1728 réponses à ce sujet

[OBakaSama]

Still on the whole 'no credit card' thing, huh? Excuse my ignorance (UK resident here) but I'd like to understand more fully the situation our European cousins have with regards to payment (and not just whether the SE will be released in those countries).

Basically there's a different payment system which is essentially a bank transfer using a bank card which is the preferred and dominant method of payment in certain countries, yes? And the bank card functions like--but not exactly like--what some of us might call a debit card? You can withdraw from ATMs with the relevant symbol (Mastercard, Visa, etc.) but cannot use the bank card to pay for (most) oversea transactions even though online retailers might have the relevant symbol? Correct?

The other point I'd like to understand is why a credit card cannot be afforded. Sure, every credit card company checks to see your income to see what level of credit you can afford (at least that's how it's supposed to work), and they issue you a card with an appropriate level of credit (amount you can spend on the credit card). Application is free. There used to be annual fees but for a long time I haven't seen these (others may). Is this the expense? And hence why some can't afford to have a credit card? Or is it because you have to use a 'foreign currency' and are charged for it? (Even on my credit card I get charged a percentage of my purchase if I shop overseas.)

Why the long post? Hopefully to try and alleviate the tension I feel between the two factions--the 'get a credit card' stance and the 'have no credit card' stance-- and to try and understand how things work elsewhere. Anyone care to assist me on this?

Oh, elsewhere....SE seems to be seperably orderable at most sites (Amazon.co.uk and the likes). If uncertain...just order that perhaps? At least the prices are starting to fall into line.

[flexxdk]

I cannot purchase anything on either amazon.com and amazon.co.uk.

amazon.com doesn't support international bank / wire transfers
amazon.co.uk accepts UK-based debit cards with for example the Maestro logo. But I really doubt that my debit card is UK-based (it has the Maestro logo, though) (I live in the Netherlands, FYI).

And the "I cannot afford a credit card" part is... a bit difficult to explain.

Since I do not have a job, I do not have a income. I'm too busy with my study to actually have a job. Because they want to know my weekly / monthly / whatever-ly income, it really isn't going to work out. So that blows up the idea already of getting one.
Just like FrostyLazer, I am a student who lives from government student loans. And these loans aren't good enough to actually get a credit card.

Modifié par Whacka, 04 novembre 2010 - 05:52 .

[Joshd21]

OBakaSama wrote...

Still on the whole 'no credit card' thing, huh? Excuse my ignorance (UK resident here) but I'd like to understand more fully the situation our European cousins have with regards to payment (and not just whether the SE will be released in those countries).

Basically there's a different payment system which is essentially a bank transfer using a bank card which is the preferred and dominant method of payment in certain countries, yes? And the bank card functions like--but not exactly like--what some of us might call a debit card? You can withdraw from ATMs with the relevant symbol (Mastercard, Visa, etc.) but cannot use the bank card to pay for (most) oversea transactions even though online retailers might have the relevant symbol? Correct?

The other point I'd like to understand is why a credit card cannot be afforded. Sure, every credit card company checks to see your income to see what level of credit you can afford (at least that's how it's supposed to work), and they issue you a card with an appropriate level of credit (amount you can spend on the credit card). Application is free. There used to be annual fees but for a long time I haven't seen these (others may). Is this the expense? And hence why some can't afford to have a credit card? Or is it because you have to use a 'foreign currency' and are charged for it? (Even on my credit card I get charged a percentage of my purchase if I shop overseas.)

Why the long post? Hopefully to try and alleviate the tension I feel between the two factions--the 'get a credit card' stance and the 'have no credit card' stance-- and to try and understand how things work elsewhere. Anyone care to assist me on this?

Oh, elsewhere....SE seems to be seperably orderable at most sites (Amazon.co.uk and the likes). If uncertain...just order that perhaps? At least the prices are starting to fall into line.

I have not read this entire post. I am just confused why you can't use a prepaid visa gift card. You pay maybe a 5 buck fee and place 80 dollars on the card. Use it one time only to purchase the game plus tax and shipping and handling.

[FrostyLazer]

OBakaSama wrote...

Still on the whole 'no credit card' thing, huh? Excuse my ignorance (UK resident here) but I'd like to understand more fully the situation our European cousins have with regards to payment (and not just whether the SE will be released in those countries).

