1700 réponses à ce sujet

[Hopefire]

For me, the lack of depth regarding Shepard's death is the most annoying thing in the game. I would have really, really liked something like Shepard overhearing a conversation between Miranda and Tali, where Miranda admits that Shepard is less than 30% original parts - more machine and cloned tissue. Or to find a lab where some of the experiments were done that led to the tech used to revive Shepard - hundreds of people killed in Mengele-like labs, and the horror (or lack thereof...) on Shepard's part. Or finding out that among the "upgrades" that Shepard got was Geth technology, long before Legion explained exactly how the Geth worked, and that Shepard is now effectively part Geth. And maybe has a Krogan liver. I would have liked more tie-in to the Shepard origin stories - a chance to talk to Hannah Shepard and say "Sorry for not calling, mom, but I really was dead." Or to talk to someone - anyone - about the last few seconds of her life.



In the entire game, the only time it's really been more of a passing mention has been with Liara. She's really the only character that actually seems to be having a hard time with the whole "Shepard died" and "Shepard got better" plot. She has a reaction more complex than "Yay, you're back, I've got a happy!" or "You're back, and I feel angry with you for dying!"

[Nightwriter]

Hopefire wrote...

For me, the lack of depth regarding Shepard's death is the most annoying thing in the game. I would have really, really liked something like Shepard overhearing a conversation between Miranda and Tali, where Miranda admits that Shepard is less than 30% original parts - more machine and cloned tissue. Or to find a lab where some of the experiments were done that led to the tech used to revive Shepard - hundreds of people killed in Mengele-like labs, and the horror (or lack thereof...) on Shepard's part. Or finding out that among the "upgrades" that Shepard got was Geth technology, long before Legion explained exactly how the Geth worked, and that Shepard is now effectively part Geth. And maybe has a Krogan liver. I would have liked more tie-in to the Shepard origin stories - a chance to talk to Hannah Shepard and say "Sorry for not calling, mom, but I really was dead." Or to talk to someone - anyone - about the last few seconds of her life.

*drools*

[Turin_4]

IU

People will always feel like they got to defy the Council more than they did TIM. And rightly so.

There is some accuracy to this complaint, and some inaccuracy.

On the one hand, you get more conflict with your 'bosses' in ME1 than 2.  That's definitely true.  On the other hand, who is really 'controlling' you that you can be in conflict with in ME2?  OK, so tIM informs you, "Horizon is under attack by Collectors right now, this very second, and its colonists are being abducted."  Are you seriously suggesting Shepard - Paragon or Renegade - should have the option to say, "No thanks, there's a loyalty mission I'd much rather complete right now instead, screw you tIM!"

I mean, it's a null option, isn't it?  Plot-wise, there isn't anything else Shepard of any stripe would do.  She would stop what she was doing and go fight the Collectors to save the humans who were being abducted right then.  And when there is some wiggle room - when the choice is, for example, build the team vs. get the IFF - you don't have to take Cerberus's advice.

- You can make the Council unhappy, consistently, throughout ME1,
depending on your decisions. (you get to make TIM unhappy with ONE
decision)

I believe you can make tIM unhappy repeatedly, depending on the stances you take with him, just not as overtly as with the council, that's true.  Particularly with respect to how you handle the 'you sent us into a trap' situation.

- You are never told exactly what to do by the Council (they only
give you helpful locations just, you know, if you wanna check it out).

In ME1 if I'm not mistaken, the structure took the form largely of, "We've lost contact with xyz," or, "We've heard reports from xyz," or, "Such and such's daughter was last seen here," etc. etc.  Things are different here.

- The Council never tells you when to do something, or in what order. Not so with TIM. When he snaps his fingers, you jump.

This is simply inaccurate.  You're on rails, but all of those were in response to Collector attacks or Collector actions.  tIM discovers something the Collectors have done, something that if not acted on immediately will become worthless...and you want Shepard to what, have the option to pull a General Maclellan and say, "Piffle to these battle plans, don't need `em!"

- Your entire relationship with the Council was based on conflict right from the very beginning.

I guess I come at ME2 differently than the majority of the posters in this thread, then, because whereas in ME1 I felt like I had the backing of a powerful and capable economic and military structure - the Alliance - in ME2, right from the get-go - I felt desperate.  Like, and I've used this reference before, Allies in 39-41 desperate.

