118 réponses à ce sujet

[Sarah1281]

Regardless of what Duncan said he would do, it would be an attempt to escape. Nothing was guaranteed. Eleanor wanted to give her child more of a chance.

Since when has Duncan been known to be overly-optimistic? Besides...

Eleanor: Darling, go with Duncan. You have a better chance to escape without me.

Bryce: Eleanor...

Eleanor: Hush, Bryce. I'll kill every bastard that comes through that door to buy them time. But I won't abandon you.

PC: I won't let you sacrifice yourself!

Eleanor: My place is with your father. At his side, to death and beyond.

That really does sound like she's more concerned about her husband than her child. She's all gung-ho to escape until Bryce tells her he's sure he can't make it then it's a quick line about how her child would have a better chance without her and then she's back to talking about Bryce.

[Obadiah]

tool_bot wrote...
...
I haven't done the human Origion (never going to either) but this doesn't make much sense to me. Howe has a small army there and from what I understand what's his face and Eleanor are in a tiny room away from it all. How could she hope to cause any kind of delay that simply being so far from the fight wouldn't cause itself?

Standing up to overwhelming odds. Gotta love it, or not (hint: I do:D)

Sarah1281 wrote...
...

Eleanor: Darling, go with Duncan. You have a better chance to escape without me.
Bryce: Eleanor...
Eleanor: Hush, Bryce. I'll kill every bastard that comes through that door to buy them time. But I won't abandon you.
PC: I won't let you sacrifice yourself!
Eleanor: My place is with your father. At his side, to death and beyond.

That really does sound like she's more concerned about her husband than her child. She's all gung-ho to escape until Bryce tells her he's sure he can't make it then it's a quick line about how her child would have a better chance without her and then she's back to talking about Bryce.

That exchange shows she wants to do both - she is doubly motivated by duty and love for her child and her husband.

Modifié par Obadiah, 05 octobre 2010 - 03:45 .

[tool_bot]

Obadiah wrote...
Standing up to overwhelming odds. Gotta love it, or not (hint: I do:D)

It's not that I don't admire her courage, (from the sounds of things she seems like a fine woman) but it's just that she could do so much more good (meaning help the grey warden cause) alive.

[Obadiah]

tool_bot wrote...
...
It's not that I don't admire her courage, (from the sounds of things she seems like a fine woman) but it's just that she could do so much more good (meaning help the grey warden cause) alive.

She'd be an asset no doubt - but maybe if she'd tried to escape, they'd all be dead. I can't say either way.

[tool_bot]

Obadiah wrote...

tool_bot wrote...
...
It's not that I don't admire her courage, (from the sounds of things she seems like a fine woman) but it's just that she could do so much more good (meaning help the grey warden cause) alive.

She'd be an asset no doubt - but maybe if she'd tried to escape, they'd all be dead. I can't say either way.

How so? Would a party of 3 been that much easier to find?

[Zjarcal]

Sarah1281 wrote...

Regardless of what Duncan said he would do, it would be an attempt to escape. Nothing was guaranteed. Eleanor wanted to give her child more of a chance.

Since when has Duncan been known to be overly-optimistic? Besides...

Eleanor: Darling, go with Duncan. You have a better chance to escape without me.
Bryce: Eleanor...
Eleanor: Hush, Bryce. I'll kill every bastard that comes through that door to buy them time. But I won't abandon you.
PC: I won't let you sacrifice yourself!
Eleanor: My place is with your father. At his side, to death and beyond.

That really does sound like she's more concerned about her husband than her child. She's all gung-ho to escape until Bryce tells her he's sure he can't make it then it's a quick line about how her child would have a better chance without her and then she's back to talking about Bryce.

I wouldn't say that she's more "concerned" about Bryce. She't not really concerned for Bryce (since there's no chance for saving him), she's just resigned to stay with him until the end no matter what.

[MKDAWUSS]

She would have been just as useful accompanying Duncan and the Warden - strength in numbers always helps.



Also, she was guaranteed a celestial dirtnap by staying behind. Escaping would have given her a chance at survival, and an additional witness to Howe's treachery.



I personally thought that was a moronic move.

[Zjarcal]

I really hate people calling Eleanor's decision a "retarded" or "moronic" decision. You may disagree with it, you may think she essentially committed suicide, you may think whatever you want, but to call her decision "moronic" or "retarded" is highly insensitive given the situation she was in.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Come to think of it. If Eleanor survived, I am not sure she would have approved of me being with Morrigan....

Huh, there IS a bright side to everything afterall. 

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 05 octobre 2010 - 04:34 .

[Zjarcal]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Come to think of it. If Eleanor survived, I am not sure she would have approved of me being with Morrigan....

Huh, there IS a bright side to everything afterall. 

You devious, devious man! 

For my HNF, the bright side of not having stayed behind herself (which as I already stated is what I'd had done if given the option) is that she met the love of her life in Leliana. It takes a lot of time for her to accept it though.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Zjarcal wrote...

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Come to think of it. If Eleanor survived, I am not sure she would have approved of me being with Morrigan....

Huh, there IS a bright side to everything afterall. 

You devious, devious man! 

And just imagine me trying to explain to her how her second grandchild is going to be born from a ritual involving blood magic, and will have the soul of an Old God AND on top of that, she'll never be able to see him as his witch of a mother disappears with him.

