97 réponses à ce sujet

[AdamNW]

 The previous thread, iirc, had something similar to this:

S: Miranda
A: Grunt, Garrus, Thane
B: Everyone else
C: Jacob, Jack

After playing a bit more, I decided to alter it a bit

S: Miranda
A: Kasumi, Grunt, Morinth, Tali, Garrus
B: Legion, Samara, Mordin, Thane, Zaeed
C: Jacob, Jack

I moved Tali up because Energy Drain is gdlk in all Blue Sun missions.  It's even usable against barriers to a fair degree.  I put Morinth a tier above Samara because Dominate is so much more useful than Reave.  Thane went down because he doesn't really have great weapons and Shredder Ammo is useless.

Anyway, discuss here!

Modifié par AdamNW, 22 septembre 2010 - 03:13 .

[AntiChri5]

What is this about, how usefull they are?

[AdamNW]

Yes.

[AntiChri5]

Based on what?



Casual difficulty?



Normal difficulty?



Veteran difficulty?



Hardcore difficulty?



Insanity difficulty?



And for what class?



Soldiers?



Vanguards?



Infiltrators?



Sentinels?



Adepts?



Engineers?



And with what bonus power?



TOO MANY VARIABLES!!!



~head explodes~

[xlavaina]

In general though he's correct. I would move Samara and Morninth to D, and move Legion to A though.

[AntiChri5]

S: Miranda
A: Kasumi, Grunt, Samara, Tali, Garrus
B: Legion, Morinth, Mordin, Thane, Zaeed
C: Jacob, Jack

I just feel Reave is way more useful.

Dominate is only useful under specific conditions.

[sinosleep]

S: Miranda
A: Jacob, Samara
B: Mordin, Zaeed, Grunt
C: Morinth, Tali, Jack, Thane, Garrus.
D: Kasumi, Legion

S: Miranda has the best passive in the game, is an aoe shield destroyer, and can help with warp bombs. It's as if she has been genetically engineered to remain in your party regardless of class or playstyle.

A: Jacob not at the bottom? Blasphemy I know, but he's INVALUABLE early game. I have NEVER seen a single class guide that begins with anything other than max your class skill and max your passive. Who pray tell is providing squad ammo during those levels? 15 of them even if your preferred squad ammo is immediately available once the class skill and passive are maxed. Squad ammo on levels with lots of armor and enemies who regenerate (Garrus, Mordin, Grunt recruitment missions) which is precisely what his ammo runs counter to? Jacob is. And on top of that he adds some utility with pull for warp bombers before Jack and Samara have maxed their class passive which results in quicker pulls. With the addition of the GPS his damage is substantially increased when parked at midrange to increase his survivability and LotSB allows you to stop barrier spam. Criminally underrated squadmate. Samara has a 25% cd reduction passive, and makes a spectacular pull bot like Jack. Unlike Jack she can use an assault rifle and has reave as opposed to shockwave which is actually useful on insanity bumping her up a notch.

B: B group is multi-taskers mostly. Mordin is anti husk with cryo blast, the best anti armor in game with a 25% damage boosted incineration blast, and if nothing else is hilarious. You could say I'm biased towards him if you must. Zaeed is the only squadmate with squad disrupter which makes synthetic heavy missions a breeze for classes that either don't have it or haven't unlocked it yet and he gets 50% bonus weapon damage from his passive. Grunt is a tank, this much is true, but how often do you need a tank in this game? He does provide squad incendiary though so I'll put him in B group for multitasking like Mordin.

C: With Morinth, I usually recruit Samara instead due to getting more out of reave than dominate. Tali's drone cool down is insane, and I'm not big on ai hacking, but energy drain and it's combination of huge shield boost and overload like one click aoe shield destruction is her saving grace. Jack's usefulness depends entirely on if I'm running a caster sentinel or not. If I'm not I only use her on her loyalty mission, if I am then I use her and Samara as very helpful pull bots once I max their passives. She also gets squad warp ammo. Thane is your only other warp bomber and he gets a 50% weapon damage boost but when you do 90% of the damage yourself the weapon damage is kinda negligible. Garrus is good all around but he only has one specialty, and that's shield missions.

