Aller au contenu

Photo

Morrigan to Return along with The Fade


242 réponses à ce sujet

#176
Ryzaki

Ryzaki
  • Members
  • 34 423 messages

AlexXIV wrote...
Lol hated him. Even before dwarven noble origin which reveals the full range of his crimes. He basically murders his whole family to become king. He is truely evil in my eyes. The only thing I like about him is that he gave me an easy choice to support Harrowmont. Something we don't agree either I guess Posted Image I can't say I like evil characters. What I like in supposed evil characters is when I can understand their motivation. Like Loghain.


LOL He's not that evil. If he was the dwarves wouldn't have improved. ^_^ 

Bhelen's trying to make the dwarven kingdom better for himself and ends up making it better for a lot of other people as well. It may not be the nicest way but it got results. Which to my warden was all that mattered.

I dislike Loghain. I understand why he did it but he hasn't survived any of my games. I marry off Alistair and Anora and feed Loghain to the archedemon.

At least he can redeem himself with that.

(Then again I play human nobles who blame him and Howe for their family's slaughter. They see Loghain and see their nephew on the ground dead and just go into a berserker rage).

Though I just saw the second part. The fade. Oh god no. Not again. Never again! *cowers* 

The Fade was horrible.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 11 octobre 2010 - 09:14 .


#177
AlexXIV

AlexXIV
  • Members
  • 10 670 messages

SirShreK wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Lol hated him. Even before dwarven noble origin which reveals the full range of his crimes. He basically murders his whole family to become king (My EDIT: MOTIVATION). He is truely evil in my eyes. The only thing I like about him is that he gave me an easy choice to support Harrowmont. Something we don't agree either I guess Posted Image I can't say I like evil characters. What I like in supposed evil characters is when I can understand their motivation. Like Loghain.


Did you just pwn yourself?


No I don't understand Bhelen. There was no pressing need to do that. It makes no sense for me to kill your whole family for power. Loghain acted to defend his country. At least that's what he thought. I can understand if people do evil things out of desperation. But Bhelen was never in any situation he was forced to act. He could have a good life as a prince or whatever without killing anyone.

#178
nightcobra

nightcobra
  • Members
  • 6 206 messages

Ryzaki wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...
Lol hated him. Even before dwarven noble origin which reveals the full range of his crimes. He basically murders his whole family to become king. He is truely evil in my eyes. The only thing I like about him is that he gave me an easy choice to support Harrowmont. Something we don't agree either I guess Posted Image I can't say I like evil characters. What I like in supposed evil characters is when I can understand their motivation. Like Loghain.


LOL He's not that evil. If he was the dwarves wouldn't have improved. ^_^ 

Bhelen's trying to make the dwarven kingdom better for himself and ends up making it better for a lot of other people as well. It may not be the nicest way but it got results. Which to my warden was all that mattered.

I dislike Loghain. I understand why he did it but he hasn't survived any of my games. I marry off Alistair and Anora and feed Loghain to the archedemon.

At least he can redeem himself with that.

(Then again I play human nobles who blame him and Howe for their family's slaughter. They see Loghain and see their nephew on the ground dead and just go into a berserker rage).

Though I just saw the second part. The fade. Oh god no. Not again. Never again! *cowers* 

The Fade was horrible.


my warden picked bhelen but made it clear to him that they didn't like each other and the only reason my warden was helping him become king was because bhelen was the "best" candidate for the dwarves as a whole.
he also saved loghain and married alistair and anora, in awakenings alistair seems to forgive the warden due to the way he talked (i guess he realized that even though my warden spared loghain, he also married his daughter to the brother of the person he killed and that brother is a grey warden, made loghain a grey warden and sent to orlais...oh and my warden also took loghain's title and land, all this and loghain thinks of the warden as his new best friend....how's that for retribution alistair? i basically ruined his life and he thanks me for it, what better revenge than that?:devil:)


about the fade i'd like to see them try to do the fade almost indistinguishable from the real world at first and then as you start to unravel the truth of where you really are, the environment itself becomes distorted and ever changing. or even to go as far as making different demons having different environments.

rage: a battlefield of fire and brimstone
hunger: a grotesque entrail themed environment
sloth: a peaceful village that makes not wanting to leave and as you near the demon, the environment darkens and cobwebs appear on objects, the people turn apparitions floating over their lying skeletons.
desire: a lustful brothel trap for anyone who dares to step inside.
Posted ImagePride could have grandiose cathedral-like structures or a luxurious mansion or castle

Modifié par nightcobra8928, 11 octobre 2010 - 09:25 .


