112 réponses à ce sujet

[Monochrome Wench]

As far as we know, the high heals have a invisible biotic field around them or some completely transparent colourless substance to make the point larger so they don't fall though the floor. They only look like pointy high heels but are in fact slightly more practical. :-)



Ok, probably not. The heels are silly.



As far as I am concerned the game is over sexualized only because of the camera angles. They make me smirk when they happen. Its really juvenile. I don't have any issues with the clothing, I think its fine. It would be a problem if femsheps armour was skin tight and/or revealing. If Mirandas outfit was standard Cerberus uniform, it would be a problem. If all Asari dressed like Samara, again, it would be a problem.

[Commander Kurt]

I actually see it as really clever, Bioware makes the half-naked ladies in heels, while still making fun of the outfits. They are eating their cookie and saving it.

People who like half-naked ladies in games get them. People who do not like half-naked ladies in games get to see the costumes ridiculed.

It is juvenile, the whole thing with the camera and the outfits. But it is adressed in-game and I am actually happy with that. It's a joke, and I'm having far too much fun with the game to take it as anything else.

Modifié par Commander Kurt, 30 septembre 2010 - 08:36 .

[ObserverStatus]

Jacob: Look at this--like sneaking into the captain's quarters. Heavy risk, but the prize...

[GodWood]

Heavensrun wrote...

GodWood wrote...

brfritos wrote...

GodWood wrote...
I think it looks stupid and makes the game look immature and childish.
So yes it is a bad thing.

Well, they are about to do sex, what do you expect?

You misunderstand.
If its during a sex scene I couldn't care if the scene played out like a porno, my problem is the fact that characters are now dressed like DC comics heroes when they're on the battle field, which looks absolutely ridiculous and serves no purpose other then fanservice.

Not true.  It says something about each of their personalities.  Miranda dresses sexy.  On purpose.  This is a clue into her mindset.

I still think thats a stupid excuse to have her running around in a catsuit, however if Bioware wanted to pull "Its part of her character" card they could of left the catsuit (and Jack's beltbra) as something they wear on the Normandy and when in battle they wear actual armour.

And as I mentioned, there was plenty of form-fitting gear in the first game as well.  Some more than others, but almost -all- of the armor was fairly snug.

But it was at least disguised as armour.

My point to -you- was that ME1 had plenty of "fanservice" as well, (although I see as much clevage walking around in real life as I do in any given Mass Effect game, so I might call it something else) and arguably -more- of such.  I think it's an error in reasoning to suggest that ME2 is particularly more sexualized than ME1 was, on the whole.

Yes ME1 was sexualized in parts (Benezia, snug armour) but to say that ME2 was no more sexualized then ME1 is just.... I don't what it is.. a lie?
ME1 had all squadmates running around in believable full covered armour, ME2 had catsuits (Miranda's wedgie/cameltoe), more catsuits with heels and ridiculously exposed cleavage that served no practicle purpose (Samara), toplessness in the vacuum of space (Jack) and I've always hated Thanes little disco vest getup (luckily the AA package fixed that).

Really it serves no purpose outside fanservice and attracting horny teenagers, there are other ways to give insight into a character outside of just dressing them in skintight outfits.

[HazelrahFiver]

Heavensrun wrote...
I gotta interject here.  I agree with most of your comments about the companion's gear, but to suggest that Jack's clothing is "demeaning" or intended as such doesn't fit with what I've seen of the character.  I got the strong impression that she dresses to offend, and to project an air of "deal with it", not to somehow demean herself, and if you're trying to suggest that nudity is somehow inherently demeaning, then again, I could not disagree with that more strongly if I tried.