In the entire game, the only time it's really been more of a
passing mention has been with Liara. She's really the only character
that actually seems to be having a hard time with the whole "Shepard
died" and "Shepard got better" plot. She has a reaction more complex
than "Yay, you're back, I've got a happy!" or "You're back, and I feel
angry with you for dying!"

I don't think the ideas you mentioned specifically would have worked very well, but I did very much enjoy the way they handled Liara's handling of Shepard's death, I agree.  Bioware dropped the ball there.

[Nightwriter]

Here's the thing. You wall of texted me. I could start a text chain to counter each of your points bullet by bullet.

But then people would stop listening to me. Because no one wants to read text chains. They don't care and aren't interested. As soon as they see people have become embroiled in text chains they stop reading them.

I don't like that. I want people to listen to me. I want to say stuff and have people read it. So I'm not sure what to do. Do I respond to each of your points? Cuz I have responses for each of them. Or do I just make a witty retort? Do I let this one go? Do I make my argument? Do I say I never felt like the Collectors were compelling the plot, but TIM? And that the compulsory nature of the missions drained all interaction and participatory value from them?

[Nightwriter]

You see! You just read my post because it wasn't a text chain! And so Nightwriter ensnared another unwitting reader.

[AntiChri5]

You mastermind you.

[AntiChri5]

It was a unique event, true. Usually I just read the first sentence of your post and respond to that. I do that with a lot of people.

Well, now i know to ignore you.

Or at the least always include some insults whenever i talk to you, on the third or foirth sentence.

[Nightwriter]

Oh, don't stop there, throw in totally unrelated sentences around the end of the paragraph.

"Cerberus is wrong because it will not admit that morality is not based upon outcome, the things it does are unjustified whether they pay off or not. And then the T-Rex came out of the closet and ran off with Ryan Seacrest and I said it'll never work, his color is fuchsia and yours is mauve, you'll always clash, where is to bananas? The seagulls are thirsty I'm wearing mayonnaise and I don't care who romanced it scissors fifty-seven avocado Yoda."

Then you can really chide him when he complains about you not reading what he said, see.

[AntiChri5]

Night, you are the queen of random.



Seriously, wtf was that!?



Glorious.

[Moiaussi]

Kavadas wrote...

Not really.  Customization happens in the planning stages of an operation.  Equipment adjusments on the individual level mid-battle are quite ridiculous.  No soldier on the modern battlefield is going to be swapping their M4's M68 Aimpoint for an ACOG mid-firefight (they'd be seriously reprimanded if they were that stupid).

Things of that nature are factored into section and squad loadout designations which are all planned in advance by way of a unit's (M)TOE.  It's this type of diversified squad loadout specialization which offers true tactical flexibility, not some silly mechanic like switching between two ARs which trade damage for accuracy, and vice versa, that we experienced in ME1; I'm glad to see those days gone.

You can make exceptions to this, sometimes, in the form of weapons systems like the XM307/XM312

I'm cool with having an inventory so long as it's tied to the ship.  The equipment choices made pre-mission should be an interesting part of the game that rewards/punishes players who approach objectives with some true insight.

But there's absolutely no way Shepard should have a "pocket" inventory ala-ME1.  It's just an arcane fantasy mechanic that a few die-hard Arr-Pee-Geers QQ about every now and then.

Anyways, queue the inevitable "U R so dum, this is a game!!!  U cant use RL 2 pik a-part gaym mekaniks!!!" peeps...

If the weapons were sufficiently modular, re-calibration was not an issue, and the components light enough to be easily carried and kept sorted, why wouldn't they? Do modern soldiers only carry one type of grenade? Only frag, no smoke? Or vis versa?

As far as ammo, isn't one of the main reasons for not carrying multiple types simply that there is not that much differentiation or need on a modern battlefield? In ME, switching "ammo" is closer to switching how the ammunition behaves, and is much more likely changing a module on the gun rather than anything else.

If you want a good modern example of field modification on the fly, isn't the use of rifle grenades exactly that? It is not like soldiers decide to prep their rifles with those before leaving base camp, they are fitted as needed in the field prior to use.

[Frybread76]

I would very much like Bioware to bring back an inventory system with weapon and armor mods, and do away with the weird "ammo powers." It can be more streamlined than in ME1.



They also need to bring back armor for squadmates, as women fighting in body suits and high heels is just immersion-breaking for me.

[Moiaussi]

Turin_4 wrote...

There is some accuracy to this complaint, and some inaccuracy.

