155 réponses à ce sujet

[Vansen Elamber]

The main difference I see between DA and NWN2 is the movement of your characters in the game world, DA is vastly superior in that regard. Obsidian did improve that with patches somewhat but DA has a much more nartual feel to moving your party through the world, that was the thing I struggled with the most in NWN2. Also I liked the story of Mask of the Betrayer much better then NWN2 OC.

Modifié par Vansen Elamber, 03 décembre 2009 - 12:30 .

[Duck and Cover]

NWN2 was a great game. Very underrated imho. I think it should have done better. But I think they pushed the NWN engine as far as they could. And it was bogging down a little (though I haven't tried running it on my current system- it's alot better).



And yes I saw the similarities too, but alot of games use similar themes. But makes you wonder...



NWN2 had more class options of course, gazillions more. Sometimes D&D 3.5 is overwhelming. It takes you 30 minutes just to plan your character build so you don't screw something up when levelling up. I think the stories are about equal. I won't say one is above the other.



Where this game shines over NWN is the combat. Combat is so much more entertaining. D&D combat for computer has alot of limitations. The rest system is the main one, but the lack of fighter abilities is another. DA:O blows away both NWN's and Kotor's in this regard. It's even better than BG2 combat. Less downtime=good (although maybe I wish mana wouldn't regenerate that fast after combat, but I digress).



All I want to see is NWN2 get a little more respect. They did alot with that old game engine.

[jackkel dragon]

Now that things have cooled down, why don't we all play DA and NWN2? Just enjoy the good parts and ignore the bad (and the "obvious" similarities.) I personally had to push myself through NWN2, but that's just because of the system. (MotB was even better, I forgot the NWN2 system was messed up while playing that.)

Enjoy both for what they are. I did.

P.S.: There ARE toolsets for both games, so if you don't like one story, make a new one. (No one said they disliked either story yet, just making a comment.)

Edit: Take a look at my Start menu: http://www.freeimage.../d04d22a12f.jpg

Modifié par jackkel dragon, 03 décembre 2009 - 01:01 .

[Incogneatus]

Apophis2412 wrote...

There are actually more similarities between DAO and other Bioware titles than between DAO and NWN2.
For example:

*Player is part of an elite organisation. (Bhaalspawn, Jedi, Spirit Monks, Grey Wardens, Spectres)
*The main plot is about gathering 4-5 things to defeat the big bad ( Star Maps, Dragon Amulet Pieces, Allies to defeat the Blight, clues to finding the conduit, companions).

And of course most of the companions from their previous titles are the same:

Proud Warrior Race Guy: Sten, Canderous Ordo, Wrex,
Kill all that lives!/Figthing is fun!: Shale, HK-47, Black Whirlwind.
Female love interest A (Nice guy with the tortured past): Anomen, Kaiden Alenko, Carth Onasi.
Female love interest B (lovable rogue): Sky, Alistair.
Male love interest A (innocent, nice, good two-shoes and sometimes clingy): Aerie, Liara,  Leliana, Dawn Star.
Male love interest B: Tough, rebellious, bad/evil and sometimes sexy): Viconia, Silk Fox/ Lian, Ashley Williams, Subject Zero, Morrigan.

He nailed it. Thread closed.

[Aisynia]

Oh?



Please elaborate.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Elithranduil wrote...

Bumped this for amusement factor. 6 months ago I had NFI what I was talking about. Sigh.

I'll say. I had a serious WTF moment seeing Dand compared to Wynne, Bevil to Alistair,  Morrigan to Elanee, and especially, Bishop to Sten.

The DA crew, if anything would be at best, combos of the NWN2 crew. More like:

Morrigan: female Bishop, though lessy neurotic and safer to have around gates. Only commonality with Elanee is shapeshifting and nature knowledge (Elanee was neutral good, remember). Survival oriented, self-centered, coldly pragmatic and ruthless. A touch of Qara added in there for the love of power and the freedom to use it however.

Wynne: sort of a mix between Zhjaeve and Elanee, especially in the rather preachy bit. 

Sten: a mix of Casavir and Zhjaeve. Uber lawful neutral and stoic, with the paladin's obsession for redemption and duty.

Zevran:  A mix of Bishop and Neeshka. Like Neeshka, manages to stay pretty upbeat and hopeful despite an unpleasant past. Like both Neeshka and Bishop, once bound pawn to rather unsavory and ruthless masters. Like Bishop, he is a shameless chaser of skirt, but with more guile and charm. Major baggage. But unlike Bishop, far more able to cope constructively with his problems.

Alistair: A mix of Casavir, Shandra, and Grobnar. has Casavir's rather conflicted ideas of duty, with Shandra's sensitivity and ethics, and Grobnar's goofieness. Like Grobby, is quite happy to be the butt of jokes, and be the party fool for amusement. Unlike Casavir, does not need battlements and night of impending doom to get around to sexytime with the PC.

Leliana: Sort of a Neeshka/Shandra hybrid. 

Oghren: Mix of Khelgar and Bishop. Dwarf, likes to get drunk, pariah in his society. Like Bishop, likes to get raging drunk and hit on anything that moves in the coursest of ways.

Shale: Construct in practice, but personalitywise, is the lovechild of Sand and a large slab of rock. The golem's snideness, high-strung contempt for just about everyone....yeah. I bet she wasn't a Dwarf, but a pan-dimensional elf.

Loghain: Yeah, Ammon Jerro is pretty much the only real similarity in one companion. Loghain is like Jerro minus the serious radiation poisoning and connections to the movers and shakers in the Lower Planes.

Dog: Kawrnwyr!

Beyond that, though, there really is little to no real similarities between the two games.

