56 réponses à ce sujet

[cos1ne]

Morinth is a wasted party member in that there is no logical reason to choose her.



For example her dialogue is, "Pick me I'm as strong as Samara" to which Samara replies "You already have my loyalty Shepard".



I mean honestly it'd be like trading an ps3 for another ps3 it makes no sense. Especially considering Morinth's attitude, at least you can trust Samara. I mean all the writers needed to do was change that one line to something like "I'm twice as powerful as Samara", she wouldn't have to be telling the truth, but it would make sense then for a Renegade to pick Morinth, but no our choices come down to the Justicar who's sworn to follow our orders, or the psychotic sexual predator who wants to get her thrills by killing us.



Yeah great choice there Bioware.

[chris025657]

Spawnfreak73 wrote...

Brain draining sexual predator, or victim of her own DNA? What do you think?

For me, the genes are irrelevant. Morinth is a serial mass murderer who must be stopped. The reason we stop serial murderers is not because they made a choice despite whatever genetic predisposition they might have. We stop serial mass murderers because they murder people. 

[Xeranx]

yorkj86 wrote...

They are both figures who appeal directly to the player's own morality.  They also challenge the player to roleplay Shepards who have differing moral systems, especially Shepards whose moral systems are different from the player's.  They are both intentionally written to be as equal as possible in their circumstances.

That may be the case for some, but not for all.  Morinth doesn't appeal to my morality so much so as she appeals to my emphatic nature...which is tempered by my willingness to see all sides.  Samara on the other hand goes so hard against my morality that I can't see her as anything but a self aggrandizing murderer.

Morinth is an interesting character who doesn't get any kind of character progression in a character driven game.  Any progression that could happen stops as soon as it starts.  I remember someone saying that characters made to not be liked weren't liked in a poll, but considering the exposition on Morinth's negatives by someone out to kill her (who killed an unarmed individual in front of you and made it known that she would kill law enforcement on a world if she were put in cuffs) I call bad writing.  It would be the same if you hid evidence of someone being a humanitarian because you want them to get the max sentence for a crime they committed.  It's prejudicial.  

If you can't give a balanced view on an individual who is probably supposed to be trusted to watch your back what is the point of writing the character?

chris025657 wrote...

Spawnfreak73 wrote...

Brain draining sexual predator, or victim of her own DNA? What do you think?

For me, the genes are irrelevant. Morinth is a serial mass murderer who must be stopped. The reason we stop serial murderers is not because they made a choice despite whatever genetic predisposition they might have. We stop serial mass murderers because they murder people. 

DIdn't want to get into this, but no...Samara is a willing mass murderer and she tells you as much.

Modifié par Xeranx, 08 octobre 2010 - 01:49 .

[Xeranx]

Modifié par Xeranx, 08 octobre 2010 - 01:49 .

[TheodoricFriede]

Icinix wrote...

TheodoricFriede wrote...

Morinth is a psychopath clear and simple.
I do however believe Ardat Yakshi are mistreated by the asari. Being imprisoned for your sickness is inexcusable. It would be like imprisoning AIDs patients.

No, it's like giving a compulsive murderer a choice.

- Fight your condition and you can be treated well and live in a closed society and perhaps even have the chance to do some good.
- Or we can kill you and end your ability to torment and take lives.

Ardat Yakshi are not compelled to kill, Morinth was. They should live life of abstanince, but not live a of forced seclusion. You cant send someone to prison for being born with the wrong genetic code.

I have the ability to take a knife and murder, but that doesnt mean id ever do it.

[TheodoricFriede]

I dont believe that whole "its addicting" thing. I think that's just something Samara said. Im not saying she was lying, but I'm saying what she was told to believe.



Morinth killed because she liked killing, not because she was addicted to the mind melding.

[Mecha Tengu]

morinth is much more badass and sexy



want

[Giggles_Manically]

Thought she would be interesting, but there is no way that I am letting a 400 year old serial-rapist/murderer live.

[AntiChri5]

considering the exposition on Morinth's negatives by someone out to kill her (who killed an unarmed individual in front of you and made it known that she would kill law enforcement on a world if she were put in cuffs)

Did you stop to consider why Samara wants to kill her?

And are you forgetting the "unarmed individual" was a criminal who, moments ago, had been armed and attempting to kill Samara?

