120 réponses à ce sujet

[Tony Gunslinger]

I wish part of the suicide mission had also involved choosing a sniper to cover you while you're running through an obvious death trap, and there's a time limit before the enemy takes out the sniper, sort of like Garrus' recruiting mission.

[Daewan]

Christianson wrote...

I only have one question among many more I wont bother to ask. How did any of you know the first playthrough to do Jacks loyalty mission only after you had an enormouse amount of paragon points so you could resolve the arguement betweet Jack and Miranda without losing one of them as loyal????

I didn't know.  My first playthrough is always with my canon Paragon Soldier.  She practically has a halo, she's that good.  She had no problem with any of the confrontations, and made everyone feel guilty for fighting.  :innocent:
My first Renegade was plenty Renegade enough for Jack/Miri, but not for Tali/Legion.  She sided with Tali and then apologized to Legion, and they laughed together about how stupid Quarians are.
After that, I started messing with people on purpose.
I didn't lose anyone on any playthroughs, not even disloyal Jack (sided with Miri on the mShep who romanced Miri).  I upgrade everything, and do all quests, because I think it is fun.  It never occurred to me to even think about getting the IFF until I had all the upgrades done, and to do that I needed money so I did all the sidequests.  Once I realized that triggered the endgame, I did it on purpose, of course.  Almost missed out on the Garrus romance because of it, too (had to go back 7 missions!).
I'm lucky, my playstyle happens to be Obsessive Compulsive.  It makes this sort of thing very easy

[wizardryforever]

Okay, am I the only one who goes through a game at least once before ever looking at spoilers or forums? I like to experience the game myself before looking at how its "supposed" to be done. Hence the reason I didn't know that you could bring everyone through the SUICIDE mission alive. Achievements are something I only look at after a first playthrough as well, so I don't know how I was supposed to know that you could keep everyone alive.

[Epic777]

First playthrough tali died, didn't have all the loyalties. On the nth playthrough tali died: I was shocked, then I realized my adept cannot take grunt and garrus.
Its more tricky than difficult.OP: To believe the suicide mission was done this way because of laziness is CRAZY. You ever think how much coding, testing, animation would have to go into making this suicide mission work? The player has to have hints about what will work and what will not, It would be one giant ass pull if they did not. Imagine if the game made no mention the vents needed a tech specialist?

Modifié par Epic777, 04 octobre 2010 - 07:18 .

[Blackbelt749]

One problem I've always had with the SM has to do with certain classes of Shepard. Why can't Engineer Shepard send himself through the vents? Or Adept Shepard sustain the bubble? I understand why Soldier Shepard can't hold the line, because he's needed to fight the baby reaper. One thing a leader must know is the team members' strengths and weaknesses, including his own.



Now, logically, you would have to create alternate paths for the SM, how to play a level while in the vents (Combat drone deployed at critical times? Using incinerate sniper-style to pick off enemies while the main team fights their way through?) and I'm not sure how one would be able to play while sustaining the biotic bubble. Short of having us control another character, say Garrus because he's a leader, or making it into some immersion breaking mini-game of pressing certain buttons at certain times or you lose the bubble, but I'm Bioware can come up with better stuff then me.



If we get more role-specific missions in ME3(please Bioware) I want to be able to have certain classes of Shepard do certain things. Replay value anyone?

[Christianson]

Thats a good idea Blaclbelt749:)

[Grisson]

 Double post mishap.

Modifié par Grisson, 04 octobre 2010 - 08:01 .

[Grisson]

Dave of Canada wrote...

Saibh wrote...

Surviving the suicide mission didn't seem so easy. Yes, once you knew what you had to do, you could perfectly plan it out, but who among us with no prior knowledge always upgraded their ship, always chose the right specialist (especially with Miranda telling you that anyone would do), knew exactly who to make fire team leader, who to take with them when, and waited until the very end of the game to go on the Derelict Reaper and immediately pursued the Omega-4 Relay?

With no prior knowledge, that seems pretty difficult.

When I first started, I upgraded everything available in terms of ship upgrades because I knew the Normandy would need these upgrades (they also seem to stand out amongst the other upgrades because they don't give you a gameplay boost). I decided to keep recruiting my crew before doing the Delerict Reaper because I expected the Delerict Reaper to risk some of the lives of my crew (I was mistaken) so when I did get the everybody-was-captured scene I had my entire crew and they were all loyal.

