735 réponses à ce sujet

[Lumikki]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

addiction21 wrote...
I just dont see the Anime comparison.

I think it's the big swords.  I don't like them either, but what can ya do.

Not just the sword, but over done armors (heavy ones) and the visual effects in actions, the jumping in air and doing big hits.

Here is example of the style.

Modifié par Lumikki, 09 octobre 2010 - 11:34 .

[upsettingshorts]

Addai67 wrote...
Is that what we can blame the big boobs on, too? 

Nah, I think that's a pretty standard Western thing . If ManHawke was some kind of androgynous teenager then you'd have a case.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 09 octobre 2010 - 11:32 .

[KnightofPhoenix]

Upsettingshorts wrote...
It's simply a matter of recognizing that it is just a diverse collection of preferences and not some grand debate about what's right and wrong.

And that's precisely why I don't bother coming on here that much. People make it sound like a war or something and they bicker over small details while the real issue is the larger picture: First person narrative (DA:O) as opposed to third person narrative (DA2). 

Dialogue wheel, voiced protagonist, the style of the narative..etc, all those details fit perfectly within the third person narrative "umbrella". What was in DA:O was equally fitting for a first person narrative. So at the end of the day, it's a question of preferring one over the other for the DA franchise.

I personally prefer the first person narrative, but I can definitely enjoy a third person narrative. And Bioware was making both, with DA:O and ME and that was perfect. So naturally I am slightly dissapointed in seeing that the Dragon Age franchise decided to go with the 3rd person view, because like I said I prefer the 1rst person one. But I realise both have their strengths and their weaknesses and I am sure DA2 will have its strengths.

Would I have preferred that DA2 sticked with the original formula? Yes. Am I hoping that future DA games revert back to the old formula? Yes. Do I think DA2 is the incarnation of all that is wrong and evil in the video gaming world and the RPG market? No.   

EDIT: but things like art design, graphics, combat..etc are another case entirely and from what I've seen as of yet, I am not excited. 

Modifié par KnightofPhoenix, 09 octobre 2010 - 11:33 .

[Clover Rider]

Addai67 wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

addiction21 wrote...
I just dont see the Anime comparison.

I think it's the big swords.  I don't like them either, but what can ya do.

Is that what we can blame the big boobs on, too?  Because something ought to be blamed.  Severely.

Big boobs is not just an anime thing it's a game thing too:innocent:.

[KnightofPhoenix]

Some Geth wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

addiction21 wrote...
I just dont see the Anime comparison.

I think it's the big swords.  I don't like them either, but what can ya do.

Is that what we can blame the big boobs on, too?  Because something ought to be blamed.  Severely.

Big boobs is not just an anime thing it's a game thing too:innocent:.

http://www.creativeu...03/sc4-ivy.html

[Clover Rider]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Some Geth wrote...

Addai67 wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

addiction21 wrote...
I just dont see the Anime comparison.

I think it's the big swords.  I don't like them either, but what can ya do.

Is that what we can blame the big boobs on, too?  Because something ought to be blamed.  Severely.

Big boobs is not just an anime thing it's a game thing too:innocent:.

http://www.creativeu...03/sc4-ivy.html

Not a big fan on how Ivy plays in SC4:whistle:.

[addiction21]

Lumikki wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

addiction21 wrote...
I just dont see the Anime comparison.

I think it's the big swords.  I don't like them either, but what can ya do.

Not just the sword, but over done armors (heavy ones) and the visual effects in actions, the jumping in air and doing big hits.

As for the sword I have seen many a comparison to Cloud from FF7 and that ridiculous thing he carried and that is just blatant hyperbole. On that we have a single example of a two handed sword and while its a little wide for my taste its not 2-3 feet wide. 12 inchs at the most.
DAO had a lot of the same issues (daggers being as wide as Gladius which is a short sword. Then again all these classifications for weapon types vary widly thru history and cultures) and it had its share of intricate armors.
I just dont see what your getting at. Maybe some elaborations as to why you dont like these things.

No insult but the whole "anime JRPG" thing thats been thrown around falls under the derisive insult catergory then a legitmate criticism. Its allright if you dont like those things and I am not a fan of them either (Cowboy Bebop great stuff) but I just dont see it as a legitimate concern or criticism.

