

[Riona45]

lazuli wrote...


Maybe I have poor taste, but I really enjoyed the conversations in Dragon Age: Origins.  If you can't suspend your disbelief about the pause that occurs while you choose a dialogue option, perhaps it's time to abandon the medium and start reviewing movies.

I thought that comment had more to do with the previewer's dislike of the silent PC.

[Sylvius the Mad]

lazuli wrote...

Maybe I have poor taste, but I really enjoyed the conversations in Dragon Age: Origins.  If you can't suspend your disbelief about the pause that occurs while you choose a dialogue option, perhaps it's time to abandon the medium and start reviewing movies.

There's no suspension required.  Time doesn't pass within the game while it's waiting for your input.  The characters aren't aware of the pause because the pause doesn't happen.

[Morroian]

Monica83 wrote...
Since from what i read Dragon age2 will have...
Sepmlyfied dialogues (pharaphrases sistem)
Lack of character roleplay customization compared with the first title...
(You can't select a race classes now are static)
Dialog wheel (if well implemented with a not semplyfied dialogues with pharafrases is a nice thing)

But if you say this thing: Dialog gets unwieldy [when you have to read more than three words at a time]

When you are making a roleplay game... well its like to tell a pizza man to don't use mozzarella

1. The dialogue is what your character says not the paraphrasing. There's been no indication that this will be shallower than DAO, in fact given the writers are the same I would expect ti to be about the same.

2. No race selection - once again there are a ton of actual great rpgs with no race selection. The fact that you can only play as human does not stop the game from having  a plenty of customisation. In fact its been said a few times that not having to spend time on different options for the the different races means more time can be spent giving the writing more depth as opposed to more breadth.

3. Dialogue wheel, whether its a wheel or a list whats the difference?

Like others I fail to see why the doom and gloom merchants are responding here, there was nothing really new here. In fact a couple of things I noticed that I don't think have been brought up yet: Confirmation that game development started March 2009. Plus there was some more info on the spell tree. ie if you get fireball you can then upgarde it to set enemies on fire afterward rather than going for a new spell.

[foodstuffs]

In regards to dialog: I generally had no problem with the people I was talking to, but many of my response options were no more thought out than many of the responses on these boards. If someone could invent a system where I could type in my responses and the game would accept, and understand, what I was saying, I would have that persons child; nevermind the fact that I am a man, I'd find a way.

[Amioran]

errant_knight wrote...

Yeah, see that was me. And I've discussed things I don't like about the new style, and that I do, extensively, in multiple threads, and with people who both agree and disagree with me, as long as they're civil.

 
Shame that when you do you always want to see only what you want, without caring for the background of your affirmations. You consider only what you want. You are not objective. This is the greatest fault of your affirmations concerning this aspect.

I refused to discuss it with that person because they started out baiting and condescending and kept it up. That's my right, and it's not like I haven't explained myself fully all over the forum. You can disagree with points that have been made, here and elsewhere, but you can't say that they haven't been fully explained.

Sure, I could either explain why I wouldn't like Raffaello or Artaud or whatever, will that mean that I will actually have a POINT? Your "explanations" are always of the subjective sort, without entering in details. You don't consider programming, you don't consider budget and time, you don't consider gameplay structure. You just consider what you care to.  

Gameplay is subjective.

No. It is both subjective and objective. You cannot like a good gameplay as you want but if it is well done it is so objectively. So, you see, your point of start is already completely inaccurate. This resemble the parable of "art is subjective" by those who like to care only what they want, but art also contain style and technique that are objective parameters, you know. Same happens with gameplay on a game, or artistic direction or whatever.

What might be awesome to you is not necessarily awesome to others. No matter how much one may like something, another may not, and the back and forth 'you're stupid, no you're stupid' is a pointless waste of time. I can't convince you, you can't convince me, so perhaps we should just let each other have our say without heaping crap on each other.

Also this fable of "I agree and you disagree" is good, but not always appropriate. When you come to some technical aspects there's someone that is right and some other that is wrong. You can also decide to insist telling yourself that it's just matter of opinion, but will it be right?

Modifié par Amioran, 19 septembre 2010 - 09:51 .

[Amioran]

Meltemph wrote...

He came across as obnoxious and condescending(and I agree he was) because you did as well.

LOL.

No, I'm not obnoxious, it is only that what I cannot stand the most is people talking of things they don't clearly understand as if they are experts.

Then, when you come to the end, they always reply they have a good argument but they will not show you. And the story repeats.

I started that argument already knowing where it would end, for this the "condescending" tone.

[AtreiyaN7]

Hmm, I was actually curious about the cheese-wheel thing (per earlier post about ephemera/cheese wheels) and attempted to run around in order to see if I could locate any. So far I've completely struck out in several dungeon areas and have only seen the massive cheese wheel in camp. Either I'm blind as a bat and terrible at finding them or massive cheese wheels have ninja-like stealth capabilities. I did find some pies in the Denerim marketplace however (I should probably try the Deep Roads, but ugh, I don't want to run through there even though it's empty).

Yes, it was a silly thing to do, but it's election night and there's nothing to watch atm.