On the one hand, you get more conflict with your 'bosses' in ME1 than 2.  That's definitely true.  On the other hand, who is really 'controlling' you that you can be in conflict with in ME2?  OK, so tIM informs you, "Horizon is under attack by Collectors right now, this very second, and its colonists are being abducted."  Are you seriously suggesting Shepard - Paragon or Renegade - should have the option to say, "No thanks, there's a loyalty mission I'd much rather complete right now instead, screw you tIM!"

I mean, it's a null option, isn't it?  Plot-wise, there isn't anything else Shepard of any stripe would do.  She would stop what she was doing and go fight the Collectors to save the humans who were being abducted right then.  And when there is some wiggle room - when the choice is, for example, build the team vs. get the IFF - you don't have to take Cerberus's advice.

Depends on how much you distrust TIM, especially after Horizon. He did deliberately leak information resulting in getting that colony attacked. We don't know that the Collectors would have kept the same schedule without that leak. By then, the Normandy could well be outfitted well enough to take on their ship (even though it inexplicably doesn't even try).

He later sets up Shepard with the 'derelect' collector vessel, and does so in such a way as to keep the Turians from considering the Collectors a threat. Presumably the Turians would also have known the transmissions were fake (since the presumably have some clue what their ships are up to). By jamming the transmissions, TIM kept them from investigating and likewise considering the Collectors a threat, and potentially from discovering independantly the link between the Collectors and the Protheans.

I believe you can make tIM unhappy repeatedly, depending on the stances you take with him, just not as overtly as with the council, that's true.  Particularly with respect to how you handle the 'you sent us into a trap' situation.

With the Council, you are working for them because they are the legitimate governing body, and because you want to do so. With TIM, you go along with him whether you want to or not, are constantly set up by him and are effectively being blackmailed by him.

In ME1 if I'm not mistaken, the structure took the form largely of, "We've lost contact with xyz," or, "We've heard reports from xyz," or, "Such and such's daughter was last seen here," etc. etc.  Things are different here.

Other than the so called 'suicide run', what TIM main mission isn't a set up of some kind? Would you even have been sent after "Archangel" if TIM had realized it was Garrus?

This is simply inaccurate.  You're on rails, but all of those were in response to Collector attacks or Collector actions.  tIM discovers something the Collectors have done, something that if not acted on immediately will become worthless...and you want Shepard to what, have the option to pull a General Maclellan and say, "Piffle to these battle plans, don't need `em!"

See my earlier point. Not only does TIM withhold information so that only you investigate everything, but he also seems to set up the attacks themselves to some degree. More importantly, you just go along with him at the start regardless, even before you know he will be 'helpfull."

I guess I come at ME2 differently than the majority of the posters in this thread, then, because whereas in ME1 I felt like I had the backing of a powerful and capable economic and military structure - the Alliance - in ME2, right from the get-go - I felt desperate.  Like, and I've used this reference before, Allies in 39-41 desperate.

And yet, ME2 seems to be all about gathering a single squad and taking out a single cruiser (something every navy still has more than enough resources to deal with, even if you let the DA die). When you think about how limited the opposition really is, it really does not feel all that desperate. There are much more important issues Shepard should have been facing, such as how to actually defeat the Reapers. Time in the Terminus systems should have been spent finding ways to unite the pirates and bring them on board rather than playing "Master and Commander" with a single Collector cruiser.

[Turin_4]

Nitewriter,

That was a wall of text to you?  I mean I know I have a tendancy towards that, but you'd consider about 1.1 screen's worth (on my monitor, which is not especially large nor on a very impressive resolution) a wall of text?

I could start a text chain to counter each of your points bullet by bullet.

It's the Internet, there's no compulsion.  You could just pick one or two instead of asserting your argument is stronger without actually, y'know, actually asserting anything at all.  That's just lazy, even for the Internet.

But then people would stop listening to me. Because no one wants to
read text chains. They don't care and aren't interested. As soon as they
see people have become embroiled in text chains they stop reading them.

You do, but as people on the Internet frequently need to be reminded, their experience is not representative of the whole of humanity, or even all the other people on the Internet.  Right here you're just assuming that 1.1 screen's worth of post is 'wall of text'.  Seriously, Nitewriter, pick one point.  Just one.

I want people to listen to me.

Listen to what?

Cuz I have responses for each of them.

I believe you. What are they?

Do I say I never felt like the Collectors were compelling the plot, but
TIM? And that the compulsory nature of the missions drained all
interaction and participatory value from them?