[Clover Rider]

addiction21 wrote...

Lumikki wrote...

Upsettingshorts wrote...

addiction21 wrote...
I just dont see the Anime comparison.

I think it's the big swords.  I don't like them either, but what can ya do.

Not just the sword, but over done armors (heavy ones) and the visual effects in actions, the jumping in air and doing big hits.

As for the sword I have seen many a comparison to Cloud from FF7 and that ridiculous thing he carried and that is just blatant hyperbole. On that we have a single example of a two handed sword and while its a little wide for my taste its not 2-3 feet wide. 12 inchs at the most.
DAO had a lot of the same issues (daggers being as wide as Gladius which is a short sword. Then again all these classifications for weapon types vary widly thru history and cultures) and it had its share of intricate armors.
I just dont see what your getting at. Maybe some elaborations as to why you dont like these things.

No insult but the whole "anime JRPG" thing thats been thrown around falls under the derisive insult catergory then a legitmate criticism. Its allright if you dont like those things and I am not a fan of them either (Cowboy Bebop great stuff) but I just dont see it as a legitimate concern or criticism.

What is "Anime JRPG" anyway is it not just JRPG or a JRPG that looks like Anime?

Modifié par Some Geth, 09 octobre 2010 - 11:55 .

[upsettingshorts]

addiction21 wrote...
As for the sword I have seen many a comparison to Cloud from FF7 and that ridiculous thing he carried and that is just blatant hyperbole. On that we have a single example of a two handed sword and while its a little wide for my taste its not 2-3 feet wide. 12 inchs at the most.
DAO had a lot of the same issues (daggers being as wide as Gladius which is a short sword. Then again all these classifications for weapon types vary widly thru history and cultures) and it had its share of intricate armors.
I just dont see what your getting at. Maybe some elaborations as to why you dont like these things.

Yeah it's not as bad.  I loved a lot about Age of Conan and it has similar sized weapons to DA:O/2.  It's just that it's on the very low end of what I'd consider silly and absurd, whereas Cloud in FF7 is on the "seriously, no @#%@# way" end.  In Conan I didn't like that my female 2H berserker barbian wielded swords and axes that were so large as to imagine them trailing in the dirt behind her as she jogged, stuff like that.

I get that it's a fantasy game, a fantasy game with magic and such - and that's fine.  But conceptually a human in Thedas is basically the same as a human in the Middle Ages, and real weapons were designed to be a size that humans could use and wield effectively.  So deliberately deviating from that size simply for artistic reasons is a point of annoyance to me, but certainly not a gamebreaking decision by any means.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 09 octobre 2010 - 11:57 .

[Tiax Rules All]

I think they should put a gun in the sword, or maybe the sword can break into two swords then go back to one big one when i want.

[AdamNW]

Oh look, this thread again.

[tmp7704]

KnightofPhoenix wrote...

Some Geth wrote...
Big boobs is not just an anime thing it's a game thing too:innocent:.

http://www.creativeu...03/sc4-ivy.html

Granted, somewhat smaller but making up for it with the.... creative outfit (or lack thereof). And it was there first

[tmp7704]

In Exile wrote...

tmp7704 wrote...
Actually wonder, is it really? Can't find much hard data regarding that, but what's available -- 1.6 mil units sold vs over 6.5 mil shipped in similar timeframe -- suggests the expectations were much higher than how well the game actually did. The title is also hardly ever mentioned in EA's financial reports available to date, even though older reports positioned it as "first blockbuster title of 2010".

Where did you get this data from? People have been notoriously inaccurate in reporting sales figures in the ME2 and DA:O commercial success debate. I do not mean to imply that you are reporting anything erroneously, I would just like to find some accurate source out there on the sales figures, and am hoping you have it available.

The sales figure is taken from Wall Street Journal article and allegedly reported by EA: http://online.wsj.co...1063997848.html

the financial reports are available at EA investor site: http://investor.ea.com/results.cfm

the 6.6 mil figure pops up referenced couple times in google search, mostly in the context of keynote presented by BioWare earlier this year: http://uk.ps3.ign.co.../1083726p1.html  This, too, appears to be second hand info and i'm not sure where the original information came from.

