143 réponses à ce sujet

[andar91]

Ryuukishi wrote...

 Respec should definitely be in.
All you guys saying it's not realistic or justified by the game's lore probably never use the pause function, right? Right?

As for me, I don't care.  A novel is one thing, but this is a video game and there are certain aspects of gameplay that are there just because they're fun. It is a video game.  But I know others don't agree on this.

[aznsoisauce]

Meltemph wrote...
It is not a game changer at all to me though, so I'm not adversely against it, I just prefer not to even have it(waste time working on it).

Agreed.

Although I would like to have it, I won't be up in arms about it if it isn't implemented.

[asaiasai]

I agree that there should be some sort of respec option for both the players and the companions. I also as suggested SHOULD NOT have to pay to respec a companion when they first arrive. In Witch hunt Ariane was specced as a dual wield warrior, useless imho and as she was the only warrior avaliable unless your PC was a warrior i felt hamstrung using her existing talents. Do not even get me started on Finn, what MORON set up his basic spec?



The need to respec characters is one that either Bioware provides as good customer service with thier products or they can rely on the mod community to provide what is a basic RPG element, which is unproffessional.



@those who feel repsec makes the game to easy.

If this bothers you then make the choice not to use this option. Or are you the types who will dial the skill to the max, then run around waving Starfang, wearing tier 7 Wardens Commanders Plate complain the game is too easy, when in truth your not trying hard enough. Having the option to use good gear or respec a character is better for the game than not, this way the chalange is on a curve.



Asai

[AlanC9]

asaiasai wrote...
The need to respec characters is one that either Bioware provides as good customer service with thier products or they can rely on the mod community to provide what is a basic RPG element, which is unproffessional.

Since when was the ability to respec characters a "basic RPG element"? I've actually never played a game that let you do this, unless the Ultimas count.

[Sylvius the Mad]

JrayM16 wrote...

So, if my theory of respecs were to be the case, are we in agreement?

Yes.

Xewaka wrote...

I'd rather be able to configure the NPCs at the start.

Agreed.

In DAO I use mods for that.

Ryuukishi wrote...

 Respec should definitely be in.
All you guys saying it's not realistic or justified by the game's lore probably never use the pause function, right? Right?

The pause function doesn't exist inside the game.  It isn't relevant to lore.

AlanC9 wrote...

Since when was the ability to respec characters a "basic RPG element"? I've actually never played a game that let you do this, unless the Ultimas count.

Which Ultimas allowed respec?  Which Ultimas even had a levelling system where that would make sense?

[DMC12]

From the NowGamer interview, I'm thinking the chances that respecing are probably going to be in the game are high. Laidlaw said the new ability trees will allow you to either uprgrade and specialize in certain areas or be a jack of all trades with less specialized, more broad abilities. It wouldn't make sense to have no respec option with what looks like a far more customizable class system than the first game. There's too much room for error and plenty of room to play around with something like he described.

[Sylvius the Mad]

DMC12 wrote...

From the NowGamer interview, I'm thinking the chances that respecing are probably going to be in the game are high. Laidlaw said the new ability trees will allow you to either uprgrade and specialize in certain areas or be a jack of all trades with less specialized, more broad abilities. It wouldn't make sense to have no respec option with what looks like a far more customizable class system than the first game. There's too much room for error and plenty of room to play around with something like he described.

That room for error and room to play is, I think, a reason not to include respec.

Learning the rules is fun.  Being able to play just as well without learning the rules is less fun.

Sony actually had a corporate definition of fun as "learning in a safe environment".

Modifié par Sylvius the Mad, 05 octobre 2010 - 09:13 .

[Doyle41]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

Learning the rules is fun.  Being able to play just as well without learning the rules is less fun.

Sony actually had a corporate definition of fun as "learning in a safe environment".

I can't believe this is still an issue. Maybe we could talk Bioware to make all characters naked, weaponless, and have to play on nightmare. Now that's fun.

[asaiasai]

Doyle41 wrote...

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

Learning the rules is fun.  Being able to play just as well without learning the rules is less fun.

Sony actually had a corporate definition of fun as "learning in a safe environment".

I can't believe this is still an issue. Maybe we could talk Bioware to make all characters naked, weaponless, and have to play on nightmare. Now that's fun.

I agree what is one person's idea of fun is another's idea of bull****. I myself can not believe that this is actually a debate. If Bioware allows the option how does that diminish the fun for anybody? Options just because they are there do not mean they have to be used. What are you weak willed and afraid that if the option is there you will use it? I am not sorry, that is a personal problem on your end, as such, keep it on your end. I would rather have options i do not want to use rather than no options at all. So after 10 to 20 hours of game play i realize i have made a mistake in speccing my character. So in the name of some one's idea  fun i have a character that is no longer fun to use because of a spec mistake hours ago. Now i have to scrap the character, more to the point i have to scrap the last 10 to 20 hours of time? Or i risk frustration at either a gimped character or the game because of lack of a fix such as a simple respec item. That is entertainment? That is assinine is what it is. I really wish alot of you guys would be content to play your game and stay the hell out of mine, whether it is respecs, same sex relationships, skill levels, or tactics, as a single player experience these things only effect your game anyway as options the player can choose to excercise or not. I do not think that is an unreasonable request, do you?

Asai

Modifié par asaiasai, 06 octobre 2010 - 05:35 .

[oblivionenss]

Respecc in RPGs.......have actually only played one RPG with respecc and that was Dragon age origins; Awakening at least the only one I can think off.