That would be one place to start, yes.  You could say such a thing, sure, but even that would not be disagreeing with me, because I was objecting to someone saying, "Shepard in ME2 just obeyed tIM's orders without question."  Well, no, that's not exactly what happened.  What happened was that Shepard was informed, by tIM, that the Collectors were attacking or were in a certain place, and responded...a total of two or three times in the entire game.  I believe you were on rails exactly three times, heading to the first colony and Horizon if memory serves, and the Collector ship.  That's it.  The other directly tIM induced missions, all of the squad mates, the Reaper, when to go on the suicide mission, all of it, was at Shepard's discretion.  You weren't tIM's lackey, he gave you resources and said 'accomplish this goal'.

One way to look at it is, "He's giving Shepard orders!  She would never tolerate that!"  And that's true.  Another way to look at it, however, is to ask, "The order he's giving Shepard is, "Save humanity and the galaxy from the Reaper-employed Collectors!  Would she go about doing it and then have it out with him, or what?"  The house is on fire.  Do you hunt the arsonist first or put out the fire first?

[Turin_4]

Moiaussi,

Depends on how much you distrust TIM, especially after Horizon. He
did deliberately leak information resulting in getting that colony
attacked. We don't know that the Collectors would have kept the same
schedule without that leak. By then, the Normandy could well be
outfitted well enough to take on their ship (even though it inexplicably
doesn't even try).

We don't 'know' that the Collectors would keep the same schedule, no.  But they've attacked many human colonies on a pretty regular basis with no signs of slowing, so there's no reason to think they'll just stop on their own except for wishful thinking.  As for the Normandy, at that point in the game, the ship had nowhere near the upgrades necessary to have a chance of taking on the Collector ship, remember?  It was a near thing even in the end of the game, taking the Collector ship completely by surprise behind their supposely impregnable mass relay, with every squad mate's special upgrade.  At Horizon, you had what, perhaps three or four Normandy upgrades tops?

He later sets up Shepard with the 'derelect' collector vessel, and
does so in such a way as to keep the Turians from considering the
Collectors a threat. Presumably the Turians would also have known the
transmissions were fake (since the presumably have some clue what their
ships are up to). By jamming the transmissions, TIM kept them from
investigating and likewise considering the Collectors a threat, and
potentially from discovering independantly the link between the
Collectors and the Protheans.

He didn't do it in a way to specifically stop the Turians from keeping the Collectors a threat, he did it in a way that would stop the Turians from responding first, after their patrol was destroyed.  The sequence was this (I'm still replaying it, having recently purchased LotSB): Turian patrol encounters Collector ship, attacks and damages it, and is wiped out in the process, but manages to send out some distress calls.  tIM intercepts those calls and delays their forwarding to the Turians, and sends Shepard in first.  The Collectors are playing possum, though.  tIM never said he would never allow the Turians not to learn of the Collector threat.  I'm not sure why you would believe he doesn't want them to know.  What goal of his would that serve?

With the Council, you are working for them because they are the
legitimate governing body, and because you want to do so. With TIM, you
go along with him whether you want to or not, are constantly set up by
him and are effectively being blackmailed by him.

No, you're working for the Council - even as a Paragon - to serve humanity's interests in the galactic community.  In ME2, you work alongside tIM because he has the most solid line on fighting the Collector/Reaper threat, and let's face it, that's straight-up true as shown in ME1.  The Council is outright ****ty when it comes to dealing with Reapers.

Other than the so called 'suicide run', what TIM main mission isn't a
set up of some kind? Would you even have been sent after "Archangel" if
TIM had realized it was Garrus?

Why not?  He sent you after Tali, specifically.  He sent you into contact with Liara, too.

See my earlier point. Not only does TIM withhold information so that
only you investigate everything, but he also seems to set up the
attacks themselves to some degree. More importantly, you just go along
with him at the start regardless, even before you know he will be
'helpfull."

OK, seriously, re: Horizon.  What happens if tIM hadn't provoked the attack?  The Collectors would have attacked another human colony, and they would have gotten away with it.  It was a completely rational assumption on tIM's part that they do so, too.  So what would have happened?

When you think about how limited the opposition really is, it really
does not feel all that desperate. There are much more important issues
Shepard should have been facing, such as how to actually defeat the
Reapers. Time in the Terminus systems should have been spent finding
ways to unite the pirates and bring them on board rather than playing
"Master and Commander" with a single Collector cruiser.

