1658 réponses à ce sujet

[Onyx Jaguar]

SirShreK wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

I like ME 2 so much that I'm going to end up buying multiple copies anyway.

For science

of Psychosomatics?

More like for Psycho Mantis

So you like Mass Effect do you?  I see your team survived the final assault

[Clover Rider]

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

SirShreK wrote...

Onyx Jaguar wrote...

I like ME 2 so much that I'm going to end up buying multiple copies anyway.

For science

of Psychosomatics?

More like for Psycho Mantis

So you like Mass Effect do you?  I see your team survived the final assault

 

[Shappy1010]

0

Modifié par Shappy1010, 29 septembre 2010 - 09:15 .

[Shappy1010]

I simply have one question WHY?.



There is no doubt in my mind the new Dragon Age will be less "traditional" RPG like BG and DAO and more "action oriented" hack&slash (or whatever name you put on it), despite all the defending comments here (which I certainly appreciate) by the devs, let's be honest and put our cards on the table, all the dev interviews acknowledges this and this video speaks volumes.



Again why?

Financially DAO outsold ME2, it was a big, big succes on both Consoles and PC and gave a lot of RPG fans hope the genre is far from dead and deserves a second chance. It pour in thousands of new fans to the genre. Why change it? Instead of expanding this, you now alienate your fans and newcomers alike, for what? Financial succes? Didn't DAO succes tell you something? I'm trying not to flame here, I just don't see the point.

[Lotion Soronarr]

Sago_mulch wrote...
most two handed weps were useless in reality, always outdone by things that could strike them at distance or quicker

You and I must live in different realities then.

Two-handed swords were weapons of the elite. They were exceptionaly deadly and versatile.

zweihander >>> any other weapon


Wit hthat out of hte way, regarding materials. The efficiency of the sword doens't come only from how hard it is, but also it's weight. A sword made of a fictional material that is just as hard as steel, but twice as light, would behave differently...and wouldn't necessarily be better tha na regualar one.

[aaniadyen]

Lotion Soronnar wrote...

Sago_mulch wrote...
most two handed weps were useless in reality, always outdone by things that could strike them at distance or quicker

You and I must live in different realities then.

Two-handed swords were weapons of the elite. They were exceptionaly deadly and versatile.

zweihander >>> any other weapon


Wit hthat out of hte way, regarding materials. The efficiency of the sword doens't come only from how hard it is, but also it's weight. A sword made of a fictional material that is just as hard as steel, but twice as light, would behave differently...and wouldn't necessarily be better tha na regualar one.

Pretty sure crossbows were better. That's situational though, in the right situation a crossbow can beat anything. Same with...just about any weapon.

Modifié par aaniadyen, 29 septembre 2010 - 09:22 .

[shootist70]

Shappy1010 wrote...

I simply have one question WHY?.

There is no doubt in my mind the new Dragon Age will be less "traditional" RPG like BG and DAO and more "action oriented" hack&slash (or whatever name you put on it), despite all the defending comments here (which I certainly appreciate) by the devs, let's be honest and put our cards on the table, all the dev interviews acknowledges this and this video speaks volumes.

Again why?
Financially DAO outsold ME2, it was a big, big succes on both Consoles and PC and gave a lot of RPG fans hope the genre is far from dead and deserves a second chance. It pour in thousands of new fans to the genre. Why change it? Instead of expanding this, you now alienate your fans and newcomers alike, for what? Financial succes? Didn't DAO succes tell you something? I'm trying not to flame here, I just don't see the point.

From what I've read on earlier dev posts on the Q & A threads, and on this one, the combat itself hasn't changed much from the original DAO. What we're seeing is a massive, knee-jerk overreaction to a bit of out-of-context video. The sort of fan hysteria we see when just about every RPG sequel is in development.