#179
AlanC9

AlanC9
  • Members
  • 35 732 messages

Ryzaki wrote...
And she gives you a thinly veiled threat after you refuse her as she leaves. Which makes it even more facepalm worthy when you cross your arms and pout like a five year old instead of attacking her. 


This isn't really true.

If Morrigan doesn't like you at the time she leaves (Approval below WARM), she says "Fare you well, Grey Warden. Should you live past the morrow, seek me out at your own peril." This is about the Warden doing something Morrigan considers threatening, not the reverse. If she's not a friend why would you seek her out? I can think of a few reasons, none of which she'd like.

Anyone who considers Morrigan a threat for saying that is paranoid. I've got nothing against games supporting paranoid PCs, but how many of us play one?

Modifié par AlanC9, 11 octobre 2010 - 09:33 .


#180
AlexXIV

AlexXIV
  • Members
  • 10 670 messages

Ryzaki wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...
Lol hated him. Even before dwarven noble origin which reveals the full range of his crimes. He basically murders his whole family to become king. He is truely evil in my eyes. The only thing I like about him is that he gave me an easy choice to support Harrowmont. Something we don't agree either I guess Posted Image I can't say I like evil characters. What I like in supposed evil characters is when I can understand their motivation. Like Loghain.


LOL He's not that evil. If he was the dwarves wouldn't have improved. ^_^ 

Bhelen's trying to make the dwarven kingdom better for himself and ends up making it better for a lot of other people as well. It may not be the nicest way but it got results. Which to my warden was all that mattered.

I dislike Loghain. I understand why he did it but he hasn't survived any of my games. I marry off Alistair and Anora and feed Loghain to the archedemon.

At least he can redeem himself with that.

(Then again I play human nobles who blame him and Howe for their family's slaughter. They see Loghain and see their nephew on the ground dead and just go into a berserker rage).

Though I just saw the second part. The fade. Oh god no. Not again. Never again! *cowers* 

The Fade was horrible.


Well Bhelen doesn't exactly do it for the benefit of Orzammar. Everything he does he is doing for himself only. That it ends up so well for him and benefits all dwarves is sort of ironical, but such things happen. Harrowmond is a weak leader but a good man at heart. Thing is if you play dwarven noble, Bhelen is basically trying to kill you even though nobody can at this point say whether you are good or bad for Orzammar. I mean you could have done the same things as him. But that doesn't matter to him. He wants to be king, no matter what. And that's why it was a pleasure for me to keep it from happening. Btw, if you play dwarven origin and place Harrowmont on the throne you get to follow him on the throne when he passes away.

#181
nightcobra

nightcobra
  • Members
  • 6 206 messages

AlexXIV wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...
Lol hated him. Even before dwarven noble origin which reveals the full range of his crimes. He basically murders his whole family to become king. He is truely evil in my eyes. The only thing I like about him is that he gave me an easy choice to support Harrowmont. Something we don't agree either I guess Posted Image I can't say I like evil characters. What I like in supposed evil characters is when I can understand their motivation. Like Loghain.


LOL He's not that evil. If he was the dwarves wouldn't have improved. ^_^ 

Bhelen's trying to make the dwarven kingdom better for himself and ends up making it better for a lot of other people as well. It may not be the nicest way but it got results. Which to my warden was all that mattered.

I dislike Loghain. I understand why he did it but he hasn't survived any of my games. I marry off Alistair and Anora and feed Loghain to the archedemon.

At least he can redeem himself with that.

(Then again I play human nobles who blame him and Howe for their family's slaughter. They see Loghain and see their nephew on the ground dead and just go into a berserker rage).

Though I just saw the second part. The fade. Oh god no. Not again. Never again! *cowers* 

The Fade was horrible.


Well Bhelen doesn't exactly do it for the benefit of Orzammar. Everything he does he is doing for himself only. That it ends up so well for him and benefits all dwarves is sort of ironical, but such things happen. Harrowmond is a weak leader but a good man at heart. Thing is if you play dwarven noble, Bhelen is basically trying to kill you even though nobody can at this point say whether you are good or bad for Orzammar. I mean you could have done the same things as him. But that doesn't matter to him. He wants to be king, no matter what. And that's why it was a pleasure for me to keep it from happening. Btw, if you play dwarven origin and place Harrowmont on the throne you get to follow him on the throne when he passes away.


harrowmont isn't exactly a good man either, in one of the ends he uses the golems to wage war against the surfacers.
bhelen might be a ****** but he does reclaim some lost thaigs and he even provides some help to the lower castes.

#182
Ryzaki

Ryzaki
  • Members
  • 34 423 messages

AlanC9 wrote...

This isn't really true.