It would turn very ugly

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 05 octobre 2010 - 04:43 .

[Sabariel]

tool_bot wrote...

Obadiah wrote...

tool_bot wrote...
...
It's not that I don't admire her courage, (from the sounds of things she seems like a fine woman) but it's just that she could do so much more good (meaning help the grey warden cause) alive.

She'd be an asset no doubt - but maybe if she'd tried to escape, they'd all be dead. I can't say either way.

How so? Would a party of 3 been that much easier to find?

The gates had already been broken open and who knows how many soldiers were swarming the castle (sounded like a lot to me). If Eleanor was smart about it she could hold the soldiers off for a good while. If there was no one there to hold the soldiers up they wouldn't have enough time to escape.

[Sarah1281]

How could Eleanor be smart about it? Barricading the door? Could be done before they left.

[Sabariel]

Barricading or somehow figuring out a way to get the soldiers to come through in dribs and drabs instead of a swarm so it would be easier to pick them off and keep them at bay (at least for a while).

[Persephone]

kag666 wrote...

I don't mind her decision at all, imo he'd stay and die with his wife if the situation was reversed.

Plus the game has enough choices to keep me busy, I try not to sweat over what the programmed characters do.
I love when a choice I make leads to a cutscene, one of my favorites is spraying gallons of loghain blood on people.

That's his daughter, you know? Rather disturbing.....

[tool_bot]

Sabariel wrote...

Barricading or somehow figuring out a way to get the soldiers to come through in dribs and drabs instead of a swarm so it would be easier to pick them off and keep them at bay (at least for a while).

That would require somehow drawing attention to their current location. That seems very reckless. There best bet right now is keeping their location and the escape route hidden. 

[Sabariel]

tool_bot wrote...

Sabariel wrote...

Barricading or somehow figuring out a way to get the soldiers to come through in dribs and drabs instead of a swarm so it would be easier to pick them off and keep them at bay (at least for a while).

That would require somehow drawing attention to their current location. That seems very reckless. There best bet right now is keeping their location and the escape route hidden. 

I mean figuring out a way to force them to come through in 'pairs' before their attention is caught so when they do notice you're all set to pick them off. I think they couldn't remain hidden. I think Howe would have told his men all about the layout of Highever Castle and like I said, it sounded like there were a lot of soldiers pouring into the castle. I don't think remaining hidden was an option.

[Obadiah]

tool_bot wrote...

Obadiah wrote...

tool_bot wrote...
...
It's not that I don't admire her courage, (from the sounds of things she seems like a fine woman) but it's just that she could do so much more good (meaning help the grey warden cause) alive.

She'd be an asset no doubt - but maybe if she'd tried to escape, they'd all be dead. I can't say either way.

How so? Would a party of 3 been that much easier to find?

Maybe. Maybe she was more hurt than she let on. Maybe she knows herself well enough to know she doesn't have the stamina for a speedy escape. Could be any number of reasons why she'd think they had a better chance of escape without her.

Modifié par Obadiah, 05 octobre 2010 - 05:05 .

[Elhanan]

The area in question is fairly well made for a defender. The lady in question is a trained Warrior, and should not have gone to her death easily.

[Xilizhra]

My HNF is, admittedly, treacherously glad sometimes that her mother died, since Eleanor never saw her do anything like defiling Andraste's ashes and preserving the Anvil of the Void... but more often wishes that she'd survived. And thinks that the decision was a poor one, but would never condemn her for it.

[Nerevar-as]

Persephone wrote...

kag666 wrote...

I don't mind her decision at all, imo he'd stay and die with his wife if the situation was reversed.

Plus the game has enough choices to keep me busy, I try not to sweat over what the programmed characters do.
I love when a choice I make leads to a cutscene, one of my favorites is spraying gallons of loghain blood on people.

That's his daughter, you know? Rather disturbing.....

 

Yes. I don´t think I´ll be able to kill Loghain with a non-elf character. Not in front of his daughter, regardless of how she is.

OP. Eleanor could have hold the door for a few minutes, so Duncan and her child didn´t have to worry about their backs as they sneaked away from the castle. The doorway out shouldn´t be that hard too defend for a short time. I think Howe had sais she´d been taken alive, too. Pity I couldn´t take my time with him, even considering I quite liked his surviving children in Awakening.

[Elhanan]

Hey! I did not squirt anyone; twas her Father.....

And I guess that pic makes this another Gush thread....

Modifié par Elhanan, 05 octobre 2010 - 01:20 .

[Sarah1281]

I think Howe had sais she´d been taken alive, too.

Howe said that he made Eleanor kiss his feet before she died (like hell she did) and that that was the last thing Bryce saw. Bryce couldn't be moved and kidnapping her was too much of a risk so I think she just died right there.

[Nerevar-as]

Sarah1281 wrote...

I think Howe had sais she´d been taken alive, too.

Howe said that he made Eleanor kiss his feet before she died (like hell she did) and that that was the last thing Bryce saw. Bryce couldn't be moved and kidnapping her was too much of a risk so I think she just died right there.

No doubt she was killed. Just thinking he had taken his time. Better not to think too much about it.

[KnightofPhoenix]

I think Howe is just trying to make you angry, or cruelly enjoy your sadness (and it's said when you threaten to kill his family). Probably both. But I doubt he didn't kill Eleanor right there and then.