14 réponses à ce sujet

[zhokar]

I found the idea of a ranged wizard slayer interesting, especially as an elf. I read that the G3 BG2 Fixpack allows wizard slayers to apply their debuff with ranged weapons as well. But since you can't use the Fixpack on Tutu, I'm asking myself if the Tutu Fixpack installed on EasyTutu does the same thing or if I will have to wait until I reach the BG2 campaign for a ranged wizard slayer.
Then I wonder if I should use short bows for the attack speed, so I get the debuff applied faster or if I should go with longbows or even crossbows for the damage and still have a decent attack speed later on.
It might be a good idea to dual class...I read some threads where people dualed their wizard slayer to a mage. But although I like the cowled wizard idea I'd rather keeps it real without additional arcane magic. So maybe thief? What class would be beneficial and at what level? I'm guessing at least lvl12 wizard slayer for hit points and attacks?

Whats your take on the ranged wizard slayer? And is it only possible in BG2 or does it work in Tutu?

[Thrar]

Long and short bows have the same attack speed (2 APR base), unless you're using a mod that changes this. If you want to apply miscast magic as quickly as possible, obviously that's an advantage over a crossbow. For pure damage dealt, they're about equal I'd say, although bows offer a better selection of utility arrows.

Have you tried installing the fixpack along with Tutu, or at least its wizard slayer component?

[Alesia_BH]

zhokar wrote...

I found the idea of a ranged wizard slayer interesting, especially as an elf. I read that the G3 BG2 Fixpack allows wizard slayers to apply their debuff with ranged weapons as well.

Wizard Slayer hits don't debuff, they cause Spell Casting Failure (cumulative). Your Slayer will still need Arrows of Dispelling to debuff via Bow.

Thrar wrote...

Long and short bows have the same attack speed (2 APR base), unless you're using a mod that changes this.

True. But he may have been thinking Attack Speed Factor rather than APR, in which case there is usually a slight (though hardly noticeable) difference between the two favoring Shortbows. It's also worth remembering that there is a Short Bow in SoA that offers an extra attack per round: Tuigan.


The tricky thing about a ranged Wizard Slayer is that there aren't that many Ranged Weapons that offer immunities or resistances. And since Wizard Slayers can't use Potions or other magical items, they are often semi-dependent on weapons based immunities.

A bow will definitely help your Wizard Slayer- especially if you apply the aforementioned G3 Tweak. However, you should also consider setting him up to be competent in Melee by the time key immunity weapons become available.


Best,

A.

Modifié par Alesia_BH, 10 octobre 2010 - 04:19 .

[zhokar]

Have you tried installing the fixpack along with Tutu, or at least its wizard slayer component?

Yup. Parts of the Tweak Pack work with Tutu, the Fixpack doesn't at all.

[Chebby]

Wizard slayer hits do debuff. The spell failure is a debuff. Arrows of Dispelling dispel, they don't debuff.

Modifié par Chebby, 15 octobre 2010 - 03:43 .

[Alesia_BH]

Chebby wrote...

Wizard slayer hits do debuff. The spell failure is a debuff. Arrows of Dispelling dispel, they don't debuff.

That depends on how you define "debuff" of course.

In my experience on these boards, most use the term "debuff" to refer to the removal of spell or potion effects which enhance character defenses or others abilities. In which case a successful "dispel" would be said to "debuff" an enemy. Most wouldn't refer to applying a Miscast Magic effect as "debuffing" either. It would be classified as a disabilling effect since it reduces performance below the character's unmodified base.

Of course, there can be variation in use of terms. Feel free to use whatever makes you most comfortable.

For the sake of clarity, Wizard Slayer hits without dispelling weapons cause Casting Failure and do not remove, Spell, Combat, or Specific protections. Dispelling Arrows can achieve the latter. classify the effects however you like.


Best,

A.

Modifié par Alesia_BH, 15 octobre 2010 - 04:41 .

[Chebby]

The most common and correct use of the term debuff is when referring to an effect that negatively impacts someone/thing, coexisting with buffs without necessarily providing a balance.
Dispelling, on the other hand, is an attempt to strip buffs and/or debuffs.
Debuffs are the opposite of buffs, they aren't dispels, that's all.

Modifié par Chebby, 15 octobre 2010 - 05:17 .

[Alesia_BH]

Whatever. I have no interest in the classification issue.