Following that, I went to the Suicide Mission and...

They said tech expert, of course I sent Tali.
They said fire team leader, I sent in Garrus because his stories told me he had experience with a squad.
They said biotic, of course I took the best biotic ever (Jack) on the team.
They said an escort for the squad, I sent in Jacob because he was a security guard and wants to protect people.
They said another fire team leader, I once again sent Garrus.

It didn't require much thinking or knowledge. I just had to use common sense on the Suicide Mission. Hell, I was pissed when everybody survived because I expected this to be the toughest mission ever.

This right here is exactly true

Of course I suppose doing all the right logical things is exactly what a smart Commander Shepard would do, I think there maybe should have been some randomness involved with people dying, as a Marine in the Infantry, I know that's just how it is... I can see that not going over well in a game though.

After I played the first time I honestly thought they only way you were going to lose people on this mission was if you were roleplaying a Shepard who was sort of incompetent OR one who thought stopping the collectors was more important then various loyalty missions (which makes sense)

Modifié par Grisson, 04 octobre 2010 - 08:05 .

[Whatever42]

I think maybe some players did feel rushed with the IFF and lost more players. But most of us hardcore RPG nuts probably did every last little side mission before going on - we know that the end of the game always waits for side missions. More casual players might have been more relaxed, though, and got a more traumatic ending.

Christianson wrote...



I only have one question among many more I wont bother to ask. How did any of you know the first playthrough to do Jacks loyalty mission only after you had an enormouse amount of paragon points so you could resolve the arguement betweet Jack and Miranda without losing one of them as loyal????

I don't think you need an enormous number of points, just a high percentage of your possible points need to be one or the other. And since I walked in with 190 paragon points from ME1 and did it fairly early, it was easy.

[Schattenkeil]

Whatever666343431431654324 wrote...

I think maybe some players did feel rushed with the IFF and lost more players. But most of us hardcore RPG nuts probably did every last little side mission before going on - we know that the end of the game always waits for side missions. More casual players might have been more relaxed, though, and got a more traumatic ending..

It doesn't depend on how many missions you made. My Jack wasn't loyal either. The game rewards players who stick to one size, always make renegade or always make paragon decision. That's not a question of points total but of the percentage of the opportunities to gain paragon / renegade decisions. Making case by case decisions is bad. My Shepard took the Paragon choice in 80% of the cases or so, but that's not enough. The reason why I never got the opportunity to change Jack's oppinion after she turned against me was probably that I decided to destroy the geth on Legions loyality mission. It seems unrelated but that's where I left 30 potential paragon points on the way and after that I never had the chance to get along with Jack anymore. That's how Mass Effect 2 works.

It's always easy if you know what's it all about and have an idea how it all works to say "just follow the recommendations". Well, I took a lot of things into account, and most of the time I did follow the recommendation. Just not with the tech specialist. And that cost me effectively two crew members - if I had send Legion instead of Garrus (and I remember thinking very long about this, even going to the kitchen and making a tea over it) both Mordin and Garrus would have survived.

[crimzontearz]

Christianson wrote...

I only have one question among many more I wont bother to ask. How did any of you know the first playthrough to do Jacks loyalty mission only after you had an enormouse amount of paragon points so you could resolve the arguement betweet Jack and Miranda without losing one of them as loyal????

it is not about how much paragon you have but about how much PERCENTAGE paragon you have over the potential total paragon

I always play pure paragon therefore I never fail any checks regardless of when they happen but I always lept Jack's loyalty 3d to last (I never liked her).....

[Zan51]

I did Jack's loyalty mission later in the game as I wasn't that fond of her, to be honest. By that time, I had done most of everything else in roughly the order that I now know you should do it, cos solving the Jack/Miranda fight doesn't depend on Points! It depends on having done all the missions in each hub world area and getting max possible available paragon/renegade  in that area before moving to another hub world and doing the same there. I just did things in a logical order naturally.

