563 réponses à ce sujet

[Captain_Obvious_au]

Kangasniemi wrote...

The small ammount of credibility this thread had just went out the window. Your super bad ass ultimate knife weapon is a freaking kitchen knife! If you are demanding a knife based on those examples, you could just as well demand to have scissors, baseball bats or any weapon of opportunity which can be used to kill a human. None of those are a real reason why a soldier should carry a knife.

Taking controll away from the player is always wrong (only exception is DA and only because the fight is over when the animations kick in, and the animations are not over used). So making one button pre-made kill animations is a bad idea. The idea of immortal Shepard while he takes 30 s (because every single game uses waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too long kill animations) to slice an enemy while making "cool" poses is ridiculous. And almost all games that use this mechanics over use it so much the animations get really old after 15 min of gameplay.

So no pre-made animations that kill the game flow. The combat works really fine in ME2, don't **** it up by making game breaking melee system. But please bring back grenades.

I NEVER suggested knife kill animations, I agree that would be a bad idea. What I suggested was the possibility of adding a retractable bayonet to weapons to give a more powerful melee IF you want to.

All that does is give more options and some cool ways of killing people, but you don't have to if you don't want to.

Plus, the examples I gave were in response to someone asking for examples of where knives are used as weapons in ME. They quite clearly are.

[Soahfreako]

Computer_God91 wrote...

Gleym wrote...

Computer_God91 wrote...

Or how about you back up you claims by giving me some evidence that blades have been mentioned in the codex.

No. How about YOU go ahead and read this thread and the several dozens of times this issue has been addressed and the Codex has been mentioned and quoted over and over again because people like you step into the thread without reading a word and start acting like you know everything. You're welcome to your beliefs, but don't go thinking that your beliefs are validated when you have no evidence to back them.

I want the short version. Not have to sift through the 15 page long garbage bin to find one diamond in the rough. You want me to care and or consider knives having a purpose in this game then why not just quote it, you can obviously find these things faster then I can because your so passionate about this thread and most likely been in at the start.

I'm not acting like I know it all either, I'm simpling saying that I've read all the novels/comics and played the games. See the above poster who only was able to reference one legit use while the others were just random kitchen knives. Again mister pissy, I'm saying from a gameplay standpoint knives would only take away from the ME experience, not add to it. There are already too many other ways to approach the combat scenarios in this game.

Hell, why don't we just throw a chainsaw on the assault rifle and call in Gears of War in space next.

..........BEST IDEA EVAR! Bioware. Do it. NAO!

[Vena_86]

How can there still be opposition to a better looking melee attack, a melee attack that both ME games already have? Where does the opinion come from that it takes away from the experience, when the gameplay doesnt even change at all?

Also, I can't see how it looks good or makes sense that Shepard fights a giant monster in a certain DLC with his/her fists. Uhm...yeah it's the future and Shepard fights cave man style.

[lazuli]

Kangasniemi wrote...

Taking controll away from the player is always wrong (only exception is DA and only because the fight is over when the animations kick in, and the animations are not over used). So making one button pre-made kill animations is a bad idea. The idea of immortal Shepard while he takes 30 s (because every single game uses waaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too long kill animations) to slice an enemy while making "cool" poses is ridiculous. And almost all games that use this mechanics over use it so much the animations get really old after 15 min of gameplay.

So no pre-made animations that kill the game flow. The combat works really fine in ME2, don't **** it up by making game breaking melee system. But please bring back grenades.

I disagree.  The special kill animations in DA were over the top and you were left vulnerable while performing them.  This never bothered me, as the game wasn't that difficult even on its hardest setting.  But there have been complaints on the boards about characters dying because they can't use a poultice while stylishly killing an opponent.

To clarify, though, the melee attacks you're describing would suck in Mass Effect, or in any game.  30 seconds (or more) for a killing animation?  Sounds like Final Fantasy 8.  Thankfully even the longest attacks in RE5 were just a couple seconds.  And I'm not in favor of quick time events in Mass Effect (interrupts are enough).  And I don't think these moves should be killing moves.  They could deal damage, but they wouldn't be a guaranteed kill.  Finally, I don't think you could lift the style right from RE5's attacks and use them in Mass Effect.  The games have very different art styles.  It would look out of place.

I am in favor of including quick melee attacks (or close combat moves, to be broad) with more varied animations than the current elbow of death.  These attacks would be available through a button prompt upon being close enough to a staggering enemy, and could vary depending on the type of stagger the enemy is performing, Shepard's class, Shepard's exact position, or other qualifiers.