Basically there's a different payment system which is essentially a bank transfer using a bank card which is the preferred and dominant method of payment in certain countries, yes? And the bank card functions like--but not exactly like--what some of us might call a debit card? You can withdraw from ATMs with the relevant symbol (Mastercard, Visa, etc.) but cannot use the bank card to pay for (most) oversea transactions even though online retailers might have the relevant symbol? Correct?

Its basicly that the internet stores only accept bank transfers/the use of debit card from the country there settled in. Every country (in the EU) have some difference in how bank accounts and payments are organized. I can understand that it is relative expencive for a site to get everything in order (because of the different laws and systems) for every country.

Its sad, but I can understand

OBakaSama wrote...

The other point I'd like to understand is why a credit card cannot be afforded. Sure, every credit card company checks to see your income to see what level of credit you can afford (at least that's how it's supposed to work), and they issue you a card with an appropriate level of credit (amount you can spend on the credit card). Application is free. There used to be annual fees but for a long time I haven't seen these (others may). Is this the expense? And hence why some can't afford to have a credit card? Or is it because you have to use a 'foreign currency' and are charged for it? (Even on my credit card I get charged a percentage of my purchase if I shop overseas.)

The problem is that you have to have an income. I myself am a student who lives from goverment student loans. I would find it strange that these student loans are enough to get a credit card. With a credit card you don't have to order overseas (in this case) because there are plenty online retailers in the UK, Germany, France (The 3 country's that are the nabours of the Netherlands) and probably a lot more.

OBakaSama wrote...

Why the long post? Hopefully to try and alleviate the tension I feel between the two factions--the 'get a credit card' stance and the 'have no credit card' stance-- and to try and understand how things work elsewhere. Anyone care to assist me on this? 

Oh, elsewhere....SE seems to be seperably orderable at most sites (Amazon.co.uk and the likes). If uncertain...just order that perhaps? At least the prices are starting to fall into line.

Hope that what I said made a bit sense.

The strange thing is that EA apparently doesn't know to what regions there going to deliver the signature edition (I got that from earlier post of different people). I think that's the biggest problem right now. Probably some online stores in the regions that you now can't get it want to deliver it, but EA won't/can't promises that it will deliver

Modifié par FrostyLazer, 04 novembre 2010 - 05:48 .

[Rutix]

ZtalkerRM wrote...

FrostyLazer wrote...

Rutix wrote...

Just got reaction from a shop in the Netherlands. They asked EA if the netherlands also participated in this thing but EA didn't know that yet. What the hell is up with that? How can you not know that yet while most other countries have it?

Come on. EA doesn't know if it will be avalible in the Netherlands? Its not like its some little country in the middel of nowhere where people still haven't heard of cars or tv's. 

I don't like bashing EA of little things, but my hatred of EA is starting to increase with these kind of things

The payment methods on the digital pre-order sites isn't Benelux-friendly (or Europa-friendly) either, requiring a credit card to pay.
-So we can't get it in the normal shops (as stated above), I asked that in a game-shop here yesterday too.
-So we can't pre-order it online without credit card. And most people don't have credit cards over here since we have a whole different system.

I think it's a prime example of Catch f*cking 22.

Well thats not the point. I dont need to order at EA shop but they could just use the webshops in the netherlands like gamemania and such. But EA doesn't know yet if it will be available which is like stupid and makes me hate them even more.

Modifié par Rutix, 04 novembre 2010 - 08:29 .

[Moirnelithe]

Is there any info on whether DA2 SE willl be available on Steam? I have DA:O on Steam and I rather like it that way with the automatic downloads and patching and the paypal payment option. Sorry if this has been answered but looking through 43 pages is a bit much.

ps. I'm in the Netherlands too so any info about availability there would be appreciated. Oh, and the credit card thing really is a pain here. I do have one but I've had to order games and game-time cards for friends that didn't. 

Modifié par Evainelithe, 04 novembre 2010 - 08:36 .

[OBakaSama]

Cool. Hopefully that's cleared things up a bit for people on both sides.



One question remains for me though: here in the UK it's possible to apply for student credit cards (not sure of income levels just that it is available), is there an equivalent in your respective countries (mainly Netherlands I detect)?



@ Joshd21: Oh, the suggestion for prepaid cards sounds like a good alternative for those without a credit card if available. And FYI, I would have no problems preordering the SE if I wanted to. I'm merely trying to clarify and alleviate the tension in this particular discussion.