So long as the OP and others understand what the hits do.


Best,

A.

Modifié par Alesia_BH, 15 octobre 2010 - 05:34 .

[Shadow_Leech07]

Chebby wrote...

The most common and correct use of the term debuff is when referring to an effect that negatively impacts someone/thing, coexisting with buffs without necessarily providing a balance.
Dispelling, on the other hand, is an attempt to strip buffs and/or debuffs.
Debuffs are the opposite of buffs, they aren't dispels, that's all.

I don't understand your definition which I bolded.

Dispelling is not an attempt to strip buffs. Dispelling does strip buffs. For example, the term dispel on hit means a weapon will dispel a buff(stoneskin) upon hitting a target.

[Chebby]

Shadow_Leech07 wrote...
I don't understand your definition which I bolded.

Dispelling is not an attempt to strip buffs. Dispelling does strip buffs. For example, the term dispel on hit means a weapon will dispel a buff(stoneskin) upon hitting a target.

You've then got to take particulars into play. The dispelling may be very limited or be protected against, in certain cases. It depends on the spell really, but in all cases, the act of dispelling is when a character attempts to strip buffs, what I should have typed was "the act of stripping buffs and/or debuffs."
Anyway, the only point I was trying to make is that debuffing is often not to be confused with dispelling.

Modifié par Chebby, 15 octobre 2010 - 06:34 .

[Chebby]

Anyway if you'd like me to elaborate on my definition of debuff, here it is again.
A debuff is a negative effect applied to someone/thing in the game world, whether it's drained levels and/or ability scores, reduced damage or damage over time. They coexist with buffs without balancing it out, which is to say they aren't, for example, one side each of a set of scales. Many buffs and debuffs can effect someone/thing in different areas and ways, therefore a debuff does not cancel out a buff and vice versa.
And no, I'm not trying to add to some ego; I'm just trying to explain myself.

Alesia_BH wrote...
Whatever. I have no interest in the classification issue. [smilie]http://social.bioware.com/images/forum/emoticons/smile.png[/smilie]

So long as the OP and others understand what the hits do.

It's not my intention to create an issue, I'm just trying to help prevent any confusion, that's all.

Modifié par Chebby, 15 octobre 2010 - 06:38 .

[Shadow_Leech07]

Chebby wrote...

Shadow_Leech07 wrote...
I don't understand your definition which I bolded.

Dispelling is not an attempt to strip buffs. Dispelling does strip buffs. For example, the term dispel on hit means a weapon will dispel a buff(stoneskin) upon hitting a target.

You've then got to take particulars into play. The dispelling may be very limited or be protected against, in certain cases. It depends on the spell really, but in all cases, the act of dispelling is when a character attempts to strip buffs, what I should have typed was "the act of stripping buffs and/or debuffs."
Anyway, the only point I was trying to make is that debuffing is often not to be confused with dispelling.

Fair enough.

A debuff is a negative effect applied to someone/thing in the game
world, whether it's drained levels and/or ability scores, reduced damage
or damage over time. They coexist with buffs without balancing it out,
which is to say they aren't, for example, one side each of a set of
scales. Many buffs and debuffs can effect someone/thing in different
areas and ways, therefore a debuff does not cancel out a buff and vice
versa.
And no, I'm not trying to add to some ego; I'm just trying to explain myself.

That's an interesting take on the terminology.

[Alesia_BH]

Chebby wrote...

It's not my intention to create an issue, I'm just trying to help prevent any confusion, that's all.

Understood. And I wasn't suggesting that you were trying to stir up a debate or any thing of that ilk.[smilie]../../../images/forum/emoticons/smile.png[/smilie]

In any event, we have the same object: clarification. My approach was to set aside the general terms and explicitly state what the Wizard Slayer hits with conventional weapons do, cause Spell Casting Failure, and what they don't do, Remove Protections.

I think everyone gets it now- irrespective of how they define "debuff' and such.


Best,

A.

Modifié par Alesia_BH, 15 octobre 2010 - 07:12 .

[zhokar]

Oh my. Does this always happen when someone uses a not perfectly correct word or phrase around here?

[Alesia_BH]

zhokar wrote...

Oh my. Does this always happen when someone uses a not perfectly correct word or phrase around here?

No. And I agree: that would get annoying.


Best,

A.