Some assumptions here.  First that there is only the one cruiser.  They could have more than one elsewhere throughout the galaxy, after all.  With a completely impregnable mass relay, how much of a navy would they need guarding their base?  Unite the pirates?  They would certainly be reliable.

[tonnactus]

Turin_4 wrote...
 Are you seriously suggesting Shepard - Paragon or Renegade - should have the option to say, "No thanks, there's a loyalty mission I'd much rather complete right now instead, screw you tIM!"

Yes of course,with consequences.This is roleplaying. Take away options is it not and force players to do something
isnt.
Human colonies were abducted for 2 years when shepardt was dead.One more doesnt lead to the end of the world.

Modifié par tonnactus, 28 septembre 2010 - 06:44 .

[Xeranx]

tonnactus wrote...

Turin_4 wrote...
 Are you seriously suggesting Shepard - Paragon or Renegade - should have the option to say, "No thanks, there's a loyalty mission I'd much rather complete right now instead, screw you tIM!"

Yes of course,with consequences.This is roleplaying. Take away options is it not and force players to do something
isnt.
Human colonies were abducted for 2 years when shepardt was dead.One more doesnt lead to the end of the world.

Making that kind of assumption is the most dangerous assumption to make if you think about it.  We don't know if the next colony the Collectors cull is the last one they need.  When we get to the suicide mission we find out that they're not done, but we have no clue if they were on their last trip through the cosmos after two years (maybe more?) of collecting humans.

[Kavadas]

Moiaussi wrote...
If the weapons were sufficiently modular, re-calibration was not an issue, and the components light enough to be easily carried and kept sorted, why wouldn't they?

Probably not, TBH.  We have ammo considerations now and there's only so much space.  If I had the choice between two magazines and an ACOG, in addition to my Aimpoint... yeah, I'd choose the magazines every time.

Besides, attaching and detaching optics to a rail ruins the zero you established last time you qual'd.

Do modern soldiers only carry one type of grenade? Only frag, no smoke? Or vis versa?

Yeah, actually.  The majority of U.S. soldiers only carry M67s.  Smoke grenades are generally reserved for NCOs because we no longer setup smoke screens in the field.  Smoke grenades are used for marking a spot so other elements can easily identify a unit or location.

You don't go giving some PFC a purple smoke grenade for ****s and gigs, LOL.

As far as ammo, isn't one of the main reasons for not carrying multiple types simply that there is not that much differentiation or need on a modern battlefield? In ME, switching "ammo" is closer to switching how the ammunition behaves, and is much more likely changing a module on the gun rather than anything else.

Correct and I agree.

If you want a good modern example of field modification on the fly, isn't the use of rifle grenades exactly that? It is not like soldiers decide to prep their rifles with those before leaving base camp, they are fitted as needed in the field prior to use.

Arte you talking about GLs like the M203?

If so:

1. The soldier carrying an M203 has no choice in the matter, they are designated by their superiors; and
2. They always have the M203.  They don't just tack it on pre-mission.  It's the responsibility they have been given as a designated grenadier.

It's not like beforehand the CO is like, "You and you, go mount an M203 on your M4s immediately!"  You've been designated well ahead of time, often before a deployment even begins and you're still in the midst of train-up stateside.  And often times even before that.

So to answer your question, no, they are absolutely not fitted in the field.  Besides, mounting an M203 requires a master armorer; it's not a level 10 task... LOL.

If you're talking about, like, ancient ass WWII style grenades that you mount on the barrel of the rifle then... uhhh, I think the last time U.S. forces used those was Korea.

Modifié par Kavadas, 28 septembre 2010 - 09:23 .

[themark443]

 As much as I love ME2, there's just a few things that didn't seem right or just seemed forced. Some of these things have probably been repeated before so I'll keep it brief.

-Lack of an inventory. Yeah the one in ME1 wasn't great but the easy way to make it streamlined is to just use a quota system (ex. instead of having a list of: combat exoskeleton, combat exoskeleton, combat exoskeleton...etc. it'll go from that to: combat exoskeleton x3) less clutter, easy to find things. Besides, with some of the situations I've run into during the game, it would help to change weapons on the fly instead of waiting to find some weapons locker in the middle of nowhere.