[Inzhuna]

Was going to write how the companions comparison doesn't make much sense, but Skadi nailed it

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

I suppose for NPCs, How could be considered the Mephasm to Loghain, if you stretch it a bit.

[alxboss78]

Guys come on. There are only so many materials to be used when making a fantasy story. I doubt that there is anything really new or innovative left to say. The trick now is the combination of these materials. So most new fantasy stories (not to talk about fiction in general) if good would look like a combination of older stories.

Apart from that we are also talking about an RPG game that emphasises choice and consequence, which also have some elements that need to be present in order to make for an entertaining and varied game (the different personalities of the companions etc.)

So if you put the two together you have even less ingredients than the initial ones for fantasy stories.

Every new story is an amalgam of older successful motives, which becomes even more evident when one game tries to be epic! Of course there will be many more similarities in the stories of DA, Star Wars, ME, NWN and BG than say... Planescape: Torment. I mean take even The Witcher as an example. The story has similarities with the above mentioned games but avoids a lot of other similarities because of the fact that there aren't any companions.

Anyway closing let's just say, that there are only so many motivating factors to push someone to become what most RPG heroes are and again only so many Epic type motives that you can use. The whole point and the hit or miss of any story or game is how they use these motives and how they combine them.

For me NWN 2 was a solid game that i enjoyed as was NWN 1 and KOTOR 2. DA though is at a whole other level in every aspect i mentioned above and on the added fact that they tried to make a completely new world and make it seem alive and full of history. Which is why i don't like making comparisons of DA:O to the BG trilogy (the pinacle of gaming for me) as BG really picked up on the second part, and it was working on an already established world full of history. DA has established its world very nicely up till now. So it will be more just to compare with BG after they move forward their world a bit more.

[Tooneyman]

NWN 2 is a lot like DA:O period whichy we can all say the least. This isn't a bad thing. It just means a company is willing to remake some old ideas. ITs like infinity ward and its sister company for the call of Duty series. They made CODWAW and then MW 2. Infinity ward little made the sister company look bad. I think this was a rivalry with the sister company as well. Basically it was bioware saying we are superior to you. I would actually like to see what Obiscan would do with the DA engine compared to bioware. The only thing I didn't like about NWN 2 was their expansion. I mean they just sucked. Period they couldn't make a good expansion if it bit them in the azz. But the game was really fun and I did enjoy it. I wish they would have Neeksha back she was my tali in that game. Everything about her was like love me. She made a grown man cry when I was able to convince her to stay on my side at the end of the game. To bad I couldn't romance her, but I'm glad I felt like I could man she really was my devil woman.



HMMM. back on topic. NWN 2 is good. DA:O is great. I'm now going to go back and play NWN 2 when I'm done with this DA:O origin because I still haven't done the evil quest version of it yet. haha!. Thanks to this thread. I think I want to see Neeksha again. LAters!

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

There are mods that make Neeshka and Bishop romancable, though i don't know how good the Neeshka mod is.

[Costin_Razvan]

Question: How do you make NWN2 not lag so much? I have issues on my PC.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Turn down the graphics level, quickest way. That's ususally what hangs it up.



Limit the number of active auras, too.

[Costin_Razvan]

Thanks for the info. Wasn't able to finish the first zone because the lag killed all the fun...



How can a 2006 game Lag on a machine which runs 2009-2010 games well is beyond me.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Even though it was made back then, it was still a pretty graphic intensive game for it's time. My machine was built last year, and NWN2 still lags if I'm not careful.



It is a great game, I've played it more times than i can count.

[Costin_Razvan]

Am I stuck with Carth.....oh wait what was his name? AGAIN for an entire game?!

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 27 avril 2010 - 10:41 .

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Costin_Razvan wrote...

Am I stuck with Carth.....oh wait what was his name? AGAIN for an entire game?!

Uuuhhh...wrong game?

[Costin_Razvan]

Isn't that companion you get at the start VERY SIMILAR to him though?

[Rhys Cordelle]

I hated NWN2. I think it would be have been much better if they'd just improved the graphics of NWN.



Dragon Age is NWN2 done right.

[Skadi_the_Evil_Elf]

Costin_Razvan wrote...

Isn't that companion you get at the start VERY SIMILAR to him though?

Who Bevil? Bevil's more a dimwited inbred hick than anything else.

[Costin_Razvan]

I thought they had the same voice actor. And knowing what kind of roles he plays ( Kaiden+Carth ) I figured that companion would be the same.



Glad I am wrong!

[Nivenus]

I think NWN2 is underrated.

That being said, I do not think DA:O lifted anything substantially from the game. As others have already said, DA:O was in development a lot longer than NWN2 - since 1999 I believe - and most of the major similarities between the two games are also elements that they have in common with KotOR, TSL, and Jade Empire. The fact that DA:O shares some of these similarities is hardly surprising - I didn't expect it not to.

Now granted, some plot elements (building up an alliance and such) are a bit more similar to NWN2 than the other three games, but it's still far from beyond the realm of possibility that it's not a coincidence. And I think the character comparisons are, frankly, a bit of a stretch (with some exceptions - Oghren and Khelgar are both outcasts among their own people for their "stereotypically" dwarven behavior, for instance). Saying that Leliana = Neeshka or Morrigan = Elanee is so oversimplistic it's almost laughable. Other than their class and abilities, the characters are not very similar at all (for instance, Neehska's the bad girl of the two).

I really think it's a stretch. Still, I love to see some NWN2 loving.

[Costin_Razvan]

I think 2002 would be a correct date.

However I should point out that they did most likely rewrite everything in DA:O several times.

Modifié par Costin_Razvan, 28 avril 2010 - 12:33 .

[Highdragonslayer]

The characters you mentioned have no related personality traits what so ever other than their class.