If Morrigan doesn't like you at the time she leaves (Approval below WARM), she says "Fare you well, Grey Warden. Should you live past the morrow, seek me out at your own peril." This is about the Warden doing something Morrigan considers threatening, not the reverse. If she's not a friend why would you seek her out? I can think of a few reasons, none of which she'd like.

Anyone who considers Morrigan a threat for saying that is paranoid. I've got nothing against games supporting paranoid PCs, but how many of us play one?


Do you have the one for hostile? Because I could have sworn she said something different...

He'd seek her out to make sure she wasn't trying to "do as she must" with the archedemon's soul. He was a grey warden. (He actually always wanted to be one too so he was going to report her to Amarathine. Along with everything she told him about the archedemon soul before tracking her down to see if she started stirring up anything).

My PC was a bit paranoid but mostly he just doesn't like loose ends. Morrigan was one. A apostate mage? He wasn't going to just let her going traversing through Fereldan after trying to spare a powerful creature that in his mind caused the blights in the first place.

If she had shown basic human decency he would've let her go. She only proved to be a selfish, foolish, unsympathetic shrew. As it was he was going to stick her head on a pike before she could screw someone's life over. (The main reason he didn't do the DR other than the old god soul? Morrigan would make a horrible mother) imagine how screwed up her kid would be. What kind of monster would give a child to someone like that? She knows nothing about love, affection just survival. She pratically has a breakdown when she realizes that she has such emotions. The last thing the world needs is a superpowered kid who never recieved any love walking around. That's a recipe for disaster.

Best case scenario: He won't be a complete sociopath.

Unless he remembers his past life...which might actually be worse.

That said he might also turn out to be pure and innocent and knowing about love despite being raised by someone who doesn't understand such concepts.

Might being the key word.

That said that's just how I see it.

If Morrigan was content to be by herself (like Flemeth pretends) my PC wouldn't care. But she's not. (I like Shale's insight on her).

Also why would she be worried about my warden coming after her unless she gave him a reason? He lets her walk right past him after all.

Edit: Well my evil warden anyways. My good warden kicked the bucket.

AlexXIV wrote...

Well Bhelen doesn't exactly do it for the
benefit of Orzammar. Everything he does he is doing for himself only.
That it ends up so well for him and benefits all dwarves is sort of
ironical, but such things happen. Harrowmond is a weak leader but a good
man at heart. Thing is if you play dwarven noble, Bhelen is basically
trying to kill you even though nobody can at this point say whether you
are good or bad for Orzammar. I mean you could have done the same things
as him. But that doesn't matter to him. He wants to be king, no matter
what. And that's why it was a pleasure for me to keep it from happening.
Btw, if you play dwarven origin and place Harrowmont on the throne you
get to follow him on the throne when he passes away.


If you keep the anvil Harrowmont starts using humans. That was enough to tell me he was an evil bastard. I don't remember Bhelen doing the same.

(Then again giving anyone the anvil other than the PC was just stupid to me. I mean it's useful but if you can't keep it to yourself it's too dangerous to keep.)

Modifié par Ryzaki, 11 octobre 2010 - 09:53 .


#183
AlexXIV

AlexXIV
  • Members
  • 10 670 messages

nightcobra8928 wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...
Lol hated him. Even before dwarven noble origin which reveals the full range of his crimes. He basically murders his whole family to become king. He is truely evil in my eyes. The only thing I like about him is that he gave me an easy choice to support Harrowmont. Something we don't agree either I guess Posted Image I can't say I like evil characters. What I like in supposed evil characters is when I can understand their motivation. Like Loghain.


LOL He's not that evil. If he was the dwarves wouldn't have improved. ^_^ 

Bhelen's trying to make the dwarven kingdom better for himself and ends up making it better for a lot of other people as well. It may not be the nicest way but it got results. Which to my warden was all that mattered.

I dislike Loghain. I understand why he did it but he hasn't survived any of my games. I marry off Alistair and Anora and feed Loghain to the archedemon.

At least he can redeem himself with that.

(Then again I play human nobles who blame him and Howe for their family's slaughter. They see Loghain and see their nephew on the ground dead and just go into a berserker rage).

Though I just saw the second part. The fade. Oh god no. Not again. Never again! *cowers* 

The Fade was horrible.


Well Bhelen doesn't exactly do it for the benefit of Orzammar. Everything he does he is doing for himself only. That it ends up so well for him and benefits all dwarves is sort of ironical, but such things happen. Harrowmond is a weak leader but a good man at heart. Thing is if you play dwarven noble, Bhelen is basically trying to kill you even though nobody can at this point say whether you are good or bad for Orzammar. I mean you could have done the same things as him. But that doesn't matter to him. He wants to be king, no matter what. And that's why it was a pleasure for me to keep it from happening. Btw, if you play dwarven origin and place Harrowmont on the throne you get to follow him on the throne when he passes away.


harrowmont isn't exactly a good man either, in one of the ends he uses the golems to wage war against the surfacers.
bhelen might be a ****** but he does reclaim some lost thaigs and he even provides some help to the lower castes.


