967 réponses à ce sujet

[Mubar]

FieryDove wrote...

The extra companion will be free to all new copies of DA2. There I just saved a month or two and lots of teeth gnashing.

I hope the extra companion is either Leliana or your Warden .

[Onix Sunstone]

SE looks fine to me as a preorder bundle, it dosnt say anything about bonue's being exclusive so we should get a dlc or code & pre order should be rewarded imo.



Personaly im not pre-ordering like the op iv lost faith in bioware & im a bioware noob since this year only I got DAO awsome, then ME1 very good rpg light, ME2 reduced to a decent story driven FPS id say its an awsome fps but there patching & dlc's for DAO have been a joke & DA2 needs testing as an RPG before im buying it.

[Jimmy Fury]

AngryFrozenWater wrote...
Let me give you an example: Supposed I sell you a house. But you can only see pictures of that house. You won't be able to look inside. It's a special deal. It saves you 20%.You won't be able to get a refund if the house collapses or has any shortcomings after you get the key. That's part of the deal. Would you do it?

The bolded part makes your analogy invalid because that's not part of the deal with the game. There is no "can't return once the game hits your door step" clause anywhere. Nor is there any "you must open the game as soon as you receive it" clause. 
You are able to wait a couple of days for other people to play it, see what they think, and decide whether or not to open your copy. All it takes is a little patience and self control.

-edit-
heck, since Gamestop's return policy is unopened within 30 days you can set your preorder aside and rent the sucker to test it out.

Modifié par Jimmy Fury, 16 octobre 2010 - 08:11 .

[Bromosapian]

leonia42 wrote...

[...] Here's a revolutionary concept: Don't pre-order if you don't like this marketting strategy. [...]

I was going to read more of the thread but then I saw this so I thought that the thread should have ended there.

Though, gamers are idiots when it comes to voting with their money.  I've heard people complain that, say, FF14 is dog****, then turn around and say they have to buy the collectors edition because its SE.

TL;DR

Gamers need to learn to not buy things when they say so.

Modifié par Bromosapian, 16 octobre 2010 - 08:09 .

[The Masked Rog]

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

Meltemph wrote...

I'm not following it blindly, but I guess whatever makes you think your decisions are superior. Blindly would infer I have no basis for trusting in the product outside of faith. However, if I have enjoyed every game they have made, then I have more then enough info to expect the same results.

For me, Bioware has earned that trust. They obviously haven't for you, but trying to find flaws in why people don't make purchases over the same items as you... well whatever floats your boat, I guess.

Where is that 2 year DLC support? Where are the patches that fix the numerous bugs? Where is that serial number of that staff? And weren't we promised to get info "within a couple of weeks" about that new community event? How many months ago was this again? But if that does not crush you trust in them then I do think you are following them blindly.

So basically if someone has trust in BioWare they follow them  blindly, because you have determined so. That you think something fails to make it a fact.

[Khayness]

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

Where is that 2 year DLC support? Where are the patches that fix the numerous bugs? Where is that serial number of that staff? And weren't we promised to get info "within a couple of weeks" about that new community event? How many months ago was this again? But if that does not crush you trust in them then I do think you are following them blindly.

Your false sense of entitlement is filling Mr. Gaider with righteous indignation.

[upsettingshorts]

Trust, by definition, is a belief in something despite less than all the facts necessary to prove it beyond a reasonable doubt.

If we had all the information we need by which to judge the likelihood of something, it's not trust.

But people are going to say "blind faith" all the time, like Bioware is a supernatural entity. They exist, therefore there is evidence out there on which to formulate an opinion on the relative risk of pre-ordering one of their products. So such criticisms ring hollow.

AngryFrozenWater wrote...

Where is that 2 year DLC support? Where are the patches that fix the numerous bugs? Where is that serial number of that staff? And weren't we promised to get info "within a couple of weeks" about that new community event? How many months ago was this again? But if that does not crush you trust in them then I do think you are following them blindly.

None of those things is "developed and released a game I regretted buying."  It's not blind faith to have different criteria through which we make these decisions.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 16 octobre 2010 - 08:21 .

[captain.subtle]

The Masked Rog wrote...

So basically if someone has trust in BioWare they follow them  blindly, because you have determined so. That you think something fails to make it a fact.