-Ammunition is a power? Strange...I always thought ammunition was just ammunition. I play mostly as an infiltrator and if anyone else has, disruptor rounds and cryo rounds just don't cut it (IMO). The only two useful powers are cloak and incinerate. If ammo wasn't thrown in as a power, give em at least 2 powers that were used in the first game like overload and damping (which would at least give the infiltrator class some extra punch against enemies with shields and barriers). On a random note, I miss Sledgehammer rounds.

-Horizon. Yep..I know, probably been covered already. The issue I have with this mission, is that it makes the game go from an open RPG to a linear action game. In ME1, when the council gives you the mission on Virmire, you didn't have to do it off the bat, you could do it whenever. 

-Final Boss. Before the game was released, I remember this buildup about Harbinger and the Collector General. I figured, "Oh yeah. Here's another guy whose ass needs to be introduced to Shepard's boot." That would have been cool, except that it never happened. Instead there was the human reaper. I think the lack of a Saren like villian was sort of a let down for me. Or instead, fight the Collector General and then the reaper.

There are a few other things I'd mention, but it would most likely aggrivate some people so I'll leave them out. Other than that, I still enjoy ME2 and will continue to play through it for a long time 

Modifié par themark443, 28 septembre 2010 - 09:36 .

[Moiaussi]

Turin_4 wrote...

Moiaussi,

We don't 'know' that the Collectors would keep the same schedule, no.  But they've attacked many human colonies on a pretty regular basis with no signs of slowing, so there's no reason to think they'll just stop on their own except for wishful thinking.  As for the Normandy, at that point in the game, the ship had nowhere near the upgrades necessary to have a chance of taking on the Collector ship, remember?  It was a near thing even in the end of the game, taking the Collector ship completely by surprise behind their supposely impregnable mass relay, with every squad mate's special upgrade.  At Horizon, you had what, perhaps three or four Normandy upgrades tops?

At Horizon, the Collector vessel is a sitting duck on the ground. Its shields are likely down due to the atmosphere and regardless, you can have the cannon upgrade by then (via Garrus), which should be all you need given the vessel cannot disengage from within the atmosphere. More importantly, if there was something larger than the Normandy there (such as an Alliance task force), it is a safe bet that they would have had the neccessary firepower. The Thanx cannon only gives the Normandy the equivalent of a cruiser's firepower, and it only took two shots to take out said vessel later on at the Collector's base.. Presumably multiple crusiers would have sufficient firepower to one-shot said vessel. With said vessel taken out, the Collectors (and thus the Reapers) would have been set back rather a while, colonies would have been safe, and there would have been that much more time to find a way to the collector's base. Regardless, given opening fire against a stationary ship, the Normandy should have been able to take it out alone.

He didn't do it in a way to specifically stop the Turians from keeping the Collectors a threat, he did it in a way that would stop the Turians from responding first, after their patrol was destroyed.  The sequence was this (I'm still replaying it, having recently purchased LotSB): Turian patrol encounters Collector ship, attacks and damages it, and is wiped out in the process, but manages to send out some distress calls.  tIM intercepts those calls and delays their forwarding to the Turians, and sends Shepard in first.  The Collectors are playing possum, though.  tIM never said he would never allow the Turians not to learn of the Collector threat.  I'm not sure why you would believe he doesn't want them to know.  What goal of his would that serve?

You seem to have missed the fact that the Turians did not send any such distress call. The call was fake. The Turians presumably would have known that. Again, if the Turians did arrive first with a fleet, then they would also have had enough firepower to take out the Collector vessel if/when it all went bad, ending or at least seriously delaying the threat. The goal TIM's choice serves is obvious. This way Cerberus gets any discoveries, regardless of who it puts at risk. He is putting everything at risk just for personal gain.

No, you're working for the Council - even as a Paragon - to serve humanity's interests in the galactic community.  In ME2, you work alongside tIM because he has the most solid line on fighting the Collector/Reaper threat, and let's face it, that's straight-up true as shown in ME1.  The Council is outright ****ty when it comes to dealing with Reapers.

Again, you are missing the fact that TIM has set you up completely and you have gone along with it. He leaked the information that Shepard had joined Cerberus even before Shepard woke up from the ressurection. He deliberately places the Cerberus logo on everything so that everyone (especially the council) believe Shepard has switched allegences, and deliberately withholds any information that could prove you are right about the reapers or the threat. It is surprising that he doesn't have the Vermire Survivor assassinated. I wouldn't be surprised if we find out in ME3 that he tried, or at least considered it.

The Council already thought that Shepard was a little unhinged in ME1 regardless of the ending, and TIM does everything to encourage that perception in ME2.