He only lets Branka use them - because she is a Paragon and he is a weak leader. So it was your fault that you didn't destroy the anvil and left Harrowmont with that crazy dwarven chick. Destroy anvil, choose Harrowmont = good ending (imho).

#184
nightcobra

nightcobra
  • Members
  • 6 206 messages

AlexXIV wrote...

nightcobra8928 wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...

Ryzaki wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...
Lol hated him. Even before dwarven noble origin which reveals the full range of his crimes. He basically murders his whole family to become king. He is truely evil in my eyes. The only thing I like about him is that he gave me an easy choice to support Harrowmont. Something we don't agree either I guess Posted Image I can't say I like evil characters. What I like in supposed evil characters is when I can understand their motivation. Like Loghain.


LOL He's not that evil. If he was the dwarves wouldn't have improved. ^_^ 

Bhelen's trying to make the dwarven kingdom better for himself and ends up making it better for a lot of other people as well. It may not be the nicest way but it got results. Which to my warden was all that mattered.

I dislike Loghain. I understand why he did it but he hasn't survived any of my games. I marry off Alistair and Anora and feed Loghain to the archedemon.

At least he can redeem himself with that.

(Then again I play human nobles who blame him and Howe for their family's slaughter. They see Loghain and see their nephew on the ground dead and just go into a berserker rage).

Though I just saw the second part. The fade. Oh god no. Not again. Never again! *cowers* 

The Fade was horrible.


Well Bhelen doesn't exactly do it for the benefit of Orzammar. Everything he does he is doing for himself only. That it ends up so well for him and benefits all dwarves is sort of ironical, but such things happen. Harrowmond is a weak leader but a good man at heart. Thing is if you play dwarven noble, Bhelen is basically trying to kill you even though nobody can at this point say whether you are good or bad for Orzammar. I mean you could have done the same things as him. But that doesn't matter to him. He wants to be king, no matter what. And that's why it was a pleasure for me to keep it from happening. Btw, if you play dwarven origin and place Harrowmont on the throne you get to follow him on the throne when he passes away.


harrowmont isn't exactly a good man either, in one of the ends he uses the golems to wage war against the surfacers.
bhelen might be a ****** but he does reclaim some lost thaigs and he even provides some help to the lower castes.


He only lets Branka use them - because she is a Paragon and he is a weak leader. So it was your fault that you didn't destroy the anvil and left Harrowmont with that crazy dwarven chick. Destroy anvil, choose Harrowmont = good ending (imho).


lucky for me that i never went for that route and that i was playing a human noble at the time now is it.
bhelen's probably the best dwarf for the job as he is in my opinion the living embodiment of how brutal and efficient dwarven politics can be. i may not like him but he certainly saved the dwarves from becoming too isolated and turning themselves to extinction.

#185
Ryzaki

Ryzaki
  • Members
  • 34 423 messages

AlexXIV wrote...


He only lets Branka use them - because she is a Paragon and he is a weak leader. So it was your fault that you didn't destroy the anvil and left Harrowmont with that crazy dwarven chick. Destroy anvil, choose Harrowmont = good ending (imho).


The dwarves becoming more isolated and the caste system remaining is a good ending? :huh:

#186
AlexXIV

AlexXIV
  • Members
  • 10 670 messages

Ryzaki wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...


He only lets Branka use them - because she is a Paragon and he is a weak leader. So it was your fault that you didn't destroy the anvil and left Harrowmont with that crazy dwarven chick. Destroy anvil, choose Harrowmont = good ending (imho).


The dwarves becoming more isolated and the caste system remaining is a good ending? :huh:


For someone who doesn't like dwarves (like me)? Yes.Posted Image

For all I care the castless can go to the surface, like so many others did, maybe found a nation or even kingdom there. I am not a big fan of the caste system I feel bad for the casteless, but supporting Bhelen is a price I am not willing to pay. I hope if Harrowmont dies a better king follows, better than both, Bhelen and Harromont.

#187
TheBlackBaron

TheBlackBaron
  • Members
  • 7 724 messages

Ryzaki wrote...

AlanC9 wrote...

This isn't really true.

If Morrigan doesn't like you at the time she leaves (Approval below WARM), she says "Fare you well, Grey Warden. Should you live past the morrow, seek me out at your own peril." This is about the Warden doing something Morrigan considers threatening, not the reverse. If she's not a friend why would you seek her out? I can think of a few reasons, none of which she'd like.