I didn't mean that at all.  It's going to become too much to explain, and will lose relevance to the topic, but I have friends that are part of the "goth/dark/angry" crowd.  I'm not putting anybody down here, because I think the whole labeling thing is pretty much ridiculous - people are people.  Anyway, they have worn outfits to literally degrade themselves, these friends of mine, as part of their lifestyle.  It's a choice and one that they enjoy.  They want people to look at them, to judge them, and to be able to have a reaction to it.  I remind again that I am speaking from personal experience, I know these people.

[Heavensrun]

GodWood wrote...

Heavensrun wrote...
]Not true.  It says something about each of their personalities.  Miranda dresses sexy.  On purpose.  This is a clue into her mindset.

I still think thats a stupid excuse to have her running around in a catsuit, however if Bioware wanted to pull "Its part of her character" card they could of left the catsuit (and Jack's beltbra) as something they wear on the Normandy and when in battle they wear actual armour.

Honestly, at the velocities that ME projectiles supposedly travel, armor really ought to be useless anyway.  It -is- useless (against weapons, anyway;  It probably does a good job of soaking melee damage) in some of the lore, which is why "armor" bars kinda annoyed me.

And as I mentioned, there was plenty of form-fitting gear in the first game as well.  Some more than others, but almost -all- of the armor was fairly snug.

But it was at least disguised as armour.

So?  The batman costume is "armor".  It's still a nearly skintight exhibition of the male physique.

My point to -you- was that ME1 had plenty of "fanservice" as well, (although I see as much clevage walking around in real life as I do in any given Mass Effect game, so I might call it something else) and arguably -more- of such.  I think it's an error in reasoning to suggest that ME2 is particularly more sexualized than ME1 was, on the whole.

Yes ME1 was sexualized in parts (Benezia, snug armour) but to say that ME2 was no more sexualized then ME1 is just.... I don't what it is.. a lie?

That's nice. "You disagree with me, therefore you must be lying, because noone could possibly disagree with me."

ME1 had just as many tight costumes.  It had Incredible Asari Clevage™.  And it had nudity and lesbian sex.  On screen.

Yes, I think ME1 wins in the fanservice department, sorry.  A few squadmembers with tight outfits does not, for me, trump a nude lesbian sex scene for raw tittilation.

ME1 had all squadmates running around in believable full covered armour, ME2 had catsuits (Miranda's wedgie/cameltoe), more catsuits with heels and ridiculously exposed cleavage that served no practicle purpose (Samara), toplessness in the vacuum of space (Jack) and I've always hated Thanes little disco vest getup (luckily the AA package fixed that).

Squadmates in ME1 consisted of two military officers, an elite cop, a quarian who can't take off her environment suit without risking infection, and a Krogan battlemaster.  And they were under your cirect command on a military vessel.

In ME2, you're dealing with a hodge-podge crew of misfits and specialists.  Some wear armor, some don't, based mostly on their personalities.  Shepard has a lower threshold of authority over this group than he had over the first.  (although he gets more once they're loyal, which is evidenced by the fact that Jack is willing to put on a shirt if you ask.  ;p )

And as I have mentioned, you're never -in- the vacuum of space in this one (aside from when the Normandy gets ripped open).  Every planet and environment you visit has an atmosphere, be it breathable or not.  This was -not- the case in ME1, but it -is- the case in ME2.  Everyplace you go has air.  I can provide evidence if you -really- need it.

Really it serves no purpose outside fanservice and attracting horny teenagers, there are other ways to give insight into a character outside of just dressing them in skintight outfits.

I beg your pardon, but it also serves as fanservice for horny adults.  ;p  (though interestingly, I thought Jack's toplessness was an awesome character statement, but I didn't find it arousing at all.)

But yes, there are other ways.  I see no reason that this isn't a valid one, though.  We all express ourselves through our clothing.  If I like to wear nerdy t-shirts that tell people I like science, I don't -have- to explain to them that I'm a scientist.  (although I might explain what kind, if they ask, which means that my nerdy shirt has opened lines of communication with my peers!  Hurray!)