D: Kasumi's passive doesn't seem to work, more well rounded characters have overload, and shadow strike is an unholy pain in the rear to get to work. People complain about charge bugging out? I've had Kasumi refuse to shadow strike guys walking around in the middle of levels for reasons I can't fathom. I recruit her to get the locust and then forget she's on my squad. Legion you get entirely too late in the game to matter, particularly if you actually care about your cerberus crew.

[edited for weapon damage boosts, I mistakenly thought it was 25% when it's 50%]

Modifié par sinosleep, 22 septembre 2010 - 12:10 .

[Athenau]

Zaeed should be bumped to to A-tier. Disruptor ammo is very useful throughout most of the game, inferno grenade is one of the better CC powers on a squadmate (nice AoE, decent cooldown), the best weapon selection (assault rifles + sniper rifles), and he gets the huge +50% weapon damage boost.

[numotsbane]

I'd agree a fair bit with sinosleep list except for a few points:



Garrus: <up to B> Garrus' value comes from the fact that he's rarely not useful. I just think overload, Squad AP and concussive are a really broad range of useful powers. he has a bit of everything, and he and Miranda are my go to squad for missions where i don't know what I'm facing.

Kasumi: <up to C at least> On xbox I have kasumi and she has one power hotkeyed: flash grenade. I only use shadow strike if she's about to die, because she immediately goes invisible, stops being shot at, and starts healing. other than that she's my general cc on large protected groups.

[PrinceLionheart]

S Rank
Miranda

A Rank
Grunt
Samara

B Rank
Mordin
Jacob
Garrus
Thane
Zaeed
Kasumi

C Rank
Legion
Jack
Tali

S Rank is self explanatory.

For A rank I included Samara, who comes packed with pull, an assault rifle, reave, and a sweet sweet cool down time, and Grunt who is the best tank in the game and also comes with Squad Incendiary Ammo.

For B rank, as Sinosleep pointed out, the DLC has really increased Jacob's usefulness and surviability. Admittedly, his powers tend to overlap with Vanguard and to a lesser degree Soldier class, but really, he's quite the underrated squadmate. He's arguably the BEST squadmate to bring along if you're playing as a Sentinel or Adept. And once you complete the Liara DLC you can phase out his Barrier glitch.

For C rank it's simple, for starters you get Legion so late in the game you barely even have a chance to lose him (unless you recruit him early and get your crew killed in the process.) Tali's powers are only really useful during Geth/Mech missions and by the time you unlock Energy Drain, you'll be dealing with more enemies that have Armor and Barriers. Jack is kind of a mix bag, she has a faster cooldown time than Jacob but I find her less useful because for starters you can't max out Both Pull Field and her Squad Ammo powers without leaving her Passive half way done because Shockwave is a prerequisite. She also have considerably less health making her the more "squishy" teammate.

Modifié par PrinceLionheart, 22 septembre 2010 - 12:53 .

[sinosleep]

whoops

Modifié par sinosleep, 22 septembre 2010 - 12:52 .

[termokanden]

How can you rank them once and for all like this? If I have a Vanguard or Soldier, I am likely to use Squad Cryo and get very little out of squaddies with their own ammo powers. Furthermore, stuff like Disruptor Ammo is obviously very good against geth, but it's absolutely useless on the Collector missions. If I'm playing a caster without an ammo power, a squaddie with a squad ammo power is preferable.

So the list changes from mission to mission and with the type of character you play.

PS: Mordin deserves a special class of his own just for being awesome.

Modifié par termokanden, 22 septembre 2010 - 01:10 .

[sinosleep]

How early do you get squad cryo though? That was my point about Jacob and class guides in my first post. Unless you sacrifice your class power and passive you aren't going to be getting squad cryo for a good long while unless you are playing ng+.