Anyone who considers Morrigan a threat for saying that is paranoid. I've got nothing against games supporting paranoid PCs, but how many of us play one?


Do you have the one for hostile? Because I could have sworn she said something different...

He'd seek her out to make sure she wasn't trying to "do as she must" with the archedemon's soul. He was a grey warden. (He actually always wanted to be one too so he was going to report her to Amarathine. Along with everything she told him about the archedemon soul before tracking her down to see if she started stirring up anything).

My PC was a bit paranoid but mostly he just doesn't like loose ends. Morrigan was one. A apostate mage? He wasn't going to just let her going traversing through Fereldan after trying to spare a powerful creature that in his mind caused the blights in the first place.

If she had shown basic human decency he would've let her go. She only proved to be a selfish, foolish, unsympathetic shrew. As it was he was going to stick her head on a pike before she could screw someone's life over. (The main reason he didn't do the DR other than the old god soul? Morrigan would make a horrible mother) imagine how screwed up her kid would be. What kind of monster would give a child to someone like that? She knows nothing about love, affection just survival. She pratically has a breakdown when she realizes that she has such emotions. The last thing the world needs is a superpowered kid who never recieved any love walking around. That's a recipe for disaster.


So...what, he's going to track her down even after denying her the ritual and basically leaving her with nothing, with the intention of spilling some serious blood, after she basically tells him to just let her be?

Yeah, no offense, that's going beyond "a bit paranoid". That's Russian levels of paranoid.

By the way, I believe you mean Weisshaupt, not Amaranthine. The only person he could report Morrigan to in Amaranthine would be himself. :P

EDIT: Incidentally, I actually quite like Behlen. Sure, he's a bastard, but he's a magnificent bastard, and he's going to drag the dwarves into the modern era.

Modifié par TheBlackBaron, 11 octobre 2010 - 10:27 .


#188
Ryzaki

Ryzaki
  • Members
  • 34 423 messages

TheBlackBaron wrote...

So...what, he's going to track her down even after denying her the ritual and basically leaving her with nothing, with the intention of spilling some serious blood, after she basically tells him to just let her be?

Yeah, no offense, that's going beyond "a bit paranoid". That's Russian levels of paranoid.

By the way, I believe you mean Weisshaupt, not Amaranthine. The only person he could report Morrigan to in Amaranthine would be himself. :P

EDIT: Incidentally, I actually quite like Behlen. Sure, he's a bastard, but he's a magnificent bastard, and he's going to drag the dwarves into the modern era.


Yup. Why leave a apostate running around? He's a Templar after all. B)

He'd leave her be if she proved herself a decent human being. She fails to do that and he doesn't like her whole "do as I must" phrase. So paranoid or not he's going after her. Better safe than sorry.

(Plus she stole his equipment. He wants it back damnit!) :bandit:

Oh yeah.. XD I mean Weisshaupt thanks for that.

He totally is.

I think my main reason for not liking Morrigan is because she *thinks* she's smart. When...she's not. She thinks she's Flemeth 2.0 when she's pretty much a darker version of Alistair.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 11 octobre 2010 - 10:35 .


#189
Morrigans God son

Morrigans God son
  • Members
  • 483 messages

Ryzaki wrote...

TheBlackBaron wrote...

So...what, he's going to track her down even after denying her the ritual and basically leaving her with nothing, with the intention of spilling some serious blood, after she basically tells him to just let her be?

Yeah, no offense, that's going beyond "a bit paranoid". That's Russian levels of paranoid.

By the way, I believe you mean Weisshaupt, not Amaranthine. The only person he could report Morrigan to in Amaranthine would be himself. :P

EDIT: Incidentally, I actually quite like Behlen. Sure, he's a bastard, but he's a magnificent bastard, and he's going to drag the dwarves into the modern era.


Yup. Why leave a apostate running around? He's a Templar after all. B)

He'd leave her be if she proved herself a decent human being. She fails to do that and he doesn't like her whole "do as I must" phrase. So paranoid or not he's going after her. Better safe than sorry.

(Plus she stole his equipment. He wants it back damnit!) :bandit:

Oh yeah.. XD I mean Weisshaupt thanks for that.

He totally is.

I think my main reason for not liking Morrigan is because she *thinks* she's smart. When...she's not. She thinks she's Flemeth 2.0 when she's pretty much a darker version of Alistair.


No offence but you seriously sound like the chantry. Morrigan deserves to die because she isn't smart in your eyes and is an apostate? Excuse me? Morrigan is different, she's says she's sorry if she isn't exactly on the good side of the law, but that's just the way she was brought into the world.