And when has Shepard ever let him/herself be detained?

[Giggles_Manically]

AntiChri5 wrote...

considering the exposition on Morinth's negatives by someone out to kill her (who killed an unarmed individual in front of you and made it known that she would kill law enforcement on a world if she were put in cuffs)

Did you stop to consider why Samara wants to kill her?
And are you forgetting the "unarmed individual" was a criminal who, moments ago, had been armed and attempting to kill Samara?
And when has Shepard ever let him/herself be detained?

Considering like a minute ago I turned Elnora into swiss cheese I dont really have a better moral position that day.

[TheodoricFriede]

yorkj86 wrote...

TheodoricFriede wrote...

I dont believe that whole "its addicting" thing. I think that's just something Samara said. Im not saying she was lying, but I'm saying what she was told to believe.

Morinth killed because she liked killing, not because she was addicted to the mind melding.

What would be your Shepard's reason for believing that to be the case?  Your Shepard's reason, not yours.

My Shepard IS me. So i can only give you my reason. My shepard doesnt trust Samara, he thinks she's just as much of a serial killer as Morinth is.
He also thinks that Ardat Yakshi are persecuted not out of nessesety but out of fear. When the government fears something, they use propaganda to get everyone to fear it too.

Keep in mind i still kill Morinth, but not because shes an Ardat Yakshi. I kill her because shes an irredemable murderer.

Sorry if thats not coherent, im very tired. And i dont mean to cause trouble with what i said about samara so forgive my opinion. Im not trying to offend anyone, its just what i think of the character.

Modifié par TheodoricFriede, 08 octobre 2010 - 03:26 .

[AntiChri5]

Samara is the most predictable, most easily manipulated person on you meet.

Keep in mind i still kill Morinth, but not because shes an Ardat Yakshi. I kill her because shes an irredemable murderer.

[AntiChri5]

Oops. Quoted the wrong bit.



Cannot edit

[Computer_God91]

GodWood wrote...

yorkj86 wrote...

GodWood wrote...

Spawnfreak73 wrote...

yorkj86 wrote...
They are both figures who appeal directly to the player's own morality.  They also challenge the player to roleplay Shepards who have differing moral systems, especially Shepards whose moral systems are different from the player's.  They are both intentionally written to be as equal as possible in their circumstances.
I don't like Morinth.  She would be a more sympathetic figure if she didn't kill.  If she took a moral stand like that, it would give me pause in my assessment of her situation.

Yeah she should do the whole Dexter thing and seduce murderers and rapists. Wait that might make her worse.

Why would that be worse?
Its much better then what she does now.

Maybe because it'd be feeding her dangerous addiction, which also happens to make her more powerful with each victim she kills.  It's a great risk to take.

Would you say its a..... heavy risk?

...But the prize.

[Therion942]

A waste of funding that likely detracted in some direct way to the development of more worthwhile ventures. Cigliuti couldn't have come cheap. Thankfully they didn't have to waste time giving her a unique character model.

[Killjoy Cutter]

I don't understand the appeal of Morinth. She has a personality that makes me dislike her almost instantly, and that's before we consider that she's been mind-raping and killing for centuries, and doing so not because she has to, but because she likes it and regards everyone else as playthings and mind-food.

[Daewan]

Paragon A: For the sake of the greater good, this individual must be controlled. If she can't be kept under control (i.e., prison) then sadly, she must be destroyed.

Renegade A: This person sounds like fun. So long as she isn't trying to suck my brains out, anyway. She is smart, and has a good sense of humor. So what if she preys on the weak? That's what they are here for. Killing others makes her more powerful? Sweet. I just kill people for fun. We can double date! It'll be awesome. It's not like anyone is going to stop us, after all.

Paragon B: Isn't there another way? It's not her fault she kills people. Blaming her for enjoying it is like blaming meat-eaters for liking steak. There ought to be some way to help her. If she were a human, we would be locking her up and drugging her into normality (or at least, non-violence). It's unfair that there isn't another way, but I already gave my loyalty to Samara, and I can't betray her like this.

Renegade B: Brain sucking Asari vampires? You have got to be kidding me. How quickly can I kill this alien and pretend all of this never happened?

[FireEye]

I suspect that Morinth started killing in reaction to people wanting to lock her up and take away her freedom.  Then she maybe got addicted and started to enjoy it (or maybe she was the one that took the fall for her sisters, she matured first, they got the "locked up and abstinant," and she took off).  And Samara considers her the "bravest and strongest" of her daughters, so...