[Zan Mura]

The whole concept of an S + ABC seems weird to me. Why not just ABCD? Or position 1 - 4?

Anyway, I cannot agree with Miranda being the sole S-member there. Overload and Warp are partially overlapping abilities, in general using either one alone is as useful as using the other, one is better against shields, the other equally much better against the armor. One can do decent AoE without prerequisites other than evolving it, the other needs a stripped biotic-affected target for it but also delivers double against barriers.

Comparing Miri to Garrus, what really paints the difference is their weapons and the surrounding extra powers. Garrus' powers do not overlap like Miri's. He brings a permanent +40% AP to the whole squad while still retaining a fully spammable Overload at all times and a KD from the Conc shot as a panic button. Plus his Incisor is aeons better than anything Miri can bring to the table.

Also let's be honest here, while Miri is way more pleasing to look at, Garrus is just better company all around.

But honestly, they're all useful if used right. I love Tali for her Drone alone. I'd love Legion more because he also has the sniper, but he comes in so late he doesn't matter. Grunt is a frigging miracle with Fortification up and the only companion you can rely on running around in the field who just won't frigging die. Etc.

[CC-Tron]

There is no right or wrong answer to this thread. It depends on what attributes the player values most in squad mates. I value squaddies with battle durability and gun damage (tanks) over (soft) squad members who rely more on biotics and tech. I don't use medigel at all (just the way I play).

A rank: Grunt, Legion, Jacob

B rank: Zaeed, Garrus, Samarra

C rank: Thane, Kasumi, Miranda, Jack, Tali, Mordin

Modifié par CC-Tron, 22 septembre 2010 - 01:24 .

[termokanden]

sinosleep wrote...

How early do you get squad cryo though? That was my point about Jacob and class guides in my first post. Unless you sacrifice your class power and passive you aren't going to be getting squad cryo for a good long while unless you are playing ng+.

It's a fair point, but then it just makes the whole list concept even more unclear.

For what it's worth, I agree about Jacob being much better than most people seem to give him credit for. Versatile and helps a great deal with the Incindiary Ammo, particularly in the beginning, as you say.

I've also been bringing him later on in my Adept playthrough for Squad Incindiary and Pull.

[Tony Gunslinger]

Here's my interpretation

S: Miranda

A: Garrus, Grunt, Jacob

B: Mordin, Samara, Thane

C: Kasumi, Jack, Tali

D: Legion

I put Garrus in tier A because his overload is the most powerful out of any squadmates. His + 25% power dmg sort of gives him heavy overload already at level 3, and that dmg bonus also applies to concussive or AP ammo. He also uses the two best weapon types, so he's probably the 2nd most versatile squadmate behind MIranda. Like others have said, Jacob is the best support squadmate.

Mordin could be in tier A if it weren't for the fact that all classes are already capable of damaging armor. Samara drops down to B because she's not very useful until you unlock her reave, could've used her on the collector ship.

Kasumi, Jack, and Tali are very situtional, with Kasumi lately dropping down to C due the discovery of her passive not working.

Legion is on the bottom since he's not available until very in the game. It's a shame since his stats are impressive but wasted.

[cihimi]

My (favorite) mission squadmates will depend on the class I'm playing.

[lazuli]

sinosleep wrote...

D: Kasumi's passive doesn't seem to work, more well rounded characters have overload, and shadow strike is an unholy pain in the rear to get to work. People complain about charge bugging out? I've had Kasumi refuse to shadow strike guys walking around in the middle of levels for reasons I can't fathom. I recruit her to get the locust and then forget she's on my squad.

Sinosleep, this has been my experience with Kasumi as well.  I started a thread seeking advice because I assumed I was the only one who had difficulty using her.  In the end, using Kasumi on Insanity is more than a bit of a gamble.

But to get back on topic, it's hard to nail down specific tiers for each squadmate because their effectiveness can vary depending on the class you choose when starting the game and the specific build you intend to use.  All the same, it's fun to rank squadmates.  I've included Liara even though you can't use her outside of a certain DLC.