Anyway....monetary problems aside I would find it difficult to fathom if the SE doesn't get universally released. (Though looking at the back of my DA:UE says UK only....) That would seem rather...restrictive to say the least. (I'm almost certain a certain amount of anti-EA sentiment can be drummed up in this particular scenario if that is the case.) Hopefully before the cut-off date there will be an update about the countries getting the SE. Perhaps preordering at an actual brick-and-mortar shop might then be possible.

[ralph2190]

Evainelithe wrote...

Is there any info on whether DA2 SE willl be available on Steam? I have DA:O on Steam and I rather like it that way with the automatic downloads and patching and the paypal payment option. Sorry if this has been answered but looking through 43 pages is a bit much.

ps. I'm in the Netherlands too so any info about availability there would be appreciated. Oh, and the credit card thing really is a pain here. I do have one but I've had to order games and game-time cards for friends that didn't. 

No there is no information as of today on DA2 being available on Steam. I'm quite sure it will be offered eventually, but going by what happened with Mass Effect 2, the game should be available for pre-order a few weeks before launch. Expect some news around the end of February or beginning of March.

[Moirnelithe]

Thanks, I'll hold off on pre-ordering until just before the pre-order end date then and see what happens.

[Mahumia]

Regarding the credit card debate: been recently checking for one, since I am reluctant continue to bug those few friends who have a credit card. The 'cheapest' one from my bank charged about 8 euro per 3 months, and that is without the fee for actually using the card... well, I doubt I'll buy enough to make up for that amount of money :/ And indeed: direct payment via a bank is free and fast... Gotta love the we're-one-union-but-still-manage-to-fail-miserably-with-our-national-regulations... ><

[Thandal N'Lyman]

Mahumia wrote...

Regarding the credit card debate: been recently checking for one, since I am reluctant continue to bug those few friends who have a credit card. The 'cheapest' one from my bank charged about 8 euro per 3 months, and that is without the fee for actually using the card... well, I doubt I'll buy enough to make up for that amount of money :/ And indeed: direct payment via a bank is free and fast... Gotta love the we're-one-union-but-still-manage-to-fail-miserably-with-our-national-regulations... ><

Now I'm curious. 

Your bank:

a)  Charges you a fee to have  a credit card 
 (that used to be common here, but not for a long time now) and;

  Charges you a fee to use  your credit card?   
This, on top of the fee they charge the merchant for processing the payment? 
And on top of the interest they charge if you do not pay the full balance?

Well, I certainly wouldn't get one under those conditions either.  But I also wouldn't have any case to complain that I couldn't buy things from overseas without one.  If I want to do business internationally, I have to be prepared to do things the international way.  (And being a consumer is also "doing business internationally".)

[ZtalkerRM]

Thandal NLyman wrote...

Mahumia wrote...

Regarding the credit card debate: been recently checking for one, since I am reluctant continue to bug those few friends who have a credit card. The 'cheapest' one from my bank charged about 8 euro per 3 months, and that is without the fee for actually using the card... well, I doubt I'll buy enough to make up for that amount of money :/ And indeed: direct payment via a bank is free and fast... Gotta love the we're-one-union-but-still-manage-to-fail-miserably-with-our-national-regulations... ><

Now I'm curious. 

Your bank:

a)  Charges you a fee to have  a credit card 
 (that used to be common here, but not for a long time now) and;

  Charges you a fee to use  your credit card?   
This, on top of the fee they charge the merchant for processing the payment? 
And on top of the interest they charge if you do not pay the full balance?

Well, I certainly wouldn't get one under those conditions either.  But I also wouldn't have any case to complain that I couldn't buy things from overseas without one.  If I want to do business internationally, I have to be prepared to do things the international way.  (And being a consumer is also "doing business internationally".)

I forgot to add I'm a student too. And have no possibility of getting either since I don't have an income. Hence, a catch 22.
a) You are charged for a credit card yes. You'll have to pay to get the actual thing, since you get the 'european bank transfer' cards standard. Don't know the exact amount of that though.
I got the costs list right here, from the ING website.
Paying/withdrawing in euro's: No charge
Paying witdrawing different valuta: 1% ...something (interest?) per transaction
Withdrawing money from atm in euro's: 4,50 euro's
Withdrawing money from atm in different valuta: 4,50 euro's plus the same 1% thingy.
Withdrawing from bank office in euro's: 3%, with a minimum of 4,50 euro.
Withdrawing from bank officce in different valuta: Same, with the 1% thingy again.