I like Morinth more than I like Samara.  I like Samara, but I don't agree with the Justicar thing, and confronted with the choice, I would want to try to save Morinth, genuinely try to save and redeem her in some way.

But I can't justify the "Morinth will be more useful to me," thing.  I would have like a "she's my responsibility now" or something option.

[DoomMech]

Morinth is a double edged sword: She's as powerful as Samara, but without those pesky morals (ideal for True Renegades) but she's also a hedonistic sex fiend with the mother of all STDs, and she's gunning for you specifcally.

But there's the issue of her deadly sex addiction. Imagine for a second that you were born with a deadly genetic disease. This genetic disease isn't deadly to YOU but to other people. Do you treat as a gift or a curse? Do you use it for good or for you own purposes? Morinth chose the latter option, letting her base instincts take over.
Another Analogy: She's the female space alien equivelant of Alex Mercer from Prototype. 

It's not about her complusions; She's a remorseless killer who preys upon the weak and helpless. She didn't chose to be born with Ardat-Yakshi syndrome, but she CHOSE to be a sucuubus. 

But then again half of Shepard's crew are remorseless killers *coughJackcough*, Morinth is just slightly more evil than the rest.

If you keep her on a tight leash, the rest of the galaxy will thank you.

Or you could kill her on the suicide mission.

Either one works.

[DoomMech]

Daewan wrote...

Paragon A: For the sake of the greater good, this individual must be controlled. If she can't be kept under control (i.e., prison) then sadly, she must be destroyed.
Renegade A: This person sounds like fun. So long as she isn't trying to suck my brains out, anyway. She is smart, and has a good sense of humor. So what if she preys on the weak? That's what they are here for. Killing others makes her more powerful? Sweet. I just kill people for fun. We can double date! It'll be awesome. It's not like anyone is going to stop us, after all.
Paragon B: Isn't there another way? It's not her fault she kills people. Blaming her for enjoying it is like blaming meat-eaters for liking steak. There ought to be some way to help her. If she were a human, we would be locking her up and drugging her into normality (or at least, non-violence). It's unfair that there isn't another way, but I already gave my loyalty to Samara, and I can't betray her like this.
Renegade B: Brain sucking Asari vampires? You have got to be kidding me. How quickly can I kill this alien and pretend all of this never happened?

I like the way you think.

[FireEye]

DoomMech wrote...

It's not about her complusions; She's a remorseless killer who preys upon the weak and helpless. She didn't chose to be born with Ardat-Yakshi syndrome, but she CHOSE to be a sucuubus. 

See, I got that she preyed on a certain type of person who, while (presumably) innocent, were kind of Byronistic and death obsessed to begin with.  Not, she preys upon the weak and helpless because they're weak and helpless, but she's drawn to certain people and wants to bathe in and soak up their shared interests.  If that girl she killed is any indication, she also has relationships with these people (which could be psychopathic in nature or an attempt at nearness as best as she can, even though she knows they'll end).

Yeah, she immediately jumps on Shepard but ... so does everyone else. 

She might be irredeemable, but I'd still like to try (even if I have no chance of success... I think it'd have made things interesting, from a storytelling perspective).

[Giggles_Manically]

yorkj86 wrote...

FireEye wrote...

See, I got that she preyed on a certain type of person who, while (presumably) innocent, were kind of Byronistic and death obsessed to begin with.  Not, she preys upon the weak and helpless because they're weak and helpless, but she's drawn to certain people and wants to bathe in and soak up their shared interests.  If that girl she killed is any indication, she also has relationships with these people (which could be psychopathic in nature or an attempt at nearness as best as she can, even though she knows they'll end).

Yeah, she immediately jumps on Shepard but ... so does everyone else. 

She might be irredeemable, but I'd still like to try (even if I have no chance of success... I think it'd have made things interesting, from a storytelling perspective).

She could vanish at the next space-station.  She's good at that sort of thing, as we already know.  Then, she'd go back to doing what Ardat-Yakshi do, and the blood of the people she kills from that point on would tacitly be on your Shepard's hands.  Like I said, it's a big risk.

No more Jacob jokes, please.

Yah its a heavy risk to start doing that....