[addiction21]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

addiction21 wrote...
As for the sword I have seen many a comparison to Cloud from FF7 and that ridiculous thing he carried and that is just blatant hyperbole. On that we have a single example of a two handed sword and while its a little wide for my taste its not 2-3 feet wide. 12 inchs at the most.
DAO had a lot of the same issues (daggers being as wide as Gladius which is a short sword. Then again all these classifications for weapon types vary widly thru history and cultures) and it had its share of intricate armors.
I just dont see what your getting at. Maybe some elaborations as to why you dont like these things.

Yeah it's not as bad.  I loved a lot about Age of Conan and it has similar sized weapons to DA:O/2.  It's just that it's on the very low end of what I'd consider silly and absurd, whereas Cloud in FF7 is on the "seriously, no @#%@# way" end.  In Conan I didn't like that my female 2H berserker barbian wielded swords and axes that were so large as to imagine them trailing in the dirt behind her as she jogged, stuff like that.

I get that it's a fantasy game, a fantasy game with magic and such - and that's fine.  But conceptually a human in Thedas is basically the same as a human in the Middle Ages, and real weapons were designed to be a size that humans could use and wield effectively.  So deliberately deviating from that size simply for artistic reasons is a point of annoyance to me, but certainly not a gamebreaking decision by any means.

Well are the weapons a single model or are they resized as seen fit to accomate the size of the character carrying it? Never actually played Conan so I dont know how it works there. On the "real world" side of course someone is not going to wield a weapon to large for them to use effectively. Video game side that would incorporating varying model sizes and while not out of the question it is also not something that I know is widly done.
For me it does not break the gameworld but that is just a chickens opinion.

@Lumikki

I posted before you added that picture. I understand better now. You dont like the intricate elaborate armors. That is not a JRPG/ANime thing. In fact you linked a picture of a Blackguard that is from Warhammer and has more then their fair share of armor and weapon designs like that.



Elaborate armors are not unique to Japan or the games media that comes from there.

Modifié par addiction21, 10 octobre 2010 - 12:27 .

[ArcanistLibram]

So you wanted Bioware to polish the combat, but now that Bioware has polished the combat, you're complaining that all of the RPG elements have been removed without providing any evidence that Bioware changed any of the RPG elements that were present in Dragon Age Origins. Right...

/Alistair

[addiction21]

Who is this Alistair and why did you slash his name at the end of the post?

[In Exile]

tmp7704 wrote...

The sales figure is taken from Wall Street Journal article and allegedly reported by EA: http://online.wsj.co...1063997848.html

the financial reports are available at EA investor site: http://investor.ea.com/results.cfm

the 6.6 mil figure pops up referenced couple times in google search, mostly in the context of keynote presented by BioWare earlier this year: http://uk.ps3.ign.co.../1083726p1.html  This, too, appears to be second hand info and i'm not sure where the original information came from.

Thank you.

The Wall Street Journal article only mentions the 4th quarter, and the inference to be drawn is that ME2 sold 1.5 million copies in that quarter alone. The fiscal year for EA ends March 31st, and I am assuming started Jan. 1st. That would mean during its initial 3-month release, ME2 sold 1.6 million. 

I have found evidence that DA2 reached triple platinum (3 million + sales) in Feb. 2010. That would be approximately the same 3 month period.

So maybe there is justification to the claim that DA outsold ME.

That just raises further questions, though. If DA outsold ME so dramatically, then what was the cause for success? Obviously the gameplay, but which parts? According to Mike, their focus groups wanted improvements in the combat animation and VO, but was that an accurate rendition of the DA fanbase?

On the whole, I think DA outselling ME just raises more questions than it answers, particularly in regard to the design changes for DA2.

[thegreateski]

I've seen this thread before . . . saying the game is bad without ever playing it . . . the misinformation . . . the complaining without actually complaining about anything in particular . . . and of course the "turning into a JRPG discussion".