Following any comapnay purely on faith is following Blindly. I use the word faith advisedly. You are ASSuming that DA2 will be good because Bioware has delivered in the past. That IS a good argument. But not a practical one.

If they are asking you to invest more money into something that is definitely going to depreciate with time, WITHOUT giving you enough proof is it not blind faith? Granted that you have ability to revoke the purchase, but is not better to wait until more info is released?

OFFTOPIC// Anyway, do you know why the "buy now reutrn if you don't like after a month" strategy is successful in general from TV sets to Computer games?

[upsettingshorts]

captain.subtle wrote...

Following any comapnay purely on faith is following Blindly. I use the word faith advisedly. You are ASSuming that DA2 will be good because Bioware has delivered in the past. That IS a good argument. But not a practical one.

There's a proverb in gambling:  Never bet on a streak to end.

Granted, it's perfectly reasonable to say that you believe the streak already ended.  I don't, but I know my opinion is only relevant to me.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 16 octobre 2010 - 08:23 .

[captain.subtle]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

captain.subtle wrote...

Following any comapnay purely on faith is following Blindly. I use the word faith advisedly. You are ASSuming that DA2 will be good because Bioware has delivered in the past. That IS a good argument. But not a practical one.

There's a proverb in gambling:  Never bet on a streak to end.

i actually play amateur Poker (and win).

[upsettingshorts]

captain.subtle wrote...
i actually play amateur Poker (and win).

Poker isn't gambling, it's a game of skill.

[captain.subtle]

Upsettingshorts wrote...

captain.subtle wrote...
i actually play amateur Poker (and win).

Poker isn't gambling, it's a game of skill.

whoever says that does not know about gambling or skill . Sorry... Not Ad ******. But couldn't avoid... It IS gambling as lucj plays a HUGE role (any type of poker) especially in 3 carder.


EDIT: In fact the only skills in Poker are knowing:

1) When you are luckier than the next guy
2) Convincing the next guy that you are luckier/unluckier than him when the situation demands it....

Modifié par captain.subtle, 16 octobre 2010 - 08:28 .

[upsettingshorts]

captain.subtle wrote...
whoever says that does not know about gambling or skill . Sorry... Not Ad ******. But couldn't avoid... It IS gambling as lucj plays a HUGE role (any type of poker) especially in 3 carder.

Luck plays a role in every game.  Or else a stat like BABIP in baseball wouldn't be useful to anyone, yet it is.  Anyway, I'm not going to dispute whether poker is skill or luck on a Bioware forum, suffice to say I'm confident in opinion, unless we're talking about a really small number of hands.

If you want to continue the debate, send me a PM.  But it's off topic here.

captain.subtle wrote...
EDIT: In fact the only skills in Poker are knowing:

1) When you are luckier than the next guy
2) Convincing the next guy that you are luckier/unluckier than him when the situation demands it....

On second thought, don't PM me, we have totally incompatible views on how to approach the game of poker. 

Anyway I was talking - with the proverb - about gambling on events well beyond your influence and control.  Like, sporting events or... the quality of video games.  So this poker stuff isn't even relevant to my comment, so I'll drop it.

Modifié par Upsettingshorts, 16 octobre 2010 - 08:32 .

[Jimmy Fury]

captain.subtle wrote...

The Masked Rog wrote...

So basically if someone has trust in BioWare they follow them  blindly, because you have determined so. That you think something fails to make it a fact.

Following any comapnay purely on faith is following Blindly. I use the word faith advisedly. You are ASSuming that DA2 will be good because Bioware has delivered in the past. That IS a good argument. But not a practical one.

If they are asking you to invest more money into something that is definitely going to depreciate with time, WITHOUT giving you enough proof is it not blind faith? Granted that you have ability to revoke the purchase, but is not better to wait until more info is released?

But if you're basing your purchase on past experience then it isn't blind faith, it's an educated guess.
Yes you're assuming but it's a reasonable assumption. Just as it's a reasonable assumption to buy size 10 converse shoes if size 10 converse shoes have always fit you. Is there a chance that your feet have grown or that the shoes will be incorrectly marked? sure. That doesn't change the fact that your assumption was logical.
There's a chance I could choke to death on the next cupcake I eat. That's not going to make me foresake the deliciousness of cupcakes.