Why not?  He sent you after Tali, specifically.  He sent you into contact with Liara, too.

He only sends you after Tali after she is willing to accept that you are with Cerberus on Freedom's Progress. He does not send you to recruit Liara until he sees a chance to aquire the SB's network.

OK, seriously, re: Horizon.  What happens if tIM hadn't provoked the attack?  The Collectors would have attacked another human colony, and they would have gotten away with it.  It was a completely rational assumption on tIM's part that they do so, too.  So what would have happened?

We don't know that they would have. We definately have no reason to conclude that an Alliance fleet couldn't have simply taken out the Collector vessel if he had tipped Alliance command off too.

Some assumptions here.  First that there is only the one cruiser.  They could have more than one elsewhere throughout the galaxy, after all.  With a completely impregnable mass relay, how much of a navy would they need guarding their base?  Unite the pirates?  They would certainly be reliable.

If there is more than one cruiser, then there is likewise the probability of more than one base, in which case, what, precisely has Shepard accomplished? Even if there aren't other bases, other ships could oversee the construction of other bases. Again, what has Shepard accomplished?

As for uniting pirates, pirates are just as much at risk as everyone else. If nothing else, if colonies disappear, what is there left to actually pirate? Reliability? Any less than the Council, whom you seem to reject and Cerberus, who seems to set you up at every turn? The Shadow Broker, who it turns out was much less neutral than his reputation suggested? The Quarian Admirals, who would sell out their best Geth expert for political points chasing a world no surviving member of their race has seen, against an enemy that they cannot even defeat in limited numbers on a small ship within their own fleet? Everyone is unreliable under poor leadership. Unless someone rallies everyone and

[tonnactus]

Xeranx wrote...

tonnaears when shepardt was dead.One more doesnt lead to the end of the world.

Making that kind of assumption is the most dangerous assumption to make if you think about it.  We don't know if the next colony the Collectors cull is the last one they need.  When we get to the suicide mission we find out that they're not done, but we have no clue if they were on their last trip through the cosmos after two years (maybe more?) of collecting humans.

Did shepardt know that at this time?No,until the last stage of Mass Effect 2.Tried to rescue one colony unprepared like it happen
with horizon could also get the normandy destroyed.Critical mission failure.

Modifié par tonnactus, 28 septembre 2010 - 09:39 .

[Moiaussi]

Kavadas wrote...

Probably not, TBH.  We have ammo considerations now and there's only so much space.  If I had the choice between two magazines and an ACOG, in addition to my Aimpoint... yeah, I'd choose the magazines every time.

Besides, attaching and detaching optics to a rail ruins the zero you established last time you qual'd.

What we have isn't the actual ammo. It acts like ammunition, but it is not the actual projectiles. We don't know how big the different modules are, but since the weapons are not any bigger regardless how they are outfitted, they could be very small. Remember that these are mass drivers and the actual projectiles are needle thin.

Calibrations could be done automaticly, via connection to targetting systems in the armour, tieing in with a HUD. These are not 'modern' weapons. They are fictional in a world where complex foreign computer systems can be hacked at range.

Yeah, actually.  The majority of U.S. soldiers only carry M67s.  Smoke grenades are generally reserved for NCOs because we no longer setup smoke screens in the field.  Smoke grenades are used for marking a spot so other elements can easily identify a unit or location.

You don't go giving some PFC a purple smoke grenade for ****s and gigs, LOL.

But is the reason for that neccessity? Or the lack of useful grenade types other than frag?

Arte you talking about GLs like the M203?

If so:

1. The soldier carrying an M203 has no choice in the matter, they are designated by their superiors; and
2. They always have the M203.  They don't just tack it on pre-mission.  It's the responsibility they have been given as a designated grenadier.

It's not like beforehand the CO is like, "You and you, go mount an M203 on your M4s immediately!"  You've been designated well ahead of time, often before a deployment even begins and you're still in the midst of train-up stateside.  And often times even before that.

So to answer your question, no, they are absolutely not fitted in the field.  Besides, mounting an M203 requires a master armorer; it's not a level 10 task... LOL.

If you're talking about, like, ancient ass WWII style grenades that you mount on the barrel of the rifle then... uhhh, I think the last time U.S. forces used those was Korea.