I realize that you don't -like- the squadmates walking around in their own choices of clothing rather than  what you would consider practical gear, and you've got a right to your opinion on the matter.  All I'm saying is that there's other perspectives out there that are not nessecarily any less informed or thought out than yours, so to call it "bad" because you don't like it is disingenuous.

[GodWood]

Heavensrun wrote...

GodWood wrote...
Yes ME1 was sexualized in parts (Benezia, snug armour) but to say that ME2 was no more sexualized then ME1 is just.... I don't what it is.. a lie?

That's nice. "You disagree with me, therefore you must be lying, because noone could possibly disagree with me."
ME1 had just as many tight costumes.  It had Incredible Asari Clevage™.  And it had nudity and lesbian sex.  On screen.

Yes, I think ME1 wins in the fanservice department, sorry.  A few squadmembers with tight outfits does not, for me, trump a nude lesbian sex scene for raw tittilation.

Oh come on, ME1 had one sexualized character, Benezia, and she wasn't supposed to be a soldier running around in a fire fight, she was Saren's advisor and thus was enabled to be dressed in more casual atire.
Even during the boss fight she wasn't flying around snapping necks in heels, she was simply issueing commands to her guards that she brought with her, onece they were gone she was basically just an instant kill.

And the nude lesbian sex scene was the culmination of a romance between two characters that had been developing throughout the progress of the game not just some random ****** and arse spread thoughout the game for raw titilation.
Besides it was during a sex scene and its the only time the characters are shown in a sexualized light, which is entirely appropriate.

ME2 had a complete style overhaul that was more sexualized then what was shown in ME1 and I for one hope they lose the ridiculous Marvel superheroes atire in ME3.

[Killjoy Cutter]

GodWood wrote...

Heavensrun wrote...

GodWood wrote...
Yes ME1 was sexualized in parts (Benezia, snug armour) but to say that ME2 was no more sexualized then ME1 is just.... I don't what it is.. a lie?

That's nice. "You disagree with me, therefore you must be lying, because noone could possibly disagree with me."
ME1 had just as many tight costumes.  It had Incredible Asari Clevage™.  And it had nudity and lesbian sex.  On screen.

Yes, I think ME1 wins in the fanservice department, sorry.  A few squadmembers with tight outfits does not, for me, trump a nude lesbian sex scene for raw tittilation.

Oh come on, ME1 had one sexualized character, Benezia, and she wasn't supposed to be a soldier running around in a fire fight, she was Saren's advisor and thus was enabled to be dressed in more casual atire.
Even during the boss fight she wasn't flying around snapping necks in heels, she was simply issueing commands to her guards that she brought with her, onece they were gone she was basically just an instant kill.

And the nude lesbian sex scene was the culmination of a romance between two characters that had been developing throughout the progress of the game not just some random ****** and arse spread thoughout the game for raw titilation.
Besides it was during a sex scene and its the only time the characters are shown in a sexualized light, which is entirely appropriate.

ME2 had a complete style overhaul that was more sexualized then what was shown in ME1 and I for one hope they lose the ridiculous Marvel superheroes atire in ME3.

Agreed.

[achwas]

Heavensrun wrote...

achwas wrote...

narthwastaken wrote...

.... Well nearly, I'm not sure about Jacob. Guess him being the one sane person on the ship is his *thing*

He is WHAT ? If sane = naive, you may be right. although personally I would call him witless, if not outright dumb.

Oh, and since I am fortunately living in Europe- where not every accidentally bared breast is the trigger for a tsunami of moral outrage from XYZ-minority" - I don't find Mass Effect 2 especially "oversexed". Besides feeling very sorry  for Miranda's poorly chosen outift.  And I never really took Samara along for anything, anyway ....and Jack... oh well, Jack is wrapped up pretty well in her outrage and fury, right ?

