315 réponses à ce sujet

[TheMadCat]

the_one_54321 wrote...

Still, you can't deny that people are complaining about the "gray and brown" in directly contradictory ways.

A contradictory way how?

[MerinTB]

Ok, my impression of that article - not that anyone who is excited for DA2 will probably care...

I think the article is unfair.

...

Yes, me.  I think it was unfair.

...

I will admit to a surge of relief at an article that didn't ape all the BioWare marketing keywords and phrases (it even mocked such things), and one that was overly critical (even of the first DA)...

but they were judging the game's visuals by one part of the game - as in the color palette or what-not, which isn't really fair IMO.

Again, don't get me wrong, I am ecstatic to see a review pointing out the changes as seeming to be ME influenced, questioning whether the changes will be good or bad, and hammering home the much more restricted character creation...

But the focus on the drab colors is an annoying meme among gamers currently, one that I wish would go away.  And just to be able to tap into that meme, they were selectively unfair to the game's appearance.

Now, if they had complained about how the darkspawn look now, that would be a more legitimate critique IMO...

[nightcobra]

Anarya wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...

Purple mountains majesty? 
But seriously, the range of the color pallette doesn't add or take away anything from the way the game is played. And I have to say that I almost have to lol when I read comments like "the gray and brown make everything so bleak and drab" and "to make it gritty and grimy all you can do is make everything gray and brown" right next to each other.
Conflicting subjectivity FTW. Again, arguing about art and style is completely pointless.

Well I kind of have to disagree with you. I mean no, the color palette does not affect gameplay in a technical sense, but color does a lot for conveying mood in an area. I would not say it's meaningless but I also don't think it has anything to do with the range of the palette so much as how the colors are being used. But lighting is also just as important for mood and tone as the palette, and from what I understand, lighting is being adjusted all the time. So that same color palette could look much different when lighting is finalized. Or it could look the same, I dunno. I'm going to trust John on this one because he does an inordinate amount of staring at the game's colors. *passes John some Visine*

enslaved for example has beautiful and colorful environments due to a good use of color

Modifié par nightcobra8928, 05 octobre 2010 - 06:25 .

[Spartansfan8888]

I think it was pretty obvious from the start they intended to have a negative disposition on the whole critique.

[soundchaser721]

I thought that the article provided a fair view on the mass-effect inspired changes to the gameplay but it was a little harsh on the visuals. They seem a little foggy and a bit drab but the game still has like five months till launch so I'm sure it won't look as bad as they were making it out to be. The visuals in origins never really bothered me much. I'm not one to focus too much on the environment of a game though I did appreciate some of the visuals in origins.

[DMC12]

I mention it a lot, but Demon's Souls uses color schemes very well in portraying the mood of the game. Then again, that's all it really has to go off of besides gameplay, since there's no story (none that matters anyway), and there's no music except in boss battles. The game's colors are pretty dull and bland as well, but they relate to the feeling of the different areas like the brown for the area infested with plague and evil fetuses, and greyish blue of the storm area that gives off an ancient mystical feel.

I doubt that DA2 will be all bland colors though. There's a few screen shots of an urban-like area and one featuring a throne room, which look pretty grand and epic to me. So I don't see where the author is coming from.

Modifié par DMC12, 05 octobre 2010 - 06:36 .

[Anarya]

Brockololly wrote...

Even if the Blightlands is supposed to be all grim and gritty thats fine and makes sense. What irks me are the seemingly still bland backdrops that makes it seem as if everything is covered in a thick layer of smog, fog and haze.

For example:
[snip]

Well it seems you don't like the lighting and atmospheric effects. Personally I like that effect, because it reminds me of Chinese landscape painting, like Hawke and co. are moving through a scroll.



Although I will point out that Chinese landscape painting is more realistic than you might think. Here's a photo of Guilin, China:



Anyway the approach to landscape in this game is supposedly more minimalistic and meant to serve as negative space. I think the Eastern tradition of painting is very thoughtful of negative space so hey, if they're taking cues from that I heartily approve.

[nightcobra]

Anarya wrote...

Brockololly wrote...

Even if the Blightlands is supposed to be all grim and gritty thats fine and makes sense. What irks me are the seemingly still bland backdrops that makes it seem as if everything is covered in a thick layer of smog, fog and haze.

For example:
[snip]

Well it seems you don't like the lighting and atmospheric effects. Personally I like that effect, because it reminds me of Chinese landscape painting, like Hawke and co. are moving through a scroll.