Modifié par AtreiyaN7, 19 septembre 2010 - 08:06 .

[namedforthemoon]

‘Oh my God, there’s a guy stapled to a board!’



This totally sounds like it should be on a signature banner. Anyone?

[Rixxencaxx]

normal mode in dragon age origins was too difficult??? they are going to made it easier.....maybe we played different games cause normal mode after patches was no challege at all.

Modifié par Rixxencaxx, 19 septembre 2010 - 08:40 .

[Nighteye2]

Merced256 wrote...

slimgrin wrote...

MerinTB wrote...
I'd like to see just one, just one, skeptical preview of DA2. One that doesn't praise the changes and bad mouth DA:O.

This won't happen till the game releases.

I always assumed that it was a general rule that if devs agreed to give "previews" of a game that the magazine would spin it positively. Thats just an assumption though, seems to hold true in most every case i can remember.

Not so much that, but they know that what they see is not completely finished yet. So they focus on what is already good and make some remarks about aspects that they hope will be improved in the final version.

[HighMoon]

I'm 99.9% positive that it's Kaitlyn the orphan girl who ends up marrying Teagan.

[Annie_Dear]

Golden-Rose wrote...

I'm 99.9% positive that it's Kaitlyn the orphan girl who ends up marrying Teagan.

Not if you don't give her 5 sovereign.

If you, however, give Bella enough money to leave for Denerim, she will marry Bann Teagan.

[Lucy Glitter]

Brockololly wrote...

First off, journalism fail? Who the heck is Mike Darreth? I think the author meant Mark Darrah?

Ugh... besides not having any new info, it just reminds me why I don't care for these preview articles. Look- I enjoyed Mass Effect, but come on gaming journalists, why does everyone think ME is some shining pinnacle of gaming perfection which every BioWare game must copy?

I get that changes are being made to DA2 but I hate how these articles just proceed to lambast and crap all over Origins, acting like it was some rubbish game that did everything wrong because it wasn't Mass Effect-y enough. 

For inspiration, they’ve looked two floors down in their Edmonton  office, and incorporated a Mass Effect-style paraphrase system. “When  you see the choices, you don’t want to read something, and then have the protagonist just say it out loud. What Mass Effect did was to  paraphrase it, which allows you to get the gist of what’s going to  happen.”

Ah yes- I just hate reading and being able to roleplay my character without guessing what he's going to do! Spare me from my own idiocy! Fewer words, more shiny colors! 
/facepalm

As a pure killing machine, the rogue will stay handy for die-hard  roleplayers, the kind who didn’t flinch at Origins’ challenging ‘Normal’ mode. Mike Laidlaw is aware of the complaints directed at the first  game’s difficulty level, but isn’t aiming to make the experience notablyeasier for us. “What I want to do is pull Normal down a bit, and keep Hard nice and  ballsy, but we don’t want to make it that that’s the only way, because  there are a lot of hardcore gamers who want to feel like, “I gotta roll  that crit!”

Really? Origins was challenging when it first came out, but since then the patches have made it progessively easier- Awakening is a cake walk. Normal was fairly easy as is.....

This x100000.

Also, I lol'ed at the Mike Dareth. Good journamalism there. This wasn't even at a convention. No excuses.

I also hate how suddenly everyone takes everything in a game literally. 

COMPANIONS DO NOT STAND AROUND FOR A BLOODY HOUR WAITING FOR YOU TO TALK. IT'S CALLED SUSPENSION OF DISBELIEF. WE HAVE USED THIS METHOD SINCE THE BIRTH OF ART. THE BIRTH. AS. IN. THE BEGINNING OF SENTIENT LIFE. 

GOD DAMMIT PEOPLE USE YOUR BRAINS. OH, RIGHT I FORGOT THAT ALL MODERN GAMERS DO NOT HAVE ANY PATIENCE NOR BRAINPOWER TO THINK. THANKS FOR REINSTATING THAT BELIEF.

Modifié par Lucy_Glitter, 19 septembre 2010 - 10:59 .

[nightcobra]

Annie_Dear wrote...

Golden-Rose wrote...

I'm 99.9% positive that it's Kaitlyn the orphan girl who ends up marrying Teagan.

Not if you don't give her 5 sovereign.

If you, however, give Bella enough money to leave for Denerim, she will marry Bann Teagan.

i never got the bann teagan marrying someone in the epilogue even though i gave the girls enough money to create their own business, maybe it's a bug on the ps3 version.

[BallaZs]

It is sad that many so called 'fans' still crying. (No offense, I meant those who comment on pcgamer)
I think Dragon Age 2 going to be awesome. Since not the fighting system or the graphics made DA:O the best game (in my opinion), it was the awesome story which made it a really great and deep game.
So as long as they are going to give us an excellent adventure like DA:O was, I'm sold.
Voiced main character will just make him/her more realistic, just like the better graphics.

I don't say that don't have opinions, just don't bring down hell on the game already <_<

Modifié par BallaZs, 19 septembre 2010 - 11:34 .