[yoda23]

Rivercurse wrote...

If enemies get that close to you (apart from husks on insanity), then you're playing the game wrong.

The beauty of Bioware was there wasn't a right or wrong way to play their games, ever. This new xbox shooter trash has killed Bioware.

[Sidewinder_617]

Now that ME3 has a premise, HtH combat is going to be that more important,
because there is NO WAY you'll have enough ammo for 4 billion husks (damn....)
also, one more form to make it happen will be major plot points happening on earth,
playing as the guy stranded on big ben trying to make sense of WTF is happening
and piecing together what the reapers' goal really is ("ascention") and if this harvest of earth
is actually the reapers finding the "ultimate specimen" for reproduction
(in retrospect, the collector cruiser's cargo bay where a squad member says this will happen
was a giveaway on what the reapers' new agenda is)

Lastly, i expect the characters from the novels to make SOME appearence in-game.

[1upD]

Sidewinder_617 wrote...

Now that ME3 has a premise, HtH combat is going to be that more important,
because there is NO WAY you'll have enough ammo for 4 billion husks (damn....)
also, one more form to make it happen will be major plot points happening on earth,
playing as the guy stranded on big ben trying to make sense of WTF is happening
and piecing together what the reapers' goal really is ("ascention") and if this harvest of earth
is actually the reapers finding the "ultimate specimen" for reproduction
(in retrospect, the collector cruiser's cargo bay where a squad member says this will happen
was a giveaway on what the reapers' new agenda is)

Lastly, i expect the characters from the novels to make SOME appearence in-game.

True, true. I've been wondering if the Reapers will have some new servant species or if the Reaper missions in ME3 will become another zombie survival horror game. If it's true that the Reapers are only using Husks, ammo conservation will be vital. I could see this situation introducing a melee weapons class.

[tywinsregards]

didnt have time to read through all post but i wondered why they didnt include knives myself. Even in some of the concept art there are images of melee weapons plus even your background can include you fighting in close quarters combat. sorry if its been mentioned before.

[Annihilator27]

1upD wrote...

Sidewinder_617 wrote...

Now that ME3 has a premise, HtH combat is going to be that more important,
because there is NO WAY you'll have enough ammo for 4 billion husks (damn....)
also, one more form to make it happen will be major plot points happening on earth,
playing as the guy stranded on big ben trying to make sense of WTF is happening
and piecing together what the reapers' goal really is ("ascention") and if this harvest of earth
is actually the reapers finding the "ultimate specimen" for reproduction
(in retrospect, the collector cruiser's cargo bay where a squad member says this will happen
was a giveaway on what the reapers' new agenda is)

Lastly, i expect the characters from the novels to make SOME appearence in-game.

True, true. I've been wondering if the Reapers will have some new servant species or if the Reaper missions in ME3 will become another zombie survival horror game. If it's true that the Reapers are only using Husks, ammo conservation will be vital. I could see this situation introducing a melee weapons class.

Tali's knife could come in handy.

[sympathy4saren]

No

[Chala]

yes, why not? everyone has a different style, some are always covered, other is from distance, in some cases there are people who likes close combat. In my case, I'm in the middle between distance and close combat, I like making a headshot with an anti personnel rifle, but I also enjoy punching people to death.

[colossus50000]

I personally dont know what to think of this matter. Im kind of on this fence about melee weapons in ME3. I guess it doesnt fit Shepard all that much IMO. Doesnt seem to practical with every one using guns and i just decide to pull out a sword or knife and go jedi on everyone. Maybe a certain class could have a knife for stealth kills but when really has shepard used stealth. correct me if im wrong.

[SalsaDMA]

Googlesaurus wrote...

Can someone give me a crash-course on the capabilities of knives in the ME universe?

According to the novels, hand to hand weaponry like knives, riflebutts used as clubs and so on, move slow enough to not get 'caught' by kinetic shields of combat suits. Thus shiels are useless aginst them.

Especially Kai Leng is illustrated as being quite proficient with knives against armored and armed opponents (Human former N7 operative working for Cerberus now). At one point he takes down a fully armed and armored  assult group of... 5 Turians I think it was, while he is without armor and wielding a knife.

Hand to hand weapons of various sorts are used a bit more frequently in the novels than one would asume from having just played the games, specifically because of their advantage against shields and because they work at a range where you can't get a proper bearing with, at that range, unwieldy weapons like assult rifles.