[captain.subtle]

Jimmy Fury wrote...
 Just as it's a reasonable assumption to buy size 10 converse shoes if size 10 converse shoes have always fit you. Is there a chance that your feet have grown or that the shoes will be incorrectly marked? sure. That doesn't change the fact that your assumption was logical.

Ahh...

but the case you quote is a FACT. Size 10 to 11 can be checked before you buy the Shoes. And shoes are labeled to boot... (pun intended).

[Meltemph]

Where is that 2 year DLC support? Where are the patches that fix the numerous bugs? Where is that serial number of that staff? And weren't we promised to get info "within a couple of weeks" about that new community event? How many months ago was this again? But if that does not crush you trust in them then I do think you are following them blindly.

I don't care what they did or did not promise, I had fulfillment out of my purchase. Also, if you think a calculated risk, based on the quality of products from a certain company, is "blindly following them", then seems more like you are just trying to "win" your argument, more then trying to make sense of the situation.



Or you need to invalidate a decision as best as you can, to feel confident in yours. I don't see any other purpose to what you are arguing.

[AndarianTD]

The Masked Rog wrote...
I don't see how offering a free product for people who preorder another is shady marketing. You are in no way entitled to get the extra character for free. It is their choice to offer it to you under certain circumstances.

Exactly. Thank you.

[Nerevar-as]

Acharnae wrote...

Yeah but you know what is the problem with all those DLCs?
Let's say you mod the game or something happens and you have to reinstall. Do you then need to download AGAIN all the DLCs?
Frustrating.

Thaks for reminding me of another reason to get GotY edition. That´s what happened with Origins when I reinstalled to change language.

[aries1001]

10 years ago I bought Baldur's Gate 2, the collector's edition at a local gameshop (that's now closed unfortunately ). In this BG2, there were a a bonus cd and some other stuff (I think a t-shirt and maybe some cards as well?) Also on this bonus cd for BG2, there would be two bonus merchants and some other stuff. People who bought the regular edition might have felt cheated at first, but I think eventually Bioware released the content of the bonus cd - at a much later date.[I think maybe ther also was a new character or two on the bonus disc, but I could be mistaken...?]



The point is this:



Try to see or view this special or signature edition as a sort of collector's edition you can order online before the game comes out. Just as with BG2, there will be people who buy this edition and buy the normal version of the game. And just as with the collector's edition of BG2, there will be items, characters, and other stuff availabe to those who get this signature edition of DA2.



For myself, I'm waiting for a) system specs and reviews.

[Nerevar-as]

aries1001 wrote...

10 years ago I bought Baldur's Gate 2, the collector's edition at a local gameshop (that's now closed unfortunately ). In this BG2, there were a a bonus cd and some other stuff (I think a t-shirt and maybe some cards as well?) Also on this bonus cd for BG2, there would be two bonus merchants and some other stuff. People who bought the regular edition might have felt cheated at first, but I think eventually Bioware released the content of the bonus cd - at a much later date.[I think maybe ther also was a new character or two on the bonus disc, but I could be mistaken...?]

The point is this:

Try to see or view this special or signature edition as a sort of collector's edition you can order online before the game comes out. Just as with BG2, there will be people who buy this edition and buy the normal version of the game. And just as with the collector's edition of BG2, there will be items, characters, and other stuff availabe to those who get this signature edition of DA2.

For myself, I'm waiting for a) system specs and reviews.

I don´t think the reaction would have been this bad if the game wasn´t so uncertain so far. The change from GW to Hawke wasn´t announced the best possible way, then the Origins DLC was cut short (although if it was going to continue the same quality, no big loss there), the gameplay we´ve seen so far isn´t thrilling a lot of us, and the claims that it´s not representative of the game make me wonder why they use it for the demo then. This seems more a stunt to get more sales out of fear the game will not be up to DA standards than a reward for people´s trust.

[aidron]

Some of the content this thread contain only re-affirm my position on humanity: people the world over are not so different and are typically hostile and angry, often for reasons that baffle me. I am beyond baffled by this thread in fact.

