105 réponses à ce sujet

[RavenousBear]

To be honest, since I love underdogs in RL, I would get thrown out from the Proving grounds if I saw the DC pull that off.

[Reika]

I don't blame you one bit.

[Obadiah]

Reika wrote...

Caak7i wrote...

I forgot to add in the "after breaking from Beraht's base" from my previous when he conscripts you and saves your life. The other scene I believe he tried to talk to the proving master into letting the DC go but the master was too furious with the "shame" the DC brought to the ceremony. It has been a long time since I played that origin so my memory is a bit fuzzy.

I knew what you meant, but I thought Duncan's reaction at the proving was amusing.

Actually, Duncan in the Dwarf Commoner origin is a bit more amusing and playful than Duncan elsewhere, starting with his goofy "Stone met" attempt at a formal dwarf greeting.

[Reika]

Obadiah wrote...

Actually, Duncan in the Dwarf Commoner origin is a bit more amusing and playful than Duncan elsewhere, starting with his goofy "Stone met" attempt at a formal dwarf greeting.

I think he was channelling his inner Alistair.

Modifié par Reika, 25 septembre 2010 - 03:53 .

[Bahlgan]

Reika wrote...

Obadiah wrote...

Actually, Duncan in the Dwarf Commoner origin is a bit more amusing and playful than Duncan elsewhere, starting with his goofy "Stone met" attempt at a formal dwarf greeting.

I think he was channelling his inner Alistair.

Hah hah!! That is pretty good! That, or the inner "ritual go into the kitchen and eat more than your weight" syndrome.

So I believe it is safe to say that we are practically all in agreement that Duncan is, in his own way, an excellent mentor/father figure and just needs more potential released into the game than just a narration and a few golden moments in Ostagar? I would like to have it to where also the Warden might, once or twice, dream about Duncan other than that event with "him" in the fade.

Perhaps this is just wishful thinking but maybe Duncan will have a mention in DA2.

[TJPags]

Oh, I'd HATE it if my PC dreamed about Duncan. Honestly, I never got why he showed in the Fade, given how much - or how little, to be precise - air time he actually got.

I'd go for it IF he had more involvement before his death than he actually does. But since he has practically none, I don't like the whole "Grey Warden mentor" thing, and I'd HATE for the game to give us more of that for what I see as no reason.



I think we don't ALL agree . . .

[Reika]

I would've liked to have seen more of Duncan, but I believe one of the writers mentioned that the only way we would see more of him is only in pre-Origins stories.

[RavenousBear]

TJPags wrote...

Oh, I'd HATE it if my PC dreamed about Duncan. Honestly, I never got why he showed in the Fade, given how much - or how little, to be precise - air time he actually got.
I'd go for it IF he had more involvement before his death than he actually does. But since he has practically none, I don't like the whole "Grey Warden mentor" thing, and I'd HATE for the game to give us more of that for what I see as no reason.

I think we don't ALL agree . . .

Unless there was more interaction during the trip to Ostagar from your origin's location, I do not agree that Duncan would take priority over the other origin characters. Something bad always happened to your friends, family, etc no matter what path you taken during the origin. I believe they missed a golden opportunity for more depth to the origin stories in the Fade.

I would not mind him being the "Grey Warden mentor" if there was more involved in the story. Otherwise, he is just another character who makes a brief appearance before being killed by the plot.

[Obadiah]

Bioware really could have improved that with a simple codex entry on arrival at Ostagar saying, "On the short trip to Ostagar, you got to know the Grey Warden Duncan who was blah blah blah...."

[Bahlgan]

TJPags wrote...

Oh, I'd HATE it if my PC dreamed about Duncan. Honestly, I never got why he showed in the Fade, given how much - or how little, to be precise - air time he actually got.
I'd go for it IF he had more involvement before his death than he actually does. But since he has practically none, I don't like the whole "Grey Warden mentor" thing, and I'd HATE for the game to give us more of that for what I see as no reason.

I think we don't ALL agree . . .

You seem to say that you are sick of Duncan to death to the point to where you don't want your Warden to dream of him during some battle or any form of event, yet you are completely fine with him as long as he gets more air time. That to me is oxymoronic (if that's even a real word); makes you unpredictable. You sir are quite enigmatic. 

But which one is it? You do or don't want him to be more involved in the game?

I would've liked to have seen more of Duncan, but I believe one of the writers mentioned that the only way we would see more of him is only in pre-Origins stories.

Yea too bad indeed. I loved Duncan and saw much potential in him for Origins. It seems that we will just have to imagine what kind of bond our Wardens sustained with him; that seems also to be a factor into the story which Bioware had left for each and every individual to determine for our own causes. I would make my own story, but I fear it would not get as much attention as I hope for. Ah the motivations....

Modifié par Bahlgan, 25 septembre 2010 - 06:58 .

[Reika]

Bahlgan wrote...