What disturbed me far more was Jack waltzing around in hard vaccuum (e.g. collector ship and base ) with her straps, naked skin and very little besides^^

The collector ship and base both had atmosphere.  Not only did your crew members walk back to the Normandy's position on the outside of the base, but the collectors themselves use -wings- to fly around.  Wings are kinda useless without a medium with which to interact.  In hard vacuum, wings are about as useful as arms and legs.  Which is to say not at all.

And even if they were in hard vacuum at times, is it that hard to imagine that barrier technology can protect you from more than just projectiles?

The shuttle flies into the collector ship straight from hard vaccuum.... Space just beyond it is even shown in the cutscene when the group leaves the shuttle. No airlock... no forcefield.... So why is my Shep forced to exchange her visor sight (much appreciated either for the extra power damage or the headshot-bonus), but Jack thinks it's a day at the beach and waltzes around in a thong bikini ?
Everybody else covers up - Zaeed pulls out his Texas-Chainsaw-massacre outfit, Thane grabs an old sock, Garrus goes for fully sealed .. but the girls think it's a picnic in the park ? Don't know about the others, never took anyone else along
Nevermind that (emergency) athmosphere-preservation forcefields as shown in the prologue are highly visble...

And yeah, I do not  suppose the Collector Base is somehow pressurized either, seeing that SR-2 Normandy can fly straight in - who honestly thinks Joker asked nicely at the airlock or the Collectors let Normandy  in through an active forcefield ? All in mid-battle ?

IMHO Bioware skimped on the outfits to keep the team members easily identifiable and distinct from the opposition, A bad choice though, since it really strains the suspension of disbelief, even in SciFi/SpecFi

As for forcefield protection - besides certain limitations by realistic physics, the shields absorb kinetic energy. If they were a hard, solid athmospheric-pressure-barrier, a user would suffocate within a few minutes, if not faster. nevermind radiation (which is not kinetic energy).... or viral/gaseous agents.

[Lady1Aph]

after reading the posts here i began to wonder a bit about some of the comments about Samara. In both ME1 and ME2 are we told that asari are proclaimed to be sexual creaturs, just take clubs its mostly asari dancers, just look at omega. Even Liara mention it her self in ME1. Besides the attire she has on isent bad so what if its snug, she is a biotic and a powerfull one aswell i dont think she would be abel to use her biotic to its fullest if she had to wear a heavy armor, same thing with both Miranda and Jack, also with the loyalti missions u get different outfits for them so i dont see the big issue with it being sexist. Hell im a female and i dident feel degraded in any way while playing the games and u know why because its a GAME nothing more nothing less.

Modifié par Lady1Aph, 30 septembre 2010 - 05:17 .

[achwas]

Heavensrun wrote...
And as I have mentioned, you're never -in- the vacuum of space in this one (aside from when the Normandy gets ripped open).  Every planet and environment you visit has an atmosphere, be it breathable or not.  This was -not- the case in ME1, but it -is- the case in ME2.  Everyplace you go has air.  I can provide evidence if you -really- need it.

I call you on that and ask for your evidence of where the athmosphere suddenly appears from when the Normandy lies powered down on the outer shell of the collector base and the team leaves the ship through the port airlock ( as shown in the cutscene starting the suicide mission ). Nevermind that everyone switches to breathing equipment

Because, to illustrate my point, the Normandy crash-landed there directly from the space-battle with the collector's cruiser.  Besides,  the Base in itself is most certainly not of the minimum size or mass to attract and maintain any sort of breathable athmosphere on its own.... The entry area is also not a prepared landing/launching area which might concievably have forcefields for athmospheric preservation....

Nevermind being in the galactic core with the entire surrounding space saturated with heavy gamma radiation from the black holes in surrounding space ( just several million of them, going  by current astrophysics.).. no reason to suit up - I guess even radiation and the the galactic core do not want to p*** off jack, hmm ?