Although I will point out that Chinese landscape painting is more realistic than you might think. Here's a photo of Guilin, China:



Anyway the approach to landscape in this game is supposedly more minimalistic and meant to serve as negative space. I think the Eastern tradition of painting is very thoughtful of negative space so hey, if they're taking cues from that I heartily approve.

guilin....shenmue memories incoming

[Stinkface27]

I think there's a fine line between colorful and Final Fantasy sparkly, and where you draw that line is a matter of personal taste.



I thought DA was tastefully colorful. I know I captured many a screenshot of areas and scenes I thought were just gorgeous. There was a bit of brown happening, but it seems like with the jumping storyline DA2 will have, we won't get stuck in monotonous blocks of time where we just have to fight the same enemies in the same area for too long.

[Faz432]

JohnEpler wrote...

Oh, we're not going to arbitrarily make tunnels out of pink granite and dye every piece of armour a rich scarlet hue just to inject colour into things.

But we do try to colour things appropriately, and sometimes, that involves other colours besides brown and grey! It's a nice day-to-day variety, especially when you're staring at the same room for 8 hours in a single day.

This is the best way I can think of explaining what I mean


This is the original screen shot



This is my attemp of trying to remove the brown filter




Get rid of this



It just ruins the good work you've done.

Modifié par Faz432, 05 octobre 2010 - 06:53 .

[The Masked Rog]

Faz432 wrote...

JohnEpler wrote...

Oh, we're not going to arbitrarily make tunnels out of pink granite and dye every piece of armour a rich scarlet hue just to inject colour into things.

But we do try to colour things appropriately, and sometimes, that involves other colours besides brown and grey! It's a nice day-to-day variety, especially when you're staring at the same room for 8 hours in a single day.

This is the best way I can think of explaining what I mean


This is the original screen shot



This is my attemp of trying to remove the brown filter




Get rid of this



It just ruins the good work you've done.

Actually I like the first more than the ssecond. Much more gritty.

[DMC12]

The Masked Rog wrote...


Actually I like the first more than the ssecond. Much more gritty.

Tell me about it. It actually looks like the land was recently destroyed and corrupted with all the dust in the air.

[RampantBeaver]

I'm feeling positive about the new art style. Just look at Bethany and Hawkes face's. Individually they are better than any of the faces that appeared in Dragon Age: Origins. For a game that relies on character authenticity and intimacy to push the story elements this is a step forward.

[David Gaider]

DMC12 wrote...
Tell me about it. It actually looks like the land was recently destroyed and corrupted with all the dust in the air.

Indeed. It's just the one environment-- which is supposed to look like a Blight is corrupting it, not like a feast of colour for the eyes. There is lots more colour throughout the game... but, meh, you'll see all that in time, I'm sure.

[Morrigans God son]

Ha! When is anything about DA2 positive? I've gotten used to the gloom now.

[the_one_54321]

TheMadCat wrote...

the_one_54321 wrote...
Still, you can't deny that people are complaining about the "gray and brown" in directly contradictory ways.

A contradictory way how?

The example is in the post Anarya quoted.

[The Hardest Thing In The World]

Okay John, I like what I've seen so far, especially that screenshot of Hawke and the qunari. I love the colours of their armors.

[ScotGaymer]

I just want to point out one thing about the arguing about the Graphics...



DAO I had to download a graphics mod to increase the detail on things and brighten things up a bit because DA was very drab. I know its supposed to have a gloomy atmosphere but that doesnt automatically HAVE to mean Drab.



However I think it is much much too early to say about the graphics based on the screenies we have seen so far; nor do I think that previewer should have slagged DA2 as much as he did about the graphics because the version he previewed was a late alpha/early beta version of the game. Much of the game is unfinished funnily enough; including textures and filtering etc.



The game wont be release till around my birthday time (marchish) which is a good 5/6 months - a long long time to make improvements graphically. Which lets face it graphics count as "polish" and thus arent ordinarily properly tackled till close to the end anyway.

Its silly to complain about graphics in the way that the previewer did when its still in late alpha/early beta stages; noting that the graphics are kinda dull, uninspired, and undetailed is fair enough because they are but the previewer whinged about it as if he was previewing a game around a month pre-release, as if he didnt think Bioware had the time or inclination to actually polish the game as it should (and will be) polished.