[DMC12]

"...Dragon Age 2’s brood of followers will get on with their own lives.
Darreth again: 'they have jobs beyond adventurer – which doesn’t pay
very well obviously. You’ll meet them in their day-to-day lives.'"

I cracked up at this part since it reminded me of this scene from MacGruber. I can just imagine Hawke going through town and recruiting old war buddies for a new adventure.

The game sounds/looks more and more awesome with every bit of information that keeps coming out.

Modifié par DMC12, 19 septembre 2010 - 11:38 .

[Deviija]

I really do not understand where or when it became trendy to badmouth DAO, what with its high scores and favorable reception and millions of copies sold. Yes, it certainly did everything wrong. Everything. And deserves to be crapped on like a D-grade game by journalists and a few BW devs in recent interviews alike. It is really disheartening to read. And confusing as heck. Ultimately, what it appears to be is downplaying the past game in order to prop up the new shiny game in order to move units. 'It's better than DAO, you better reserve now.'



The preview held nothing new in terms of info. All it had to offer was a ton of buzzwords and Mass Effect comparisons. Oh, and the recurring blather about how terrible it is to read and how unwieldly having a list of roleplaying choices to choose from is. O-kaaay...

[Herr Uhl]

Lucy_Glitter wrote...

I also hate how suddenly everyone takes everything in a game literally. 

COMPANIONS DO NOT STAND AROUND FOR A BLOODY HOUR WAITING FOR YOU TO TALK. IT'S CALLED SUSPENSION OF DISBELIEF. WE HAVE USED THIS METHOD SINCE THE BIRTH OF ART. THE BIRTH. AS. IN. THE BEGINNING OF SENTIENT LIFE. 

GOD DAMMIT PEOPLE USE YOUR BRAINS. OH, RIGHT I FORGOT THAT ALL MODERN GAMERS DO NOT HAVE ANY PATIENCE NOR BRAINPOWER TO THINK. THANKS FOR REINSTATING THAT BELIEF.

Well, I'd argue that it is an improvement from Origins non the less. Why do you choose to rage against that thing out of all things. Not having to suspend disbelief should be a good thing, right?

The article had little new to offer, it is the about the same thing that we knew since a month back.

[Lucy Glitter]

Herr Uhl wrote...

Well, I'd argue that it is an improvement from Origins non the less. Why do you choose to rage against that thing out of all things. Not having to suspend disbelief should be a good thing, right?

I rage against it because they make it out like this is a horrible thing, when it's been around for ages and no one has complained about it beforehand. I have an imagination, and in an RPG, I like it use it. Imagination brings more to the story's table. It's hard to describe, perhaps because I am listening to a Bombcast atm, but I am sick of everyone bashing the whole silent protagonist thing. I really am. 

[Herr Uhl]

Lucy_Glitter wrote...

Herr Uhl wrote...

Well, I'd argue that it is an improvement from Origins non the less. Why do you choose to rage against that thing out of all things. Not having to suspend disbelief should be a good thing, right?

I rage against it because they make it out like this is a horrible thing, when it's been around for ages and no one has complained about it beforehand. I have an imagination, and in an RPG, I like it use it. Imagination brings more to the story's table. It's hard to describe, perhaps because I am listening to a Bombcast atm, but I am sick of everyone bashing the whole silent protagonist thing. I really am. 

I like the silent protagonist, but I am all for fleshing out the NPC:s on the other hand. They are their characters, the more defined they are, the better in my opinion.

[Lucy Glitter]

Can't a silent protagonist be fleshed out by you? By the writers? It's not hard.

[Herr Uhl]

Lucy_Glitter wrote...

Can't a silent protagonist be fleshed out by you? By the writers? It's not hard.

Did I say that I wanted the protagonist to be pre-defined? No, I didn't.

It is good for an NPC to be defined on the other hand.

[Amioran]

Lucy_Glitter wrote...

[b]COMPANIONS DO NOT STAND AROUND FOR A BLOODY HOUR WAITING FOR YOU TO TALK. IT'S CALLED SUSPENSION OF DISBELIEF. WE HAVE USED THIS METHOD SINCE THE BIRTH OF ART. THE BIRTH. AS. IN. THE BEGINNING OF SENTIENT LIFE. 

And leaving you no time to think clearly before replying at leisure and not knowing certainly what will happen it is called "building up tension". There are advantages and disavantages in both. So for God's sake let's not talk about a thing without understanding all the implications, would we? "Suspension of disbelief" (as you call it, but that's not exactly what happened in DAO) has the drawback naturally of giving you all the time in the world to answer and to understand all implications of what you do, this in turns it is the difference between writing a letter and instead having a conversation, the former lack the "momentum" of the latter. This is either more true given that you clearly understand what it is being said before you are saying it (as it doesn't happen in a real conversation). The advantage is that the choices are more varied, pondered, and the same time you have to reply and decide the course of action.

So, you see, as always, there's never a thing bad in absolute. The system they are using now if well implemented could create some interesting situations. Sure, it has to be seen if they will be able to do it (they didn't utilize it so well in ME) but still, it is a different way to approach things, and *not* a worser way, as you like to see it.

Modifié par Amioran, 19 septembre 2010 - 02:14 .