Then again, on many of your points regarding "fanservice" and nudity, I at least partially agree,

What I find more interestiing though is that the strongest biotics in the game are all female in gender, while the strongest techs are all male (neither Kasumi nor Tali are powerful Tech wielders like, say, Mordin or Garrus. )... now there is some gender-oriented stereotyping :innocent:

Modifié par achwas, 30 septembre 2010 - 05:18 .

[Killjoy Cutter]

Lady1Aph wrote...

after reading the posts here i began to wonder a bit about some of the comments about Samara. In both ME1 and ME2 are we told that asari are proclaimed to be sexual creaturs, just take clubs its mostly asari dancers, just look at omega. Even Liara mention it her self in ME1. Besides the attire she has on isent bad so what if its snug, she is a biotic and a powerfull one aswell i dont think she would be abel to use her biotic to its fullest if she had to wear a heavy armor, same thing with both Miranda and Jack, also with the loyalti missions u get different outfits for them so i dont see the big issue with it being sexist. Hell im a female and i dident feel degraded in any way while playing the games and u know why because its a GAME nothing more nothing less.

As one example, it's not so much that Samara is wearing a tight outfit, it's that she's wearing go-go boots and a plunging neckline into combat.

Modifié par Killjoy Cutter, 30 septembre 2010 - 05:27 .

[achwas]

Lady1Aph wrote...

after reading the posts here i began to wonder a bit about some of the comments about Samara. In both ME1 and ME2 are we told that asari are proclaimed to be sexual creaturs, just take clubs its mostly asari dancers, just look at omega. Even Liara mention it her self in ME1. Besides the attire she has on isent bad so what if its snug, she is a biotic and a powerfull one aswell i dont think she would be abel to use her biotic to its fullest if she had to wear a heavy armor, same thing with both Miranda and Jack, also with the loyalti missions u get different outfits for them so i dont see the big issue with it being sexist. Hell im a female and i dident feel degraded in any way while playing the games and u know why because its a GAME nothing more nothing less.

Makes you wonder why other Asari, including Liara or the asari spectre in LotSB dress far more sensibly in armoured bodysuits, or like Liara in the prologue cutscene (only there if she was your romance in ME-1) in carapace armour like Shepard's. The Eclipse sub-chief in Miranda's loyalty mission even mocks Miss Lawson's "state of undress".

Modifié par achwas, 30 septembre 2010 - 05:23 .

[Killjoy Cutter]

achwas wrote...
What I find more interestiing though is that the strongest biotics in the game are all female in gender, while the strongest techs are all male (neither Kasumi nor Tali are powerful Tech wielders like, say, Mordin or Garrus. )... now there is some gender-oriented stereotyping :innocent:

Tali and Kasumi are not what now huh?  Is this another case where I ended up with a different version of the game than someone else?

[Asheer_Khan]

Then WHY game hints that tech specialists for vents mission in C-Base are TALI and LEGION (not sure about Kasumi), and if you put Garrus as tech specialist he will die by the door no matter of his loyalty status?

[Killjoy Cutter]

Asheer_Khan wrote...

Then WHY game hints that tech specialists for vents mission in C-Base are TALI and LEGION (not sure about Kasumi), and if you put Garrus as tech specialist he will die by the door no matter of his loyalty status?

Kasumi is also on the list, and works out very well.  Given that she's a combination of tech and infiration, she was my first choice to go on that mission.

[achwas]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

achwas wrote...
What I find more interestiing though is that the strongest biotics in the game are all female in gender, while the strongest techs are all male (neither Kasumi nor Tali are powerful Tech wielders like, say, Mordin or Garrus. )... now there is some gender-oriented stereotyping :innocent:

Tali and Kasumi are not what now huh?  Is this another case where I ended up with a different version of the game than someone else?

*shrug* yes, obviously your take on their power differs.
Tali has barely anything offense-oriented in her arsenal (AI-Hack, Combat drone..) , and only uses extremely indirect powers. For an engineer... she lacks almost any direct effect applications. Vastly underpowered and hardly adding any tactical punch. TALIMANCY is not an ingame power either...