S: Miranda, Liara
A: Garrus, Thane, Jacob
B: Mordin, Samara, Zaeed
C: Grunt, Jack
D: Kasumi
F: Legion, Tali, Morinth

S: Miranda doesn't need an explanation.  All four of Liara's skills are fantastic.  Stasis, in particular, is incredibly useful on Insanity.

A: Garrus and Thane serve similar purposes depending on the mission.  They provide defense removal and long range damage, keeping them safe.  Jacob's early access to Pull and Incendiary Ammo make him useful for a wide range of classes in the early game.  In the late game, some of this effectiveness fades unless you're playing a caster.

B: Mordin has an awesome nuke and decent survivability.  Additionally, he can disable entire groups of enemies at once.  Samara is great for Pull and Area Reave.  Zaeed's Squad Disruptor Ammo gets things popping on specific missions, but I don't find him as effective as Garrus.  He's a good choice for Haestrom or Canalus though.

C: I only ever use Grunt on two missions: his loyalty mission and the Derelict Reaper.  He's great at clearing out husks and will never die if you watch his back.  Still, these are limited applications.  Jack can have a great recharge on her Pull, but she suffers from Samara syndrome.  She's got three great abilities (cooldown reduction, Pull Field, and Squad Warp Ammo), but you can never get all three to their max level.

D: Kasumi has a lot of potential but crippling bugs and unreliability ruin her.  Still, I find her more useful than...

F: Legion's skill set is so bad it looks like it was designed before global cooldowns were implemented.  Couple that with his arrival late in the game and you get a fairly useless character.  I use him on his loyalty mission and nothing else.  Because of upgrades, I always put Tali's recruitment off until near the end of the game.  By then, Garrus has had an increased damage Area Overload for years and Tali can't keep up.  I relied on Tali in the first game, but she's pretty terrible now.  Morinth is awful on Insanity.  Other characters provide more utility and still carry great Biotics (Jacob, Jack, Samara).

Modifié par lazuli, 22 septembre 2010 - 02:12 .

[Leon Zweihander]

With the exception of Miranda, rankings are biased because of the player's class. For example, OP's rank A's are mostly tech-based, which leads me to the assumption that his classes tend to have biotics. As others have said, Samara should be A ranked. For classes with no biotics, her Reave for armors/barriers, Pull for warp detonations, and assault rifle make her an excellent teammate.

[Kronner]

Miranda - take her on almost every mission

Thane, Zaeed, Samara and Garrus see a lot of action too.

Grunt and Legion are my favourite squadmates, I use them quite often.



I almost never use the rest. Jacob, Jack, Tali, Kasumi and Mordin rarely leave Normandy.

[Teknor]

Legion with widow gets the highest burst damage output after you. Certainly not a F grade.

[lazuli]

Teknor wrote...

Legion with widow gets the highest burst damage output after you. Certainly not a F grade.

The other squadmates can use the Incisor instead of the Widow and still provide utility that Legion's terrible skill set lacks.  The only ability he has that you can use with any degree of frequency is AI Hacking.  AI Hacking.  I don't mind Legion as a character, but his skills are awful.

As far as weapon damage goes, I want most of that to come from Shepard if I'm a combat class.  If I'm an Adept or Sentinel, I'm going to want squadmates that can set me up for Warp explosions by using Pull or stripping defenses. Legion might get used more if I played Engineer again, but his late game arrival ruins him in that regard.

Legion gets a big fat F from me.

Modifié par lazuli, 22 septembre 2010 - 03:02 .

[sinosleep]

Teknor wrote...

Legion with widow gets the highest burst damage output after you. Certainly not a F grade.

Even if Legion did Shepard damage, I'd still rank him low based on how late you get him. I mean come on, if you want to save all of the crew you can use him all of twice in the entirety of the game.

[Teknor]

Considering that, yeah Legion belongs to sh*t tier.