[Vena_86]

Kasumi uses melee. As a soldier and vanguard on insantiy I use melee a lot, since it offers tactical advantages in certain situations. Shadow Broker boss battle...



Don't anyone tell me there is no melee in Mass Effect, because it is focussing on ranged combat. There IS melee and the gameplay is fine it only LOOKS underwhelming. Not Dragon Age in space is beeing suggested, not literally running arround with a knife like in Counter Strike is beeing suggested. Just don't force Shepards futuristic special forces to use their rifles as clubs in close combat, as that does not make any sense, no matter if the game is about ranged combat or flying ponies.

[Googlesaurus]

SalsaDMA wrote...

Googlesaurus wrote...

Can someone give me a crash-course on the capabilities of knives in the ME universe?

According to the novels, hand to hand weaponry like knives, riflebutts used as clubs and so on, move slow enough to not get 'caught' by kinetic shields of combat suits. Thus shiels are useless aginst them.

Especially Kai Leng is illustrated as being quite proficient with knives against armored and armed opponents (Human former N7 operative working for Cerberus now). At one point he takes down a fully armed and armored  assult group of... 5 Turians I think it was, while he is without armor and wielding a knife.

Hand to hand weapons of various sorts are used a bit more frequently in the novels than one would asume from having just played the games, specifically because of their advantage against shields and because they work at a range where you can't get a proper bearing with, at that range, unwieldy weapons like assult rifles.

Did Kai Leng's knife cut straight through the armor, or did he stab in-between the plates and whatnot? His biotics play a role in his success?

[ScotOfClanDonald]

There's no reason NOT to let us improve melee if we want to use it. As I mentioned in the other thread, you could mod your gun to have a kinetic bayonet or chainsword blade, or you could just give us a melee weapon slot that activates when you use the already existing melee button.

[King Gigglez]

I rather have a sword then a knife lol Either one could greatly help in combat scenarios

[SalsaDMA]

Googlesaurus wrote...

Did Kai Leng's knife cut straight through the armor, or did he stab in-between the plates and whatnot? His biotics play a role in his success?

He's not a biotic. Just a very skilled combatant.

And he stabs, slashes at strategic points from what I remember.

Ofc the whole hand to hand thingie is way more dynamic in the novels than in the first 2 games as you can fire weapons without issue at point blank in the game but are severely restricted with that against aware opponents in the novels as grappling, hand to hand weapons and kicks towards vulnerable places/joints restrict the opponents ability to retaliate.

Short range stunners also play a fairly noticabl role in the retribution novel, yet we never see any of them in the games. One would at least had asumed the prison guards on jacks prison station would have been equipped with such.

[Googlesaurus]

SalsaDMA wrote...

Googlesaurus wrote...

Did Kai Leng's knife cut straight through the armor, or did he stab in-between the plates and whatnot? His biotics play a role in his success?

He's not a biotic. Just a very skilled combatant.

And he stabs, slashes at strategic points from what I remember.

Ofc the whole hand to hand thingie is way more dynamic in the novels than in the first 2 games as you can fire weapons without issue at point blank in the game but are severely restricted with that against aware opponents in the novels as grappling, hand to hand weapons and kicks towards vulnerable places/joints restrict the opponents ability to retaliate.

Short range stunners also play a fairly noticabl role in the retribution novel, yet we never see any of them in the games. One would at least had asumed the prison guards on jacks prison station would have been equipped with such.

I can't see melee attacks in ME3 like that. Until players can accurately replicate some measure of hand-to-hand skill within a game, melee combat will always fall into three categories: stylish and requiring little skill, effective but as a last resort, or way overpowered. I like the idea of this thread, but video games are just too limited at this time to make it balanced and dynamic. 

[Annihilator27]

King Gigglez wrote...

I rather have a sword then a knife lol Either one could greatly help in combat scenarios

I woulde settle for that lol.

[PREY985]

I CANT WAIT FOR IT!!

[Annihilator27]

PREY985 wrote...

I CANT WAIT FOR IT!!

Patience, Itll be here..........Someday.

[SomeKindaEnigma]

Ok. How difficult would it be to simply add a knife to the game? And why is that such a big deal? Instead of the very uninspired rifle butt and "oomph" sound Shepard makes in ME2, he could pull the knife out and take the enemy out in a more fashionable way. It may be a bit more violent than a gun butt, but that's why the M rating is there for the game, right?

[Annihilator27]

Is talis knife the only modeled melee weapon in the game?