Kasumi has a very specialised infiltration oriented arsenal of Tech power, including overload - but again, no Incinerate (say like Mordin ), group supporting ammunition powers. a little more useful, but then again, Kasumi is the most chaste of all the female characters in ME-2, being un-romancable and faithful to her late partner. Unless we take the poetry in her shadowbroker dosssier serious...*shudder* But even that, in comparison to the stuff in Miranda's and others files is very tame. She is almost sexless by ME standards

Mordin on the other hand even gets his very own upgraded Incinerate (on par with Jack's biotic boost) and is the only source for it besides Shepard. packing the heaviest offensive DD punch in the game. Garrus is a walking arsenal, packing effective powers against every type of protection in the enemies' arsenal.  Also, all the soldiers in ME-2 are universally male - Grunt oozes "alpha male" attitude, nothing female about him. same with Zaeed, even Jacob  is oozing testosteroids  - unless you want to call Samara a soldier because she can use assault rifles ? Wither powers and biotic level screaming "adept" that seems slightly ludicruous.

Nevermind there being no female snipers.

Tech + Physique ----> overwhelming number of male characters.
Biotic powers  --->overwhelming number of female characters

Carbon copy of the classic fantasy males are warrior, females are mages clichee.

Modifié par achwas, 30 septembre 2010 - 05:54 .

[Killjoy Cutter]

Well, sure, if you want to claim that only the Engineer power-set and offensive powers count as having "tech", then yeah.



*shrug*

[Schneidend]

I like how people criticize Miranda's outfit when, given the patterns in it and the thickness of the material, it's probably far more protective than any of our contemporary tactical armor.

[achwas]

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Well, sure, if you want to claim that only the Engineer power-set and offensive powers count as having "tech", then yeah.

*shrug*

To which "school" a power belongs is defined by the game/Bioware, and the effect of tech-damage/biotic damage upgrades. I don't claim anything.

Tech powers :  Incinerate, all ammo-powers (except one) , AI Hacking, Combat Drone, Overload, Tech Armour, Tactical Cloak. Shadow Strike (Kasumi Only) Concussion shot  ... + Energy Drain, Neural Shock. Inferno grenade and Flashbang Grenade, Geth Sheld Boost

Biotic : Pull, Throw, Shockwave, Stasis (Liara only), Warp,.. plus Warp Ammo, Slam, Reave

classes : 
Samara : Adept w. assault rifle
Miranda Adept with one tech power
Jack : Vanguard
Tali : Engineer with shotgun
Kasumi : Infiltrator -spin-off
Liara : Adept w. assault rifle

Zaeed : soldier
Grunt : soldier
Garrus : soldier w. Overload
Jacob : variant sentinel or soldier
Thane : Infiltrator w. warp, no cloak
Legion : variant Infiltrator

notice any pattern ?

Modifié par achwas, 30 septembre 2010 - 06:26 .

[Lady1Aph]

achwas wrote...

Lady1Aph wrote...

after reading the posts here i began to wonder a bit about some of the comments about Samara. In both ME1 and ME2 are we told that asari are proclaimed to be sexual creaturs, just take clubs its mostly asari dancers, just look at omega. Even Liara mention it her self in ME1. Besides the attire she has on isent bad so what if its snug, she is a biotic and a powerfull one aswell i dont think she would be abel to use her biotic to its fullest if she had to wear a heavy armor, same thing with both Miranda and Jack, also with the loyalti missions u get different outfits for them so i dont see the big issue with it being sexist. Hell im a female and i dident feel degraded in any way while playing the games and u know why because its a GAME nothing more nothing less.