Flemeth 2.0? At the start a little bit maybe, but after all Flemeth was all she had as a mother. It would be overly stupid for her to act like she was raised by a normal, average person from the start. Morrigan doesn't speak in rhymes either, except for the "You paint the shed while I bake the bread." line. Plus she changes...throughout the game....at the end she calls you "love." from Morrigan's reaction it looked really hard to confess too...god bless her lmao. Posted Image

Modifié par Morrigans God son, 12 octobre 2010 - 12:03 .


#190
Sable Rhapsody

Sable Rhapsody
  • Members
  • 12 724 messages

Morrigans God son wrote...

No offence but you seriously sound like the chantry. Morrigan deserves to die because she isn't smart in your eyes and is an apostate? Excuse me? Morrigan is different, she's says she's sorry if she isn't exactly on the good side of the law, but that's just the way she was brought into the world.

Flemeth 2.0? At the start a little bit maybe, but after all Flemeth was all she had as a mother. It would be overly stupid for her to act like she was raised by a normal, average person from the start. Morrigan doesn't speak in rhymes either, except for the "You paint the shed while I bake the bread." line. Plus she changes...throughout the game....at the end she calls you "love." from Morrigan's reaction it looked really hard to confess too...god bless her lmao. Posted Image


Contrary to popular opinion, there's nothing inherently WRONG with "sounding like the Chantry."  In fact, the majority of the denizens of Thedas probably wouldn't have the greatest opinion of Morrigan.  

And Morrigan does have her flaws.  Her inability to empathize with people or really understand them makes her judgments on your actions during the game incompletely informed at best and just plain off at worst.  And even if you befriend her or romance her, her behavior and opinions only change with regards to the Warden, not to everyone else.  She doesn't learn any big grand lesson about the nature of life in general--she only changes her opinion about the protagonist.

I loved Morrigan.  She was my big sis, and I did not want to see her go.  That being said, there are very valid reasons to dislike her. 

#191
NKKKK

NKKKK
  • Members
  • 2 960 messages
Yes, Morrigan is a ****, that's not reason enough o kill her

#192
Sable Rhapsody

Sable Rhapsody
  • Members
  • 12 724 messages

NKKKK wrote...

Yes, Morrigan is a ****, that's not reason enough o kill her


...I've killed people for far, far less in video games.  I've killed Kaidan for being the unfavorite, Thane and Zaeed for TEH DRAMAZ, Carth for being...well...himself, Aribeth for being a painfully overdramatic Sue (TWICE), and countless of other people for the simple sin of getting in my protagonist's way.  And that's just BioWare games.  

#193
AlanC9

AlanC9
  • Members
  • 35 732 messages

Ryzaki wrote...
Do you have the one for hostile? Because I could have sworn she said something different...


I've got the convo open in the toolset right now. That's what she says.

Edit: there are three options:

Romance active: "Fare you well, my love. Should you live past the morrow, I trust it will only be with regret."
Approval WARM or better:" Fare you well, my friend. I do what I must, now, and so shall you."
Otherwise: "Fare you well, Grey Warden. Should you live past the morrow, seek me out at your own peril."

He'd seek her out to make sure she wasn't trying to "do as she must" with the archedemon's soul. He was a grey warden. (He actually always wanted to be one too so he was going to report her to Amarathine. Along with everything she told him about the archedemon soul before tracking her down to see if she started stirring up anything).


Huh? If you didn't sign on for the DR, there is no archdemon soul anymore. He's dead, Jim. Did you sign on for the DR with a Warden that wasn't even friends with Morrigan?

My PC was a bit paranoid but mostly he just doesn't like loose ends. Morrigan was one. A apostate mage? He wasn't going to just let her going traversing through Fereldan after trying to spare a powerful creature that in his mind caused the blights in the first place.


So your Warden is threatening Morrigan. At least show some intellectual honesty here. Maybe he's got reasons, but the conflict is your doing, not hers.

Modifié par AlanC9, 12 octobre 2010 - 01:37 .


#194
Ryzaki

Ryzaki
  • Members
  • 34 423 messages

AlanC9 wrote...
I've got the convo open in the toolset right now. That's what she says.

Edit: there are three options:

Romance active: "Fare you well, my love. Should you live past the morrow, I trust it will only be with regret."
Approval WARM or better:" Fare you well, my friend. I do what I must, now, and so shall you."
Otherwise: "Fare you well, Grey Warden. Should you live past the morrow, seek me out at your own peril."


Ah I see. I must've gotten my playthroughs were they were friendly/hostile mixed up.