As for knowing Bioware games, my only XP was Neverwinter Nights, which is totally different. So I came cold to these games. I lost the crew because I did 2 misions before going through the O-4 Relay, because as someone else said, I didn't think they would take account of time in the game as they hadn't really done so up till now.  I did Leigion's Loyalty mission, obviously, and someone else's, possibly Jacob's as I don't like him much either.

Like others have said, it was just common sense who to pick for which job if you actually paid attention to the game. I stuck to main team members as I didn't have many of the DLCs then. I never paid much attention to what Miranda said either. She is not exactly that good a leader type as she gets folk's backs up.

Garrus was obvious for the Fire Team, Legion for the shaft, Samara was more reliable and experienced for the Biotic sphere, I decided, and I took Mordin and Grunt with me to kill the Reaper. The rest held the line.

Modifié par Zan51, 05 octobre 2010 - 06:05 .

[Schattenkeil]

Actually I think Garrus would have been a poor choice for a team leader. When you learn to know him a works alone at C-Sec against all odds. There is no indication he's a good leader. When you meet him again on Omega he works alone again, he actually prefers that. But he does tell you how he lost his whole team the only one time we know he did work with a team. He's a lone wolf type. There is no indication he's a better leader than Tali for example. You were lucky, that has nothing to do with common sense.

The right answer is always the characters who present themselves first. Common sense has little to do with it, the best choice is to not think about it at all, but to always accept the suggestion, the first thing to present itself. The truth is, if you read the thread, those who made poor choices were the ones who actually spend time thinking about the problem.

Modifié par Schattenkeil, 05 octobre 2010 - 06:30 .

[Dave of Canada]

Schattenkeil wrote...

But he does tell you how he lost his whole team the only one time we know he did work with a team. He's a lone wolf type.

He lost it due to betrayal from within, he was kicking ass and taking names before the betrayal. When you get betrayed, it suddenly doesn't make you incompetent.

[Frybread76]

I lost one of my characters only because I chose Miranda to do the biotic bubble. Because of her genetic engineering she has advanced biotics (for a human) who I thought would be powerful enough to do it. She (and I) was wrong.



What I thought was funny was how many people chose Thane for the vents mission.

[Zulu_DFA]

I know it sucks to want an ME2 squaddie back in ME3, but I think everybody should brave up and stop inventing faint reasons for them to be back other than as cameo/DLCs. Or else it's just the quickest way to the dissapointment with ME3.



This one is particularly pathetic, 'cause Casey Hudson has recently revealed that BioWare had not even been expecting the people to care about carry-overs as much as they had. And during ME2 promo he was as clear as he could about ME2 squad not being planned to stay for ME3, when he said that Liara, Ashley and Kaidan had to be kept away from it to return in ME3.

[Gibb_Shepard]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

I know it sucks to want an ME2 squaddie back in ME3, but I think everybody should brave up and stop inventing faint reasons for them to be back other than as cameo/DLCs. Or else it's just the quickest way to the dissapointment with ME3.

This one is particularly pathetic, 'cause Casey Hudson has recently revealed that BioWare had not even been expecting the people to care about carry-overs as much as they had. And during ME2 promo he was as clear as he could about ME2 squad not being planned to stay for ME3, when he said that Liara, Ashley and Kaidan had to be kept away from it to return in ME3.

That sounds like an extremely idiotic thing to say, did he seriously think that ME fans wanted each game be as stand alone as possible?

But i do think that there will be returning squad members. I know that there is no way in hell Garrus will be leaving shepard, Miranda and Jacob i also think are highly likely to be in your squad. The rest, however, have reasons to leave. So the rest of the crew will likely be new squaddies, which i don't have a problem with.

[Zhijn]

As Garrus said, this time everything is told to us.

Miranda is pretty much the one telling you what to do throughout the hole suicide mission. And whether or not you picked up on it, well thats a hole other thing. Jacob, Tali & Garrus also make it pretty clear the ship need improvements when you ask em about the normandy/mission.

Another thing, i did a renegade character were i did only a couple of loyal missions and Miri was pretty damn clear that most of the crew were not ready nor focused on the mission.

In the end there wasnt much room for failure on the suicide mission unless you purposely made it so, or just dont pay attention when playing a game!.