So, to end the negative "get one you stupid idiot" story once and for all:
1) You can;t get a credit card here unless you have a stable income
2) Buying stuff WILL cost you extra
3) Buying stuff abroad WILL cost even more
4) This was the YOUNG PEOPLE credit card. The rates may be even higher for different types of credit cards.
5) It's not worth losing 4,50 euro's every time you need contant money. Since credit cards aren't big here, you'll need to use 'real' touchable money often.
So yeah. In europe, we're pretty f*cked as it is.

[Thandal N'Lyman]

ZtalkerRM wrote...
I forgot to add I'm a student too. And have no possibility of getting either since I don't have an income...

Well, yes.  Not having an income does put a hurdle between an individual and... buying things. 
My condolences. 

[Joshd21]

This is why I like Prepaid Visa cards they come in amounts of 20-500 and usually there is just the five dollar fee and that's it. Also that way you don't leave your stored credit card information out on the information highway of the internet.

To aviod fees that later might be charged just get another card when ordering something. Depending on how often you order things the prepaid won't fee you after paying that five bucks when you checkout. I wonder how the fees are outside the united states.

But back to the topic what's the deadline to order it and get the extrras? I knew on gamefly I saw a deadline

[AsheraII]

All that the Dutchies here said about Credit Cards in the Netherlands is sadly true. I'm lucky to have one, but it's indeed expensive. The Dutch banks are kind of arrogant that way, though it's also cautiousness to some degree.
A credit card is considered a loan here. So if you don't have a regular income other than wellfare/student loans, you can't have one.
If you failed to pay some bills, you won't get one either.

The banks are also kinda hung-up on their own debit-card system (a big part of it is also chauvinesm though), and keep investing in the stupid things, refuse to make them compatible in any way with the credit-card system, other than allowing you to pull money from a teller machine within Europe, and even worse, invest tons into even more annoying and unwanted nonsense like the infamous "chip-knip".

The government doesn't mind this at all. They see it as a means to reduce the amount of money spent abroad, and recycle more money within the country's own economy. People from abroad are ofcourse welcomed to spend as much money as they like in any way they want within the Dutch economy, but they're quite happy with this artificial barrier that prevent money from leaving the country. And no, not even the most leftist party will ever ask a question about it. Removal of this barrier would make a pretty huge dent into the Dutch economy, one that would take away any financial basis for any other ideas they might have.

Modifié par AsheraII, 05 novembre 2010 - 01:55 .

[Joshd21]

AsheraII wrote...

All that the Dutchies here said about Credit Cards in the Netherlands is sadly true. I'm lucky to have one, but it's indeed expensive. The Dutch banks are kind of arrogant that way, though it's also cautiousness to some degree.
A credit card is considered a loan here. So if you don't have a regular income other than wellfare/student loans, you can't have one.
If you failed to pay some bills, you won't get one either.

The banks are also kinda hung-up on their own debit-card system (a big part of it is also chauvinesm though), and keep investing in the stupid things, refuse to make them compatible in any way with the credit-card system, other than allowing you to pull money from a teller machine within Europe, and even worse, invest tons into even more annoying and unwanted nonsense like the infamous "chip-knip".

The government doesn't mind this at all. They see it as a means to reduce the amount of money spent abroad, and recycle more money within the country's own economy. People from abroad are ofcourse welcomed to spend as much money as they like in any way they want within the Dutch economy, but they're quite happy with this artificial barrier that prevent money from leaving the country. And no, not even the most leftist party will ever ask a question about it. Removal of this barrier would make a pretty huge dent into the Dutch economy, one that would take away any financial basis for any other ideas they might have.

You can use welfare to your advantage there to get a credit card? That's pretty sweet. The banks here I thought worked like all the banks do. If you have anything you haven't paid it goes to collections and on your credit card report.

I'm happy to report that I never even have a credit card from a bank my entire lifetime. I just don't see the reason why when I can place money on a card and get it. Unless the item is very expensive. Wow, I just finished reading your post and the dutch economy is werid.

I don't mean that in a bad way just different from here.