Huh? If you didn't sign on for the DR, there is no archdemon soul anymore. He's dead, Jim. Did you sign on for the DR with a Warden that wasn't even friends with Morrigan?


My bad. I thought she was going to attempt to get it another way.


So your Warden is threatening Morrigan. At least show some intellectual honesty here. Maybe he's got reasons, but the conflict is your doing, not hers.


When did I say he wasn't threatening her? :huh:

But for her to say it in the first place means she must think she'll end up doing something to make him chase her. Otherwise why not attack her right then and there? 

So yeah. I started a conflict. :P

Doesn't make my reasons for disliking her to begin with any less valid.

People like her, people don't. Neither is less valid.

Though him chasing her around to kill her is extreme but I never said he was a nice person.

Though my favorite is the kind of guy she claims she wants dark, handsome, manipulative, prideful. Yeah. She's going to understand how it feels to be on the opposite side of someone pulling the wool over your eyes pretty soon.

Modifié par Ryzaki, 12 octobre 2010 - 02:07 .


#195
asaiasai

asaiasai
  • Members
  • 1 391 messages

David Gaider wrote...

No-one's forcing you to like anyone. As a matter of fact, there's no character in the game that we force anyone to like. Hating a character is a valid response, and utterly intentional-- Morrigan in particular is designed to be loved and hated.
As for everyone else, we've not said one way or the other how Morrigan's story will continue or if she'll even appear in DA2. Stop leaping to conclusions and you'll be a lot healthier.


Thank you it is official one does not have to like Morrigan to still be considered a valid fan, as the developers have created the character to provoke either reaction. I have never said anyone who likes Morrigan is a jerk, i have been called that on occasion for my dislike of Morrigan, but that comes with the territory of a minority position, and children without adult supervision. I have been accused of insulting Morrigan and by extention her fans by clearly stating why i do not like Morrigan, and yes some of the reasons i dis like Morrigan are not flattering hence the honest dis like.  

I do as i have said before find it quite ironic that Morrigan has the kind of following she does, and to a degree it does make me shake my head in wonderment that she has generated this kind of undeserved devotion. See every character in the game wants something from the warden, is only following the warden because of the something they hope the warden will provide. I find it ironic that there are really only 2 characters in the game who follow the warden not because of what the warden can providefor them, but for what they can provide for the warden and those 2 characters are the most reviled characters in the game. Anyone care to take a guess as to whom i am talking about before i give you the answer your not going to like? Anyone, anyone, perhaps MR Gaider? 


These 2 characters who are proof of divine providence, or at least proof the developers actually like the player. These 2 characters who beg to come along on the warden's mission. These 2 characters who for all thier faults and flaws provide guidance for the warden while walking the perilous road of absolute power. These 2 characters whose skill in battle have provided to all but 3 or 4 of my 22 characters the support to complete the warden's task. Those 2 characters are Leliana and Wynne. Every character except those 2 want something from the warden. Morrigan wants a bastard demon baby as either a replacement for Flemeth to use a a new meat suit, as her own meat suit, or to use as a weapon against Flemeth to prevent becomming Flemeth's new meat suit. Allistair, wants Loghain's head on a pike, even if it is not until late in the game that this motivation is revealed in an animated  tantrum. Sten wants out of his cage and redemption. Zev wants to continue breathing. Shale likes mobility. Oghren wants to find Branka. Dog aside from the occasional ham bone and scratch on the butt is easy and does not really have a choice being imprinted to the warden anyway. Everyone of the party members has an ulterior motive as to why they follow the warden except Leliana and Wynne. I can not say how many times i have read that due to the preachy nature of these 2 honest women they are often killed, sometimes out of hand. But Morrigan a vile, manipulative, lying, self centered, emotionally scarred, morally questionable, apostate, with no sense of duty to others is the toast of DAO. I do not get it, and at this point after 22 plays there is very little one will provide that would change my mind, that would not appear to be a weak attempt at a resale of the character. WH changed the Morrigan character from a worthy adversary to one only worthy of pity, and even that is not enough.  

I am not against the Morrigan fans getting all the Morrigan they want, hell get some with cherries on top, i would rather chew broken glass, and i would consider it a personal favor to be provided with the glass as an option. I am merely trying to remind the developers who read the forums that there are others who do find Morrigan to be a reprehensible excuse for a human being, regardless of her upbringing. Would one excuse an ax murder if thier defense in court was "I am an axe murder because mommy did not hold me as a child." or " daddy never bought me a pony or dirt bike". I know the answer, that answer is many of you would practice tying a hangman's knot until your fingers bleed in the hopes that your noose was the ONE. Yet you will disregard that comtempt for others that Morrigan will display time and time again, wave it off with the "can you blame her, she was raised by Flemeth after all, as if that is,was a viable excuse for her behavior and outlook on life. 