Bioware have said that you'll still issue combat orders in exactly the same way as DAO. Console users can still switch on auto-attacks in the radial menu, if they want. The only changes are largely cosmetic: combat animations are faster and your character's actions are more responsive once you've issued an order. That doesn't make it a real-time combat 'hack 'n slash' (not that there's anything actually wrong with a decent real-time combat RPG). That's probably a good thing considering how sluggish DAO was.

Modifié par shootist70, 29 septembre 2010 - 09:28 .

[ViSeiRa]

Well, I obviously missed much and the discussion over the weight, speed and size of 2 handed swords on the game has come to an abrupt halt at some point but I'll need to restart it right there.

I don't have an issue with the fast paced combat as long as two hander animations are tuned down a little, that's way too fast for anyone, man or woman to handle a two handed sword, the swing may be effortless in real life, but actually the problem would be dealing with the weight after the swing not during it.

If anyone would like to get a history lesson then please feel free to read this article: http://www.thearma.o...ssays/2HGS.html

The sword in the video is way too wide for a 2 handed sword, it needs to lose some of its width, that said, checking some of the photos on the article above should give you all some ideas about how 2 handed sword look like.

I loved DA:O, and I'll certainly buy DA2, but that sword model looks utterly unpolished and looks way to heavy for a fem Hawke to handle that easily, normal 2 handed sword weigh between 5 - 8 lbs, and they were way thinner at the shoulder and point than this one in the video.

No well balanced two handed sword in the history of mankind had a width of over 70mm for the blade and an actual thickness of over 10mm, that sword in the video looks 3 CMs wide after the base of the hilt!!!!

Most likely people will bash me for trying to inject realism into a fantasy setting but I just can't get past the final fantasy / devil may cry sword models vibe.
 

Modifié par ViSeirA, 29 septembre 2010 - 09:43 .

[Onyx Jaguar]

Maybe its made out of materials that would not be similar to our world. Or the gravity isn't the same.

[Kolos2]

this must be a joke, like watching a trailer for Dynasty Warriors or an jrpg, not the Dragon Age i know of.
With each new vid from CDP i get thrilled, with each DA 2 one i get more disappointed

A great way to destroy a franchise, such an obvious EA C&C 4 deja vu that it makes me laugh

Modifié par Kolos2, 29 septembre 2010 - 09:36 .

[nightcobra]

ViSeirA wrote...

Well, I obviously missed much and the discussion over the weight, speed and size of 2 handed swords on the game has come to an abrupt halt at some point but I'll need to restart it right there.

I don't have an issue with the fast paced combat as long as two hander animations are tuned down a little, that's way too fast for anyone, man or woman to handle a two handed sword, the swing may be effortless in real life, but actually the problem would be dealing with the weight after the swing not during it.

If anyone would like to get a history lesson then please feel free to read this article: http://www.thearma.o...ssays/2HGS.html

The sword in the video is way too wide for a 2 handed sword, it needs to lose some of its width, that said, checking some of the photos on the article above should give you all some ideas about how 2 handed sword look like.

I loved DA:O, and I'll certainly buy DA2, but that sword model looks utterly unpolished and looks way to heavy for a fem Hawke to handle that easily, normal 2 handed sword weigh between 5 - 8 lbs, and they were way thinner at the shoulder and point than this one in the video.

Most likely people will bash me for trying to inject realism into a fantasy setting but I just can't get past the final fantasy / devil may cry sword models vibe.
 

well they're not "our" human race, so their physical prowess may be higher than ours. seriously could you picture one of our soldiers leaping a few feet into a dragon's head while wearing a full massive armor? can't see that happening. if they have that much strength in their legs then the strength in their arms shouldn't be too far behind.

Modifié par nightcobra8928, 29 septembre 2010 - 09:33 .

[MiyoKit]

Gameplay just looks ridiculous... Oversized JRPG-esqe weapons, exploding enemies and silly little jumps.... Makes me a very sad panda indeed

[k177sh0t]

Its like WoW warrior meets Dragon Age and Mass Effect = Dragon Age 2



Lookin' good

[Clover Rider]

MiyoKit wrote...