[Thandal N'Lyman]

AsheraII wrote...

... The banks are also kinda hung-up on their own debit-card system (a big part of it is also chauvinesm though), and keep investing in the stupid things, refuse to make them compatible in any way with the credit-card system, other than allowing you to pull money from a teller machine within Europe, and even worse, invest tons into even more annoying and unwanted nonsense like the infamous "chip-knip".

I gotta ask... What's "chip-knip"?!?

[Joshd21]

Thandal NLyman wrote...


I gotta ask... What's "chip-knip"?!?

I got to say I love the way outside the united states talk. They just seem so mellow. They are like Eh, good day mate it's so cool with their accent and I'm being serious. I'd love to be able to have an accent like that for some reason chicks dig that

[0x30A88]

Whacka wrote...

Fact is, I don't feel like getting me a credit card when I still haven't got a real job.
And after having used it once, it would gather lotsa dust in the closet anyway.

If I had a income (and not just a income, but a sufficient income), then yes I would've gotten one. But til then (which is probably six years later anyway), I'll have to use my bank account (and I'll have to do without a credit card til then).

I use a debit card, the great difference is that you use money that you actually have... And it's a little 1$-like fee on VISA payments (at least for Norway).

EDIT: To you dutchmen (right...?), Paypal offers a system where you can transact money to an accaunt with a unique account ID as message and get it on your Paypal balance...used that system a lot before actually daring to register my debit card with Paypal...which was safe and nice actually.

Modifié par Gisle Aune, 05 novembre 2010 - 08:27 .

[FrostyLazer]

Thandal NLyman wrote...

I gotta ask... What's "chip-knip"?!?

A chip-knip is a dutch thing (I think). Its like electronic cash. On every debit card there is a chip where you can put money on from you bank account. This money you can then spend the same way like cash (whel you need a machine to reduce the ammount of money on the chip). The advantige used to be that to pay this way you don't need an connection to the bank (like with an atm or the use of a debit card in stores). Nowday's that connection can be mobile so its not that a big advantage anymore

[ZtalkerRM]

FrostyLazer wrote...

Thandal NLyman wrote...

I gotta ask... What's "chip-knip"?!?

A chip-knip is a dutch thing (I think). Its like electronic cash. On every debit card there is a chip where you can put money on from you bank account. This money you can then spend the same way like cash (whel you need a machine to reduce the ammount of money on the chip). The advantige used to be that to pay this way you don't need an connection to the bank (like with an atm or the use of a debit card in stores). Nowday's that connection can be mobile so its not that a big advantage anymore

Most international bank cards (like my ING one) function as a chip-knip too. It works like pre-paid on a mobile phone. It used to be ideal for paying for parking or small transactions. But since the normal system is mobile now it's kind of useless.
And please, quit the sarcastic (and shallow)  comments. I do have a side job and work for my money just like everyone else. But college (or university) here is a day job that stands for 30/40 hours a week of work. It's simply not enough to register for a credit card if you only have a side-job.

[flexxdk]

Gisle Aune wrote...
To you dutchmen (right...?), Paypal offers a system where you can transact money to an accaunt with a unique account ID as message and get it on your Paypal balance...used that system a lot before actually daring to register my debit card with Paypal...which was safe and nice actually.

ScamPal scammed me out of my money once. I'm not gonna use their system again.

Besides, amazon doesn't support PayPal.

But now I'm wondering if play.com accepts non-UK debit cards. Same for gamestation and game.co.uk.

[FrostyLazer]

I use PayPal now and then and never had a problem with it. To bad not a lot of sites support PayPal.



It worked great with the Bioware store. To bad that the shipping cost are way out there (to ship it to the EU) and that I still had to pay import taxes when I got it

[ZtalkerRM]

FrostyLazer wrote...

I use PayPal now and then and never had a problem with it. To bad not a lot of sites support PayPal.

It worked great with the Bioware store. To bad that the shipping cost are way out there (to ship it to the EU) and that I still had to pay import taxes when I got it

I checked the UK sites 'we' could order the Signature Edition from.
Only credit-card payment method.

Plus, it'd take 3-5 days to get here....which is not that pre-orderish you'll get it 3-5 days later then the people who get it from the shops.

[Rutix]

Yea lets hope EA decide to also include the Netherlands. It would be ridiculous if it wouldn't include it.