All i want to do is, for lack of a better word protect, the continuation of the decision sets my characters made in DAO as series progresses. The story of DAO is good, the presentation of DAO is good, the developer interaction with the fans is stellar, but for me the reason i like DAO is because the developers have inferred to me the player, choose the path and we will respect the path you have chosen to the best of our abilities. I do understand that does come with limitations, and while Mr. Gaider is writing a story he is allowing me to play the one i choose. How many games and developers will go that extra mile to provide the player with a way to personalize the experience to that extent? Seriously how many? I have PC gamed for over 15 years, i can go back to the mid seventies if you include Pong or Atarii so if you know of any other titles that will respect the players involvment in the story and carry it through to the next installment by all means please let me know, i am always looking for a new experience. There are plenty of linear point A, to B, to C, here is your trophy moment, roll credits games like GTA3, GTA VC, GTA SA, GTA 4, Half Life 1 and 2, etc, games that have an initial quality about them the first or second time, but as they will always be the same with play after play there is litte reason to return after a few plays.

So Bioware i realize you will do what you must, and in some cases the creativity necesary to extricate yourselves from the corners of player choice you have painted yourselves into will escape even your talent. I have no idea what you have in store for later installments, and i do wait as patiently as i can for your next offering. I do hope that you will keep in mind while you create that not everybody likes Morrigan, not everybody wants her role to be expanded. But if you do need to because of the corner you may be painted into, at least this time try to provide some valid reason as to why i should care about the Morrigan character. If that means a bit of extra dialog or cut scenes to explain for the sake of a few fans I and i am sure many others would appreciate it.

Asai

#196
Dave of Canada

Dave of Canada
  • Members
  • 17 484 messages

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

Thane and Zaeed for TEH DRAMAZ


I don't see Zaeed as "TEH DRAMAZ" type. He mentions it maybe... once?

Modifié par Dave of Canada, 12 octobre 2010 - 07:09 .


#197
Esbatty

Esbatty
  • Members
  • 3 760 messages

Dave of Canada wrote...

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

Thane and Zaeed for TEH DRAMAZ


I don't see Zaeed as "TEH DRAMAZ" type. He mentions it maybe... once?

One time he went to a Hanar dinner party, he brought a bundt cake. He was the only one to survive.

#198
asaiasai

asaiasai
  • Members
  • 1 391 messages

Esbatty wrote...

Dave of Canada wrote...

Sable Rhapsody wrote...

Thane and Zaeed for TEH DRAMAZ


I don't see Zaeed as "TEH DRAMAZ" type. He mentions it maybe... once?

One time he went to a Hanar dinner party, he brought a bundt cake. He was the only one to survive.


That is great! You really nailed Zaeed there.

Asai

#199
Lotion Soronarr

Lotion Soronarr
  • Members
  • 14 481 messages

Ryzaki wrote...

AlexXIV wrote...


He only lets Branka use them - because she is a Paragon and he is a weak leader. So it was your fault that you didn't destroy the anvil and left Harrowmont with that crazy dwarven chick. Destroy anvil, choose Harrowmont = good ending (imho).


The dwarves becoming more isolated and the caste system remaining is a good ending? :huh:


Only if you're not playing a Dwarven Noble.

Remember, you get to be Harrowmonts sucessor. A new golden age for the dwarves will dawn!

#200
Guest_Acharnae_*

Guest_Acharnae_*
  • Guests
One can say that there are some altruistic people who follow the warden but what is actually altruism? By the same logic Wynne is so preachy that if you hate the circle and the chantry her approval rate goes down the drain. Leliana is semi-nuts but I don't disagree that that could be adorable for some and that it is not a bad person per se.
There are however people who like the self sufficient, clear minded, emotionally solid (and gorgeous looks) of Morrigan. If through the course of the game, there was no change in her behavior or her beliefs then I would talk about a cruel person. But thankfully the writers allowed her to be human which means to be able to change her mind.
As to why there is so much interest in Morrigan? Think of the romances which have managed to endure the test of time? Some of them didn't have good endings. Romeo and Julliette killed themselves. Morrigan's DR provides drama and that is intoxicating as far as romance goes (maybe not in the long run). But it also bodes well with the setting. Having a romance in an RPG game, where people get burned from fireballs and dragons get decapitated, which is "normal", expected etc is not really something special.
Morrigan's story takes up the ante to RPG level of familiarity which is something very welcomed and very successful (as it turns out, which it's expected that it would turn out that way)

Modifié par Acharnae, 12 octobre 2010 - 11:57 .