Gameplay just looks ridiculous... Oversized JRPG-esqe weapons, exploding enemies and silly little jumps.... Makes me a very sad panda indeed

Yes it needs to be like real life not fun at all<_<.

[nightcobra]

i'm more interested on seeing new enemy designs. take a look at the manga berserk's monsters, now those would seriously scare the crap out of the audience, though their bodies may be too hard to animate properly.

Modifié par nightcobra8928, 29 septembre 2010 - 09:42 .

[MiyoKit]

Some Geth wrote...

MiyoKit wrote...

Gameplay just looks ridiculous... Oversized JRPG-esqe weapons, exploding enemies and silly little jumps.... Makes me a very sad panda indeed

Yes it needs to be like real life not fun at all<_<.

Realistic =/= real life :x

[ViSeiRa]

nightcobra8928 wrote...

ViSeirA wrote...

Well, I obviously missed much and the discussion over the weight, speed and size of 2 handed swords on the game has come to an abrupt halt at some point but I'll need to restart it right there.

I don't have an issue with the fast paced combat as long as two hander animations are tuned down a little, that's way too fast for anyone, man or woman to handle a two handed sword, the swing may be effortless in real life, but actually the problem would be dealing with the weight after the swing not during it.

If anyone would like to get a history lesson then please feel free to read this article: http://www.thearma.o...ssays/2HGS.html

The sword in the video is way too wide for a 2 handed sword, it needs to lose some of its width, that said, checking some of the photos on the article above should give you all some ideas about how 2 handed sword look like.

I loved DA:O, and I'll certainly buy DA2, but that sword model looks utterly unpolished and looks way to heavy for a fem Hawke to handle that easily, normal 2 handed sword weigh between 5 - 8 lbs, and they were way thinner at the shoulder and point than this one in the video.

Most likely people will bash me for trying to inject realism into a fantasy setting but I just can't get past the final fantasy / devil may cry sword models vibe.
 

well they're not "our" human race, so their physical prowess may be higher than ours. seriously could you picture one of our soldiers leaping a few feet into a dragon's head while wearing a full massive armor? can't see that happening. if they have that much strength in their legs then the strength in their arms shouldn't be too far behind.

Well, they don't have that kind of strength in their legs, not really, who told you they jumped at all? just because all of a sudden you found your character on top of the dragon's head doesn't mean he jumped there, that's just the absurdity of animations for you..... in DA: The Calling, duncan actually reached the dragon's head by spriting over its tail and whole body, he's human, if he had super strength David would just say "And then Duncan jumped up high and landed on the dragon's head with a high thud!".

[nightcobra]

MiyoKit wrote...

Some Geth wrote...

MiyoKit wrote...

Gameplay just looks ridiculous... Oversized JRPG-esqe weapons, exploding enemies and silly little jumps.... Makes me a very sad panda indeed

Yes it needs to be like real life not fun at all<_<.

Realistic =/= real life :x

too much realism doesn't equal fun either 

[Clover Rider]

nightcobra8928 wrote...

MiyoKit wrote...

Some Geth wrote...

MiyoKit wrote...

Gameplay just looks ridiculous... Oversized JRPG-esqe weapons, exploding enemies and silly little jumps.... Makes me a very sad panda indeed

Yes it needs to be like real life not fun at all<_<.

Realistic =/= real life :x

too much realism doesn't equal fun either 

Yup.

[Monica83]

The problem with animations its: They are too much faster and total out of tone.. I can accept style but personally i dont like the japanese style of anims..I loved DAO because have his IDENTITY.. Tis sad to see that cutted off only for the pleasure of casual gamer.. DAO was a wawe of resh air on rpg because when all others follows the new Fashion style of rpg DAO stays original.. Now with dragon age 2 with dialog wheel paraphrase system and manga trash animation we have lose the identity of this wonderfull world to play... Its a clone of something else... Put some mass effect.. Put some dinasty warrior... Its another new fashion rpg game whitout identity...