I was referring to the WWII style. They may be mostly out of use these days, but appearantly are still made and deployed.

http://en.wikipedia...._breach_grenade

The US version:

http://www.strategyp...s/20060628.aspx

Like the WWII version, the soldier they are issued to doesn't fit their rifle with them pre-mission. They fit and deploy in the field. That they are not issued to all solders is irrelevant.

By the way, the M203A1 is not an armorer level fitting. It is detachable.

[Nightwriter]

Oh FINE! I'll text chain you, you ravenous beast you.

Turin_4 wrote...

Nitewriter,

Mispelling my name. Hurtful. Hurtful.

Turin_4 wrote...

That was a wall of text to you? 

No but it was to others. Do you think anyone even read that? Do you think anyone's reading what I'm writing right now? No. Because it's part of a text chain. They didn't read your text chain and mine was sure to be longer. These things grow.

So how could I be sure they'd read mine? I must think ahead. Yes. Yes.

Turin_4 wrote...

That's just lazy, even for the Internet.

Pfft. You're like that one person who accused me of being lazy. That one time.

What was their name... mom... dad... grandma... grandpa... best friend Tadd... 1st grade teacher... 2nd grade teacher... 6th grade teacher... 10th grade teacher... postman... pet dog... random bird flying overhead... man at the hotdog stand... Governor Strickland... bum sleeping on the side of the road... Grace Chapland Memorial choir...

Turin_4 wrote...

Listen to what?

See how closely you're listening to me right now? Ah, this is the life.

Turin_4 wrote...

That would be one place to start, yes.  You could say such a thing, sure, but even that would not be disagreeing with me, because I was objecting to someone saying, "Shepard in ME2 just obeyed tIM's orders without question."  Well, no, that's not exactly what happened.  What happened was that Shepard was informed, by tIM, that the Collectors were attacking or were in a certain place, and responded...a total of two or three times in the entire game.  I believe you were on rails exactly three times, heading to the first colony and Horizon if memory serves, and the Collector ship.  That's it.  The other directly tIM induced missions, all of the squad mates, the Reaper, when to go on the suicide mission, all of it, was at Shepard's discretion.  You weren't tIM's lackey, he gave you resources and said 'accomplish this goal'.

Look, that's one of my big beefs. They break the show-don't-tell rule the minute you first talk to TIM. I was never really motivated by the Collectors. TIM sort of told me they were important, and told me I thought so too. No surprise I felt really disconnected from my Shepard in ME2.

He tells you to recruit all these people, too. Even their loyalty missions feel forced and a bit tedious.

Jacob wants to talk to you.
Miranda wants to talk to you.
Mordin wants to talk to you.
Jack wants to talk to you.

Turin_4 wrote...

One way to look at it is, "He's giving Shepard orders!  She would never tolerate that!"  And that's true.  Another way to look at it, however, is to ask, "The order he's giving Shepard is, "Save humanity and the galaxy from the Reaper-employed Collectors!  Would she go about doing it and then have it out with him, or what?"  The house is on fire.  Do you hunt the arsonist first or put out the fire first?

It's not really about giving me orders, it's more how BioWare handled the story and your involvement in it in ME2. I just never really felt on board with TIM. Or with the Collector threat. It's like we got together to stop a band of rampaging mutated potatoes that Professor Farnsworth had created in a freak experiment.

... Okay, yeah, I'd be pretty interested in doing that, much more interested, bad example.

Okay, it's like if you woke up from a coma and some stranger came and said, "This bad thing is happening. You care about this bad thing. My presence is necessary because of this bad thing. Forget about all your old allies and the old storyline and go stop it!"

Modifié par Nightwriter, 29 septembre 2010 - 12:37 .

[Xeranx]

tonnactus wrote...

Xeranx wrote...

tonnaears when shepardt was dead.One more doesnt lead to the end of the world.

Making that kind of assumption is the most dangerous assumption to make if you think about it.  We don't know if the next colony the Collectors cull is the last one they need.  When we get to the suicide mission we find out that they're not done, but we have no clue if they were on their last trip through the cosmos after two years (maybe more?) of collecting humans.

Did shepardt know that at this time?No,until the last stage of Mass Effect 2.Tried to rescue one colony unprepared like it happen
with horizon could also get the normandy destroyed.Critical mission failure.

I just need to correct the last line in my original post: 

When we get to the suicide mission we find out that they're not done, but we had no clue if they were on their last trip through the cosmos after two years (maybe more?) of collecting humans when we got to Horizon.

The additions in bold was what I meant.  Sorry for any confusion I caused.