76 réponses à ce sujet

[EmonFett]

I know it seems really out there.... What more evidence do they need? they're ignorance baffles me. At one point they claim geth built sovereign i'm glad legion intervened and put them straight.

[LuxDragon]

Nah, they're just idiots.

[Mr. Gogeta34]

They're not quick to jump on large truths. Smaller ones are just more digestible.



But considering that the Citadel is a Reaper structure, they could've been indoctrinated to deny the Reapers. At this point the Council could really keep spinning the truth around to deny the Reapers until the end of time... no matter what you show them.

[Sajuro]

You know, I don't know why it seems so incomprehensible to some people that the Council wouldn't tell the truth to a former Spectre who supposedly died 2 years ago but is now allied with Cerberus. Has it ever occurred to you that the council is, you know, withholding information.

[The Big Nothing]

Oh, man - it all makes sense now!

[AntiChri5]

Or they are simply lying to a Cerberus spy.



Politicians, lying, who could imagine?

[betd2]

You know all this grief with the Council could have probably been avoided if we had managed to goad Sovereign into a "I am your DOOOOOM" speech during the battle of the Citadel. or if we had recorded our talk with Sovereign on Vermire or with Vigil.

[Sajuro]

AntiChri5 wrote...

Or they are simply lying to a Cerberus spy.

Politicians, lying, who could imagine?

No, don't you see anyone who doesn't believe the Shepard was dead and somehow brought back to life by a terrorist organization and doesn't trust him implicitly must be stupid,evil, or controlled by the reapers since revival is so logical

[Mr. Gogeta34]

Sajuro wrote...

You know, I don't know why it seems so incomprehensible to some people that the Council wouldn't tell the truth to a former Spectre who supposedly died 2 years ago but is now allied with Cerberus. Has it ever occurred to you that the council is, you know, withholding information.

They apparently don't know that he died, only that he went off the radar long enought to be declared dead.  The reason some doubt they're withholding information is that they came up with a really good reason to doubt the Reapers.  It's also because the Council has always been like this.  Making these kinds of excuses are not new to them... if it were a change, then you'd be more likely to suspect information withholding.

Modifié par Mr. Gogeta34, 26 septembre 2010 - 01:33 .

[Anacronian Stryx]

In any case it is political convenient to uphold the facade that the citadel was attacked by the Geth and nothing else.

[Mr. Gogeta34]

You were sent to fight the Geth before you were killed and before you teamed up with Cerberus. The Council denied the Reaper's existence even then.

Modifié par Mr. Gogeta34, 26 septembre 2010 - 01:35 .

[PWENER]

Hope so, It's a reason to kill them. Oh wait, I already did that.



lol

[betd2]

betd2 wrote...

You know all this grief with the Council could have probably been avoided if we had managed to goad Sovereign into a "I am your DOOOOOM" speech during the battle of the Citadel. or if we had recorded our talk with Sovereign on Vermire or with Vigil.

and because no one on the Normandy had a video camera we still haven't shown the Council a single scrap of solid evidence.  all they have is our word.  would you belive that the end of the universe is coming because a few people told you?

[Mr. Gogeta34]

They would've blamed Sovereigns speech on an AI made by Saren to convince the Geth that the Reapers were real.

[Anacronian Stryx]

Knowledge of the reapers is like a dirty family secret everybody in the family knows about it but only the black sheep uncle/aunt talks about it (shep).

[betd2]

Anacronian Stryx wrote...

Knowledge of the reapers is like a dirty family secret everybody in the family knows about it but only the black sheep uncle/aunt talks about it (shep).

Yeah in the middle of his "Ah, yes, Reapers" Speech that Turian bastard was probably checking on the Turian's new super-secret anti-Reaper superweapon.

[UNAVAILABLE]

You know all this grief with the Council could have probably been avoided if we had managed to goad Sovereign into a "I am your DOOOOOM" speech during the battle of the Citadel. or if we had recorded our talk with Sovereign on Vermire or with Vigil.

and because no one on the Normandy had a video camera we still haven't shown the Council a single scrap of solid evidence. 