Now ARPG on the other hand.......



So no respecc options unless they make this to a ARPG, but then I wouldnt buy it because ARPG, in my opinion, sucks.

[In Exile]

Personally, I just hope NPCs don't come preleveled. With the PC, you have the option to design every skill from stratch, so even if you have a suboptimal PC, you had the opportunity to the avoid that. But NPCs (especially mage NPCs) filled to the brim with abilities are just trap characters.

For example, if you use the respec mod for your NPCs (they all start with no skills/talents assigned), DA goes from moderately challenging on nightmare to easy. 2 sword/shield warriors + 2 mages becomes an indestructible combination for most encounters.

Modifié par In Exile, 06 octobre 2010 - 02:01 .

[0x30A88]

Well, it's not like they force you to buy it. Leave it alone if you hate it.

[AlanC9]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...
Which Ultimas allowed respec?  Which Ultimas even had a levelling system where that would make sense?

The Avatar respecs between games. Yeah, I wasn't sure if this would count, but it's the only game I've ever played that came close. Or can you respec Shepard when starting ME2?

[AlanC9]

In Exile wrote...
For example, if you use the respec mod for your NPCs (they all start with no skills/talents assigned), DA goes from moderately challenging on nightmare to easy. 2 sword/shield warriors + 2 mages becomes an indestructible combination for most encounters. 

S&S warriors are that much better than rogues? You can have this combination if the Warden is a S&S warrior himself, although Wynne's starting spells aren't all that great.

[Sylvius the Mad]

AlanC9 wrote...

The Avatar respecs between games. Yeah, I wasn't sure if this would count, but it's the only game I've ever played that came close.

Oh, good point.

Given that the Avatar, though, was a fairly ordinary nerd in the real world, though, and further given that character craetion was done through a gypsy tarot reading, there's clearly a magical aspect to that respec.

Or can you respec Shepard when starting ME2?

You can, though again there's a lore-based explanation for that.  Shepard has effectively been rebuilt between the two games, arguably as a cyborg (that's never really made clear).

[Sylvius the Mad]

In Exile wrote...

Personally, I just hope NPCs don't come preleveled. With the PC, you have the option to design every skill from stratch, so even if you have a suboptimal PC, you had the opportunity to the avoid that. But NPCs (especially mage NPCs) filled to the brim with abilities are just trap characters.

The No Follower Auto-Level mod combined with the No Starting Abilities mod means that every character, both Warden and companion, is introduced to you with zero points assigned.

On my various playthroughs Alistair has been a S&S warrior, a 2H warrior, a DW Warrior, and a Warrior Archer.

My favourite Warrior Archer in the game is Sten; I think it really suits his demeanour.

Those mods are an important part of my DAO experience.

[Maverick827]

But doesn't that make the game much easier? The encounters are not tuned for your party having an extra Warrior Archer or Dual Wild Warrior. That seems pretty unbalancing to me.

[Sylvius the Mad]

Maverick827 wrote...

But doesn't that make the game much easier? The encounters are not tuned for your party having an extra Warrior Archer or Dual Wild Warrior. That seems pretty unbalancing to me.

Depends how you play it.

The game isn't really intended for having 3 dedicated archers in one party.  Does doing that make the game easier, or harder?  Some people think archers are underpowered in DAO.

The game seems designed for a party with a tank in it all the time.  If I happen to play without one (even without assigning points myself), does that make the game easier, or harder?

It makes the game different.

But by using mods to achieve this result rather than asking for it to be including within the core game, I'm not affecting anyone else's gameplay.  The game wasn't changed to accommodate what I'm doing to it, so there' sno cost to other players.

[AlanC9]

I suspect difficulty would become somewhat random, rather than be consistently one way or the other, which was why In Exile's post surprised me.

[Reaverwind]

Tantum Dic Verbo wrote...

I haven't played Awakening. But in a level-based game with talent trees, it can be frustrating to find that choices that weren't obvious 12 levels ago are now hamstringing your character.

Even worse is getting stupidly-specced companions - I'd want the option to fix that.

[Ortaya Alevli]

Mod solutions don't do any good to console players.

[Sylvius the Mad]

Ortaya Alevli wrote...

Mod solutions don't do any good to console players.

I'm indifferent to console players.  I'm not one.  What they get doesn't matter to me.

I don't care if there's a respec option in the console DA2.  I don't care if there are mods.  I don't care if console DA2 is an action game.  I'm indifferent.

[Ortaya Alevli]

Sylvius the Mad wrote...

Ortaya Alevli wrote...

Mod solutions don't do any good to console players.

I'm indifferent to console players.  I'm not one.  What they get doesn't matter to me.

I don't care if there's a respec option in the console DA2.  I don't care if there are mods.  I don't care if console DA2 is an action game.  I'm indifferent.

Err...good on you?

[JrayM16]

I think that the core of this debate lies in PC/console gap in terms of how those games are made.

Now that the two are coming together, both are being changed, and the fight stems from which way games are going.

Edit: They have become joined and will affect the other.  While being indifferent to one side is fine in theory, console and pc games have become linked to a degree that what happens to one will affect the other. 

Modifié par JrayM16, 06 octobre 2010 - 07:44 .

[Sylvius the Mad]

JrayM16 wrote...

While being indifferent to one side is fine in theory, console and pc games have become linked to a degree that what happens to one will affect the other. 

Yes, but I'm only concerned with those effects that manifest on the PC.