Makes you wonder why other Asari, including Liara or the asari spectre in LotSB dress far more sensibly in armoured bodysuits, or like Liara in the prologue cutscene (only there if she was your romance in ME-1) in carapace armour like Shepard's. The Eclipse sub-chief in Miranda's loyalty mission even mocks Miss Lawson's "state of undress".

ive never seen that on Miranda´s loyalty mission, seems i have to play ME again just to get that one.



well Miranda´s armor is snug but i still dont see the big deal, it has nothing to do with IRL anyways, so what if we see alittle fiture here and there both with male and females.

[TheGreenLion]

It's really a matter of dress code. That's pretty much all it boils down to. So here's a solution: Give all the characters combat appropriate gear when they go out on missions, and give them their catsuits and what not when they are aboard the ship. High heels don't really fit with the attire, save FemShep's fancy getup from the Kasumi DLC. Regular ol' boots would do the trick, and if there must be high heels there should be an appropriate dress to go with it.



Basically to dissipate the problem of people not liking the one or more of the characters attire is to make more options. Much like we choose Shep's two types of attire combat/casual. Perhaps there should also be the option in terms of casual to select a modest getup or a sexy getup. That's a lot of extra work obviously, but it will lessen the complaints of the customers offended by the portrayal of the women in Shep's team.

[Phaedon]

Added the point of this thread to the OP, because some people didn't get it, I think.

Modifié par Phaedon, 30 septembre 2010 - 07:24 .

[Killjoy Cutter]

achwas wrote...

Killjoy Cutter wrote...

Well, sure, if you want to claim that only the Engineer power-set and offensive powers count as having "tech", then yeah.

*shrug*

To which "school" a power belongs is defined by the game/Bioware, and the effect of tech-damage/biotic damage upgrades. I don't claim anything.

Tech powers :  Incinerate, all ammo-powers (except one) , AI Hacking, Combat Drone, Overload, Tech Armour, Tactical Cloak. Shadow Strike (Kasumi Only) Concussion shot  ... + Energy Drain, Neural Shock. Inferno grenade and Flashbang Grenade, Geth Sheld Boost

Biotic : Pull, Throw, Shockwave, Stasis (Liara only), Warp,.. plus Warp Ammo, Slam, Reave

classes : 
Samara : Adept w. assault rifle
Miranda Adept with one tech power
Jack : Vanguard
Tali : Engineer with shotgun
Kasumi : Infiltrator -spin-off
Liara : Adept w. assault rifle

Zaeed : soldier
Grunt : soldier
Garrus : soldier w. Overload
Jacob : variant sentinel or soldier
Thane : Infiltrator w. warp, no cloak
Legion : variant Infiltrator

notice any pattern ?

That really isn't germane to the point I was disagreeing with, that Tali and Kasumi aren't first-rate "tech characters".

[wizardryforever]

achwas wrote...

Heavensrun wrote...
And as I have mentioned, you're never -in- the vacuum of space in this one (aside from when the Normandy gets ripped open).  Every planet and environment you visit has an atmosphere, be it breathable or not.  This was -not- the case in ME1, but it -is- the case in ME2.  Everyplace you go has air.  I can provide evidence if you -really- need it.

I call you on that and ask for your evidence of where the athmosphere suddenly appears from when the Normandy lies powered down on the outer shell of the collector base and the team leaves the ship through the port airlock ( as shown in the cutscene starting the suicide mission ). Nevermind that everyone switches to breathing equipment

Because, to illustrate my point, the Normandy crash-landed there directly from the space-battle with the collector's cruiser.  Besides,  the Base in itself is most certainly not of the minimum size or mass to attract and maintain any sort of breathable athmosphere on its own.... The entry area is also not a prepared landing/launching area which might concievably have forcefields for athmospheric preservation....

They're called Mass Effect fields, the same thing that keeps the atmosphere on the Citadel from being sucked into space.  The base's Mass Effect fields were still active, and they extended some distance from the base itself, meaning it is not vacuum.  I am a little perplexed that the Collector ship doesn't have breathable atmosphere, but their base does?