The lack of recording equipment is kind of interesting. Especially considering the Council doubts Shepard's word about anything from the getgo, and it is a recording that gets Saren exposed as a traitor. You'd think Shepard would start video documenting everything.

all they have is our word.  would you belive that the end of the universe is coming because a few people told you?

If I trusted that person enough to appoint her an elite, above the law defender of the galaxy, I might.


Here's the Renegade option I'd like to see.

Council: Ah yes, the "Reapers". We have dismissed this claim as a myth.
Shepard: Oh really. Then explain THIS!

(Shepard activates the Citadel Relay. Thousands of Reapers pour through.)

Shepard: There. See that. Bet you feel pretty damn stupid now, don't you?

+99999999 Renegade Points

Modifié par UNAVAILABLE, 26 septembre 2010 - 03:23 .

[betd2]

UNAVAILABLE wrote...



Here's the Renegade option I'd like to see.

Council: Ah yes, the "Reapers". We have dismissed this claim as a myth.
Shepard: Oh really. Then explain THIS!

(Shepard activates the Citadel Relay. Thousands of Reapers pour through.)

Shepard: There. See that. Bet you feel pretty damn stupid now, don't you?

+99999999 Renegade Points

ROFLOL:lol:  I would keep a save just so I could do that once a day

[Sajuro]

betd2 wrote...

Anacronian Stryx wrote...

Knowledge of the reapers is like a dirty family secret everybody in the family knows about it but only the black sheep uncle/aunt talks about it (shep).

Yeah in the middle of his "Ah, yes, Reapers" Speech that Turian bastard was probably checking on the Turian's new super-secret anti-Reaper superweapon.

-Shepard storms out of Anderson's office after the meeting-
Anderson: So what did the Heirarchy say?
Turian Councilor: They've got the Destiny Ascension's Anti-Reaper cannon online and are now mass producing them for our ships
Asari Councilor: It's gonna be a massacre.

later
-Shepard is facing down the Reaper fleet with the Quarians as the geth had yet to arrive-
Harbinger: We are your doom! -blown up by Destiny Ascension right after it exits FTL-
Turian Councilor: Ah yes "Reapers" -gives signal for citadel fleet to open fire on the Reapers- we've dismissed that claim.

[Aedan_Cousland]

PWENER wrote...

Hope so, It's a reason to kill them. Oh wait, I already did that.

lol

Except allowing the alien council to die doesn't change anything. The human council also sticks their heads in the sand and refuses to believe in the Reapers.

[Prince of Kemet]

I don't think that the council is indoctrinated. If you go back to when Shep was talking to the council...remember when the Turian counselor did his famous, ah yes finger quote thing....the moment he says, "We have dismissed those claims" he looks at the other two council members as if to say, yeah we know the truth but, we don't want you to know that we know. So what I got from this was, the council does know, they just don't trust Shep enough to reveal their plans for the reapers. That's just my take on the matter.

[P3G4SU5]

Sajuro wrote...

betd2 wrote...

Anacronian Stryx wrote...
Knowledge of the reapers is like a dirty family secret everybody in the family knows about it but only the black sheep uncle/aunt talks about it (shep).

Yeah in the middle of his "Ah, yes, Reapers" Speech that Turian bastard was probably checking on the Turian's new super-secret anti-Reaper superweapon.

-Shepard storms out of Anderson's office after the meeting-
Anderson: So what did the Heirarchy say?
Turian Councilor: They've got the Destiny Ascension's Anti-Reaper cannon online and are now mass producing them for our ships
Asari Councilor: It's gonna be a massacre.

later
-Shepard is facing down the Reaper fleet with the Quarians as the geth had yet to arrive-
Harbinger: We are your doom! -blown up by Destiny Ascension right after it exits FTL-
Turian Councilor: Ah yes "Reapers" -gives signal for citadel fleet to open fire on the Reapers- we've dismissed that claim.