Sad but true..

[Clover Rider]

Monica83 wrote...

The problem with animations its: They are too much faster and total out of tone.. I can accept style but personally i dont like the japanese style of anims..I loved DAO because have his IDENTITY.. Tis sad to see that cutted off only for the pleasure of casual gamer.. DAO was a wawe of resh air on rpg because when all others follows the new Fashion style of rpg DAO stays original.. Now with dragon age 2 with dialog wheel paraphrase system and manga trash animation we have lose the identity of this wonderfull world to play... Its a clone of something else... Put some mass effect.. Put some dinasty warrior... Its another new fashion rpg game whitout identity...
Sad but true..

The hell:huh:.

[shootist70]

ViSeirA wrote...

I don't have an issue with the fast paced combat as long as two hander animations are tuned down a little, that's way too fast for anyone, man or woman to handle a two handed sword, the swing may be effortless in real life, but actually the problem would be dealing with the weight after the swing not during it.

If anyone would like to get a history lesson then please feel free to read this article: http://www.thearma.o...ssays/2HGS.html

 

Your article states that two-handed swords weighed between 5-7 pounds and were expertly balanced. 5-7 poinds is nothing, especially if the weight is well balanced without the centre of gravity being excessively towards the tip. It means there won't be a lot of inertia to overcome in the swing recovery.

Not only that but as anybody who has practised a martial art for years knows, anything that you've practiced thousands of times over becomes committed to 'muscle memory' as the muscle groups used in that action become strengthened. Your body becomes 'tuned' to the weapon and its characteristics. I've no doubt at all that a strong, expert warrior could slash a 5-7 pound two handed sword around with very little effort.

Ok, the DA2 action in the vid is a little OTT, but it's actually a hell of a lot closer to being realistic than the goddawful two-hander animations from DAO.

EDIT: I agree about the silly weapon size, though.

Modifié par shootist70, 29 septembre 2010 - 09:50 .

[MiyoKit]

nightcobra8928 wrote...

MiyoKit wrote...

Some Geth wrote...

MiyoKit wrote...

Gameplay just looks ridiculous... Oversized JRPG-esqe weapons, exploding enemies and silly little jumps.... Makes me a very sad panda indeed

Yes it needs to be like real life not fun at all<_<.

Realistic =/= real life :x

too much realism doesn't equal fun either 

True, but including very little makes for a terrible game, IMHO ofc. Just feels as though Bioware has gone too far towards the manga direction for my taste.

[Shappy1010]

shootist70 wrote...

From what I've read on earlier dev posts on the Q & A threads, and on this one, the combat itself hasn't changed much from the original DAO. What we're seeing is a massive, knee-jerk overreaction to a bit of out-of-context video. The sort of fan hysteria we see when just about every RPG sequel is in development.

There is a very good reason why fans are hysterical, the genre is simply in danger. I'm gonna save you the whole dumbing down of the gaming industry rant, but Bioware has always been a quality house when it comes to RPGs. It seems that it's finally come to the point where even they cannot maintain this. It's just sad.

Bioware have said that you'll still issue combat orders in exactly the same way as DAO. Console users can still switch on auto-attacks in the radial menu, if they want. The only changes are largely cosmetic: combat animations are faster and your character's actions are more responsive once you've issued an order. That doesn't make it a real-time combat 'hack 'n slash' (not that there's anything actually wrong with a decent real-time combat RPG). That's probably a good thing considering how sluggish DAO was.

Ah you condider DAO "sluggish", that says more about you as a gamer then DAO. I consider DAO 's gameplay an improvement over say NWN(2), but keeping true to the spirit of strategic RPGs. It's a delicate balans, this blatant DA2 gameplay video crosses that line by a million miles. Defend it all you want, it doesn't take a genius to see they went into a completely different direction here.

Modifié par Shappy1010, 29 septembre 2010 - 09:53 .

[Onyx Jaguar]

But reality is such a subjective term