Yea too bad indeed. I loved Duncan and saw much potential in him for Origins. It seems that we will just have to imagine what kind of bond our Wardens sustained with him; that seems also to be a factor into the story which Bioware had left for each and every individual to determine for our own causes. I would make my own story, but I fear it would not get as much attention as I hope for. Ah the motivations....

Go for writing the story, if only for your satisfaction. I'm just shameless about plugging my own, not so great stuff.

[Reika]

Dalira Montanti wrote...

Ducan is like Marmite you either love him or hate him or smudge him on bread mmmmm

:lol:

Too true.

[Bahlgan]

I cannot help but imagine what it would be like to have Duncan without his beard or mustache. Would he look a bit like Elmer Fudd?

[CalJones]

Well, not quite. I feel totally indifferent about Duncan. There are characters I love, and characters I hate. And Alistair I love and hate at the same time. But Duncan? Nothing.

[TJPags]

Bahlgan wrote...

TJPags wrote...

Oh, I'd HATE it if my PC dreamed about Duncan. Honestly, I never got why he showed in the Fade, given how much - or how little, to be precise - air time he actually got.
I'd go for it IF he had more involvement before his death than he actually does. But since he has practically none, I don't like the whole "Grey Warden mentor" thing, and I'd HATE for the game to give us more of that for what I see as no reason.

I think we don't ALL agree . . .

You seem to say that you are sick of Duncan to death to the point to where you don't want your Warden to dream of him during some battle or any form of event, yet you are completely fine with him as long as he gets more air time. That to me is oxymoronic (if that's even a real word); makes you unpredictable. You sir are quite enigmatic. 

But which one is it? You do or don't want him to be more involved in the game?

I would've liked to have seen more of Duncan, but I believe one of the writers mentioned that the only way we would see more of him is only in pre-Origins stories.

Yea too bad indeed. I loved Duncan and saw much potential in him for Origins. It seems that we will just have to imagine what kind of bond our Wardens sustained with him; that seems also to be a factor into the story which Bioware had left for each and every individual to determine for our own causes. I would make my own story, but I fear it would not get as much attention as I hope for. Ah the motivations....

I don't think I'm enigmatic at all.

Duncan got barely any face time in this game, yet somehow he is my "grey warden mentor", the sloth demon tries to tempt me with dreams of him, and I am supposed to somehow be broken up over his death? 

IF he had more time, and IF there was something resembling mentoring or bonding happening in the game, this might make sense.  But there isn't, and it doesn't, so no, I don't see the need for any more Duncan.  I see the need for less  - the fade dream would have been much more realistic had, say, the Cousland seen his/her parents, the DE his dead friend, the DN his dead father, etc.

I wouldn't mind if the game had put more Duncan in it - since it didn't, I see no reason for anyone to want any more.

[Reika]

TJPags wrote...

Duncan got barely any face time in this game, yet somehow he is my "grey warden mentor", the sloth demon tries to tempt me with dreams of him, and I am supposed to somehow be broken up over his death? 

IF he had more time, and IF there was something resembling mentoring or bonding happening in the game, this might make sense.  But there isn't, and it doesn't, so no, I don't see the need for any more Duncan.  I see the need for less  - the fade dream would have been much more realistic had, say, the Cousland seen his/her parents, the DE his dead friend, the DN his dead father, etc.

I wouldn't mind if the game had put more Duncan in it - since it didn't, I see no reason for anyone to want any more.

Yeah, never got the Duncan thing for any of my characters at all, especially my HNF. Then again if she'd been given the dream of her family, she wouldn't have broken out of it.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

How Duncan is viewed depends entirely on the character. My human noble despises him for forcibly conscripting her and blackmailing her old man. My mage and dwarf casteless, however, see him as a hero who not only saved them from certain doom, but gave them the chance at freedom and a better life they would have never realized before. My dwarf noble saw him as her ticket out of the deep roads, my city elf her meal ticket out of ghetto city and jail.



It really is a matter of your origin, and how exactly you RP your character and your origin, which ultimately decides how one views Duncan.



Putside the game, though, he has The Beard. That alone is proof of his divine awesomeness.

[Bahlgan]

How Duncan is viewed depends entirely on the character. My human noble despises him for forcibly conscripting her and blackmailing her old man.

Eh, my human noble saw it differently. Seeing as to that his parents were dead, Duncan was the one to make sure that he grew stronger for it and pushed forward as a new recruit. Duncan, to my warden, was also viewed as his only hope for a second chance; certainly against Howe as well.

It really is a matter of your origin, and how exactly you RP your character and your origin, which ultimately decides how one views Duncan. 

I CANNOT believe my "internet ears" when seeing someone type that they hated Duncan, or could not stand him, or wanted him dead (no worries I am not pointing specific fingers at anyone). Sure he was pragmatic in some of the origins, but what do you guys expect him to say?