Councilor Velarn +9999 Like 

Prince of Kemet wrote...
I don't think that the council is
indoctrinated. If you go back to when Shep was talking to the
council...remember when the Turian counselor did his famous, ah yes
finger quote thing....the moment he says, "We have dismissed those
claims" he looks at the other two council members as if to say, yeah we
know the truth but, we don't want you to know that we know. So what I
got from this was, the council does know, they just don't trust Shep
enough to reveal their plans for the reapers. That's just my take on the
matter.

I share this view. When it was said that no debris was recovered from the remains of Sovereign it  screamed: "Council cover-up!". It is likely they did this partly for the reasons above (a Spectre working with a terrorist organisation is ample reason enough for distrust, despite any previous services they have done for the Council) but I believe the main reason for them to keep the Reaper threat hidden is to maintain galactic stability.

Making it widely known to the public that an extremely powerful collection of sentient beings who are responsible for successfully repeating galactic genocide over millenia would be counterproductive to any effort against fighting them. There would be immediate panic and disorder which would disrupt security and infrastructure, something which is undesirable when preparing for a state of war, and furthermore nothing would be achieved by letting the public know. The races with enough miltary power to actually contribute towards fighting the Reapers are already on the Council, and the few others (Krogan, Quarian, Geth) were warned by Shepard and prepared for the war in ME3.

The Council's behaviour in this regard is therefore entirely logical if they wish to have their military and economy ready for when the Reapers finally arrive. The Council will eventually have to let the public know what is coming nearer the time, when proper evacuation and defence plans have been formed. 

Modifié par P3G4SU5, 26 septembre 2010 - 01:06 .

[lovgreno]

Sajuro wrote...

betd2 wrote...

Anacronian Stryx wrote...

Knowledge of the reapers is like a dirty family secret everybody in the family knows about it but only the black sheep uncle/aunt talks about it (shep).

Yeah in the middle of his "Ah, yes, Reapers" Speech that Turian bastard was probably checking on the Turian's new super-secret anti-Reaper superweapon.

-Shepard storms out of Anderson's office after the meeting-
Anderson: So what did the Heirarchy say?
Turian Councilor: They've got the Destiny Ascension's Anti-Reaper cannon online and are now mass producing them for our ships
Asari Councilor: It's gonna be a massacre.

later
-Shepard is facing down the Reaper fleet with the Quarians as the geth had yet to arrive-
Harbinger: We are your doom! -blown up by Destiny Ascension right after it exits FTL-
Turian Councilor: Ah yes "Reapers" -gives signal for citadel fleet to open fire on the Reapers- we've dismissed that claim.

As a fan of the turian councilour I would love to see that.

But to answer the original question:
Shepard have little evidence to prove the rather wild story he/she tells the Council.
The Council are politicians, they always knows more than they tell you.
A Geth attack is a more realistic threat and also a good cover for the councils own investigations. It's unwise to think all they do has to include Shepard.

Indoctrination is a weapon the reapers don't use untill the invasion has started to not lose the element of suprise. The only exception is as a security measure on reapers, their artifacts and bases. As there is little chance that organics will come in contact with those and that they don't want them to get away with information about reapers the risk of revealing their secret weapon is small and worth it to take. If people on the Citadell should start acting strange however it would be a bit too suspicious, so no I doubt there is any indoctrination traps on the Citadell and Mass relays, no need for it.

[Silentmode]

"Ah yes, yet another conspiricy theory has arisen to make sence of the councils unfathomable tardness, we have dismissed that claim.

[FlyinElk212]

I wouldn't like it if the council was just indoctrinated the entire time. It'd ruin the whole "Who's Better, Council/Alliance or Cerberus?" argument.

The Council is morally just, but gets little to nothing accomplished. Cerberus is just the opposite. If the Council was only useless due to an outside force, than they have a perfectly acceptable reason reason for their flaw, making them, easily, the better party of the two. Especially if the council WOULD be willing to help you if they weren't indoctrinated.

Modifié par FlyinElk212, 26 septembre 2010 - 04:47 .