That said, at first i was disappointing about how easy and how everything told me what to do. But now i kinda like the idea of setting up various deaths and what not for my ME3 import. I just hope BW is onboard that idea that when you kill em off their actually dead for ME3. If not, well then ME2 needs to be re-reviewed as to how good it really was. ^_ ^

[Count Viceroy]

Gibb_Shepard wrote...


But i do think that there will be returning squad members. I know that there is no way in hell Garrus will be leaving shepard, Miranda and Jacob i also think are highly likely to be in your squad. The rest, however, have reasons to leave. So the rest of the crew will likely be new squaddies, which i don't have a problem with.

I think the LI's will be staying. Everyone else goes. Some miracle cure for thane obviously.

[Frybread76]

Count Viceroy wrote...

Gibb_Shepard wrote...


But i do think that there will be returning squad members. I know that there is no way in hell Garrus will be leaving shepard, Miranda and Jacob i also think are highly likely to be in your squad. The rest, however, have reasons to leave. So the rest of the crew will likely be new squaddies, which i don't have a problem with.

I think the LI's will be staying. Everyone else goes. Some miracle cure for thane obviously.

About the only ME2 squad mates I see returning in ME3 are Miranda, Jacob, Garrus and Tali.

[smudboy]

Gibb_Shepard wrote...

That sounds like an extremely idiotic thing to say, did he seriously think that ME fans wanted each game be as stand alone as possible?

Idiot or no, God has spoken.

But i do think that there will be returning squad members. I know that there is no way in hell Garrus will be leaving shepard, Miranda and Jacob i also think are highly likely to be in your squad. The rest, however, have reasons to leave. So the rest of the crew will likely be new squaddies, which i don't have a problem with.

Oops I just killed <insert random squadmember here>.

[TMA LIVE]

The only saving grace is that you can't import a character unless 2 or 3 people survive (from what I'm told). If more then 2 (to fill a squad) die, then you die.



That doesn't mean they'll have important roles, but they at least want you to have some survivors for playing DLC and ME3.

[Zulu_DFA]

TMA LIVE wrote...

The only saving grace is that you can't import a character unless 2 or 3 people survive (from what I'm told). If more then 2 (to fill a squad) die, then you die.

That doesn't mean they'll have important roles, but they at least want you to have some survivors for playing DLC and ME3.

???

[Fiery Phoenix]

smudboy wrote...

Gibb_Shepard wrote...

That sounds like an extremely idiotic thing to say, did he seriously think that ME fans wanted each game be as stand alone as possible?

Idiot or no, God has spoken.

But i do think that there will be returning squad members. I know that there is no way in hell Garrus will be leaving shepard, Miranda and Jacob i also think are highly likely to be in your squad. The rest, however, have reasons to leave. So the rest of the crew will likely be new squaddies, which i don't have a problem with.

Oops I just killed .

This really worries me.

The thing is ME3 will be the end of a trilogy. It would be beyond stupid if at least part of the ME2 team did not return as active squad members in ME3, not to mention it would render ME2 more meaningless than it already is plot-wise.

We get 12 squadmates, spend hours recruiting them, gaining their loyalty one by one, and keeping them alive at the end, only to not have them by our side in the next game? It would make zero sense, regardless of the fact that some of them can be skipped, left unloyal, and not even imported. But that's another story.

My point is, if I spend 45 hours (my average playtime) working mostly on my team to keep them alive, why don't I get to have them with me in the next stage of the adventure? Why should I be treated like those who just ran through ME2 and ended up with a few teammates alive? A two-minute cameo is nothing I care for.

It's just not fair.

[TMA LIVE]

Zulu_DFA wrote...

TMA LIVE wrote...

The only saving grace is that you can't import a character unless 2 or 3 people survive (from what I'm told). If more then 2 (to fill a squad) die, then you die.

That doesn't mean they'll have important roles, but they at least want you to have some survivors for playing DLC and ME3.

???

Think about like this. Unless ME3 starts with completely different people, and you have to recruit everyone, they'll at least want Shepard to start with 2 people. Those people "could" be ME2 squadmates, or not. They're probably still deciding that right now. But they left the option open in case they do want you to start ME3 with the SR2 crew, without anyone new till later.

Modifié par TMA LIVE, 05 octobre 2010 - 04:31 .