Duncan - you see Teryn Cousland, I could use your Warden to fight the darkspawn.

Bryce - Be that as it may, this is my son we're talking about. I am sorry, friend, but the answer is no.

Duncan - Oh well, I suppose it is ok, I will just march back empty handed and tell the forces that it is a no-go. Oh, did I mention the darkspawn are an iminent threat to all of life as we know it, and that if we do not recruit strong spirited fighters to counter their prowess, that Ferelden will fall?

Bryce - The answer is NO!

Duncan - I see... *walks away sucking his thumb*

Let's be honest here. If not for him, your warden would not be in the game. He/she would probably be slain by Howe soldiers, serving up a nug dish for Beraht everyday, or doomed to die a withered rose's death from the Dalish Origin. Hell, as a mage I believe you might be sentenced to the Aeonar, am I right? Be grateful of his existence, as to his sacrifice, honor, and time taken made the difference between a saved and doomed Ferelden. A difference made in YOUR warden.

IF he had more time, and IF there was something resembling mentoring or bonding happening in the game, this might make sense. But there isn't, and it doesn't, so no, I don't see the need for any more Duncan. I see the need for less - the fade dream would have been much more realistic had, say, the Cousland seen his/her parents, the DE his dead friend, the DN his dead father, etc.

Bioware does a good job at overlooking certain possibilities; then again, there is a certain budget they have, which quite frankly I do not believe had anything to do with missing storyline.

I wouldn't mind if the game had put more Duncan in it - since it didn't, I see no reason for anyone to want any more.

I will respect your opinion, though strongly disapprove. At least do not forget considering characters such as myself who roleplay beyond one's wildest dreams. I am up for extending the storyline anytime, even if it means Bioware fails to do it themselves. Yes, I go that far. Yes, it just happened.

Modifié par Bahlgan, 26 septembre 2010 - 06:09 .

[CalJones]

Skadi's saying that particular character hates Duncan - which is a fair viewpoint. Duncan comes off least well in the HN origin. He knows damned well that your Cousland could well be the last surviving member of the family, yet conscripts them anyway in the full knowledge that they could die in the joining, the battle or, if they survive, have their fertility compromised. He's practically condemning one Fereldan's noble families to extinction.

Of course, it turns out that Fergus survives, but at that point in the game, it's not a given. Duncan lies to Bryce, saying that he'll make sure your Cousland lives, when he knows full well the joining could kill them. Frankly, he's a ruthless bastard.

Some may play their Couslands as people who don't want to be nobles and are relieved to be escaping from that. But anyone is justified in playing their Cousland as someone who hates Duncan, for very understandable reasons.

[Bahlgan]

He's practically condemning one Fereldan's noble families to extinction.

That is completely debatable. Condemning assumes that the Warden doesn't have a chance at survival at all. Guess what? He does survive, however by luck or genes is irrelevant, as to we don't the secret to surviving the joining.

Of course, it turns out that Fergus survives, but at that point in the game, it's not a given. Duncan lies to Bryce, saying that he'll make sure your Cousland lives, when he knows full well the joining could kill them. Frankly, he's a ruthless bastard.

So it never occurred to you that Duncan might have hoped for the Warden's survival? I believe he kept his word, whether or not the Warden dies, for Grey Wardens are needed to fight the darkspawn, and they DO take priority over Howe. Let's not forget that.

[CalJones]

You are confusing Skadi's and my characters' opinions with our actual opinions as players. As Skadi said, the different origins give varying views of Duncan - he is a saviour to some, but less so to others. If someone wants to roleplay their character as feeling hard done by, then that's perfectly fine.

Still, to address your points:



1) Metagaming. A lot of recruits die in the joining. Duncan doesn't know the Cousland kid will survive. He thinks they have a chance to, but there's no guarantee.



2) Of course it occurs to me. Your missing my point. Duncan obviously hopes the Cousland kid will survive. He needs recruits, after all. But he has no way of knowing that they will survive so his promise to Bryce Cousland is false. Hoping for something and guaranteeing it are two different things.

[Elhanan]

I really liked Duncan until he copied my 'Climbing the Ogre' moves I just finished in the Tower. Now cause he dies and gets a cool cut-scene, he gets all the credit.....

[Bratinov]

Duncan got what he deserved, and i love telling Alistair that.
Its a shame you cant hurl the joining chalice at his face.

Modifié par Bratinov, 26 septembre 2010 - 09:09 .

[Elhanan]

Only one of the Origins that I do not care for Duncan much is Dalish Elf. While he does save me by taking me back to camp, the best deal I then get is a 30 year extension from the so called cure. 30 yrs?!! I am an Elf that used to live thousands of years! *mumbles something about Shem medicine*

The rest of my Wardens admire what he is. My Human Nobles get to say farewell to their parents, my DN survives the Deep Roads, my DC and CE gets to avoid execution, and my Mages get to leave the Circle Tower. What ain't to like?