All we need now is a keg of beer, a mechanical bull, and some silly string and then we'll have a crappy thread, a keg of beer, a mechanical bull, and some silly string.

[Mallissin]

*chants* BOOB THREAD! BOOB THREAD! BOOB THREAD!

[TheEpicSidewinder]

i just hope DA2 returns to the same style of party banter that was accessible in the camp in DAO. Unlike DA:A. I'm still playing DAO for the tons of epicly funny moments that occur between party members. And being used to Bethesda-esque types of RPGs i thoroughly enjoyed DAO and will definitely be back for DA2. Cheers.

[AlanC9]

Huh? Party members bantered with each other on the road, never in the camp.

Modifié par AlanC9, 10 octobre 2010 - 01:20 .

[Lumikki]

addiction21 wrote...

@Lumikki

I posted before you added that picture. I understand better now. You dont like the intricate elaborate armors. That is not a JRPG/ANime thing. In fact you linked a picture of a Blackguard that is from Warhammer and has more then their fair share of armor and weapon designs like that.



Elaborate armors are not unique to Japan or the games media that comes from there.

Okey, my point wasn't tell what is the exact history of that style. I just posted some random picture I picked what just showed the style what I'm talking. It may not even come from Japan, but it's the style what is used alot in there including many mmorpgs. When I look DA2 I see this style in they graphics. I don't mine if it's there little bit it, but when it becomes so dominate, it's not what I would like for DA serie. Also other aspect are the sword swinging woooof visual effects. Jumping in high in air and then fall down to do high damage hits, also in many japanese animes.  So, I'm not talking some small details, but more like overall impression of the graphical design, it's little bit overdone. The DA2 graphics is maybe "cool" and interesting looking, but it doesn't give the right feeling of DA series world.

Modifié par Lumikki, 10 octobre 2010 - 02:30 .

[Addai]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

I get that it's a fantasy game, a fantasy game with magic and such - and that's fine.  But conceptually a human in Thedas is basically the same as a human in the Middle Ages, and real weapons were designed to be a size that humans could use and wield effectively.  So deliberately deviating from that size simply for artistic reasons is a point of annoyance to me, but certainly not a gamebreaking decision by any means.

Agreed.  Much more interested in historically accurate depictions myself, or at least things that are in the realm of plausibility.  I would rather see weapons that have small, beautiful detail, for instance, rather than big, flashy, with lots of useless gizmo.  Unfortunately even just judging by the mods made for DAO, a lot of people like big, flashy and useless.

[AtreiyaN7]

Manga and anime characters generally have specific attributes - usually you get some combination of characters with manga-style eyes (extremely large, unrealistic eyes), odd hairstyles, bizarre hair colors (if color is involved), "exaggerated" combat depending on the genre, and possibly oversized and unrealistically proportioned weapons, etc. Style-wise, the art of DA2 doesn't seem to really resembles any of the anime that I've watched or manga that I've read (I think I have Domu somewhere in one of my boxes of comics, heh).

The big swords are similar to the ones from DA:O and aren't grossly different from them in the screenshot comparisons that I've seen in other threads, but I think people are simply fixated on the size and width of Lady Hawke's sword (I would agree that the 2H swords could perhaps be toned down a bit in the width department BTW). That, combined with the increased responsiveness in the animations probably equates to "Horrors, DA2 has turned into an anime/JRPG abomination!" in some people's minds.

If I hear JRPG, what comes to mind is the Final Fantasy series more than anything else (and I have played other JRPGs on my assorted Gameboys). If someone says anime, Bleach comes to mind. Eh, DA2 not so much at this point. I think in an anime series or a game heavily influenced by anime, the combat would be way, way, waaaaay more over-the-top than what we've seen. Maybe that applies to the rogue class however, heh. Meanwhile, I'll wait for something more official that covers both melee classes before passing judgment.

Modifié par AtreiyaN7, 10 octobre 2010 - 02:32 .

[Sylvius the Mad]

the_one_54321 wrote...

I hope you realize that you just made a cyclical argument.

It is not role playing because we are not given the information by the game.
We are not given the information by the game because to use it would not be role playing.

Each is based on the other.

I did nothing of the sort.

Those were different pieces of information.