[Brockololly]

Anarya wrote...
Well it seems you don't like the lighting and atmospheric effects. Personally I like that effect, because it reminds me of Chinese landscape painting, like Hawke and co. are moving through a scroll.
*snip*

Well, yeah in Origins I hated the over done fogginess of all the settings. The lighting in Origins was rubbish really and I am happy to hear that they're working on that for DA2, even if its not evident in the screens as of yet.

I quite like Chinese landscape paintings too, but the issue I have is that every environment in Origins did the smoggy/foggy look:

If the area is actually supposed to be foggy- cool! But if not, why is the area only about 10-20 feet in front of you all blurry and foggy? In the landscapes you posted its fine since you only see that sort of stuff waaay off in the distance.

And this screen from DA2 is also foggy:

Now is that genuinely supposed to be a spooky, foggy locale or just overdone atmospheric perspective?

Anarya wrote...
Anyway the approach to landscape in this game is supposedly more minimalistic and meant to serve as negative space. I think the Eastern tradition of painting is very thoughtful of negative space so hey, if they're taking cues from that I heartily approve.

Oh, I know about all that and I'll be interested to see the final product. I just can't say I'm a fan of what I've seen thus far.

[jones0901]

this review is a joke....i'm definitly a bit worried about the direction of the game, but this article is just pandering to the people who are worried about the game so if the game sucks they can say they said it first. Example, it says that character customization has been dumbed down, which bc of no race selection may be true, but it continues by saying that you can only be mage, warrior, or rogue.We all know this, its just the reviewers phrasing stuff negativly....lots of examples like this,

[DMC12]

Brockololly wrote...

And this screen from DA2 is also foggy:

Now is that genuinely supposed to be a spooky, foggy locale or just overdone atmospheric perspective?

Dude, that's in a mountain range. Of course it's going to look foggy. There's nothing exciting about about fighting demons and the undead in a sunny, clear environment with pretty tulip gardens all around you. Dark, foggy, and generally spooky environments may seem overdone because they work.

[tmp7704]

Brockololly wrote...

I quite like Chinese landscape paintings too, but the issue I have is that every environment in Origins did the smoggy/foggy look:

If the area is actually supposed to be foggy- cool! But if not, why is the area only about 10-20 feet in front of you all blurry and foggy? In the landscapes you posted its fine since you only see that sort of stuff waaay off in the distance.

Well, the Brecilian Forest is supposed to be place of many wars and battles, where the Veil is thin from all the bloodshed and spirits/demons cross it frequently and haunt the place. The blurry, foggy look lends to making the place spooky which i figure was the intention.

edit: that said, the fog is also frequently used to mask the short drawing range the games have in general as well as the level of detail changes on the props farther out, and to fool the mind into perceiving environments as bigger than they really are. So there's some practical reasons for that, too.

Modifié par tmp7704, 05 octobre 2010 - 07:41 .

[The Hardest Thing In The World]

I think everyone knows that but I think it is atmospheric and worked at the same time.

[CoS Sarah Jinstar]

tmp7704 wrote...

Brockololly wrote...

I quite like Chinese landscape paintings too, but the issue I have is that every environment in Origins did the smoggy/foggy look:

If the area is actually supposed to be foggy- cool! But if not, why is the area only about 10-20 feet in front of you all blurry and foggy? In the landscapes you posted its fine since you only see that sort of stuff waaay off in the distance.

Well, the Brecilian Forest is supposed to be place of many wars and battles, where the Veil is thin from all the bloodshed and spirits/demons cross it frequently and haunt the place. The blurry, foggy look lends to making the place spooky which i figure was the intention.

edit: that said, the fog is also frequently used to mask the short drawing range the games have in general as well as the level of detail changes on the props farther out, and to fool the mind into perceiving environments as bigger than they really are. So there's some practical reasons for that, too.

Lets just be honest, they did it to keep the frame rate up because the engine isn't very optimized in the first place.

[Bryy_Miller]

Faz432 wrote...

When he's talking about the game being 'brown' he means the colour filter that is being applied for example

This has a Blue colour filter applied to it which makes everything have a blueish look = sad



This has a green filter applied that makes everything look greenish = futuristic



This has a brown filter applied which makes everything look brownish = dark & grimey

Video games don't have filters. The textures are created.

I will wait until it's released and I've read people's reactions before I make my decision.

Maybe you should play it and form your own opinion?