Pre-orders are typically refundable. At least, every pre-order I have placed has been. Perhaps there are some which are not. In the end, you might lose an estimated $5-10 if you cancel your pre-order. A loss of a potential loss of $5-10 should you decide the game is in fact not for you hardly warrants such an angry and frighteningly paranoid ("They just want to bleed me dry! It's all a conspiracy!") response. This response is in fact disproportionate to the cause. It's sheer lunacy. I won't say this just a game and people should not let it adversely affect their mental and emotional health to such a degree. I am, however, thinking it very loudly.
 
We have been given a choice though. Aren't choices, particularly in RPGs, good things? Aren't choices generally a defining point of RPG? If you don't want to pre-order the game, so be it. If you believe you should be allowed to wait until all the reviews out and are then entitled to it: too bad. You can't have the benefits of both choices. You have just have to trust you'll make the best choice for you and let the darkspawn fall where they will. A sense of entitlement will get you nowhere. You are entitled to nothing in life. Not even toilets (which people really do not appreciate enough by the way).

Sure, they could include this content in all new copies of the game, but why must they? Because you are entitled to it? I think I covered that. Why are they including it at all? Probably to reward loyal fans like they said and probably because this ensures that most of the money their hard work has earned goes back to them. That's not greedy. It's not even treacherous. It's thoughtful and it's also smart business. Who wants a gaming company consisting of sheer idiots in terms of economic know-how? I don't. It means they won't be around to put their products on the shelf. Which means less games for me. Which probably means I'm selfish, greedy, and evil. I'm fine with that.

I personally do not know if I will pre-order the game. I'm partially hesitant due to Origins itself as I had a lot of criticisms with it which I feel have been largely overlooked.  I am also partially hesitant because as many reviews as I have read of Mass Effect 1 & 2 in the hopes that I would find the games appealing, I do not. DA2 borrowing from the Mass Effect series, even if it is only voiced protoganist and dialogue wheel (my biggest turn-offs for the Mass Effect series), concerns me.

On the other hand I would prefer that every cent I spend on the game go directly to the company rather than to a retail chain for a used copy. The retail chain did nothing for me. In fact their employees are usually rude, self-righteous bigots who glare at me for even daring to pick up an RPG rather than some first person shooter. The game designers, however, did do something for me. Assuming I liked the game of course. And rarely do I buy a game that I do not enjoy, so I trust my own judgment.

But I have many months to make my decision and no matter what choice I make I am at peace with the reality that Bioware has given me exactly what I want in RPGs before I even pick up a copy of the game: the freedom of choice.

(I would say thank you, but I'm a selfish, greedy, evil gamer, remember?)

[Urazz]

TonyTheBossDanza123 wrote...
I'm gonna tell you straight out, I stopped caring when you said you worked in retail. If you're a higher up I'd wager your first thought is "Increase my profit margin" instead of "Serve the consumer", and that's the problem with todays market. Companies would rather serve their investors then they're consumers, and that's just plain greedy.

Not saying you'r wrong about the corporate leadership of retail companies but unless you worked in retail for a sizeable amount of time, then you don't know how unreasonable some customer requests or complaints might be.

[Anarya]

*slow claps for Aidron*

[bjdbwea]

Wittand25 wrote...

If you check the announcement only the items are exclusive bonus, the character is just called bonus so it is pretty certain that everyone will get him/her.

That is an interesting observation, and it's true. Here's the quote again:

Chris Priestly wrote...

Featuring over $20 of additional content, the Dragon Age II BioWare Signature Edition includes the full
version of Dragon Age II, along with a download code for an additional playable character and new missions, the Dragon Age II digital soundtrack, an exclusive in-game digital armory featuring a variety of in-game weapons and other digital in-game items.

That might indeed be an indication that the additional character and missions could be included in every new game. And that's pretty much all I for one am asking for, because I couldn't care less about some items that are usually overpowered anyway, and if they are added to the inventory automatically, it often doesn't even make sense that your player character would have them. Besides, if the game can be as easily modded as DA, then there'd be plenty of new items available anyway.

So yeah, as has been said before, if the important content is included in every copy of the game, then this thread would be completely pointless. Of course BioWare could easily have said so, but of course they do want to create the impression that everything they announced now is indeed exclusive. That, at least, is a marketing scheme that is questionable. Especially if they are convinced of the quality of their game, because surely then everyone would buy the game anyway, pre-ordered or not.

Modifié par bjdbwea, 16 octobre 2010 - 11:03 .